 Olymp that is becoming so great and a very warm welcome, and a very warm welcome to our international audience who are joining online now, and just to make you aware we do have an online audience who are participating in this event as well. So if you feel the need to leave at any time be aware that the international audience may also see your comings and goons. So, ydw i'n fwy o'r ffordd o'r panell ar y cyfrifio. Rania Ae Al-Mashabh gydag yng Nghymru, Egyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol. Rydym yn fawr am ymweld. Yrgyn Carl Zatler, ynghylch yn ymddiadol, ynghylch yn ymddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol. Yn gwybod, Richard Baldwin, ymddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol, i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol, yn Swythsylion ac Faeson Gwyber Ffoson Hoenbo, G wyno i gynyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol i Canoedd, i gynnaeth Iolol, oedd yn iawn i'r cyfnogi'r gyfrifio ffordd o'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol i'r Cyfrifio Egyddiadol. Dyna ddim yn sicr gwnddiadol i'r c Report, i'r Llywyddias Nid, dwi'n gofau i fawr i'n fluffiannol. that it comes highly recommended. So, please go and do that. I won't talk for too long. Just wanted to say thank you to Klaus and Hilda and Sardia for giving me the opportunity to host this opening panel, which is incredibly important. I think, as Sadia described, that studied by the economists, I mean look they are economists, Ond ydych chi'n gweld ar ymdweud o'ch chi'n gweld ar ymdweud ar gyfer. Mae'r oedden nhw'n gwneud argyrchio. Ond rwy'n credu bod ydych chi'n gweld llawer a'r bydd ymdweud o'r ffysgau ar y cwestiynau? Rwy'n gweld â'r macroeg, y dyfodol yn gweld yn ogylcheddu, ond rwy'n credu ffasio'n gweld i gaf i gyrraedd, rwy'n gweld i gydig o'r ymdweud, mae gennym ni i ddysbu'r cyfnod wedi'u Chino ac ystod y Unedig, sy'n gallu o'r ffordd yn fawr o'r ffordd, o'r ffordd, o'r ffordd, o'r ffordd. Yn ymwneud, yma yw'r ysgrifennu hyn yn ymwneud, mae'n ei gilydd o'r ffordd. A ydych yn ymgyrch yng nghymru a'r ffordd o'r ffordd, a'r ysgrifennu sydd wedi'u bod yn ymdîch yw'r ysgrifennu o'r ysgrifennu yw'r ysgrifennu. Ond yn ymgyrch ac yn ymburdoedd gyrwch ar y mawr. Ond yn ymgyrch, mae'r cyfrwyr yn cyfrwyr sy'n cyfrwyr.. ..o gweld yn ymargrifio'r siaradau, yn cyfodd bwrw. Mae hyn yn ddechrau'r cyrwyr datblygu cyfwyr yn cyfrwyr cyfrwyr sy'n cyfrwyr yn cyfrwyr. Mae cyfrwyr yn cyfrwyr yn cyfrwyr. Mae gydig yn gwybod yn gwybod. five years ago when Beijing started lifting the price of workers, or the wages of workers. Even before Covid, he started to think about whether he should still get his goods manufactured in China. And so he began to move some of that manufacturing to Vietnam, to Bangladesh, to other low cost centres. An economy is made up of millions of decisions that are made every day that aggregate into a bigger story. And then of course we had Covid, and then that was a reason for him to move out of China completely. And then he got a cold call from someone who was going to set up a manufacturing plant in the southeast of England. I mean, the guy must be crazy, right? Why would you set up a manufacturing plant in the southeast of England with all the associated higher costs of manufacturing and so on? But then he explained that there weren't actually many people that were going to work there. It was primarily machines that were going to make the products, so he could bring down the costs. And so we talked about it, and I said to Mark, you know, this seems interesting, but the world has so far been about importing your product from the lowest cost centres and managing all the frictional elements that come with that, whether that's currency risk, whether that's the miles that your product has to travel, whether it's the fact that a customs officer may need a bribe to get your goods out of it, and so on and so forth, right? We know that there are many of those. And he said to me, look, I've shortened my supply chain. I've removed a lot of the currency risk. I have taken out the COVID-related risks going forward. A whole plethora of reasons why he was taking those decisions. So that to me seems like a de-globalisation story, but it's sort of a localisation of manufacturing and sale story. But I just wonder, is that typical of what is happening more broadly across the global economy? And Jürgen, if you don't mind, can I ask you, because we come into this panel with the assumption that globalisation has peaked, and for all of the reasons that everybody in this room has read about, we are now de-globalising. Is that actually true? In fact, I think it's not true. You just said that it's levelling out. And under this macro level, I think you can see many interesting things. You have mentioned China and the rising costs of labour. This will have an impact, but also now resilience, of course. And the diversification of your supply has an impact than the global transformation we have to do in terms of decarbonisation. We'll have an impact, for example, on the commodity markets. We see a strong shift in commodity supply. We see a little bit of decline in manufacturing, and we see an upward trend in services. So this is also a kind of restructuring of the global economy, but it's not just, you know, a blunt levelling out or decline. So that's important. So we've got a restructuring going on. So what currency are we going to globalise in going forward? Because, again, depending on what you read, we are de-dolarising. And China and Russia and some Middle Eastern countries want to move the global economy away from reliance on dollar trade settlement. So maybe let's ask Richard, our economist, is that true? Are we de-dolarising? And if so, what does that mean for the new trade paradigm? Yes, it's true. I'm an economist. Can I apologise for my earlier comments about economists? No, it's, you know, somebody had to be. I just got up late. It was the only thing left. No, so, you know, good luck with that. The dollar has been the vehicle currency in currency markets trading in the asset market and in the commodities market. For a very long time, and that network externalities, overlapping network externalities make it very difficult to move. Now the role of the dollar, you can see it year by year, is declining in terms of, for example, central bank reserves and things like that. But I don't know if it's out of line with the decline of the Western share of world GDP. In fact, it's probably declining less quickly than the Western share of world GDP. So in some sense, it's reflecting the rise of other places. But in terms of another currency taking over the role of the dollar, I think that's very, very hard. And I must say I've been at this business for 35 years and I've heard at least three or four major assaults. OK, it's over. The dollar's done. It's going to be the euro. And then, you know, the dollar's done, it's going to be the reninbi. But I don't see the combination of trading goods, the foreign exchange markets and the deep capital markets being reproduced by any other currency. What do you see, though, because the experience of sanctions and the use of the dollar system against some countries has obviously made a lot of other countries rethink how they use the dollar in trade settlement. So we've agreed that we're adjusting. There are structural changes taking place. What do those changes imply, do you think, in terms of other currencies becoming more significant? So the way we think of it, there's a big push to remove the financial weaponisation of the dollar by creating some sort of backdoor or maybe some sort of cryptocurrency way of trading that avoids it. And we've seen with the sanctions against Russia, for instance, and Iran has led to trading in other currencies. But that, I don't think, is going to catch on and generalise. But I can very easily see, and a number of people have tried to do it, is to create this backdoor for high value. It would be expensive, but high value transactions that get out of the American banking system and therefore the weaponisation of the financial system. Small stuff. Small stuff so far, but it is happening. Minister, let me ask you, one of the other big stories that we've always, I think, tried to focus on is the direction of flow. North-south, south-north, but south-south now increasingly we understand is important. Bring us up to date, how strong are those flows and how is that changing north-south or south-north? OK, well I'm also another economist on this panel. Let me say that there are certain common challenges which create common denominators for countries. Be it in the north or the south, but more so in the south. For instance, there's an SDG goal by 2030 that many countries wanted to achieve, and this is a growth summit. So in these SDGs you had no poverty, no hunger, quality of jobs, and we heard from Sadia how technology might create displacement and therefore skills. So there's a financing gap for the SDGs. There's a climate challenge, which also, as much as there's discrepancy between the north and the south on that, there are common goals. And this requires, again, a big scale of financing. So in this environment, there's a need to be very fast in order to adapt and also to create resilience. And that's where sharing experiences under south-south cooperation become extremely important. Because there are countries that have created programs and projects with certain strategies that can be very easily replicated in order to create the momentum for sustainable growth, to be able to close the gaps when it comes to the SDG goals, to be able to face not de-globalisation but the restructuring that is taking place. Your example of Mark, this is localisation, but also localisation has a flavour of globalisation because countries need to see where the comparative advantage is, and that's how you're able to invite more investment either from your private sector or also to create the jobs which are most needed. Emerging markets, Africa, huge youth numbers need for more jobs, and therefore this concept of south-south cooperation and then north-south, where we also see with different multilateral development banks of IFIs, the programmes that have worked in one place can also be moved into or replicated. And this is the whole concept out of COP 27 with the scaling of projects, with moving to see what has worked with renewables, mitigation projects, adaptation projects, so the actual operationalisation of attracting flows and attracting private sector investments in key objectives such as climate change particularly. And if I could follow up, one of the headline stories we were reporting on this morning was obviously First Republic Bank, and the banking story has been a significant story and event that has us, again, worried about growth going forward. Lending and financing are incredibly important to trade flow and the continued south-south story. What progress is being made? What concerns might you have about that progress being stalled by what's happening elsewhere in the financial plumbing? When we talk about globalisation, the globalisation, I think what we're seeing today is that we are more coupled than ever before. And if we take a look at the macro backdrop, it's a very tough macro backdrop. High interest rates globally, the risks related to a recession, no recession, but definitely a slowdown and a massive slowdown. The number of successive shocks one after the other, so it's this poly shocks or poly crises, has its way. So, I mean, we just as emerging markets came out of COVID, you know, starting the recovery hit by price shocks related to food energy on the back of the war. Now this risk of financial stability and just coming out of the spring meetings in Washington. Again, a very important message on what central banks should do this trade off between financial stability versus inflation and growth. So these are real questions. You said the prospects and you also said concerns. I think the concerns are way more now and we have to work through these concerns to create prospects. Otherwise it's going to be very difficult and I think the unraveling of the systemic outcomes or systemic risks of the banking situation is yet to be seen. Hopefully not too big, but again, I think there's yet numbers on how much this will cost and how much it will have a ripple effect on other banks. Gilbert, we've just seen hundreds of thousands, possibly millions of workers around the world spend a day marking that day by the fact that their household income has declined. Their wages are not keeping up with inflation and as they see growth slow in their economies, they fear for their jobs. The report that's been released here has very sobering numbers about the likely loss of jobs going forward for a number of reasons, some to do with technology, but a lot to do with growth. Tell us a little bit more about what changes you see unfolding at this time and whether you are optimistic or pessimistic about the globalization story. Unfortunately, I'm always a very optimistic guy and sadly I'm not an economist. But if you allow me to quickly bounce on the earlier discussion, I think the trend we're seeing in the globalization, I will tend to really to agree with Yorgen that I will not expect anything to just go down the drain. Yes, it is stagnating and that stagnation started, let's recall, since the 2008-2009 financial crisis. So it's not even, it's not COVID on that. But it is the transformation that we are seeing happening with the near shoring and the French shoring and the relocalisation of manufacturing, both manufacturing and services. One will expect that to continue. But if I take the example, a very good example that you're giving, yes, AI, yes, technology will change it. I just came from the G7 Labour Minister's meeting in Kurashiki in Japan and we visited Mitsubishi plant there where you have about 1,600 workers and 1,000 robots. In the whole production. So we're getting almost to very soon 50-50 on that back to your point that you're making. But the real point that I'm making in terms of the new trend of globalization, you have to count on the fact that the countries from the south or the law of emerging economy, clearly they want to, they will be also turning the page of just exporting raw materials. So the whole value chain will also have to happen in their countries. And therefore, though you may want to regionalise the supply chain and French shoring, you still have to build that into consideration, which is one. Secondly, which is quite, I believe, very positive, is the fact that the use of artificial intelligence or technology, thanks to globalization maybe, is really much more open to all countries than you will expect in the past. So it will depend heavily on those countries that are much more prepared to transform their technological modis operandi on that. Third point quickly reacting, certainly adding to Professor Baldwin's point, and again I agree. I wouldn't say the de-dolarisation of the global business, of course we can look at that from a political angle. But you can also see that as not necessarily to get away from the dollar, but to diversify and therefore to reduce the excessive dependency on the dollar. It's not necessarily to just get away from it, and this is clear to me that it's not just Iran, Russia, China that are looking to that. I think a lot of countries want to diversify their dependency on one single currency, be it the dollar or the euro, when you think about it. All of that obviously has impact on the world of work, and from the technology point, we in ILO estimate that between now and 2030 the SDG deadline, 100 million new jobs in the technology will be created at the same time millions of jobs close to 70, 75 will be lost with a net net gain of around 25 million jobs. So, as I like to say, none of us want to be in the category of 75. This is why, and I'm very glad when Professor Schwab and Sadia were mentioning that at the beginning, the whole re-scaling and upscaling become crucial in our way and our way forward. What we also see happening, you're referring to May 1st day, and it is good to remind ourselves the origin of May 1st. That goes back to 19th century, 1884 or so, when workers in Chicago were demanding eight hours day schedule, not the 12, 15 hours day on that. So my point is that with all those transformation that we are looking at, for business sake, we have to ensure or we have to keep in mind what was said in 1944 in Philadelphia, what we call Philadelphia Declaration, that poverty anywhere is a threat to prosperity everywhere. So in moving forward, not only is it a matter of the job we are creating, but it is also a matter of the quality of more and more the quality of the job. And what I'm referring to the quality I'm not looking for the moon is basically ensuring a dignifying job that the job is not a commodity and that it comes with a minimum voice for the workers and a protection for the workers. OK. You brought up AI, and it is, I think as Klaus said, the topic of the moment. Professor, I know you've written on robotics in the past, which was a previous wave of modernization, if you like, of workplaces. Again, you know, how optimistic or pessimistic are you about AI and what it ultimately means for growth and for employment? So I would like to put together two things, both the, and I want to focus on the service sector, because I think the story of automation and globalization was about mining, agriculture and manufacturing for the last 25 years. But I think going forward is going to be mostly in the service sector. And the digital technology is advancing both of those at the same time. International telework is becoming a real thing and automation of service sector jobs is becoming a real thing. So my personal take is that it's going to change every job, how we do it in the service sector, but not eliminate many jobs. And I think it may very well have. I'm, again, an optimist like Gilbert here. I have a question for you, by the way, a little later on. But the AI is essentially wisdom in a can. And so it's giving more power to all workers, but especially those average workers. So if you take an AI, for instance, and give it medical AI and give it to a nurse, he or she is much more capable than they were before. The doctor, too, a little bit. So I think this AI will be uplifting to the middle class because it's, in essence, the most expensive, most talented workers are people who have 20 years experience and know how to apply that. That's what AI does overnight. So I think it will be uplifting for the middle class. That's my, but it will be extremely disruptive in the sense that every job will change. There will be automation of certain things, and everybody will learn how to deal with it. Or what I say on Twitter all the time is AI won't take your job. It's somebody using AI that will take your job. So you better learn how to use AI. Jürgen, just to bring you in on this, because I think we've largely thought about these new technologies evolving very rapidly in already developed economies. That seems to be the locus for the development of a lot of this technology. What does it imply for developing economies and can developing economies embrace and internalize the technology as quickly? And will the consequences be fair and equitable for everybody? And if not, how can that be changed or how can they be helped? And if yes, well, we should celebrate. But what's your thought on that? Yes, again, it's complex. I think on the one hand, it's a challenge for developing countries. Because we have seen, for example, your example in the southeast of the UK, that we have seen on shoring because it becomes so attractive to use machines to do the work. And in particular because the labour costs in China have increased. So I think that's something which is not good for developing countries, perhaps for some of them, like China being well advanced in modernizing and automizing the economies. But on the other hand, of course, the new technology and digital technology can be a huge potential for developing countries. Look at agriculture, persistent agriculture. Look at services you can do remote now health services, for example, which can have a big impact on the SDGs and on the health part of the SDGs. So there is a potential where also poor countries can perhaps find peace in the global value chains in the services area. Does anybody else want to weigh in on this? I see a lot of nodding. Maybe I just add, I agree with Jurgen, and I go back to your first question about the macro scene. Because for countries to be able to attract such opportunities, the perception of risk has to be one which is manageable. And what we're seeing from the global backdrop is a lot of downgrades and a lot of reassessment of risk for good reason. But again, it's a period of several shocks and therefore as countries were moving forward on their development paths and so forth, there are sand in the wheels, if you will, because of the complications in the backdrop. So I think this is just a real extra challenge which might slow down things. So the idea is how can we, through the narrative of stakeholder engagement, government policies, private sector, MDBs, so forth, push forward so that we are not kept back and create more divide because of a very current circumstance which is pressuring everyone. If I can, yeah, maybe to compliment that two point that you mentioned one, and Jurgen just talked about the agriculture sector. It's something that we should watch, particularly since COVID and followed by the spiking of the grain and the fertilizers cost after the war in Ukraine started. Today, continental Africa imports 70 billion food a year, 70 billion dollars. And if you couple that with the ongoing challenge but progressing free trade agreement that African countries are really trying to pull together, that creates some kind of a positive outlook and optimism that I was referring to. On the flip side, and you have a very, very good point, the financing that you are referring to first of public. The financing is going to be one key matter that we will really have. The World Bank announced during the spring meeting that they plan to do everything possible to be able to inject more, five billion dollars in financing every year. But some token oblivious the UN that has estimated what is needed is four hundred million dollars a year. So it tells you a little bit to give you a sense of the magnitude of what we can or what the IFIC they can and what are the needs. So the financing both from the macro and the micro level is going to be challenging. And just briefly, one of the much vaunted desires I think of multilateral organisations like this one and non-governmental bodies that are focused on these issues is to see the green economy emerge as a significant employment opportunity going forward. But we've just come through an energy crisis in Europe and we continue to see headline oil at just below eighty dollars a barrel and we're worried about growth. Is that desire slipping, fading or does it represent a meaningful opportunity still? Certainly not. I would certainly not say that is slipping. And by the way I think we need to keep the political momentum, which was created since the Paris agreement. We see that momentum growing up until the COP 27 in Charmescher and 2016 Glasgow and others. So it's not I'm slipping. You see on the flip side the just transitions is going to be crucial. We need to pay more attention to the transition. Not only the green transition to decarbonising the economy is the energy transition is the digital transition and the energy transition you're talking about. This is where you really have to mix both the environmental climate change concern that we need to keep high and also look at that from a country that had to manage multiple challenges. You know if today you I don't know we can so many countries what comes to my mind in Senegal with the gas that they started or they're about to start trading. And you know that can contribute to your immediate SDG codes. At the same token you know you want to move towards renewable energy. What's how do you balancing. It's a challenge for everyone and to me it does not mean that you're giving up on the momentum. Okay let's open the floor to conversation and questions. Who'd like to ask a question to any of our panellists if you could identify yourself and then direct the question to ever you'd like to ask the question of can I see a hand up. Can we get a microphone to that gentleman here and is it possible to open one of these windows because I think we're all we're all you don't need to be an economist to melt to you. We need a clear voice. The conditioning is struggling. Yes I'm JJ from Japan. I'm teaching MBA and also running high school. And then the problem is when I'm teaching those students young students in Japan quite a lot of them think growth economic growth is bad things. Right. So even for MBAs quite a lot of people said I came here for not for the company's growth. What do you think is a future benefit of growth economic growth. Who'd like to take the question. I will volunteer before the professor. OK. Let's keep them tight and then we can get some more questions in. I think when we talk only about economic growth is what the youth the youngster don't want to hear anymore. We need to really start saying that you have three pillars that have to move side by side. Economic growth protecting modern nature environment and the social spending. A stop there. Yes. I think we need growth until we arrive in communism. Some have read perhaps Karl Marx there. Everybody gets what he or she needs and there we don't need growth but we are not there yet. So we need growth and in particular in developing countries and that's a big problem in terms of jobs in terms of SDG. And that I would like to to stress one point how tough how hard the situation is at the moment in developing countries. The minister has has raised the point of interest rates and the cost of capital. I mean these countries they have low growth. They have many development problems. They have to finance the global transformation towards decarbonisation. Capital is very very expensive there and I think we have to to look at that and therefore we address the issue in the World Bank. We want to reform the World Bank. My ministers asked for that in at the annual meetings last year. Now it's on the way but this has to be really a game changer and we have to look at other issues in the international architecture. Hopefully there will be and hopefully but there will be the summit in Paris organised by by France on financing. I think we have to find solutions there because it's about development and SDGs but it's also about financing the global transformation we need. Professor. So let me just say that your students are Japanese and maybe Japan doesn't need that much more growth. But there's a large number of people in the world where if their son breaks their arm and it gets complicated he dies. That's the way a lot of people live and for them getting income above say ten dollars a day you know be able to have some sort of security owning some property or a house that's what growth is. So the way I think you think about is growth or GDP per capita is not a measure of social economic welfare but it's correlated with an awful lot of those measures especially in the bottom half of the world income distribution. So the D growth narrative I think makes a lot of sense to a lot of people to say nothing in Switzerland what could you want but for a lot of the world they still need GDP to rise because they don't have the material conditions for a decent lifestyle. I will hope we agree though that you shouldn't just focus on growth and hoping that growth will solve the rest. It's important that we bring back we need growth I want to for me is very clear from my own perspective we need the growth but that growth should not be looked at in an isolated way and later on it will take care of the social and the environment. Rania did you want to talk about this. I mean I just want to say that for the just transitions to happen we need just financing and just financing means that countries development pathways need to be respected in achieving their climate goals which are part of the global goals and this is through quality and quantity of financing. And there's a lot of work that took place at COP 27 to give a definition of just financing and principles of just financing and how because of the cost of capital we need more concessionality in order to bring down the cost of capital to draw in the private sector much needed for the transitions but also for growth. Because if we think about each and every climate project be it mitigation or adaptation as a project that will create jobs as a project that will add to the country's development and therefore growth rates then this is where we will have a window to push forward on financing. Being the governor at the World Bank we are having very active discussions on we finished the mandate the new mandate but the operational the new operational model of the World Bank how are we going to be able to translate the mandate into action. The 15 billion from the World Bank was an experiment also there's a part with hybrid capital going into the markets and trying to see how we can increase that. So there's a there's a very vibrant discussion the verdict is still out and that's where examples that took place earlier and work should be scaled up so that we save time and create more growth in areas that need them. Let's take a question here. My name is Oda Al-Khazemi from United Arab Emirates. My question is what would you perceive the the undermined accelerators of growth at the moment because we are stuck in between reality and perception infection at the same time. We are in a world where we are brazing the economic growth of advanced technology like AI saying that there will be a contribution by 15 percent to the global GDP in 2030 and what not but at the same time we have a level of growth that lies within advanced education empowerment and equal communities and societies that surpasses the 15 percent to 30 percent growth opportunities. So what would be from your perception the undermined growth accelerators given the current economic outlook. Who wants Professor. You're the development guy. I mean I think the question is really challenging because there are so many country situations and probably that's not really possible to find the answer. When you look at low income countries that's more my focus and there I think the sources of growth are in the new commodities because the landscape is very rapidly shifting. The G7 has decided to create a club for commodities now and they signaled that they would accept in a way commodity kind of industrial development based on commodities. You know so local content issues. So that's that's a signal I think this could be a basis for growth based on commodities for low income countries. Another one is is light manufacturing and of course I think linked to to the the new areas of services. What I already said but for more developed countries of course middle income countries the situation is is a different one. Let's try and get another question in here. Thank you. Hi my name is Amol Merah with Laudas Foundation. I have a question for the director general. I think it's really interesting that the conversation thus far has been oriented toward the future the potential for growth what we need to do to address it. And I thought that the jobs report did a good job of highlighting the challenges of the present including the gaps in social protection. So I just wonder how you view sort of a positive future oriented mission to grow with the real challenges that communities and countries are facing now and even meeting basic social protection floors. Thanks. And let's use that as a wrap up question I think so if we could get an answer from everybody who'd like to start. Yeah let me very clear you on the social protection. This is one of the huge thing that ILO is working on. Some of you might know last year on this even the Secretary General Gutierrez and ILO launched this global accelerator for job and social protection. And we recall that half of the population four billion people have zero zero zero protection. Zero protection half of the population. So imagine if we were to provide basic not so different flow basic basic minimum protection to every citizen in the world the universal social protection is really key. And again for that obviously financing is a challenge and therefore you need a growth to be able to generate that financing the IMF and ILO are working on four pilot cases in how we work with government to really try to create the maximum fiscal space that can be used to finance those social social protection. So it's very critical again in providing that social dimension and balancing what I call the protection and employment. Professor. So I'd like to be optimistic on this and I think we have we're in a new world that consumers and workers at least in the rich nations care not just about how much but how. And I think in some sense that consumers have joined the value chain and they're demanding things are made with respect to labor and they're demanding that they work for corporations that have plans to make sure that there's no slave labor or whatever in their supply chains. So I think that's the optimistic way go forward and that's fundamentally based on awareness transparency and information. And that's where I put in my view where it's all come from is people actually know how their t-shirts are made nowadays. Whereas in the past all they did is how much it costs and how nice it was. So that's that's my optimistic take is inform transparency and empower the consumers to demand better conditions. Great. We've got two minutes. Jurgen. I think it's not only about awareness and transparency. I think the state the government has to play a very important role in this transformation has to set the framework has to guide and transform the the economy. We have made bad experience mobilizing private sector very bad. It's flat what we mobilize in the climate area. So we have to have a sector approach in the sense of Mariana Mazzucato where the government together with the industry sits together. So that's where we want to go decarbonisation. What does it take. This is a sector transformation approach and not a kind of transaction approach minister on the acceleration of growth. I think one of the topics is gender equality because there have been statistics and studies here that more female participation will push an accelerate growth. That's on on that issue with respect to climate financing and social protection. Each of the goals pushing forward does have an implication on the public social protection or social programs that have worked in countries can be scaled. We have for example today with the macro situation and the fallout from food prices and energy prices cash transfers. And I think out of covid the using the digital platforms that are able to allow these disbursements to go to the people most in need is something which is quite quite important. But I go back to the global backdrop because fiscal space is very small. There needs to be more cooperation not just government but also all stakeholders particularly when it comes to concessional finance. OK. Thank you very much. So lunch follows and I just like to thank our panellists for their contributions and for you for the questions.