 Think Tech Hawaii, civil engagement lives here. Out of the comfort zone. On Think Tech on Spectrum OC 16, I'm your host, Arby Kelly, and today I'm here with a very special repeat guest, Kajana Movery. Hey Kajana, thank you for coming in. I am excited to be here. Thanks for having me. Always my pleasure. So can you explain to our viewers a little bit more about what you do? Okay, so I have a social marketing agency and what we do is we help businesses and personalities, etc., to increase the awareness of their business as well as create more sales using social media. It sounds super fancy. It's very simple. Use social media. Make more money. That's really all of it. I love that because it seems like a lot of businesses struggle because people don't know they exist. Is that something you addressed? Yes. This is very true. You know, a lot of people, there are two very common preconceived ideas around social media. One, it's not professional to use, or two, if I post once a week, people will come and find me. That's not really how things work. When you look at social media, it's all about capturing the attention of people. Because you're not just competing against other businesses. You're competing against Susan from Down the Road who just got married. You're competing with Gary who just bought a new dog. You're competing with Kelly who just went and got married. There's lots of things that are in your feed. So it's social media. It's all about capturing the attention of your consumer and then reaffirming while you are the expert or your business is the best choice to work with. It's very simple. So when I see people posting, hey, I've got a sale on makeup this week, or hey, 25% off on this thing. And they're just always posting. Is that an effective strategy for them? It's an effective strategy if you want to spam people. It's a fantastic strategy to annoy people and to get them to stop paying attention to you. Oh, okay. Yeah, the secret is, you know, it's about social media is two pieces. Social, you know, contact, communication, relationships and media, different forms of way to consume things. You need to be able to create content that people can consume easily and want to continue consuming. No one wants to continuously see Kelly who's posting about her makeup special every single day because it's one, one, it's kind of boring. And two, this feels very pitchy and salesy. People don't like being sold. People don't like being pitched to. People want to be part of the experience of when they find you on social media. And Kajana, I've noticed something that is, that's, you excel at that. Whenever you post on social media, I'm always like, oh, that's a good point. Oh, that's true. Oh, burn. Like you are so good at promoting what you do and making it clear you're an expert in a way that's fun, engaging, entertaining and not salesy. Thank you for that. So, you know, when I, when I'm posting on social media, whether for myself or for my business or for clients, it's a very simple process. Would someone find this interesting and will they be able to take this and do something with it? Right? We live in a world where people are looking for immediate gratification. And that means you have to be able to feed that immediate gratification consistently. Ho, ho, ha, ha. Funny, funny, funny. Hey, I'm going to try that out. It works. It doesn't work. It's very simple. But the secret is consistency and persistency. You have to do it every single day continuously over and over again until it works. Just like anything else in life. Or I mean, most things worth doing in life are just like that. All right. If you want people to be posting something that's interesting and useful every day, it seems like it would be really easy for them to run out of content. You know, people think that. But what you have to remember is that if someone sees you today, they may never see you again for three months. So if you continuously post the same category of things, you'll never actually run out of content because people would choose when they see your stuff. So someone could follow you every single day and by the time they've gone from day one to day 30, they're going to be like, Oh, that's brand new. That's awesome. But you use the exact same thing you use 30 days ago. On the other hand, you have people who don't see very often and when they go and scroll through your feed for about 10 minutes, they're like, Oh, look at all these cool things. But literally, they know you just took the exact cool things you did this week from the last week. People just aren't aware of it because we are our attention spans are so finite. They're so short, right? So, you know, you could post literally, like literally, literally, you can take the exact same content from a month and post it every single month. The exact 30 posts and like no one will tell. No one. I mean, unless you have like a stalker stalker would be very aware of this case. You have other problems. Exactly. Then your problem is like, ah, crazy people, not sure what to do. But regular people would be like, Oh, look, I've never seen it before. That's interesting. That's brand new. I've never seen it before. That's interesting. That's brand new. It's that simple. Now, Kajana, my brain is wondering if that's what you do. And all the posts that I think are super brilliant for you are things I've like liked four times before. Haha, it's funny you say that. Yes. So what I do is I literally take, I have a deck of 20 stories that I share. 20 stories. I take the exact same story. I change a few words out. I'll maybe change the key takeaway from the story and I'll post it again. Like if you go and scroll through my feed, you'll see the same story about me cutting down a papaya tree for the first time. You're going to see a story of me running into a mirror in Best Buy. It's the exact same stories. I just switch what the key takeaway is because then people are like, Oh, my gosh, I've never heard that before. No, you've heard the entire thing before. I just changed one very small piece of it. Interesting. Don't tell anyone. Okay. Shh, don't tell. So you also mentioned earlier, I noticed that you mentioned whether you were posting for you, for your business or for your clients. Do you post stuff for your clients? Is that one of your services? So I don't do the direct posting myself, but since it's a team component, agency-styled, one of the services that we offer is posting for our clients because, you know, face it, when you're a business owner, unless you're like super, super creative and you like making new things, chances are you're not very skilled or you don't like creating content. So it's very simple. We take content that's already been created. Doesn't matter where it's coming from or we take best practices from your industry, et cetera, et cetera. And we create content to be released for you. It's a very simple process, right? It's literally taking what you've already done, pulling out all the key categories and keywords, turning it into content that shows why you're the expert or why your business is the best for you to come to or why you create the best experience at, let's say, your restaurant or you have, you know, the best form of cuticle care if you're at a nail salon and you take that and we just run it consistently because then you begin to show up in the feed of people, you begin to get noticed, they become interested, then you find out what works and we just double down on that and we do more of that until it works. It's really simple. It's kind of crazy how simple it is. But with that being said, it's not easy, right? You have to consistently be aware of what's happening in the world. How is your industry reacting? Because if everyone in your industry is talking about hair products and you're in the natural hair business, should you go down the path of hair products because everyone's talking about that? Or should you veer away from that because you actually want to go to just organic hair beauty? Now you have the problem. Be like everyone else and provide the same content or go the other direction and maybe not be seen or in the other hand, be the person who's the only one doing that. Not everyone's going to you for that one piece of advice. So do you have a set recommendation for that situation or does it change depending on the client and their goals? So it completely changes depending on the client and their goals. What the reason is when we're looking at, now we're moving a bit more into the marketing psychology as opposed to just social media. When you're marketing, there are two things that determine what every, all of your marketing is. Your business or your brand and then who your audience is. You can take the exact same business and the exact same industry, but if you change the audience, the entire approach to talking to them changes because you wouldn't talk to your 70-year-old kid. The way you would talk to your 27-year-old kid. The way you would talk to your 37-year-old brother. The way you would talk to your 47-year-old sister. The way you would talk to your 67-year-old father. It's all of the same content, the same things, but the way you communicate it changes. My favorite analogy is teaching a child how to drive. If you teach your 15-year-old to drive, you're like, okay, now we slow down, now we speed up. This is the gas, this is the brake, that's red light. It would not be the same process of teaching your five-year-old how to drive. You wouldn't be like, hey son, you sit here and you drive us home today. I'm going to walk you through it, right? But it's the same concept. You're still teaching them how to drive. The conversation, the depth of the conversation is different because you're talking to your 15-year-old who has little to some experience driving, and your five-year-old who likes the idea of driving, but is exactly. Interesting, now that's something, when I think of that difference in audience, that makes me think of my fellow body language learners. I'm currently the only one in Hawaii, but there are hundreds of us across the world. And we all get together in groups online and we talk about how we take care of our clients. And I've always had that kind of worry in the back of my mind of how do we all get enough clients since we teach the same thing. But it sounds like, what you're saying is, yeah, we can teach the exact same thing. But if one of us is teaching body language to 30 to 40-year-old business women and another is teaching body language to 30 to 40-year-old single men, it would be a complete different marketing tactic. This is true, so let's take a very practical example. One of the most common business comparisons, Coke or Pepsi, right? So we go in and look at them, basically, they sell the exact same thing. They're selling pop soda, whatever you want to call it. And they basically taste the same, let's be very honest, very the same. But if you look at their marketing, the way that they market and who they're talking to differs immensely. Coke is selling this idea of nostalgia, you're sitting on the porch with your dad after a terrible game and he's like, son, it's okay, here, let's drink a Coke. Or, you know, you're going to the beach and you see that cute girl over there and you're like, oh, I'm going to share a Coke with you. It brings back this feeling of nostalgia, right? Whereas if you look at Pepsi, Pepsi's all about look at who's drinking the Pepsi. They're all about celebrity endorsements. They have, you know, they have like Britney Spears. They have like Bruno Mars. You know, oh, be like me, ha ha, drink Pepsi. Now if we take that, it's the exact same product. If we break it apart, you see on one side, for Coke, they're selling the idea of experience, the nostalgia. If you look at Pepsi, they're selling the idea of be like a person drinking the Pepsi. They're looking, they're selling authority influence. But it's the exact same product. And based off of that, who you're selling to would differ. Nostalgia fits extremely well for people between the ages say 16 to 20, you know, summer vacation, just out of high school, fresh into college. Oh man, you remember that one time at the beach? And people in the older category were talking about 38 to 50, oh man, the good old days. I remember drinking with my dad. I remember, you know, after the big game we'd celebrate whereas Pepsi is huge on that 20 to 40 year old range. Oh man, I wanna be like that person. Cause you're ambitious at that age, you wanna achieve more things. Oh, I wanna be like that, I'm gonna drink Pepsi. Oh, I wanna achieve that, I'm gonna drink Pepsi. Exact same product, different audience, completely changes the way you approach it. Interesting, whoa. Mind blowing, right? She's just like. So it sounds like even if there were other social agencies here in Hawaii, you wouldn't necessarily be going after the same customers that they are. Exactly, you know, not like I'm throwing shade or anything. A lot of the social agencies here are very big on either social media management. Hey, we'll post for you daily, you give us the content, we'll share it, or we'll just take industry best practices and we'll share that for you daily, which is great. You know, it's a very important step. And on the other side are people who are at the very high level advertising model. Like, hey, you know, you come in with a $20,000 budget, we'll shoot together some advertising videos and we'll give you back the content so you can do with it what you want. You know, that's a very big gap, you know, from just managing to shooting, like, full creative advertising videos. So what we do is, while we handle both ends, we fill the gap in between. You know, some businesses, their problem is that they aren't able to create content. So we create content for them. Some businesses, their struggle is that they're not seeing an ROI from their social media leading to more sales opportunities. So we convert the funnel that helps them go from A to B, you know. So what I would normally say is that what we do is we help businesses make more money and create brand awareness. But what it really is, is we help them to create more impact using social media. Impact hand for influence, I, M, money, P, profit. A, activation, C, conversion, T, tactics. By going down that funnel, we were able to move any business, any business that has sold something at least three times, we can set it for them 3,000 times. It's not a question, it's a fact. Whoa. Because we know it works. So if you have an offer that works and you've sold at least three times, we can set it for you 3,000 times. Now, you know, maybe 3,000 may be a bit exaggerating because maybe you're selling like, I don't know, a $7 million house. Can't really sell 3,000 of those. But if you sold three more in a span of six months, what would that do for your business? Whoa. On that bombshell, we are gonna take a tiny break and we'll see you back here. Come back because you don't wanna miss more of this. See you in a minute. Think Tech on Spectrum OC 16. And you can tune in Tuesdays at 1 p.m. And I don't know if you noticed, but if you have a question, we've got a little plaque here in front of us with the phone number for where you should call if you've got a question. And that is 808-374-2014. Call in and we'll pick up. Now Kajana, when we left off, we were talking about social media, how it works here in Hawaii, what it's used for. And so I'm curious, I bet you've seen a lot of examples here in Hawaii of good social media practices and horrifically awful social media practices. Would you be willing to share some of those with us? Yeah, so for the safety of the parties involved, I will be changing the name of these businesses just so that you're like, ha ha, make fun of you. Or like, ha, no, that's mostly it, just so we don't make fun of them. So some businesses that I've seen, there is a restaurant that I have in mind right now. What they do is they post every single day what their menu is. And while this is a great tactic every now and then to share your menu, sharing your menu doesn't give people reason to come to your business. Let's think about it. There are like 500 million places to eat on the island. You sharing your menu doesn't help to solidify that your restaurant is where they wanna eat at. It just tells them the prices of your food. People don't buy on logic and data, people buy on emotions. So by them doing this, they're actually propelling people because they're like, oh, look at these pricings. Where is this place at again? Where am I going? I don't think I've been here before. Do we know how to get there? No emotions have been created. On the flip side, there's another restaurant that I know. They're actually not a restaurant, sorry. They are a, they make macaroons, macarons. I'm not sure how to say that. I don't know what they're called either. Whichever it's called. And those things that are tasty. Yeah, the really tasty things. Anyways. Macarons. Yeah, macarons. I don't know. They're just called Ems for now. So they sell Ems, right? And these Ems, the way that they do their social media, it's beautiful. It's like, if you were to take a magazine and look at the frames and the mock-ups in the magazine, every single picture is like magazine worthy, right? But they don't just show the finished product. They show the process of making the product. So people can watch, be like, oh man, that's so cool how they make Ems like that. Oh man, that M looks amazing to watch to be made. Oh man, that M looks really good. Oh wait, are we in the area? We should totally go and get an M, right? It creates this experience people want to be a part of, right? So let's move into another industry. So I'm thinking of a business or two businesses that sell clothing, their retail stores. One of them, what makes them so amazing is that every single piece that they create on social media is they put it onto one of their, one of their floor representatives, right? Customer service, whatever you wanna call them. And they have them modeling so that when you look at like, oh my God, that shirt is so cute, that dress is so cute. I love those earrings. You go into the store and everyone you've seen on social media is someone working in the store. Every single one. So you go, it is really, right? It recreates experience. So when you go in, you're like, oh my gosh, is this person working today? Like, can I get this shirt? Like, oh yeah, Casey's over here. Casey, are you in? Like, oh my God, I love it. It feels like this. It feels like that. Looking at your body type, so on, so on. It's the experience, right? The experience you're creating. And you're already familiar with the, you see familiar faces as soon as you walk in the store. Exactly, right? So there's no barrier to be apprehensive or anything. It's like, oh, looking at all these people that I'm watching, looking at all these different body types, all these different skin tones, all these different shaped women, and then you go in and you see all of them. These are the actual people you're following on social media, all for one store. So it's the best, it's like the best connection, right? On the other hand, there's another business I'm thinking of. What they do is they post only stock photos. Stock photos are photos that are taken by professionals and so for commercial licensing rights. That means it's just any type of photo of different types of people. So what they do is they take stock photos and they post it every day on their social media. So why is this a kind of good idea? They have consistent content, right? It helps to cement their value in people's brains. What doesn't work is that the type of clothing that you're selling, the type of people who buy their clothing are not represented in the photos which they choose, right? So this is what I'm thinking of specifically. They sell urban streetwear, right? So we're thinking of like kind of hip hop culture-y, kind of like streetwear action, right? The people that they use are middle-aged white men. I'm sensing a slight disconnect here between the target audience and the models. Yeah, just a little bit. It's a bit of a disconnect, you know? It's not that middle-aged white men don't wear street hop, streetwear clothing. It's just, that's not what you think of. Exactly. It's not really like, oh man, I can't, oh man, look at John. He has dope fooboos. That's so dope, that's so crazy, right? It's not really, there's a disconnect there, right? So is it bad that they're using that? No, it works, because it's consistent content still. But it doesn't necessarily appeal to the people that are trying to get in front of, right? It's really, it's a small thing, but it creates a big difference. It creates a ripple effect. Exactly. And I can even see how, Kate, when I'm going shopping for a new place to buy clothes or jewelry or whatever, I look at the models. And if the models don't match my personality or my how I see myself, I don't think this is a store for me. But if I am looking through stores and I see maybe someone's got a cute piercing or maybe they've got some crazy hair or something like that, that feels like, you know what this place is for me? I should buy the services here. That's exactly what it is, right? You know, people like people who look like them. Yeah, it's just birds of a feather flock together. Exactly, that's something, right? So you could have the most perfect item for someone, but if they can't see themselves wearing it, if they can't see themselves buying it, if they can't see themselves experiencing the joy of having it based off of what they see on social media about your product, your store, your offer, et cetera, there's a disconnect. And that small disconnect makes a huge difference. That's actually something, okay, so the, I'm gonna name names here, but they'll probably never see this. So the body language trainers that trained me, they are in Seattle and it's very, very white, very, very cloudy all the time. So everyone there is super white. And so all of their body language photos and like micro expression photos are all of white people. And so when I came here to Hawaii and I was trying to use these photos in my marketing, in my presentations, it didn't take me long to feel like super awkward. Here's another slideshow of another white person and another one, click, and it was so awkward. And so that's why I actually don't use any of their products anymore. I make my own because none of what they have fits the people I'm talking to. And it's a small thing, but people feel it. Yeah, it's a very small overlooked notion, right? Like, you know, to your point, very practical example is if you use your own face, right? Cause they're obviously watching you. So they're like, oh, I know that face of this person. Or, you know, if you just found like a very stereotypical looking brown person, not to approach it. Like the rock. Exactly. He looks like everybody. Exactly. He's like basically every single brown person ever, right? So if you took facial expressions of the rock, you'd be all like, oh man, he looks like me. I should totally buy this now. That's, it sounds silly, but it's literally that simple. And okay, you probably don't follow makeup trends, but this is something I see, oh really? Yes. This is something I see a lot of in people releasing new makeup lines. Like they're lines of concealer. It's like 18 different shades for white people and then like three shades that are darker than that. And it's, especially it just alienates people because you're saying, I don't make services for you. You don't look like my ideal customer. So even though I claim to be inclusive or even in like I think Kim Kardashian's, her husband is black, her child is black, but her line and the marketing for her line was almost like all of the concealer shades matched white women. And so there was this whole huge like backlash about how she wasn't doing what people thought she should be doing. She was alienating her customers. Interesting, isn't it? There's actually another campaign I'm thinking of right now. This happened five or six weeks ago. And it was a very, very, very large makeup company, like extremely well-known. And in their campaign, what they did was the whole move of the campaign was to where I think it's concealer maybe or blush that helps your skin look lighter, like a fairer look, right? So this is the most, oh man. So what happened was there's a black lady who's going and putting her makeup on and what happens is she goes to wipe it off and when she wipes it off, she turns into a white lady, right? And the idea was that using her makeup helps you to become lighter in terms of your skin tone, right? The idea is great. It's a great idea. But when you actually put into practicality, it's like- Especially in an already- In an already tense time, right? So it was like, so you're telling me that if I wipe my brown skin off, I'm gonna be a white person. And it was a dude, the backlash was terrifying. Oh God. It was all over Twitter, all over Instagram. People were losing their minds, right? So then I say this example, not to like associate anywhere, but to put it very practically, you need to be aware of what you're creating and how the experience affects the people what's meant to, right? In their mind, oh, this is great idea. She's gonna wipe it off. Really? Exactly, this is great. I'm gonna wipe it off and she's gonna be lighter because the idea of our line is that this specific line helps to make your skin a lighter tone in light of the way the trend is going. But when you actually put into practicality in front of people they're like, what did I just watch? What undertones are we sensing here? Exactly. Oh gosh. Right, and that's a very, of course this is a very extreme example, right? But to reel this back in and make it back to being practical is that you need to be aware of what you're creating, what kind of content, what kind of value you want people to get and how you want to be perceived on social media, right? If we're looking at it very, very, very bottom line. If you're marketing, the idea is you're trying to get people to change their perception of your business or brand so that they choose to work with you so that they choose to bio-frame you so they choose to rent your space, et cetera. So you need to identify what perception, do you, what light do you want them to see you in? Because your job as the business owner to get people to align with where you want them to be so they choose to work with you. That's why some businesses do extremely well because they're very good at getting people to switch their perspective. And on the other hand, submits do terrible because they think like, I can just do anything or this cookie cutter method will work or this et cetera piece of content will work but in practicality, it just doesn't. So how can people, I'm sure a lot of members in our audience, like even I'm thinking like, oh, I have this product, Kajana. I've sold it three times, but I want to hire you. So how can the people in our audience who are thinking your agency might be a good fit for them? How can they find you? So you can find me on Facebook as Kajana Movery. You know, it's a personal profile. I don't really shoot people to my website because you know, it's outdated. I'll be really honest. So you can find me on social media, K-A-J-A-N-A space, M-O-V-E-R-Y. Just shoot me a DM. I'm on social media all the time, which may come as a surprise. And we can connect and figure something out. And if they can't find your Facebook profile? If you can't find my Facebook profile, we may not be a good match. So I'm gonna suggest you go and look for another social marketing consultant because we're gonna have some serious barriers to over jump together. And I don't really have, you don't really, it's okay. It's okay. It's not me. It's you. Yeah, it's totally you. It's okay though, but it's you. Let's be clear. All right. Well, thank you for coming on the show, Kajana. I've really enjoyed having you here. And is there any last minute advice you'd like to give to our audience? Number one thing, social media, always, always, always. Who are you? Who are they? Why should they care? If you can answer those three questions, anything you post with those three questions. Who are you? Who are they? Why should they care? You're golden. That's it. Awesome. Thank you, Kajana. Now viewers, thank you for watching next week. Tune in because I'll be talking with Pam Chambers again, and you'll be surprised at what we talked about. So I will see you next week, Tuesday at 1 p.m. on Out of the Comfort Zone. See you then.