 addition of the public works commission meeting calling this to order at 634 first item on the agenda is the Agenda itself We can scan that it looks it looks fine on my end. I think there's there may be a question on one of the consent agenda items That is the complete streets form So if anything I might might suggest in 4d from consent I'll make a motion to pull the 4d off the consent agenda and make it some other number down below 7.1 would work for that staff. Yeah, it's like a 7 okay 7.1 Thank you for that motion second We have a motion from vice-chair on Yovanovako a second from Commissioner Muntano Question over me. I wanted actually need to pull C as well a motion on the table that's been seconded Here though, I'm like a motion on the second you could offer a friendly amendment Would it be possible to add also pulling C From the agenda the all-way stop proposal at Luma Street and Mansfield Avenue So in discussion around this motion, there's a suggestion from Commissioner over me to pull for C All-way stop at Luma's and Mansfield That friendly amendment is fine with me. So to pull items C and D off the consent agenda and move them Into deliberative right sure It's friendly to the motioner Would that be friendly to this indeed it is Commissioner Muntano as well Thank you, so we're looking at a modified motion here. Is there any other discussion around that all rights None will go to a vote then Commissioner Muntano, aye Commissioner over be aye vice-chair on Yovanovako aye I for myself I Modified agenda has passed. Thank you we forward to Public forum is certainly welcome public comments at this time request to keep your Keep your remarks brief please Is there anyone on the phone or sign up to speak in the room? Sure. So I just want to let the folks on the phone know We have a quite a few members of the public use the raise your hand feature On zoom if you do wish to speak now or in future public comment periods during tonight's meeting and If anybody's called in which at this point, I don't think they have please use star nine You have folks in the room, but we have to sign up We'll go one by one in the room and then switch to zoom Great. Thank you Oh It's Brian Alcorp. I am one of the owners at the Dan daily planet on Center Street I'm here to talk about What we've had two summers part of the expanded sidewalks program Yeah, and what I'd really like to do is talk about bringing that back into effect For us on Center Street, there's there's three restaurants right in row on that street and in the last two summers It's it's really helped us a lot to be able to put outside seating there for dining and And in order to do that You know, we had to make a lane shift and It took some parking spaces to do that, but it's no different than what you've allowed for other restaurants in the city As long as their parking spots are in front of their restaurant You've allowed them to put their outside seating there and do away the parking spots. So in order in order for us to do it you made a lane shift there and In the last two summers You know, it's allowed us to put a deck there. I think it's really helped Center Street You know, it's kept a lot of riff draft off the street Um You know it and and by having the deck there it's made us look like a legitimate restaurant You know in the times of the restaurant business in Burlington it right now. I mean, it's not a good time You know in the last two years haven't been a good time. We just bought this place two years ago We were open a month and we had to shut down because of the pandemic You know, and then you allowed us to do this and it and it helped us through the summer You know, um Restaurants right now in the city, you know, I don't know if you've been out there But there's a lot of them that aren't open but maybe a couple day nights a week because they aren't finding any help We haven't had that problem. We've got a lot of help. We employ 38 people at our place You know and some of them might only work a shift of week and whatnot but you know, we got people that are coming in there and want to work and And You know by having our outside seating it's allowed us to seat 35 ish 35 more people um You know, so I guess what I'm asking you is, you know, can we reimplement this? this lift this Shift change in the in the traffic and eliminate a few parking spaces To help out three restaurants in a row and I'm speaking for the other two restaurants But I'm I'm really here for our restaurant um But I I know that the other two restaurants have used this also and You know, I I guess I'm here to ask to re-implement this expanded sidewalks program for center street so that we can put our deck back up this summer Open for any question. Great. Yeah. Thank you. We don't um You know, there's nothing on our agenda on our warren's agenda, right to deliberate on this item, but we'll certainly Take your input. I hear you. I'm clear. Director Spencer. Yeah, yeah staff has been in communication I just personally introduced myself and we will follow up on this about some ideas given the expanded sidewalk programs over We're now shifting into more of the traditional encumbrance, but uh, some of the the operational issues that We've talked to The owners about still need to be worked through we'll continue to work with them See if we can find a solution. Uh, and if the the the if you don't find an acceptable solution You're welcome to come back the commission can, uh, you know overrule of staff recommendation if uh, if that's Your perspective. Okay. All right. I appreciate that. I just like to say again how you know last two summers We haven't had any issues there, you know with traffic and you know, nobody's run into our deck or had any problems there So I think it's a great program and it worked well for us. Appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you Hi, i'm jane nodell and i'm here to talk about north nooski avenue um project that i've been following or involved with for Very long time And the last at the last meeting of the last council they adopted a resolution um that directed the city to move forward with installing bike lanes north south bike lanes On north nooski avenue north of the food shelf. So in that stretch between the food shelf and the community health center Um, which was kind of a nice compromise from the original position, which I think would have done a lot of harm to the neighborhood Um, that said there's still a lot of people are very worried about the impact the removal of the parking may have And and even though the council did act the project is not over Because the resolution specified Um, some work that the city council is asking the public works department to do and i'm hoping that the commission will also get engaged with this and um And specifically the dpw staff has been asked to continue to work with the many businesses and non-profit organizations on that stretch of north nooski avenue to identify some off street parking to help Accommodate some of the demand that's currently being met by the on street parking And if you're familiar with that avenue, you know that there are lots of non-profits there that work with um marginalized populations And there are a number of small businesses owned by many of them new americans Um, and we certainly want all of these organizations to continue to thrive into the future Um, and I I know that director spencer will continue to be active and i'm just really here to kind of say Many of us, you know are continue to follow this. Um We would love to help communicate with the public about what's been going on and you know We have an organized group and we'd love to work in partnership with the department with the commission to kind of get it done I think it is it can be done um, and i'm encouraged that um We're going to keep you we have a commitment to continue continue working on this. Um, and So just want to thank you for your time Thank you Uh Hi, good evening um I was going to speak on one of the items that was on consent has now been moved off But it's the always stop on lumas and mansfield um, and I understood that um, there's no recommendation from staff because you're going to wait until the side the mansfield side path is Complete and utilized and see if that would generate some um, other rec some final recommendation about the always stop I don't live on mansfield avenue, but I travel it a lot and I understand The delay in making a recommendation, but I wanted to speak to the planters and the the visual barrier or obstacles that they provide Or create for a driver um, and I'm not sure when when those are installed Who evaluates? If there is a visual barrier If it's someone in a truck, they're not going to be bothered by that But if it's someone in a car It certainly is troubling Um, especially where the stop line is on lumas You have to stop there and then you at least for me I have to inch inch inch close to mansfield because I can't see over the planted barriers when there's nothing in the the planters It's sort of okay, but not wonderful So in the interim while you're doing the side path I would really request that the commission Ask the department to reevaluate the visual barriers the planters create and have people do that in Cars not just trucks and see if there can be some improvement. I think The attempt to make it safer I understand that but I think in the as a result It has created an unintended hazard and it's been there from the get-go And I know some of the printed comments reference The planters as problematic and that those comments come from people who actually live on the street So I want to thank you for your time and I just wanted to bring that to your attention and I hope That someone will look at that Before the side path is done and if there needs to be a modification make that modification Thanks again Sheriff Hogan, uh, just quickly to respond the side path project on mansfield will also include traffic calming improvements on mansfield and those planters will be replaced by curves And grass so the issue will get addressed this year Hi, can you hear me? Yes, we can Thanks Yeah, I'd also like to speak to the north wienerski avenue project and first just to thank the staff for all their hard work. It was probably over three years of meetings and a really long process that I think ended with a You know a good compromise From my perspective the conversation became really difficult regarding this bike lane as opposed to other neighborhoods because there are complex race income and cultural dynamics in the neighborhood and you know that really requires City and other officials with power and resources to meet people where they're at Especially when they don't have the power and resources to navigate what's mostly a white middle class dominant culture And and that's what these projects are. They're very difficult for regular people to navigate. So as jane said we worked with Um a lot of loan contentants and the immigrant owned businesses and the nonprofits that really don't have the time to engage with the process and And they you know As you've heard have had a really hard time making the transition in their minds to how they're gonna Proceed without parking and and this just speaks to the need for the city to have a policy of a just transition when it comes to climate crisis solutions So one thing I'd like to ask the dpw commission to do Is to understand and adopt a just transition policy So that we use procedural equity when facing climate crisis solutions. These are all terms and concepts from the state Global warming solutions act and climate plan that just was adopted There's a lot more work to be done on the on the avenue and as jane said we would like to understand from dpw how The department's going to proceed. I understand there's meetings with city counselors and all kinds of conversations going on but we'd like to have the transparency about how the department staff will proceed with You know making all of these constituents aware of what's going to happen and how they can best work around The project so that they can continue Contribute in as residents and businesses on north oneeus scavenger. It's a fragile neighborhood. It was developed very intentionally in the 1990s in order to to co-locate social services and to have affordable housing so that people Could who work at those nonprofits could live there too and people could also use the services like the health center so The disruption in this case is pretty significant and disruptive Climate solutions hurt those most vulnerable neighbors of ours the most Thank you Thank you That is all that is All right okay Are you taking off? Okay. Yeah, that's fine. Yeah. Thanks for coming All right with that it will close public forum and move forward to our thinned out consent agenda. There are two items remaining on a content agenda for a approval of draft minutes from march and february meetings and For b parking adjustment in front of 58 pearl streets I'll make a motion on the consent agenda I'll make a motion to approve the amended consent agenda Thank you for that motion vice chair on your second I'll second second from commissioner bows. Thank you for that Is there any discussion around that motion? all right So now we'll go to a vote then uh, commissioner muntenu. I commissioner overby I commissioner bows I vice chair neil vivanco I I for myself It's an agenda passes five to zero. Thank you moving forward to item five an agenda towing fee ordinance change From mr. Padgett Good evening. Good evening everyone. I'm division director for parking and traffic um, jeff padgett And i'm here tonight to continue my ongoing quest to make our ordinances Align with our operations and remain modern and over thinking so that's a preamble to It might get a little in the weeds. I'm going to try to keep it as out of the weeds as I can So certainly ask questions if I haven't gotten deep enough on something We do have uh, kevin splain explains towing on the zoom tonight. I believe rob has promoted him So at the appropriate time he can chime in to answering questions Um, so in essence what we're looking to do tonight Make do four things one is make a fundamental change the way ordinance works is to take the rate structure out of ordinance So that the ordinance says you must have a rate structure and the public works commission needs to approve the rate structure But it's not baked into the ordinance Which is a much more difficult heavier lift to make Rational changes to rates products all that type of stuff. It's much more of an operational issue So that's that's part one part two is to remove a whole paragraph that is Duplicative and also references an alternative rate for private property versus public property It just kind of doesn't make sense. So just kind of striking that all together and third which is actually really critical is it's Changing the way that we notify people of their impounded cars Right now the ordinance says that splain's towing will notify the impounded vehicle owner However, in order to do that we have to divulge this to splains The name that's associated with the license plate number Or I'll say can't contact the person Well, that connection is the very connection that's protected by See just the criminal justice information system is what we're certified to protect Which is why we have locks on our door while our people are certified I think we've talked about this before with respect to LPR Plate recognition stuff. So we're taking it very seriously this this connection So what we've done is changed the language to make it so that we Notify people of impounded cars now There's a whole different state process related to how splains in the end can actually take ownership of an impounded car If it's if it's abandoned unclaimed whatever So we need to work out and I've talked with with kevin about this quite a bit How we can create an operation there But the key for you guys is fixing the ordinance so that the ordinance isn't in violation of the federal law And then the fourth thing which is not in ordinance, which is the actually the towing rate table So if we're going to pull the rates out of ordinance And say they're in a rate table, we also need you guys to approve the rate table So those are the four general things that we're doing um And I without I pretty lengthy memo here explaining everything how we came to Our belief that this that kevin's proposal is a reasonable proposal So I guess i'm willing to open it up now and answer questions have kevin step in and talk to how his costs have changed over 10 years So i'll leave it that Sure. Yeah, thank you for that intro. I so um bring it to the commission for any Questions discussion we have Which are mutano Hey, thank you for that. I just have one question actually about the the changes itself part 20 74 in ordinance Could you speak to part d? Which is orange and underlined so I assume that's also an addition that wasn't there previously. Oh, yes. I'm sorry I failed to mention that Yeah, so we just wanted to make it very clear that was sort of wrapped up in the old impoundment language that they had that They could actually require take ownership of the car So we just wanted to make it expressly because we struck so much out of c We needed to make d sort of very clear that To cars towed the cars never claimed and there is a whole state law Around what it means to be an abandoned car and when the towing company has the right to claim it We just wanted to make it very explicit that that process is deferred to the state process. That's not us Thanks for the clarification. Yeah, sorry all right, uh commissioner overby um I I have two questions I I love it when you try to clean up the ordinance. That's that's the first comment So I appreciate you're doing that and it really really does help because there's a lot of goofy things that need to be fixed So thank you very much. Um, but first question is is burlington's towing done by a pool of towing companies? Or is it just a um, a sole vendor contract with splains? Um, splains is our only vendor and they're the only responded to our bid process So it's like an annual bidding of some sort that actually it's a five-year bid Five-year contract Okay, that answers the first question and then then the the question I had about the operation of the notice I'm looking at uh, the I guess it's item c where you're having the city notify the The holder of the vehicle within seven days um Am I in the right spot there? So it would be that the 20-74 charges uh Notify by registered mail within seven days of the impoundment of the vehicle, right? So the city would now do that instead of take on that right straight up and and I just had a question about how That would work like in snow ban kind of things or it just would seem like when people go out and they can't find their car Uh, you know no bands work a little differently because yeah, well, maybe technically impounded They're moved street to street. Okay, so that answers that part, right? So I'll tell you exactly right now. It's uh Leonard Dusharm will be here at seven o'clock tomorrow morning Hand on the phone because it's uh, we're doing a clean sweep tonight And somebody's going to get to it and they're going to be calling it 7 a.m One or another card. So that's a that's sort of a different process because that's just street to street So then the uh, when when somebody's vehicle like disappears off the street I'm just curious about functionally. It would seem like it would be handy to have some other Quicker way for them to to you know, like a website or something that would be done in a very, you know We've discussed this because uh many many times and the problem comes with the sieges situation So you have to have a you would have to have a secure login to say that this is my car Which means you would have to say well, I think I'm going to get my car towed this year So I'm going to set up an account with the city give them my name give them my things a trade account It becomes very difficult. No, I'm just thinking of by just the plate number And the fact that it was impounded it would be very simple So you don't so I would I know my I know I'm just I'm just making a suggestion Because like I was concerned about people whose car, you know, they go out and they It's gone and they want to figure out where it is and they can obviously call the police or you know, but that's a lot of Labor so if there was a way that you could You know I'm saying something like that Just to save effort save effort for you guys of calls and make it so everybody knows if your car disappears You know, did you leave it the wrong place that you thought, you know You came home a little bit late and you didn't remember. Yeah. Anyway, so that was my other question Simple answer is if we can find a way to do that legally we are happy to do that We are still trying to find a way to do that Yeah, the seven days thing is I think is helpful for you to not have to have to do it within a couple Days to notify people their truck their car got impounded, but it seems like a long wait for somebody And they're going to call somebody they're going to start well I think practically from an operational perspective if somebody gets toed and impounded on monday We need to be sending them that a letter on tuesday, right? But but but the fact that it says that you can you might be busy and it might take seven days You're authorized to take seven days. We're trying to be practical. We want to have a practical I'm just thinking of one extra thing for the that will save people getting calls And you can still do the seven days for the registered thing because you know, you might have people that Don't use their car every day and wouldn't even notice So, okay, that was my that was my there were my two questions So but I appreciate you're cleaning things up and I don't think I have a problem with the way the rates are compared to what you research for the other communities, so I'm sure it's not pleasant for people to have to pay for that, but It'll happen once and maybe not again for each person Like I've probably said here before we really have an explicit goal of towing fuel people I get that I know it's a very important tool. We need to have it, but we would like to use it more Surgic, right? Thank you That's my thank you Commissioner Bose No questions at this time. Thank you vice chair on Yovanov Great just maybe just to quickly follow up From commissioner overbie I was just going to try to google this or where's the information online or on public works site about How to contact if your vehicles towed? Because that information might be helpful. I haven't had a car towed in a while and now that Public works handles parking That information would maybe help alleviate some of the calls that you cut that you may get So that there is you know something clear on our site or that goes out in from porch forum this week during The street sweeping And then I guess what's the The timeline and efficiency of informing owners. You say you have this seven day window What's typically The the turnaround on informing owners of that their vehicles towed Well, we haven't actually done it ourselves. Kevin the splain's towing has been doing that process and Without getting into the weeds the state process has a 30 day window on it And there's also like a 10 day criteria. There's all these different gates in the state of excess for Claiming an abandoned vehicle So I'm not too versed on that. I know the seven days is within Within a window period that we so then what we can do is support Splains in their efforts to claim the abandoned vehicle When that time comes, you know, we're not encouraging that obviously, but we want to be sure okay doing all of our paperwork, right? So they can do their paper Okay, so seven days sounds reasonable and then any information that we can Communicate either on a website or a phone porch form of if your car gets towed. This is this is where to look for it Or for the steps to take Go ahead Okay. All right. Thanks And then one just final thing. Um, Jeff, this was um, we asked this over email. So I just wanted for the record We asked about a clarification for the extra 20 per person per tow per vehicle Um, and you responded to that, but I'm wondering if you can just can respond for the record What are the situations when a second person? Would be needed or has been needed? Um, and and how how you plan on I guess tracking that is it is it for every tow or just for certain vehicles, right? So in special cases specifically sort of ironically for like motorcycles motorcycles are actually hard to tow Because they're they're only two wheels so often they'll need a second person to help with moving of the of the motorcycles so the $20 charge is $20 per person per tow per tow vehicle per tow So if somebody if we call explains to common tow motorcycles, for example They'll say hey, we want to put another we need to put another body on that truck So the tow will now be caught that tow will cost $20 more So i'll i'll fix the rate table to make it more clear that it's $20 per person per tow vehicle per tow not per day or at our request Yeah, yeah, these are all services that we are purchasing Okay, all right, that makes sense. Well, actually we are not purchasing on that The towed will actually purchase them, but we are requesting them and we're right responsible for them if they don't get paid Benefit of the fines food program as we start getting compensated those tows that have been sitting out for years Okay All right, thanks. That's that's all my questions. I appreciate that great. Thank you. There's also a typo on that page was y'all fix Thanks Thank you. Um, just a clarification on that on that last point then so the dpw requests the service Towing company on contracts provides the service And then does the uh vehicle owner Pay the towing company They end up well, that's part of what's a little complicated right now is right now They can pay two different ways They can either go out to splains yard and they pay and they take all the money They take the fine and the towing charge and then they pay the fine back to us And then sometimes people come to us and they pay the fine and tow here Then we have to send the tow money over to splains. So this will streamline that whole thing They will get a check from us Because we collect everything that we put fine money over here and tow money over there How does this simplify that process? Because it's because all of the money is coming here Versus some of the money going to splits, right? Like you coming you pay your ticket here. You're paying for tow and fine So we owe that money the tow money to splains Well, the same thing is happening right now at its planes as somebody comes and they pay their fine and their tow at Splains then splains has to cut us a check for the fine So it creates an accounting kind of dance between both of our operations and this will have all the money flowing into us And then one stream of money going to splits Gotcha. Thank god if I could run through that back to suppose I get towed tonight I call Leonard tomorrow morning Find out. Yes. My car's been towed. I come down here public works to pay it And then go to splains. And splains gets notified that I've settled up Correct. So we have a very close working relationship with splains, sort of extensions of each other's offices But there's a very important difference specifically around sieges Data security. Okay Nothing further on my own. Thank you for that All right Open it up for a public comment at this time If there are any members of the public on the call looking to speak to this item Uh, chair hogan's opened up public comments. So please use uh, the raise your hand feature and At this time there's nobody signed up before public comment Correct. It's okay. Thank you for that. I'll bring it back to the commission or seeking a vote on the specified ordinance changes here Welcome a motion if anyone's got I'll move to accept the or I'll make a motion to Uh, accept the recommendation Thank you for that motion commissioner bows Is there a second? Second from commissioner mutano. Thank you Is there any discussion around that motion? All right, we'll go to a vote then uh first to the phone commissioner bows I Vice-chair on the obo vanco I Commissioner mutano. I Commissioner over b. Hi I for myself motion passes five to zero. Thank you Moving forward item six two pearl street lots Welcome back The division director jack pageant parking and traffic Round two, um, this one is um, not as complicated. Um, but interesting nonetheless, um Fundamentally, we are looking at the pearl street parking lot, which is behind the old bobs restaurant And that parking lot has historically been underutilized um We've been measuring parking occupancy in that lot for the past couple of months and Running it's running at about 10 spaces out of 30 um, and so what we're proposing is to Sell some monthly parking permits in that lot to increase activity in the lot and also provides an option For some of the elmwood parkers to park something somewhere closer to their office now how we actually Navigate that sales process where we're still working on but But as obviously it's not intended to be any sort of mitigation for the elmwood lot Closure because it just doesn't have the capacity. We only there's only 15 spaces So this we're looking at it. We we're looking at really as an opportunity to increase the energy in the lot and hopefully just weight some of the you know negative behavior that's happening in that area so One very important change to the memo and my request is that there was a typo in my database And the occup the capacity of that lot is not 35. It's 30 So what we'll be asking for is instead of 20 permits we're asking for 15 Which still achieves the goal is just just a math error So apologies for that We're looking to continue the same rate the $55 rate from elmwood And in the process of this we're also along the lines of my previous presentation cleaning up a little bit lots have Never had parking agreements. So I know a couple years ago. We made we've worked with you to create a generic parking agreement for the garages Well on my list since then it's been to do the same for the lots So when this came along I said that this is a great opportunity to take that generic agreement that we had with the garages and basically slip in the word and lots And and that allows us to have a form that we can sell various parking products to people in the garages or people in the lots and that will be under Contracts with folks in the lots, which is a better place to just They got have an agreement. So that's what this does too. So it Increases energy in the lot gets it more utilized. Hopefully helps out some of the elmwood displays people and provides this administrative, you know, cleanup and starts getting people under parking Uh, and I have talked with the businesses on the streets The only feedback I got was there was concern that we were actually taking 15 meters out And to be clear, we are not taking any meters out. It will function just like just like the parking garages When you get a perp a permit in the garage, you're not guaranteed parking You know, it's what we call a hunting permit. You're allowed to go in and find a space and this will operate the same Um, so no meters are going away Um, it will operate exactly the same on the weekends and should in the evenings because it will function Just like come what did it would be, you know, no overnight parking type of situation so Just to lay that fear that was the only Concerned fear that I heard from business owners of adjacent was that parking would go away because the meters were going away They are not Thank you for that. Yeah All right, I will open up for commissioner discussion at this time Mr. Mutano, I guess kind of just like a quick Comment it looks like on your Bart shot chart showing all the different days Is sometimes that there's 30 spots available when you checked. Is this lot often totally empty? It's very underutilized very and I mean because I talked to the parking enforcement folks the parking service agents and yeah, there's like if we go in there all the time and it's just Very very Yeah, there's times when it's just dead empty. All right. Thank you um But it is busy on weekends that I did hear from the business owners. They said it's actually kind of a problem on the weekends They have a hard time getting you know, like there's a dog dog training place. They have a hard time They have an event on a Saturday morning It's busy So I guess these counts were only on weekdays the ones that you show there. Yeah, because that's when the enforcement is happening Yeah And that's likely when we'd have the downtown weekday use by permit So it actually works well to maximize utilization Thank you Commissioner Bose This is very helpful context. No further questions from me. Thanks. All right Vice chair on the avaco This is um, this is great. Jeff. I really like this idea of really maximizing um our Surface parking. I mean absolutely we need to do this. So we're not screaming that we're removing parking all over the city, which we're not So I haven't been to that car park in quite some time What's the signage like, I mean if you're saying it's underutilized during the day Is it because it's not visible and I guess if we're going to be selling permits for that spot to make sure that People know where to find it that they know that it is You know a city owned lot as opposed to You know remnants of boves. So I guess, you know just being able to address that would be great. That's it Thank you Commissioner overby I just have a question about the the status of the uh agreement we like the public works commission was seven years ago, maybe uh Five years ago basically agreed to sell that lot back to um Boves for the development of the hotel and the apartments and all And I just wanted to know what the status of that agreement is because as far as I was concerned The the commission had already agreed that that that lot would be returned to ownership of the um the bove family in order to do their uh their development and they obviously had some Uh some hoops to jump through first But what's the have you made an agreement with the boves about that agreement that we made to sell it to them? We still own a lot. I I think shape and could I speak better to this topic than I can? I'm not directly involved in that part of it as long as the lot is in our hands. I'm running and so the the purchase and sale agreement detailed a whole bunch of uh requirements for the Developer before the lot would be transferred from the city My understanding from cito is that those Those conditions have not been met and as a result, uh, this lot remains a city lot So the agreement is terminated I can't recall whether or not it was a time limited Agreement I believe it was and I believe that period has passed, but I am not entirely sure So we can double check and let you know I think I would do that because I think That's a constraint that um You want to know We we we voted. I mean you might have been on the commission at that point And there was contention about selling a public parking lot and uh, So there's a commitment there And uh, I think you should know what that is because otherwise you're you're not going to be able to carry through with this agreement It's just something that you know, I think you might I don't know. I don't know what to say about voting on this Only because I really feel like That's a piece of information that I thought maybe you would have already Cleared up that that he's not going to follow through on that contract for sale That makes sense information. Maybe maybe somebody's got maybe you've got the answer Hi, uh, laura wheelock with a dpw I've actually been working with our cito department and zoning trying to help figure out where development is happening throughout the downtown Um and both cito and zoning the zoning permit uh expired. So this project is considered Closed or uh, nonexistent as it relates to both cito's development and our zoning department So we don't have to do anything to say that our A decision to sell it is now expired It starts over everybody starts over we open it. That's all I needed to know That's what I needed to know that it wasn't hanging out there that there was going to be A claim against it in a year after everybody's got their parking passes. Great. Thanks. Thanks Great. Thank you for that To put a good catch on the seasonal demand patterns and adjusting your your ask here. Yeah, like to see it Just sort of a question on practical terms so the the meters remain one meter for each of our 30 available spaces How does parking enforcement know if somebody's got a Permit is that because they're in their license their license plate is entered. We actually have a We're doing well. We have a couple different ways of doing it. Yes, their license plate is in our system Yep, so it's easy enough for your portion people to enforcement doesn't know the difference They type in the number and the program goes out and looks to see if it's a valid parking if it's valid they move on The enforcement folks won't even know if it's a per monthly permit Or if it's somebody who's just happened to that paid up Right. Yeah Oh, we all our parking service agents need to know is are they have they paid or have they not paid? Sounds great All right. Yeah, nothing further on my end I will open up for public comment at this time Chair Hogan does not appear anybody has signed up for public comment. All right Looks like we have no one in the room as well All right with that I will bring it back to the commission. We're seeking a vote on this Post ordinance change here Welcome a motion if anyone's so inclined I'll make a motion to accept the The language of the staff recommendation Thank you for that option I'll second All right. We have a motion from vice chair on Yvonko the second from commissioner Bose. Thank you for that Is there any discussion around that motion? All right, let's go to a vote that in the room commissioner overby I Mr. Montana I Mr. Bose I Vice chair on Yvonko I I for my Motion passes five to zero Thanks everybody. Yeah. Thank you very much Moving forward item seven on our agenda main street concept I will just start off by saying I'm very excited to be bringing this to you tonight and Lauren Olivia who are Present who presented last night to the Duke and presenting tonight and attending the public meeting tomorrow or to be commended for three nights in a row here of this really important project in the beginning of a Important engagement period as we seek to go to the council in a few weeks to get Direction on the conceptual plan so we can move to final design All right. Thank you. We have a few of our consulting team here that we're going to give a Brief ish presentation. It'll mirror the public meeting or the neighborhood meeting presentation that we're actually going to give tomorrow night as well So it's a it's a four night a week As shape and said, uh, Olivia and I are managing for DPW side the main street project. Um It's sorry, it's just odd not being able to see the the rest of the team, but uh, I'm sure they have their videos on in the background They are sharing their screen here. So they are definitely there behind the scenes. Um And uh, we are just DPW so as we move forward, there's there's a bunch of other city departments that are working on this project We are here tonight to give you guys just the preview and overview. It's informational only We do hope to come back to the may commission so that we can Uh, hopefully have addressed any comments or concerns that you have tonight or throughout any of the other engagement that we provide And then we'd seek your support at the may meeting. Uh, just for the concept Not actually adopting actual regulations, but just um so that the council can be informed as they work on their part of the decision So If we can move to the next slide That was our welcome. Um, so this is a little bit about our team. So we have VHB agency and grayscale here tonight. They make up our consulting team And as you can see at the bottom really there's A wide variety of our city departments who have been working behind the scenes with parks bca reib church tree marketplace cedo And the administration I also give credit to the the less known departments like the city attorney's office You have to help us throw a lot of this and the ct office. So With that i'm going to hand it over to evan from vhb to move us through the rest of the presentation Okay Thanks a lot laura. Good evening everyone. Thank you for having us in tonight to talk about the great streets main street project We're all very excited about it And uh, we do have a formal presentation as laura mentioned. You can see some of the folks here with us tonight The agenda tonight. We're going to provide an overview of the project and our process today. We're going to talk about the public engagement that we've been undertaking Throughout the design process here and as we're working through the early stages of the project and talk about the uh the toolkit of the design That we're using to inform the concepts we're working on And then we're going to walk you through the current design concepts for two different options on main street And um into tomorrow tomorrow night's meeting. We're going to have breakout rooms for the public But tonight the breakout room will just be this group here So project overview This project has been around a while. Um, that is the great streets initiative has been around a while Started in uh 2015 some standards were developed through 2016 and then some of the projects Went into design and then construction you all know about city hall park, which was already built as was two blocks of st paul street when now we're on to the next one, which is the main street corridor and that corridor runs from battery street in the west and it runs Six full blocks to the east ending at south union street So that's the section of main street that we're going to be talking about tonight And the the section of main street that our team has been working on We got started in uh october or so of last year Got engaged by the city and we've been doing some of the behind the scenes sort of things Since that time things like field survey geotechnical investigations looking into the existing utilities But we've also been doing things like reaching out to the public and different focus groups Which susanna is going to talk about in just a few minutes here. We did have a neighborhood meeting At the beginning of february that was our first one and we have another big one tomorrow night In between we've been talking to all sorts of uh city agencies and these focus groups From around the city to try to get everyone's opinions and ideas About main street and and what people want to see out of the project So right now, uh, it's late april and we've been working through concepts for the main street redesign Looking forward, uh, you can see the schedule over the next couple years there on your screen But we'll be working on concepts through the rest of the spring and into the summer Uh, and then later in the year we'll get into the preliminary plans design Uh, and then we will go through the final design plans and contract plans Through 2023 so that later in 2023 our current goal is to get the project out to bid And then into construction and construction would last from late 23 Until probably 2025 depending on what other initiatives in the city has going on Such as the possible addition of the ravine sewer So that's kind of the timeline that we're up here for the project So i'm going to turn it over to susanna at this point to talk about what we've been up to as far as community engagement Thank you evan. Yeah, so as mentioned there has been a lot of outreach in the last couple of months There's about 30 city meetings that have been attended that you'll see listed on the next slide Some listening sessions with focus groups who are underrepresented Burlingtonians We've had an online survey our website is active And we did have that initial main street kickoff public. Sorry neighborhood meeting with 60 folks plus lots of advertising yard signs We hope you've seen postcards Flyers next Um, again, these are all of the meetings where we've uh, we meaning the sort of client and consultant team Or one or the other um have been for the last Since the beginning of 2022 with the four in blue Well, the top one in blue is is tonight and then we've got a few more coming up as as evan mentioned tomorrow night our public neighborhood meeting number two Um, and the whole time we have been Preparing little summaries of what we're hearing from folks So, um, we really encourage you to take a look at that in a little bit more depth on great streets btv dot com There are for each group that we've met with between that sort of neighborhood and the various focus groups We've prepared a a little poster summarizing all of the things that we've heard from them Um, and we you know would love for you to take a look but just to uh, sort of summarize sort of the the The themes that are really rising to the top between all of those folks There are a couple pretty common to residents at the top that main street's vital cultural and civic resource for newcomers and A long time berlin tonyans And it's a gateway that should represent the diverse and rich culture history and identity of all residents On the bottom are some that are particularly of interest to businesses regarding maintenance and the Investments today needing to support future needs and last for years to come As well as coordinating this project with other city priorities And then in the middle are some that you see common to residents and businesses That this should be a place for Our arts and programming of all ages that accessibility and safety of pedestrians is paramount And that a clear parking and wayfinding strategy will support the success of the businesses on main street So let's take a closer look at what we have in our toolkit when it comes to the redesign of main street We are actually given A basic reconfiguration of the right-of-way from the 2016 work that was done on great streets But essentially what we're talking about here is streamlining the roadway bed with the two drive lanes and two parallel parking lanes to to the the kind of What they need to be in order to give space back to outside of the road bed and therefore make space for walkways for amenities and planting stormwater uptake a dedicated bike lane And all of that sort of keeps in mind that we're also replacing Utilities underground here. So this is a real revamping of the street section above and below This represents an ideal section. We do know that in parts of main street And our six block stretch, there's going to be encumbrances Like at city hall at the griffin Where we don't have all of that space available for the amenities outside the roadway So we're going to sort of tweak it where we need to but we're really striving to to create that balanced section along the length of the six blocks So just to get mathematical with that, we're talking about taking a roadway with a 50 to 70 feet and making it a consistent 40 feet We look at parking spaces going from 157 to 90 and we've got some ideas about how to sort of mitigate that But again, the idea is that we're achieving a lot of things with that space Including bike lanes including a consistent sidewalk that doesn't go from really skinny to overly wide That we're going to have generous spaces available for stormwater treatment and for green space and Spaces for public art and and plazas that just don't exist today We do See a number of ways that we can support parking changes including technology Whether that's apps or variable peak pricing Incentives for reinvesting in parking fees into non motorized travel modes Loading to current off-peak hours employee parking programs We want to build out infrastructure that really makes it Sort of less of a need for parking between bike parking that are transit Better wayfinding to parking that exists off of main street ev charging stations And then very parking restrictions to reflect land use seasonal demand and flex spaces So with that, I think I will hand it over to my colleague Steve Woods who's going to talk about Two different concepts for these six blocks In each case we're talking about a section that's pretty much the same in terms of overall Amounts of space but just different ways of thinking of the the space in terms of the design and the look and feel So Steve take it away thank you just as a Quick reminder or sort of a flashback as it were The overall plan is looking at this main street area from battery street from union And we've done a lot of initial research and planning to look at how the streets activated are addressed Along that full stretch different uses civic use office use service use restaurant and retail use And we've also come to recognize that There may be an inherent Zone or quality that happens along the street by these uses by the densities of the of the street wall And even by the natural topography of the space and land So in thinking about looking at the plan and that aspect Looking down as it were from battery street to union street We have developed these two approach design approaches this way to look at the street One is called artful gateways. The second is called lake city and mountain And Thinking about the design approach associated with artful gateways We see that there is an opportunity for a dignified and continuous streetscape for all six blocks that happen from battery to union with particular emphasis at the intersections and also great emphasis at the center as it were between church street and st. Paul So in looking at that plan we're seeing the opportunity to describe a very clean unified and thoughtful Sort of rhythm that happens along the street opportunities where there is places for planting to develop a nice clean and organized shade street shade tree street system clean straight and accessible bikeways on either side offering clarity at the intersections and the opportunities to provide Good spaces at the at the corners where there's bumpouts to gather for Clean crossings closer crossings that are here now offering safety for pedestrians living across the street and also opportunities for stormwater management in those locations The blow-ups in each section show an area at south union street between memorial auditorium no brand salon In that section, it's it's a bit of a tight area of encumbrance as mentioned before So we're looking to potentially potentially show a shared mixed-use path that happens on the south side of the street in that location That's one variation that's different from the rest of the streets where the bikeway is a clear and separated from the normal sidewalk sections We do think that within the heart of the space church street and city hall and city hall park offers an opportunity to potentially study A curbless section between church street and st. Paul street similar to what's happening along church street currently, but think there's a nice Opportunity for dialogue between the now activated city hall park and the really rich character that's happening along the southern face of that block including the flint We pick up with that same type of clear character as you move down between shampoony and battery street offering opportunities to for expanded retail and pedestrian space adjacent to vibrant restaurants and clear access to office buildings In looking in cross-section in some of these areas back down this same location We see a clear organization As mentioned previously using the toolkit to provide Separated bikeways from pedestrian ways. We understand there's great change that occurs between the curb line and the streetscape And we see that there's opportunities to have these green spaces manage these these changes in elevation there's opportunities also for flex use of parking areas for outdoor dining Earlier in the meeting there was conversation about the benefits a lot of restaurants see from having these these extra outdoor spaces available for use So we think that there's opportunities to have that be thoughtfully incorporated within the parking spaces when available seasonally or during special events As Susanna mentioned we have been reading and listening actively listening to different community groups and business groups and all of the blue thought bubbles that are shown here begin to show comments that we've heard that directly relate to some of the concept concepts we're developing We want to make sure when you go back to the neighborhood that we are not stopping That interaction but continuing the dialogue in a circular and responsive manner through all the design work that we're doing We've heard a lot of information from those community groups about the desire for activation of the street through art through signage So we see that there are locations where the art may occur both in the ground plane In vertical aspects and maybe over the street in the gateway aspect And then back at the top This is the section that's showing the encumbrances on the south side So we have the opportunity and desire to maintain some sort of a green character on both sides of streets So we think there might be a an option to have a shared path in this uphill slower moving bicycle lane Where there is where there are those encumbrances It's we call the this there's option to art through gateways because we we know that and see that the quality and care of vibrant and and Great artwork is this already existing within bruenton. It could be enhanced and have have main street act as a A showpiece or show place for that with thoughtful consideration of these larger pieces and activations of Spaces happening within the gateways locations Particularly at the ends union street and a battery street But also at each intersection and at the heart of main street between church street and st. Paul street the planting concept for this one again speaks to formality and clean Unison and rhythm that moves along main street providing adequate and more than adequate soil spaces Either in planted zones or within structural soil or cell-to-cell systems within the hardscape areas That are happening in the areas that might be closer to businesses or activated zones of streetscape Particularly within the when you ski to st. Paul block management of water in this Sloping landscape sloping streetscape is very important. So the continued use of stormwater tension areas in appropriate locations and with appropriate management and baffling of water in High steep slope zones would be incorporated in a thoughtful manner along the street as well And then zooming in a bit. This is a zoomed in section at church street Moving To the west is the center section towards city hall park and then to the east is towards musky We see that there's different opportunities for zones of use As it were in this conceptual plan You have the adjacent building spillout spaces or frontage zones for for resident or for businesses and residences along this along this frontage We have special to admit specialty amenity zones, which typically occur at the larger hardscape areas that are gained At these bump outs at the intersections Furnishing zones are usually tied in with the green spaces Where street trees would occur These would either have expanded green space for street trees or opportunities for organized seating and gathering And then I mentioned before the flexible parking space those zones. We might be able to activate streetscape with with adjacent uses The second option is called lake city mountain I mentioned before there seems to be three character zones that happen along main street Through the quality of the space that's there. So we thought it might be an opportunity to have that have the main street act as a expressive Zone of the landscape character and the natural character of the area So that that character is being expressed still within a functional streetscape but within nuanced changes in the movement of bikeways And the availability of green space that happens along the stretch of the stretch of the roadway A lot of the similar aspects are seen in both the concepts But you can begin to see this meandering pathway that allows for larger capacity zones of planting when Access to the street or either roadways aren't necessarily required There's still the the desire for a mixed-use path mixed-use path that happens along the south side of the street between union and monewski As you move towards the church street section again, we're looking at a shared street section that happens after church street towards st. Paul but again, there's the sort of more organic movement of spaces and And use that happen on the area behind the back curb towards the buildings We see also that in this concept we would be able to use the tools and the Sort of standards that have been developed within the great streets Works that's on previously, but there might be opportunities to look at materiality Being expressed in very special ways through these different zones For example, if granite is being used within the pavement or in seating blocks or curb edges it may take on a more rough or Exposed face in the mountain area towards a more honed or Refined space within the city and then back to something a little bit more organic within the lake But all using the same materiality something that's native and Familiar to the region Again, we'd look to the Comments that we've heard from different groups Places to sit and hang out with the affordable food options. We heard that from the immigrant and BIPOC group pop-ups, food stands, arts, farmers markets from youth And then obviously the continuation of use of rain gardens and stormwater management from neighborhood meeting groups Again back in the middle section a shared street Not just a shared street, but a curbless street that has the opportunity for more pedestrian interaction Is available within this portion between city hall park In the south side of that block The tree planting that would happen in this area could be one that's using a more Subsurface structured Containment of soils that allows for more expansive use of Seeding and gathering underneath the trees in this zone Art and multicultural sign language and multilingual sign which would be used throughout the street But in those cases where there might be events we look to see their opportunities using The infrastructure of sighting signage and lighting to support those amenities And then again moving towards the north Or the east side, I'm sorry We have sort of the mountain area That's that's expressed here So there might be an opportunity to express native trees that are more fitting to that environment Maybe the inclusion of natural materials of stones or rocks or boulders within the planted areas that speak to that quality But so ever mindful of the safety and movement of bikeways pedestrians and vehicles throughout Art as it's expressed in this option is looking to find its its heart and It's expression in the in the culture and the people that are are living and using and in from the area murals and collaborative works temporary installations Fun and playful types of artworks would be woven throughout main street not necessarily primarily focused at gateways, but Happening and being sprinkled throughout the the whole streetscape space I talked a bit about the materiality and planting again moving away from more Rigid application of planting and something that feels a little bit more organic and a little bit more natural that speaks to the greater space of Wellington something that is unique to to this location not something that might be found in Any typical streetscape something that really defines Main Street in Burlington as being something different Same to with the management of water You see there's an opportunity to have the the storm water treatments expressed differently throughout different areas something that's a little bit more native in the upper portions more captured and Contained within this within the city portion and then back to a more natural gathering collection zone At this at the lakeside all again happening within appropriate locations within the streetscape and its functional edges and then lastly Looking at the use zones all the same type of many zones furnishing zones and flexible zones would be present in this option But just looking to see how the organic quality of movement and available space that could occur to begin to connect some of these zones rather than subdivide them into pockets or to sort of linear gestures So those are the two options that we're working with are are going to be sharing with the community tomorrow all of them both of them look to solve functional issues and problems that are present In the street now, but begin to look to listen to the things we've heard from the community to express that those intangible Qualities that really make Burlington and Main Street special to within itself and so Looking to get feedback from the community about those options tomorrow night So I'll hand it back to Evan to talk about next steps Okay. Thanks, Steve So next steps for the project We do have our big neighborhood meeting tomorrow night And we're going to be going back and talking with the business owners again on May 6th The outreach to the general public and these focus groups is going to continue throughout the remainder of the conceptual design phase And that's going to continue throughout the summer as I mentioned before So we do want to meet with these five focus groups again including the business owners BIPOC and the others that susanna mentioned earlier that will continue throughout the summer Also, we're going to go to the city council on May 9th to share the concept plans with them and make More or less the same presentation We'll also in may be sharing with In may will be sharing with the dpw commission and the church street commission And a bunch of other folks as well as we continue to coordinate with all the parties involved And we are looking for feedback from the public Through our website, there's a survey there and people can register their emails and that sort of thing Before may 14th because of the second city council meeting today We are hoping to get city council approval to Approval of the conceptual plans and allowing us then to move into the final design portion of the project And with that, I think I'll turn it back to Laura for any closing thoughts before we open it up to the group for a discussion Yep, thank you everyone. Um, so yeah as Evan was indicating and I kind of opened up with uh, we're just really Here to hear your thoughts um questions concerns so that as we do move through the rest of this public process and the engagement Which is you know, really meant to be more of a two-way street With the uh, the way that we were presenting this, you know, we want to make sure we have it all together when we come back to you in may Great. Thank you for that Starting the phone here vice chair on the other side Thanks chair um All right, Steve um and Evan These these these are these are really great concepts. I'd be fine with either one. Um I think it's really important that we continue to communicate that streets are for me moving people and goods And that we move away from this idea that streets have to be built for vehicles And I love the concepts because they give priority to Bikes and pedestrians not solely vehicles and they get rid of that ridiculous pull-in parking on lower main street um I think um speaking as um a parent um As i'm sure you know One of the largest public school complexes in the city is right on the edge of union and main street Edmunds elementary and Edmunds middle school um, so the middle school kids have all sorts of freedom and so And they go down to church street So looking at these at these concepts and renderings thinking wow, they will be able to access Church street on their bikes and on foot in a much safer way than exists right now Again, I don't know the exact numbers Um post covet, but they're probably at least 800 students between Edmunds Allen Edmunds middle not insignificant Um, so thank you for that and then I think um looking at um looking at the concepts and looking at main street now Compared to what you have presented as a woman. I feel like there's it's much it looks so much more vibrant um dynamic Multi-use it's a lot it's on a on bike main street is a lot easier to climb And um with the the shifting in the parking and A dedicated bike lane. I would feel a lot safer going up that than humping it up Maple or college street. Um, so I think those are those are fantastic. I like the the um Um The the dynamic curb space Um, I don't know the exact term that you used um steve But um, maybe drop-off spots for either micro mobility or we've got grandma in the car and Let's get her out of the car and then we can go ahead and park um clear signage um for the available parking which there's um, there's plenty of available parking In this in the city of burlington in our in our car parks, especially like you in college just ask Jeff pageant um, so I really feel like if if we can incorporate the signage for the parking that would That would help and if we're really looking at even kind of ways to think about mobility in the future and and possible micro micro mobility and curb space incorporating that into um Into your concepts would be it would be great. Um, I think Um, and I think two more things Um with the seating um on the streetscape Um, a really excellent balance, you know tipping on the side of more seating that you don't have to pay to play Um where you can just sit without having to you know be at a restaurant is is fantastic and welcoming for all regardless of income level and then I think Signage, I don't know how into the weeds you go on this, but there are Over 30 different languages spoken in our public schools We have a lot of international visitors. So signage that is more visual with images And and and kind of fewer words That Is probably more welcoming to all than focusing on, you know, what are the top four languages we want to put on there? Um, and I know there are examples in other countries That we can draw from but we really are such a dynamic city And linguistically diverse that it would be great to take that into consideration. So those are all my comments. Thank you Thanks All right. Thank you commissioner Bose Thank you I was also really really excited to see this I kept thinking oh, I want at first I was thinking did we get this in our package and I missed it How did I miss it because I wanted to dig into so much of what you put up there? I loved both of the The visions I like the way that they were articulated you went by things where I was like no no no go back I want to see more of that So, I mean one of the things I was going to suggest as you continue on the The presentation tour that you you make some form of this Available for us to kind of dig into a little bit more Even in when you presented the five groups you had a slide up there where you had the five groups that I was like, wait, what? What what are they saying? I said, I wanted to get into that because much as Vice-chair, O'Neill vivanka was pointing out the signage was one that I was thinking about as well I was like, oh great. Yeah that it brings this up it I was I was curious process wise. So I was going to say and this is something I'll bring up with director spacer Later on about like this is the kind of process. I hope we do that we don't do in North Wyniske. Anyway, I will bring I will come back to that later, but This is the kind of process. I really hope we do Digging into very diverse groups of users Of these kinds of spaces and that they may not always have You know, there might be competing demands on space and so one of the questions I was thinking some people might ask is In terms of the focus groups themselves, how did you put together put together these focus groups? I'm imagining looking at the list of partners. Maybe REIB or others helped with the recruitment of some of the participants I don't know how many people were in the focus groups, but just maybe a little bit more I can imagine people asking those sorts of questions Um, certainly seeing, you know, you highlighted some of their responses You mentioned doing the survey as well making some of that A little bit more transparent just might be helpful. I mean, this certainly speaks to everything that I envision But perhaps making it It seemed as though this is also coming from very different spaces that you're collecting this data from different points And presenting it in this way So, um, yeah, I mean, I don't really have any suggestions other than the the presentation of this. I just thought it was I love the the lake mountain. I'm gonna get the order wrong, but I love that. I love both of them. I thought they were Really wonderful You know vibrant visions for for what this can be. So, um, so I really applaud you for doing this. Thank you Thank you Thank you um, if I can just Speak to the presentation it has been provided to Holly so that she can post it with the notes If you're really clever, you can find it on the Duke agenda. It was posted last night It's almost identical. Uh, if you want to see it sooner rather than later But as of the meeting tomorrow, it will be posted just at the start of the meeting So anybody who's in the meeting can can find the presentation material on the website and it'll live there For the rest of the time the website exists Great. Thank you for that Commissioner overby I I have Express some concerns about some of the design in the past So I'm not going to go into all of those concerns But one of them is are all the intersections going to be signalized or is there still at this point an opportunity to have A roundabout design in any of the intersections Yeah, I can start that um, then I might ask Evan are from our consulting team to also add in We've asked them to review the intersection control throughout the corridor But there's definitely a lot of other factors that I think that go into What intersection control type that we're going to select and move forward with Honestly, the preliminary information really leads us to showing these concepts as signalized intersections And I'm hopeful Evan. Can you also add into that? And why that why what led us to that? Yeah, sure We certainly acknowledge that there are safety concerns along main street. There are some high crash locations. There's no doubt about that Fortunately a lot of the high crash locations are Involving only motor vehicles and not pedestrians and bicyclists. So that's kind of the good news about the high crashes but with the looking as laura said, we'll be looking more closely at the intersections and the capacity analysis that we've run Says that the signalized intersections Work almost as well as what you would have with the roundabout and as laura said, there are a lot of considerations that go into The traffic analysis such as the proximity of nearby intersections that are signalized that aren't on main street that would have The potential to affect the operation of the roundabouts were they to be part of the equation additionally the the Concepts that we have now do have a lot of safety improvements with them Which includes things like really shortening up the crosswalks at all of the intersections today. The crosswalks Are very long. They're 55 or 65 feet in some cases from curb to curb and pedestrians are often hidden by parked vehicles With the concepts as you may have noted The ball bouts are going to be created at each one of the intersections so that those Crossings are going to go from 55 feet or 65 feet down to about 24 feet And where people step step off of the curb They're going to be stepping off in a way that's much more visible to the drivers on the road So there are a number of factors like that that we feel are nice safety enhancements With the with the project and with the roundabouts You know, we're going to continue to look into those and whether or not they make sense But at this stage, we did show them all a signalized and looked at that at this time primarily The other thing I would say about the roundabouts too is They are a bit more complicated to construct and they require The acquisition of rights of way and their property impacts, right? They're going to be bigger than a signalized intersection too So there's some real challenges with the roundabouts and very much an urban setting Established urban center like this is but we will continue to look at that and And DPW has asked us to prepare an evaluation matrix that kind of spells out all the reasonings for whatever Whatever we end up with at these intersections Well, I I just want to continue to say that The aesthetics of roundabouts and the safety Of roundabouts because of the slowing of speed and the efficiency of roundabouts by not Having vehicles sitting at an intersection When there's no traffic moving anywhere and they're just idling And no pedestrians coming across there is nothing about a signalized intersection that is safer or more environmentally sound Than a roundabout and aesthetically they're far more Beautiful and they let the traffic move and when there are needs toward the traffic to stop Because there are vehicles This traffic can stop and when there are pedestrians the pedestrians will stop and walk across I'm just I ask the question every time and I'm I we haven't quite progressed in this community to be supportive of the effort to Do the work to get the rights away and to Incorporate the the challenges. They're much less expensive to maintain than Then the mechanics of signalized intersections. They're a lot safer So I I I I asked the question because I you asked for my input. I don't feel like it's going to be valued and used I think the decision has been made that these will be signalized and I feel like we're missing a wonderful opportunity to have that corridor Look beautiful like many other communities have who have knowledge have already acknowledged what the value of those Right roundabouts are and to to my second question and comment relates to the bump outs and the rain gardens with the the curves I have been in communication about around a rain garden in another part of burlington, which And I had another conversation about it today And what has happened in that scenario is the bump outs happen The curb is low enough that In the winter there is no it's not obvious And so in the winter cars have run into it and been damaged And trucks are big trucks are big enough to drive over it and have basically crushed the curb curbing the so the the the functionality of the Rain gardens when you use them as a bump out design Has significant problems as far as safety of the vehicles that hit them in the winter And then the maintenance of the plantings in this in the in the summer So so this so they they unless those rain gardens are not in the in the roadway They don't stick out in you know the purpose of those bump outs as you suggested Is to shorten a crossing distance when you have to deal with a signalized Run across because you're trying to get across within the however many 15 seconds you have um They don't work when Cars have are are not able to see them in the winter And and trucks are able to drive over them. So I think if you were to look at other instances of them The goal is great to shorten crossing distance, but they don't They don't hold up To what their value is so again my my suggestion on that is that it would be worth looking at where those rain gardens are in your design And if they're going to be bump outs into the roadway They're going to be obstructions and and dangerous obstructions So those are those are some considerations. I think it's great to have tree street trees I think it's great to have the other uh aesthetic Elements of benches and the wide and sidewalks so that So that people feel like they got a little more space And I think the bike path the bike separated bike lane is critical because people have challenges by bicycling up main street, but um So the aesthetic elements of your ideas. I think are great I think the fact that we don't have a plan for even considering I mean, I think you'll go through the motions and you'll say it's just not going to work for doing roundabouts So that's going to go away and I think that the rain gardens And the way that they're put with the bump outs with a low curb that is going to be hit by cars in the winter And I think we're going to have problems so those are my suggestions that you might want to look at the designs that you have And we'll see if maybe those some of those things can be addressed. I'm I'm not optimistic because I've made these suggestions before But I would like you to at least consider them. Thank you. Okay. Thank you for your comments Um, if I can just add a little bit or or respond You know the main street is within the great streets downtown standards And so I would expect that the lines are going to look a little bit like st. Paul street. They're going to be granted They're going to be New and they'll be able to be, you know, the full projection height that they are I would be greatly interested to know where this bump out in this rain garden isn't working because we do like to learn from Challenging areas we were we discussed at the last meeting. It's at grant and north winewski And I just had a conversation today I said, how's it going about the cleaning because it was not being cleaned out It was a mess and she said oh the other problem is People have had their car damaged there and trucks have driven over it. It was immediately Destroyed the the curb was immediately destroyed. So that's the one right at grant and north winewski. Okay. No, that's that's helpful. Thank you All right, thank you commissioner mattano Hey, thank you everyone like on the consulting team and everyone in the city and everyone that participated in the process so far It it really was, you know, a super impressive presentation And I don't really have any like specific questions But I definitely like appreciate just how like open and How like kind of wide reaching the engagement process was And now I have seen the signs all over like This part of town. So I definitely hope the word is definitely getting out and no one's gonna be Surprised when there's gonna be changes and construction starting So I definitely hope that that level of engagement continues And and yeah, I actually I will talk like one thing If the signalized route ends up being what you guys what what the city goes with There there will be signals for bicyclists as well So there will be one set for pedestrians and then sort of another set showing a green bicycle For the bike lane is is that the case? I would welcome. Yeah, Evan also participating in this in this question I think our preliminary look is that we would still look to have bicycles go concurrently with vehicles In their infrastructure, I know that at battery is one location that we're looking at providing really specific signalized Um separation of bicycles and vehicles just because of the strong right turn movements and left turn movements You know in and out of main street and battery, but Evan do you have other Anything else that we know yet? Yeah, I I think if we do end up with a signalized situation the bicyclists will get a a lead Time in the phasing of the traffic signal like you have for pedestrians at some of the intersections today So as we look at this, you know the the more I guess Current thinking with signalized intersections is you have the pedestrian signals And bike signals where they're used that they turn green a few seconds before your motor vehicles Turn green the lights of the vehicles turn green so that they get a head start and can occupy the The crossing before motor vehicles get going So that's how we that's how we see that operating if it goes that way But those are also details that you know as we get to that next preliminary plan phase that vhb will have the ability to do a lot of those Calculations and you know we can certainly come back to you guys with an update when we have you know more specifics about those types of operations as well That would be fantastic And I guess i'll go back to the roundabouts really briefly I think it's important that like each intersection is like considered separately Since like you mentioned there are very specific traffic patterns in terms of like how the road is being used And I know for like bicyclists Oh, it's going to be a lot of people like moving basically the whole length of the corridor as like a commuting kind of thing So just making sure that it is an efficient ride that like Streets don't just belong to cars. I mean they belong to everybody But there are like some people that are moving through and you know doing that safely and efficiently throughout the whole Whole corridor is is important No, I I think we understand what you're what you're getting at One of the things I guess I want to highlight and it has probably been mentioned in a while But our city grid is actually really small. It's a 400 foot long block length And in the intersection world and the roundabout world that puts things very Proximate to each other So when we say we have to think about things as a whole corridor It's important to recognize that one round about even within this Section is going to impact two to three intersections beyond it. And so We're not doing anything on Winooski And so the intersection of Winooski and college street signal is going to have a great impact on the main and Winooski intersection or College and batteries signal will have a significant And impact at main and battery And so Those are the types of things that are going to go into their evaluation matrix so that we can make sure We are bringing an informed decision forward Fantastic. Thank you All right. Thank you On that theme to the extent that we're providing clear passageways for the transportation by people on bikes One comment on like what would appear to be maybe like wavy bike pass through there is that I feel like some might find that counter to the spirit of Providing first-class transport options for people on bikes, but It does look nice The rest of the artistic design Pieces look look fantastic and are super exciting Whichever among the options space we end up with I get one clarification. Are you really Are you looking to go sort of either To make a decision either or between the the artful gateways in the lake city mountain Or are we kind of Blending yes from each um I can jump on that real quick. I think the Intent is to be able to share with the community A wide range of qualities and options that happen within each of the options And that they're able to go through and tell us Which of those different qualities and characters sing the most in each option Regardless of the scheme So I think what may happen is that we come out with some I've been calling it this beautiful frankenstein scheme That is a that is a great blend of all the best things that people want and need And that work and that function well And not necessarily Divorced or Lose some of the best things that happen in similar option I think we we want people to be able to have like a small risk board type of Application that comes to the best option. So in the end, we will probably have some type of hybrid That's being expressed as we move forward Yeah, thank you that that that resonates that makes makes perfect sense at this at this phase of things We don't need to feel hard best option a or b and that yet I Guess a lot so along lines are sort of as we're converging on plans over the next Year and a half or two years or so Can you help me get a sense of you know by the time you're looking at a potential city council? Action may 14th How cooked up Are these plans like it's really just like just a concept At that point to facilitate moving forward with like The 25% engineering sketches or whatever or is this some percentage of engineering sketch It's a little bit of both. So we are on a condensed timeline to try to use the TIF funding based on when it it does need to get bonded and Used within its lifetime. So we've actually had our team do a lot of data collection as it relates to They've performed a full survey of the corridor We're working with utility locations and we're working to find right-of-way boundaries, which are usually things that happen a little later on They're also going full steam ahead with the water and sewer Replacements that are underneath the ground that you know, don't necessarily impact as greatly the above ground concept But our work that needs to get done As it relates to what we're looking for at the city council meeting is really Their acceptance. Um, that's going to change the curb line of the street, which is going to impact You know the line and grade of the road, which is where their responsibility lies so Knowing that it's such a significant change for main street We want to bring this to them early So we don't get too far down the process and then have you know Everyone wondering what were we doing and why did you do it this way? And I don't know that I can support this so Going early, which is something that we had done on other great streets projects really helped us move The community through the project and move the officials that had to make difficult decisions sometimes To let them know that they were informed and included Yeah, thank you. So that we are going early. We are kind of looking for that direction so that we can keep our our team moving forward Understood. Thanks There was a mention Susanna potentially among the I think you sort of touched upon parking revenue Feeding into non motorized Uh, the supports for people outside of vehicles And I I forget the exact language on on that although I will Look forward to reviewing these in more detail later. I was curious. Is that Is there projected ordinance change needed to do that? I know we have rather strict Uh rules on what certain budgets Can feed into Sure, uh, happy to delve into that. So as part of Great streets may uh, st. Paul street. We were able to use traffic funds For that project as it relates to controlling and regulating traffic So, uh, those opportunities do exist for us. I will say currently The importance of this tiff opportunity cannot be understated The traffic fund as a result of the pandemic has taken a large hit and the fund balance Is exceedingly small. We had worked years to regrow the health of the traffic fund, but uh, given the pandemic It is it has been significantly depleted. So having these funds that are time limited 30 million dollars of of work that does not impact the property taxpayer Is a once in a generation opportunity here So we are very bullish to move quickly If the traffic fund does rebound and uh, and covid recedes Then we can look at traffic Contributing to a part of this project as well if there are amenities Or features calming features that The community would like to see that require additional funds beyond the tiff funding Gotta thank you for that and I appreciate the The urgency of the leveraging that that tiff opportunity that's in front of us here This thing I wanted to toss out I was wondering if there's any Maybe this doesn't square with the the time frame Is there any option to sort of extend the pedestrian space and to lower church street a bit as as we're sprucing up that intersection um I feel like I've heard this comment before in our outreach and I I apologize. I can't remember specifically where It's a challenging question. We can we can do intersection improvements And certainly extend a little bit to the south side of main street, but the way that the district was described is um It's on record with the state as it relates to our filing for the tiff project and so we are We do need to honor that boundary unless we go back for some sort of substantial change Okay, thanks. Yeah, I I know from our previous conversation on that that that was the origin of the Drawing the line at the top at union or just below union Yeah, I mean we do benefit lower church street is within the downtown tiff district whereas going further east is definitely not But right now the way that the project it was drawn and described. It doesn't include that area Okay Thank you for that So certainly. Yeah, I'm excited to see these sketches come together and looking forward to Following along In the months to come here Yeah, we appreciate. Thank you Nothing further on my end just check and see if there's anyone interested speaking at public comment at this time There does not appear to be anybody signing up. So there is no one for public comment All right There's no action Thank you, thanks everyone So, uh It's called 7.1 are always stop at luma street in mansfield avenue. Um, and there's really no No change proposed at this time This was like an as I gather an informational item that was in the consent agenda as a Her to see it at this point, but there has been a lot certainly a lot of interest Yeah, I'd welcome an introduction for your end. Yep. Sure. So, um Yeah, we definitely want to just provide some background on Some of the changes coming to mansfield avenue The mansfield avenue side path and traffic coming project so to kind of start from the beginning in 2015 the mansfield avenue neighborhood Had submitted a request for An always stop at luma street Due to safety concerns surrounding Vehicle speeds and crossing at that intersection So dpw staff at that time evaluated the request and found that The intersection did not meet the requirements for To meet a stop sign warrants so They brought that to the commission However, due to the demand in the Again, the the safety concerns many safety concerns from the neighborhood the commission In november 2015 asked that a stop sign be installed at that intersection as a temporary Measure to alleviate safety concerns on the condition that that neighborhood would Submit a request to the traffic calming program um So we installed the stop sign the the traffic calming request was submitted and in 2019 we began We initiated the Side path in the traffic calming project as as one project So if you're not familiar with the side path portion the side sidewalk on the east side of the road will be replaced with a 10 foot wide Side path and then we also began our public process for Developing concept alternatives for traffic calming measures We held two public meetings between the end of 2019 and the end of 2021 And We presented the neighborhood with a few different options for traffic calming alternatives We had also communicated during that time that the stop sign would be removed with the installation of traffic calming measures We also administered a survey In the fall of 2021 Kind of getting that final feedback. It's kind of like a final vote from the neighborhood on what traffic calming alternatives They preferred or alternative. They preferred So they were presented with an option for Either chicane's a combination of chicane chicane's and raised Crosswalks or just raised crosswalks and We ended up going with the raised crosswalks So one located in front of the manor christie school and then two at luma street on either either side of luma street so that was the the Plans went through the final design for the side path and the crosswalk raised crosswalks Earlier this year went out to bid and now we're Have plans to go to construction next month As part of that effort to remove the stop signs having met the conditions of the condition of evaluating traffic calming alternatives we were looking to come back to the commission to Get the removal of the stop signs authorized. We did receive quite a bit of Um feedback from Quite a bit of concern from the neighborhood around removing the stop signs We met internally a dpw staff to Kind of discuss how to move forward and we decided that We're going to wait for we're going to go through with construction We're going to wait to Um Come back for approval to remove the stop signs until we can see get the side the side path installed and evaluate whether or not that influences the volume of pedestrians using those crosswalks And make a determination at that time. We still want to Recommend removing those stop signs. So once the the project is installed We'll give it a few months Give it time people to get used to it. Um wait for school to get back in session See if the side path Influences and influx of new users to Both that facility and those crosswalks and then we'll collect some data in the fall and We'll come back with an update at that time So Happy to answer any questions as best I can. Yeah. Oh, thank you for that You know Christian ovaries you had a particular interest in discussing this one. Yeah I I asked to have this one taken off because I had I had seen the the Nice serve the the the list of all the signatures that the young young people in the neighborhood had You know collected that were concerned about the stop sign being removed, but I had a separate separate kind of question It was suggested that you're you're going to collect the data about traffic and bicyclists and pedestrians and stuff after the The side path and the crosswalks are put in Which is great, but what I would suggest and I do travel that route when I do use a car and One of the things that I would suggest that maybe needs to happen is if you're going to be studying traffic on Mansfield what really is going on is there's two ways to avoid the stoplight at pearl Colchester and north prospect and So what's happening is people They will take north and get over to mansfield and then they will take you know, they'll be at the stoplight at colchester and mansfield And so what's so what's happening is that's the that's the statistic that we need to know There's traffic going on north prospect heading toward that intersection the stoplight and both directions trying to get up to Route two main street getting on the interstate And so what I would suggest that needs to happen is when you're doing the study of these data Somehow there needs to be a way of assessing the the way that the traffic Moves because what what I think is I think the problem is that it is we're not figuring out a system to Reduce the traffic that of those folks that do not want to use north prospect and and and be sitting at the stoplight at North prospect and pearl slash colchester avenue so So I don't feel like that. I think the reason why people recognize that those stop signs have been helpful is because there is still a You get a better return for your minutes of driving going on north, you know on mansfield avenue Then you go and sitting at that stoplight And so that until that changes You're going to have a problem with traffic on mansfield And and so I don't know what the solution is except that I I can't I can't see taking those stop signs Until there is you know, I don't think I don't see where that 10-foot sidewalk is going to you know multi is going to make a difference in the The the way that people can get across the street and the perception of the the speed It's just You know The only other thing I can think of is you know you're parking on both sides or some other things like you were talking about the Chicanes it sounds like other things were removed From consideration. So you have just those raised intersections So I I think people maybe are not comfortable that that's going to make any difference once you get rid of the stop signs But so my suggestion was that That needs to be part of your study. How can you? Get people to stay on prospect When they're trying to get to the interstate They can get to that corner pearl and north prospect and go on east av route or they can go across over the main and around But I guarantee you that's what's going on if you That's what's happening and and you can't have that be the shortcut So that's that's that the other thing too and it was commented in public comment about you know former city councilor busher about the planters being visual barriers and And it relates exactly also to the comment I made about the rain gardens and the the bump outs and having a curb The clearly those planters were attended to make a visual, uh, you know make a shorter crossing Which maybe isn't The isn't needed at that point and if you Switch them to curves then you bump out with curves and you know a permanent grass You've got the other problem of people running over them and hitting them with you know their car. So I you know, I just wanted to continue on with that conversation about the planters At that intersection, maybe not being a good thing Obviously it was temporary, but then converting them to something that is equally problematic You know a curb cut out with just grass might not be the best thing for that intersection as well. So um, I just wanted to offer those comments to make that happen because I don't I don't think I could support taking those stop signs out Until we have a sense of how do you make it more convenient to take prospect and and the stop light Yeah, that's that's really great Input and something certainly something that we can take more of an overarching um, look at into kind of how you know, what's uh causing the The volumes of traffic and kind of the the higher speeds and it's definitely been something that we we have talked about but We can certainly make sure that we kind of focus on prospect as well when we Well, if you had it if you figure out what cars are coming down I mean you'd be able to say it since where you have You're going to be able to see that flow like when people come in from east av and they're coming in You know to town and how many of them go down mansfield and how many of them do proceed to the stop light and wait there and wait there and wait there And then go down so most people don't want to do that So that unfortunately runs them through that neighborhood So I I'd love to find a solution to that and maybe you know that can happen if you do the statistics And you can then come up with something else to uh I don't know what it is again. It would have been the roundabout it would have been a better solution So there's not everybody sitting there um You know like if you were to I think I'm going to make a suggestion that everybody uses a thought experiment when they're sitting at a stop light And there is a red light for you and there's no traffic going either way. There's no pedestrians and you're sitting there idling So whenever you're in that state at a stop light, that's the thought experiment. You would have not been sitting there idling to So so it's an improved way of keeping Keeping the traffic and and then that would actually you know, those are the kind of things that help people go Well, like I know I'm not going to be held up. Oh, if I miss that light, you know I mean, it's just yeah, so there you go That's my that was that was my reason for pulling it off and I wanted to Add that information because I think it would help in uh, maybe Helping the neighborhoods You know helping you come up with a solution that actually works and the stop signs at this point stop people so they are slowing down One question for you. What is the cross the raised crosswalk at lumus and then right next to the motter christie school What are the two places that you're going to put the raised crosswalk in the proposal? Yep So right now there are existing crosswalks in front of the motter christie school So that one will be converted to a raised crosswalk and then either side of lumus street So basically it'll be one either side of the intersection That people so people won't be able to just blow through the intersection. They're going to have to slow down significantly to Go through the intersection and there won't be the rapid flashing beacon thing for the kids to get across Correct. Yeah, I think that's just not going to fly. Unfortunately. I'm I'm just giving you my honest opinion of Why your why why you have these 12 and 13 year olds having collected all of these signatures From families that have children in the area that that would walk in there and and I just feel like We're never going to we're never going to address that their concern by taking that stop sign stop signs out so Thanks. Thank you All right. Thank you for that Checking with other commissioners here anyone else has other thoughts on this Vice chair on the obama Yeah, just real quickly. You know, I look forward to the side path construction and and data collection And you know, my office at uvm is right on the is right on the The uvm campus side of colchester and mansfield avenue It's a really dynamic street as as you know, and I think to commissioner overview's point It's kind of during that rush hour piece When people kind of cut through and zip down and I mean, I've seen people even blow the stop sign But without that stop sign It is how quickly can I get to north street to you know, jog to wherever i'm going or How quickly can I get from north street to colchester av so without the stop sign? It just becomes this just zip zone and and I guess I wonder what's the detriment to leaving The all-way stop even after the The side path is constructed So the stop signs do not meet mutcd warrants. So um as engineers by Putting in installing unwarranted stop signs They do create other hazards Such as folks becoming complacent to the stop signs Maybe not completely looking both ways really relying on the stop signs in order to control traffic So as engineers we put ourselves At risk by installing unwarranted stop signs if they do create You know hazards that Really, you know are created outside of these mutcd regulations so that's the reason that we and Just as you said, I mean you've even seen people blowing through those those stop signs And we've heard many many complaints about that as well. So it's it's kind of you know, we hear complaints from both sides We hear that first we hear sometimes that the stop signs aren't working And then we hear that they that they do work. So but really, you know as engineers We we have to rely on the data and rely on the kind of the rules and the the the regulations that are that we abide by in our in our design so All right, but I look forward to more of a discussion after the side path Is is constructed. Maybe we need a different guidebook That really focuses on the safety of vulnerable users if the mutcd whatever that is Right, I know I know what it is. I always forget all the order of the letters If if that's making our residents removing that stop those stop signs make our residents feel unsafe I don't know. I see how all this is but thank you very much for addressing that Of course, uh, yeah, just to clarify there. Those are federal design guidelines. So the federal highway administration is one of the resources that we have to know to get our even professional licensure I also just want to add to my comment that aside from like our You know the the data driven analysis. It's also just about kind of not wanting to set a precedent from just adding stop signs anywhere and everywhere wherever they're requested So we start putting them in all these unwarranted places and it starts to become problematic as well as people just think that we can Kind of install stop signs anywhere and everywhere. So That's just my my last comment. So Thank you for the question though. Thank you Commissioner bows nothing for me. Thank you Commissioner mutano Yeah, just a quick comment That's my preferred way from getting between the old north end and the uvm campus and it's explicitly to avoid the cold chester pearl North prospect street intersection. So I totally understand why drivers are are thinking the same thing And certainly as you are considering the traffic patterns in the area sort of the impact of that intersection Yeah, I think it's important That's yeah, that's again really valuable input that will certainly keep keep in mind. So thank you for bringing that up All right. Thank you. Just to have briefly that intersection is on our list in our mind We had tentatively put some design money into Realigning that intersection The full 40 million dollar bond was not approved in november This is one of the projects that is currently not funded But if we can secure other funds that we would like to advance this project at cold chester pearl prospect Thank you for that Yeah, that would be uh Probably a welcome source of attention as well Okay, thanks. Yeah, I mean I think you know, I know You probably gathered you're looking at the citizen board here to Did not share your same reverence for the manual uniform traffic control devices that That you pros all do And I Yeah, so I'd be pretty solid no on removing them if you were to ask me today As you probably got it from others here and I recall some years back that The city has been challenged and in some place sometimes like Committed to sort of going above and beyond the mutcd And there's the uh, NACO or DACTA Sort of city guidebook and we don't need to go through it Now and I know this question has come up and You all have helped me with that relationship between Those things, but I I think it it would be Necessary to sort of review that Again, this this fall as well because there's certainly other places around town like I wish there was Stop signs that you know my other favorite intersections that I go through where I perceive it to be challenging to get through as a human being And I know, you know, you don't have an infinite budget of stop signs or Planning engineering bandwidth to to evaluate all these things so we need to be judicious with those So, yeah, I saw I'll just leave that there for now Welcome some welcome a conversation about what's strictly required. Where are we sort of putting ourselves? at risk with the Fun police at the state or the federal level and where do we really have leverage to Go beyond This is helpful part of why we delayed is because we heard from residents request to see the post construction condition And we thought it would be helpful to update you and the community that we were Delaying this so that we could get feedback from you We've gotten feedback from the neighborhood so we can collect data and have a more robust informed conversation this fall Thanks. Yeah, and I mean I pulled up this The specs the drawings for the traffic calming and the side path looks really exciting like a That's going to be a huge ad For the the neighborhood and the crew Dozens of people we've heard from that are sort of Passion about having this be a place for them to live their lives and not a meaning cut through for Yep commuters Thank you. Yeah. All right. Nothing further on my ends. We had a check just for Good measure here. Make sure is anyone interested in speaking on public comment on this one No, not at this time. No one send up. We've got an earful already from the public on on this. Okay so It's very sad. There's no action on this It was just acceptance of the communication But since it was pulled from the consent agenda, there isn't any action needed. It was information only Thank you All right with that I will close out item 7.1 and move forward to item 7.2 We're in the complete streets form Yep, uh, laura wheelock. I'm gonna pitch hip for this one It looks like as the document got pulled into the complete packet that there was a formatting challenge I have the original That I am going to share with you. So maybe uh, it hopefully can be quickly reviewed and considered tonight Um, we would like it considered tonight as we are about to start paving In the next week or two. So it's uh, it's helpful to make sure that you guys had a chance to See these forms. Um They are a An actual law to have them reported and completed and on record. So Here is the original packet that was sent to our Staff that puts it together. This is the communication that you see Um and the first part of the packet scrolling down through the first street that comes up is actually alan so On the forums, uh, despite them all saying birch cliff, uh, they do go in alphabetical order So alan is the first street that would have been on your packet list Indicating that it has no exemptions that there are complete streets Amenities within the corridor as we do go to repave it They're repaving the mill and fill of the inch and a half or more is what triggers the complete streets consideration And brings it more than just a maintenance activity Really, this is required um from the the act so that during the design planning and construction phases that um, all all amenities are considered The next one is the actual real birch cliff parkway parkway Form so i'm going to skip that one The next one that you come to is flin av Now in stuff it does actually have sidewalk on one side I will note that these forms are submitted at the end of the construction season year So they are submitted in december. So while you do provide action on them now We don't actually sign them and send them in until the actual construction completes because Sometimes you don't know what's going to happen within the year Is there enough? The next one that comes to is franklin square one of the newest city streets. I feel like a tour guide That one does have all of the kind of checkboxes that are required for repaving And then we have north avenue from ethan allent parkway through shore road Certainly several amenities for various users on that street And then I think the last one's platzberg I remember right? Yep This one does actually have the sidewalks on one side. So we will have the small updates for the other for Flin av and for platzberg for noting those pedestrian facilities You know, if there's anything you want me to go back to No, that looks yeah, I'm fine at this. Thank you for that. I just want to make sure we're Yeah, I've got the right street names when we when we yeah, we will uh, We'll provide this updated pdf so that it can be amended to your packet material and hopefully it won't Unformat itself Very good. Yeah, I have no further concerns on that supportive of you. I'll Get any forms Approved and on their way forward Sort of do a quick check with my fellow commissioners here and see if there are other Comments while we're on it I you might have mentioned I was trying to figure out what looking at yours and I had the printed one So I might have an okay version of it So, you know what you had but quickly on allen street. Is there a bus stop on allen street You had listed a public transit stop on that one. I don't know that there is one on There's one at the corner of elmwood and allen. Oh, so maybe it's the allen street the corner Okay, so that may be that that one And Is does flin have is that one you've read about the sidewalk on one side or both sides? Yeah, okay. So that's going to have a check in sidewalks Okay, because I couldn't remember I remember that thing about is there so is there other sidewalks on both sides now or one side Just one side and you're going to put one on the other side No, okay So there's nothing going to be done with the sidewalks on flin avenue not improved But it just is supposed to be noting that it that there is one there Yeah, okay that are that are already within the project. It's it's okay. So then there was one let's see then the Um The north avenue between eith and allen parkway and the shore road aren't there bus stops on that stretch as well Yeah, so, um, this is the first year for the staff member completing these forms and I apologize because I didn't have a chance to review it as the one of the former paving managers and having completed the form so Normally what happens with these forms is that the box is for every amenity that exists within the corridor Whether it's existing or an improvement is supposed to be marked off so that it's considered as part of the design So that's where this is a little bit challenged Well, the wording of it says that these are incorporated in the project. It doesn't say they exist Um, if you go back to the actual act Language, this is a form that is developed by the ccrpc to be able to collect the reporting information It just would probably be helpful for you Whoever's doing it if it didn't say these are in the project right because there are public transit stops on north Have in that stretch. So it's it doesn't look like I don't know what's going to happen and there's street lights on all these streets too. So it Right. Well, I get I get it. This is the checklist, you know, like I get it But um, you want to make it actually useful and so it's it's not very useful if they're sort of like You know what I mean? It's hard you to do the form and it's hard for us to figure out what is really going on And I think that we'd be more than agreeable to providing you guys the updated Corrected forms. I what's important tonight and and why I asked for it not to wait until may is just the fact that we are about to Start paving the contractor is going to start on north ave. Yeah, I don't know for your next meeting I think it's more of a matter of It's more a matter of helping these forms actually work for you and work for us and they don't work right now Yep And is it is does plaster gab have sidewalks on both sides or just one side just one side. Okay. So the same thing just one side Okay, I will assume these are going to be improved For your benefit and ours Thanks. All right, uh Checking for commissioner martino. Oh good. Thank you. We're good. Uh vice chair on neil vivacca All good Commissioner bows no questions. All right any public comments on our three streets forms Uh, no, I'm sure people are stacked up They've been waiting for this Seeking that I'll be back with commission seeking a vote on these Welcome a motion So moved Thank you commissioner bows for that motion I'll second the motion seconded by vice chair on neil vivacca. Thank you. Is there any discussion around that motion? All right, the motion is just to accept the communication just like we've acknowledged that that we receive These compliance forms. Yes Further discussion? All right, we'll go to a vote then commissioner bows I Thank you vice chair on neil vivacca I Commissioner over be I Commissioner mutano I I for myself Motion is passed five to zero. Thank you Moving forward to item eight director's report Great, uh first. Thank you senior engineer laura wheelock for getting that one addressed here so that we can embark on our paving season um I am most pleased to say that We had a very successful city council meeting monday night notably unanimous approval of Construction awarding the initial construction contract for the champlain parkway We are working with our state and federal partners to execute that contract and expect Work to be underway in late june We are excited about this We also know that there's going to be a fair bit of coordination with the community around traffic Impacts and managing that Especially with the roundabout under construction So, uh, we have been clear in the bid documents that no substantial work can happen on pine street this year While the roundabouts under construction But we will be working with the contractor quickly to get out information on upcoming impacts and ways that folks can avoid Uh delays in traveling around the south end. So stay tuned for that information Uh, we heard from a couple members of the community tonight about north wienewski avenue and working to Uh mitigate impacts of the installations of the bike lanes on north wienewski avenue And they had asked staff to continue to be engaged in this process I want to let the commission know that staff continues to be Very much engaged in this. I had a meeting this week about it With a number of city counselors in addition I've communicated with multiple property owners as we continue to look to secure Off-street parking along the corridor And staff will continue to be engaged in that process and look forward to working with many of the folks who showed up tonight You saw a notice that we submitted a very large raise grant application. That's the federal government former tiger grants $25 million asked to reconstruct the wienewski river bridge root 2 and root 7 That would also add Dedicated bike and pedestrian facilities on each side of the bridge protected from the vehicle traffic so fingers crossed on that application and I think those are the major updates Public information manager goulding am I missing anything operation clean sweep clean sweep starts tonight So it is zone by zone. Please check The website for information on when your neighborhood is up. This helps us clean the streets, which also protects lake champlain Keeps organic matter out of the lake reduces phosphorus loading in the lake And we very much appreciate everybody's help to get their vehicle off the road Thank you Thank you All right Moving to item nine our agenda commissioner communications Start with commissioner mutano Uh, yeah, nothing really but good job with the communication on the clean street on the clean street Thing I've lived here for like two years and I never really paid attention to it But like now I saw it and I realized shoot there's actually like written signs and everything and everything's flashing so Nice and yeah, no no comments really apart from that all right commissioner overby Nothing for me. I've had all my comments addressed earlier. All right commissioner bows Yeah, could I follow up? director spencer on the The north wienewski issue that was raised earlier any in your Director's report. You just mentioned You know the kind of the follow-up work that's being done and I know that this You know, we've we've had a number of these kinds of and I'm sure they there's nothing new about um, the kind of feedback from business owners and residents when You know changes of this This type are enacted. I was surprised to hear Um, you know, this kind of coming forth from city council when it did And I think especially with some of the kinds of comments that were made by some of the counselors And perhaps I don't think it really helped the situation Some of the the comments I heard from city counselors about like well We have to go ahead and make these sorts of changes and I think one of the the comments from One of the public comments somebody talked about needing to balance just transitions And I think that that's a really, you know, something we really need to take on board And I don't think anybody should feel like These kinds of changes that we make are disproportionately The the weight of them is not disproportionately born by any particular section of of the community and I think that in in this particular case I mean, I honestly think this was pretty ham-fisted. So I would really like to see You know, some of what you've described as attempts to find Alternatives for some of the parking that will be lost. I mean, especially in in light of you know, some of the You know businesses that we're talking about It goes without saying for any Affected resident but I really was very taken aback and concerned by the way in which This was at least publicly talked about. So I would really like to To be You know as a commission kept in the loop on what some of those alternatives might be What the results of some of these consultations with affected residents Look like so That's my only, you know, I just like to be kept in the loop as you continue on with this Thanks Thanks, commissioner bows and I do think that maybe you and I can talk to the chair about, you know Whether there's agenda items at future meetings or How best to work on this currently conversations are somewhat sensitive as as property owners are trying to understand what, you know Implications are of opening up their private lots to public parking But I understand the desire for increased transparency and conversation and happy to Facilitate that Thanks very much All right. Thank you Vice chair on ill evanco Just underscore echo ditto. What commissioner bow said about Just transitions and the The the need for Really careful transparency You know, which came first the the needs in The old north end for services or a lot of services in the new north. I'm sorry in the old north end And so you have a population that Is transit dependent Lower income And Many in need of social services and social services are there Instead of in other parts of the town So it's, you know, in our kind of, you know, department of energy world. This is really an overburdened population for for lots of reasons and so I feel like, you know As the city department it's incumbent upon us to To take special care in the outreach and the communication and making sure that Access to the necessary services are still available Not that parking is a service, but That that vital curb space is for those who Need car drop off taxi Bus, etc. And then Balancing that with the needs of the private businesses who You know are there in that community to be able to Host their their clients Who arrive By whatever mode So every effort we can have to look for creative solutions to the parking challenges would be great And really committing to A deep communication and and outreach efforts And and then One more thing is I'd like to just go back. I think you said you were going to speak to The folks from the daily planet about the expanded sidewalks and those alternatives I think that's fantastic that we have a business who recognizes that that curves base in front of their Their building is actually More more vital to them To serve food and serve the community Than it is for parking. So anyway, we can you know help support that that would be great And that's it. Thank you All right, thank you Good question. Yeah, I mean I certainly I was yeah encouraged by the feedback from the daily planning representative this evening and you know, perhaps that it Shouldn't have come as a surprise, but it did come as a surprise to me that we weren't Going as big or at least under the same structure for like a street seats program that this summer So it's really encouraged us sort of looking into options To support these kind of businesses the businesses that are interested Yes, we have facilitated many In our regular program now that we're out of the state of emergency that said There are some unique issues here with they don't have curbside parking. So Trying to accommodate a couple spaces here with the lateral shift to Create curbside space for two or three Spaces of Outdoor seating will likely take eight or nine parking spaces and whether or not The adjacent businesses are also supportive of that effort and the amount of effort It's not as simple as just encumbering up parking space So we will certainly continue to follow up with the owners and Keep you informed on how this goes. Yeah, thanks. I'm glad to hear there are so we can Take the lessons learned from our emergency Street seats things and transitioning into opportunities for the summer and beyond A note on the the admins drop off and pick up situation I Recorrespondent with Spondance with assistant director pageant on that From my perspective the the signs have been up there for a couple months now I'm not seeing Much movement in behaviors there. I still see the buses having to jog around like six private vehicles that are hogging the curb Where they shouldn't be um I know assistant director pageant has expressed more optimism than I'm sharing in how well that's going But I'd be interested in engaging um With you all in the school district on on the next steps there and I know people in schools are Stretch incredibly thin as you all are Is well, so this is probably not a like Cram it in this spring kind of kind of change but Let's be thinking ahead for how we may want to approach things differently in the fall yeah I'm confident we could probably get good partners and support from the bus drivers In this one as well some of our More guys than others and like setting a pick for each other. That's quite literally what we're setting a pick for themselves Reach in and get close to the curb Anyhow, they have sort of more to come on that one. Um, you know Not unlike the um Mansfield lumus Question, I know that we have had previous questions in previous months about Union Adams. We've actually had questions on that one going back Pre-pandemic, I thank you even Um And I you know, I gather that there could be a similar story there that by the mutcd warrants the such-and-such volumes May not I mean, I don't know if we've done that analysis, but You know suppose the warrants all right volume wise or crash history wise don't support But a stop I would still um, you know, I'm curious to dig back up our recommendations on the uh Sort of like sight distance and sort of just intersection treatments and see how that squares with that and other intersections Is well there I feel like the sight distance might tell a different story from the downhill versus just volumes Yeah, we owe you an update on that one and we are looking at sight distances the grade change and to understand what Our recommendation will be so I can certainly update you directly On just where that stands. Uh, I expect it to be coming to you in the next meeting or two Yeah, so even if it's a no Well either way. Yes, I know we know that request has been out there. So Thank you. Um, yeah, let's just say sort of Prost you all again for keeping up with the um the covid tests from our wastewater stream strikes me as um, you know a very objective measure of where we're sitting Covid-wise in ways that aside from maybe hospitalizations. We're just not getting because of changing patterns and tests and reporting outcomes of home tests and so forth. So it's really uh, a valuable resource Yeah, I think it's all uh, all I've got on my end Thank you as always for the The great work and the engaging conversations here With that I will close out our commissioner communications And hear me read the ask a question. Oh sure, mr. Overby. Yeah, I was just Is the uh street seats program going to be happening this summer? With the parking not not talking about the one that requires their rearranging But I know are you going to be putting forward a street seats? Proposal for some of the restaurants that do want to put out a street seats Sitting areas in a parking space Absolutely. Yes. Yeah, you you all approved a program. Maybe you know two years ago Uh, the state of emergency came in uh, that program has now come back into effect And ultimately, uh, I spoke probably too quickly when when they uh, came up and said that the commission could uh, overrule staff's recommendation Fundamentally the approval of street seats goes to the council's license committee And then is approved by the full city council. So if uh, if staff is not prepared to support a recommendation The applicants have their recourse in front of the license committee and the full city council I just wanted to know if you're going to do like 10 Locations or whatever the however many people apply the restaurants could actually use the park Absolutely and those approvals have been going through the license committee and have been going through the council There were a number on monday night. I had just my memory was jogged of it with the questions that were asked about it And I thought yeah, let's you know find out where we're at with that for this summer. Thanks Yes, we can include an update on the director's report next month That's good. Thank you All right moving forward item 10 on our agenda adjournment and next meeting date may 18th Welcome a motion on that I moved to adjourn I'll second the motion to adjourn and we have a second Vice chair onil vivanko. Thank you. Is there any Discussion around that motion All clear. All right, let's go to a vote then uh, commissioner bows. Hi Vice chair onil vivanko Hi Mr. Mutano, hi Commissioner overby. Hi. Hi for myself. We are adjourns at 9 10 Thank you all Thanks. Yep