 705 and I'll call to order this meeting a special meeting of the Waterbury select board on Monday, October 30th 2023 I like to first start just by recognizing the loss of one of the pillars of the village of Waterbury lefty seah passed away today We'll all miss him deeply The first item on the agenda is to approve the agenda So moved second Seconded any discussion Hearing none all of ever stay high high high Opposed any abstentions, okay, the agenda is approved The consent agenda includes minutes from our last meeting on the 16th and tobacco substitute endorsement And this Mexican cuisine LLC license All in favor of the consent. Oh, do I have a motion for the consent agenda? Moving seconded all in favor say just just a question shoot what is tobacco substitute endorsement Okay Thank you for the discussion Hearing none all of ever say aye. Aye. Aye Any post any abstentions? Consent agenda is approved as written Next we have the public Session Anyone that would like to address anything not on the warned agenda. Please come forward Last to try to keep your comments to three minutes or less anything more we'll put it on the agenda for the following meeting Nothing on the public. We'll move on to the next item informational meeting on Charter boat which is due to take place on December 5th, 2023 Presentation presentation So just for a little background run through a short presentation with some numbers It's not a presentation mode for us. Yeah, so stop So just if you go back to the zoom Yep, and stop this share that little red guy Okay, and now we go back to the zoom Go back to zoom. I mean sorry And No We have to get this in presentation mode and then share so from current slide again Display setting Just go back to zoom we should be able to Starting to look at sorry Yeah Danny can you see it? Yeah, we can see it. We still have the tool like the slider on the left. That's okay Yeah Just let me know if you need me to adjust something here, so I'll give a short presentation a little background We first started talking about a charter actually the very first time the select board met after town meeting day We subsequently had six separate meetings before this one Where we had the charter as a warned item on April 3rd the select board directed me to draft a proposed charter The next couple meetings after that we talked about a framework and whether or not we wanted to have a simple charter or something That was a little more complex But in the end the select board decided that we really didn't need to Fundamentally reform town government. We just wanted to address a few specific items My first real charter presentation was in August 21st We did a lot of work in April and May and then there was the flood But in August what I presented is substantially similar to what you're seeing today We had a couple meetings in September and early October to essentially set dates About this presentation and the vote on December 5th Short version is that we decided on two articles for the charter the first one is simply about the manager's authority and This has been a bit of a recurring issue and there's a couple positions in particular that are applied to this year State law says that the manager hires and fires All employees unless otherwise specified in state law and there's a few that are specified in state law Two great examples that this year we filled both the planning director and the zoning director and Both those positions are specified in state law as having another hiring process. So in that case the planning commission makes a recommendation to the select board about about They sent me forward a name the select board doesn't have to take that name in this case they did but the manager is a daily supervisor Little bit awkward For the zoning director, it's especially awkward because while the planning director works closely with the planning commission The zoning director works with the Felton review board primarily So you have a board making a recommendation to another board about an employee that they will not work with or Supervised so this simplifies that process Makes it quite easy another position that this does not impact. That's otherwise specified in state law Is the library director who remains hired by the library board? So I wouldn't have that authority under this that's retained with them Some of the other pieces We worked on together And they're really a reflection of our employee handbook and our past and current practice the second bullet Simply about the manager authorizing department heads to hire a point Discipline, etc. Simple example is public works. I Have the ability to give that department head who's been here a long long time the authority to make some of his own decisions Which is pretty reasonable given the size of the department his experience with the new department head I have the authority to say what's Let's make some decisions together until you get a little more time under your belt here and then the final piece to this clause is that we Decided that department heads are too important and the select board should have some ability to weigh in on the higher-end department head Note that the the sentence Simply says shall be approved by the select board. It does not talk about the form of approval So that depends on the manager and the select board in the relationship. So that could simply be that I Call Roger and say I want to hire this individual and maybe it's an individual who's well known to the town and Roger says I think that's fine I'll pull the board and he calls me back an hour later and says go ahead. It could be that it's done at a public meeting It's up to the manager and the select board to work that out at the time the final piece I just want to say about this is All this language was reviewed by attorneys at the Vermont League of Cities and Towns and all of it was reviewed by an Entity named Jim Barlow who's got a specialized practice in Vermont local government Karen you want to go the next one? That's the real meat of the charter is the local option tax which we've again talked about Almost the entire year here And there's a couple of ways to warn that in our case we warned it as one item You can in fact break it out and have separate questions about You can do a rumble to be all's you can you can do the alcohol beverages or the or the total package which we did Identical to a lot of towns Pretty ubiquitous at this point throughout Vermont and I have not heard from a single Business owner since we've talked about this that's supposed this I haven't heard from a bunch who've been in favor of it But I've never been one who opposed it We can keep going one more. So just just some details of what tax rates are now and and how it all changed take all these numbers here And they had 1% Motor vehicles are something entirely different. So if you're spending 30 grand on a vehicle, which is tough to do these days You're not going to get hit with another 300 bucks there Just like retail sales tax groceries are exempt prescription drugs Most clothing some of the luxury items are not This would apply to all your internet purchases the Amazons of the world now collect the tax and remit it to the state Which sends it to us and this would apply to your vacosa your Airbnbs And we can go one more Just to get some context on on what's happening So these are those categories You can go to the state website back to 2004 and you can show those categories On the far maybe slow on the far left is alcohol This is rooms. That's meals and that's general retail sales and alcohol is growing the fastest at almost 7% General retail sales is a slower at 4 anyone have an idea what our what our tax levy has grown since 2004 what percentage any guesses It's actually five so a Bunch of those categories are growing faster than your than your property taxes have historically And I think it'd be nice to tap to tie some of the town's fiscal future with a revenue source that has a pretty high growth rate and Doesn't impact your property taxes Go one more please This chart just breaks some of those things down by category and all I do is I use this I use the historical growth rates Cut them in half So I'm not projecting six point nine percent for alcohol and perpetuity. I cut everything in half Just to show what this would generate so the projection is pretty conservative 2025 644,000 And the reason I use 2025 is the legal process If this Charter is indeed improved by the voters on December 5th. It has to go to the state legislature to be approved If that happens it then takes the tax department two quarters to implement it So it wouldn't be paid until 2025 the town in fact wouldn't see its first check until about May of 2025 because it's collected and turned over a quarter way, but there's There's a process to that But our 2025 budget could in fact have this as a revenue source And then again, what would that mean in the tax rate if it was all done to reduce taxes in today's dollars? What a low rate sense so pretty pretty meaningful revenue source for the town For now and for the long term You go one more So what's that? What's it eight point two six cents on your site at three hundred thousand dollars about two hundred fifty bucks? I'm not pledging we can use all this money to reduce taxes But I think it can be a component of how we can manage our budget and I can talk about that going forward. You can keep going The select board back in August did sorry That's correct Back in August did in fact adopt a policy. No, excuse me October 2nd adopted a policy on How to use the local option tax so four things were the heart of that policy the first is payment of existing debt The debt for the town is about seven hundred fifty thousand dollars a year our total debt is about five million dollars and Every year there are demands to issue more debt Public works as a history of essentially buying one big work truck a year The fire chief has already gotten select board approval and and on the warning for March There will be a new fire truck at a cost of 300 about three hundred seventy thousand dollars and he's got another truck. That's 06 I believe So he is thinking he'd like two trucks in the next few years and they both have a big cost And public works tends to average a hundred fifty two hundred thousand dollars a year. So managing debt It gives us some real possibilities to manage the tax rate capital expenses similarly What the policy says is that any unspent local option tax funds are reserved and so If there's a planned capital project for the town we can save cash Years ago and in fact until recently I would never have advised that to any town in Vermont one of the great Levers you have and local government is your borrowing costs are really low way lower than the private sector and that's been the case for a long time Many years local government could borrow less than the rate of inflation even when inflation was two percent so I always thought Vermont towns were were Spend thrifts and I thought that the last 20 years should have been the era of capital investment because it's cheap as cash You'll ever get That era is and you know what a very actually did a lot of that you're standing in a new building That era is over We can still borrow money a lot cheaper than the private sector, but the days of issuing 20 year debt at 2% are gone I don't know how long they're gone for but they're certainly gone today You know now rates are more like four to five For those of us that have mortgages, which is probably all of us you know the difference a few points make On that monthly payment no different for the town We also talked about economic development community vitality efforts. That's a pretty broad bucket But I think it's broad intentionally because there's a lot of things that could fall into there a great example is Next year there's an eclipse and we've talked about that a little bit, but there's We are being told from a lot of people in higher places that for month should expect a huge amount of visitors Something like half our population So we've got to be prepared for those visitors and that'll likely be a line-on in your 2024 budget to buy a Lot of things if nothing else portapies and rent those Some of those challenges that pop up and opportunities be nice to have a revenue source to pay for those It's not necessarily property taxes And then community of vitality You know we have a beautiful downtown, but there's a lot of interest Myself revitalized and water buried we've talked about it in Expanding some of our beautification programs in a downtown some of the holiday decorations some of the plantings throughout the summer And none of that is cheap or free So revenue source for some of those things is nice And then sometimes as a town you have some opportunities to make investments that generate some long-term savings generate some efficiencies Great example I can give is that waterbury like every town in Vermont is Wetted to really old software not really by choice but Just the way we interact with the state we're sort of bound to this product. It's really cheap And it works But it's nearing the end of its life and at some point we're gonna have to make a pretty expensive switch It's gonna generate some long-term help for us, but the turnover is gonna be difficult financially and operationally Again, it'd be nice to have something To finance that turnover, which is gonna help us in the long term Move on Karen And just some of the other challenges some of which I mentioned some of which I haven't affordable housing big challenge I don't think I don't think it's going away anytime soon So it'd be nice to have some funding to maybe keep keep trying to address that As the town in EFUD had with 51 South Main Street where they've tried so far Paving so our paving budget is four hundred five thousand dollars. It's been that amount for three years In that three years ash falls up 40 percent. So we're we're doing what we can but we're paving 40 percent less I'd love to grow that budget. I think a lot of people would love to grow that budget The two old fire engines I talked about Policing is another issue. I haven't talked about extensively in the past in public meetings, but I think it pertains to this Our contract with the Vermont State Police expires in June of next year It's also about four hundred thousand dollars It's a three-year contract and essentially the rate was flat for three years I think the state views that contract as The good faith effort to help water buries. So I don't know that they're gonna ask us for a giant increase But the cost of policing has gone up a lot in three years for the state of Vermont So they have every right to ask for a pretty meaningful increase and finally That's a unique arrangement and Two things are I don't want to say Meaningful possibilities or strong possibilities, but they're the odds of these things occurring are not high But they're certainly not zero and one is that The state police I don't think any time soon, but at some point could say With a long lead time that what are very we think it's time to figure out a different option for policing and this model is Tough for us because they have their own staffing struggles and policing water buries tough The other thing the community might say that we need more police coverage And if we're essentially paying two hundred thousand dollars per year per officer, and we want a third officer Here's a way to pay for it, and that's also a decision that Could be in our future someday depending on what happens with public safety Final thing is the flood After Irene the town engaged with a hydrologist And a number of experts to try to figure out some flood mitigation projects Then the same effort is happening again, and that's going to be another long-term effort in fact I would guess for water barrier that's going to be An effort that essentially never ends in various various forms So these are not things in our current budget or in real recent budgets and and again without Substantially increasing the tax rate here's a way to pay for some of these things and advance the town We can go ahead Karen, and I just want to fast forward if we had a local option tax about what I think 2025 Could look like in broad strokes So if we assume 650 grand which essentially is no growth From what we would have today, which is a really conservative scenario Two things I think we could do that if I was a year ahead, I'd probably be talking about with the select board right now and the first is We have some debt that's smaller capital equipment public workstrucks It doesn't have a ton left on it, but if we paid 256 grand and killed that debt We'd lower our tax rate by two cents Two cents is pretty consistent with our annual increase So in most years that two cents gets us a flat budget And that two cents carries forward because that debt has then gone for all future years The second thing I would tell them and this is something that might be a feature of the 2024 budget Depending on the vote on December 5th is that the fire chiefs truck for three hundred seventy thousand dollars And that's a rough number if we issue a 20 year bond at today's interest rates We essentially pay About five hundred thousand dollars in total debt service for that truck so 130 thousand dollars in interest over the long term We wouldn't need to do that. We could issue a very a short-term note Pay half of it roll half of it over do it again and have it paid for in two years. We did those two big things We'd still have two hundred thousand dollars left over Whether it's saved whether it's applied to other items Would be a decision made at that time But we could move the lever pretty significantly on two items still have a whole lot of cash left over and have a budget that has Essentially a zero percent tax increase so that's That's how I think about 2025 if the local option tax is in place I think there's some great options and I think if I I think if any manager tells any select board The budget I'm the draft budget. I'm delivering to you has a zero percent tax increase It's generally an easy conversation after that and it's generally a relatively easy vote for the public So that's my that's my 2025 Hope and and preview if this all goes through and that's that's the end of my short presentation He's out First thing comments from the board Tom's presentation was very comprehensive. Good job. Thank you. Okay. Let's open this up for questions in the public Comments I like to be first, but I have a few questions and then you stop so so do you mind? I'll have introducing yourself We can't hear you It'd be helpful if you may have a better automation should be in the approach for the use I have several questions, but I'll take them as we go first is it just introduce yourself I'm sorry Tom Glor by every resident the The data you just presented a lot of Well, we can but it's okay. I mean I can remember it I just is it accessible or will it be posted for this? Okay, all right, and then it has a lot of assumptions right not not facts, right? So so good good assumptions. I'm not I'm not So I took the 2022 numbers which are available To 18 years of history whatever those rates of increase were cut them and cut it in half So 50% of historical growth just to give some Some long-term projections about how this would move and I can email you the spreadsheet if you want and you can Pittle around with it too. I would I would be lost but but no, that's good. I mean, it's all it's all analytics It's good. It's data. It's just the assumptions. I'm talking about our Points in time right stuff happens in which I would say the flexibility and use of the funds would be key Right if this gets approved and then what would be the process for introducing What the strategy would be for that specific year say in 25 you get approved There's now funding that's a resource to the town What is the process or have you given some thought as to? Getting feedback because again like four or five very broad categories You're probably only gonna have enough money to do maybe one one and a half that year If you show some of the things you talked about the fire truck Phenomenal I mean any way to to reduce property taxes a great approach as far as I'm concerned, but I'm Sure, so the thought is So local government does something called fund accounting. There's the general fund You know water and sewer beef out or separate, but there's a general fund. There's capital funds This would be a separate fund. So think of it as a separate bank account Like an MR or sleep. So you do that. So everything is just transparent what goes the revenue goes in and what goes out is Is all the approved expenditures? So it'd be a separate fund it'd be reported that way in the town report so you could see Both in the budget, but then in a separate snapshot for this What the anticipated revenue for the up for the current year would be what would be the anticipated expenses? What's the difference and then what's the what's the balance in the fund? And What some towns do? Every town is a different strategy One town in Vermont didn't spend their local option tax for darn near a decade and they had two big capital expenses and they paid cash I don't think that was the greatest idea at the time since the cost of borrowing was so low But so was the cost of so was the price. So was what they earned an interest. So I think they were a little Little spendthrift in that respect But the idea would be really simple transparent embedded in the town report Okay, and then so that's the report that would be discussed at town meeting or and that would be for the next year's Okay, okay, and then is there a thought Yeah, you know what let me pause because they're probably other questions and I'll come back and ask them How's that Tom just to answer probably, you know Because I know you're looking at what people may think of good things to spend money on You could always come to any of those select board meetings when we're in the budgeting process in January And when it comes to whether it be a library or paving or whatnot You could discuss when when that items coming up for the board discuss And that that would be probably an appropriate time to present maybe an idea or you know You could always give something an idea to the town manager or and or the select work. No, I appreciate it I I literally just want to know how what that engagement would be right and when the the opportunities like that or want to be as Transparent as possible one one other piece Tom just to elaborate a little more the select board adopted a policy not a law about how to spend this and So the voters at town meeting to have full authority to say Whatever year hey, we've got this local option tax with a bunch of cash sitting in the account our taxes are high Let's let's vote ourselves a Tax cutter. Let's pay for this with it. There's in the end the voters at the final authority some towns Have the policy embedded into their charter Then it's law and then it's more rigid. Yeah, I've been I've been I mean Understand, I mean, I've been tracking your discussion on this and how that would play out I just didn't know the if that's gonna be the process that's fine. It feels like it's transparent It's fine. It's just those categories are so broad that I would get great because it's flexibility, but with anything resource You just got to think poverty right and and you're probably not gonna get in a specific year what you May have assumed and again, I am not talking obviously for against it's just the idea that We're two years out a year and a half out before getting any of this, right? So the expectation is we're looking at two years of potential tax rate hikes property tax, right? There's other people like the legislature to get to vote again on terms of other taxes that are hitting We're doing a reappraisal to right at some point in time in the future that our costs So there there are a lot of unknowns that are Coming right and that's why I think it's important that this process is so transparent But the public can look at it as okay look you're piling on right now I'm not adverse to the the idea of a local option tax But the the idea of option is kind of interesting, right? Is it really optional? It's you can shop somewhere else, right? I guess but Online shopping to me. I think it's that's a significant cost that no one's going to be anticipating and based off the The show tonight, right? And I know people get data different ways They a lot of it's just looking at site for meetings and stuff and work a shout out very good But that's something I don't think a lot of people know right now That that that it's going to apply to your internet purchases. So I don't know how you solve that in terms of participation, but it's probably something that when you have the meeting on the fifth The fifth is a vote the vote I'm sorry So the vote on the fifth if you looked at those categories that you saw on there There's no way of telling what would be Internet related costs right or that's correct. Yeah, so those are those are the Assumptions, I'm saying that could be higher, right, you know, so and then I have one more question, but so so just a a Boundaries right town boundaries, and I'm not gonna bring up other municipalities in this discussion That's for another time and again, I do a Feel bad about lefty, so that's news not not good but and that topic the So hardware stores in Waterbury one steps on the 100 one steps across the bridge There's local option tax apply to both Yeah, so it's I'm just saying you're gonna affect I Would imagine at least one of those Property owners who's gonna say look up you take because I know that I work in Wilson. Mm-hmm. There are times I don't Go to things like Home Depot because the local option tax, right? And I get a darn pretty good discount So but I look at it and try to keep my my business local In town, but that to me would be a bit of a discriminator. It's only 1% but You know, you're correct something something to look at And I only break because you said you haven't got a lot of feedback from businesses that type of a business I think would be something to talk to you. Maybe engage in direct. I don't know, but all right Thank you Yeah, Teresa Appreciate the the Stamped and words consideration of this local option tax I Agree with it what people are saying in terms of There's there's you know a lot of different options for how it can be used but we won't even have an opportunity to to have those discussions in less the less we've asked this and so I I am very much in favor of this and There are so many surrounding towns that have this we we are at an economic advantage by not not having this and I'm not sure if there's something that that Tom mentioned but you know the part that goes to the Part that stays with the state goes to fund the pilot program which we will also benefit from because it will increase the pilot payments, so I'm definitely in favor of this and appreciate you bringing it forward for public both. Thank you Yeah, Bill Good presentation Tom. Thank you I'm Bill Shepulek from water right I Support this charter Proposal I support the local option tax And I was going to mention what Teresa just did I was going to ask Tom I assumed the six hundred and fifty thousand was the seventy percent share correct and the thirty percent that of the So for every hundred dollars of the local option tax the local community gets seventy dollars and thirty dollars goes into the states Coffers and they take a little bit of that for administration because they do all the administration of this It's a tax that the state collects and the municipality doesn't the state Sends the money to the town But as Teresa indicated the town is one of the larger recipients of pilot funding in the state and and we will get a little bit more from That source as well, so We'll we'll get a bigger impact than some communities that have this that don't have a big state presence It might I can't announce yet in that a little bit So the pilot payment of will of taxes the state Takes this pot of funds and pays towns Based on the insurance values of state property in their borders Insurance values because I'm sure at some point a smart wister said hey There's a piece of state, you know, there's a state courthouse in my town and I can just value it at five million bucks It's normally one no one's going to care and I'll get more So it's it's insurance values We budgeted this year to get three hundred sixty thousand dollars from the pilot payment pilot came in a week or so ago at four hundred K So that's great You can look at each town share of the pilot payment and some of no state property and get none But based on that using the six hundred fifty thousand dollar number We get another fifteen thousand dollars a year in pilot payment. So there's that other side effect Good. Yeah. Thank you. I Know this is about the Charter and about should we have the tax I couldn't say it better than Teresa did We don't get to think about how we're going to use it unless we have it just a couple thoughts and I Heard what you said about long-term debt and that You know four or five percent is not The good old days that I dealt with for the last 20 years, which was you know 2% and you know Tom and I had talked many times when he first came that you know It was crazy not to issue debt to buy these things I would say however that even at four or five or six percent That's that's kind of back to what traditionally were interest rates when I came into the business in In the early 80s. So I would suggest that look towards how you can spend the money to reduce taxes through maybe operating expenses or on capital projects or capital Or equipment purchases that are maybe you know Pick up trucks and small vehicles things that are going to be paid off in five maybe even eight years like a Dump truck. I think we're on a five to seven year turnaround on those Things like fire trucks at thirty thousand dollars or buildings or highway graders and things like that My personal feeling is that not only does debt It's a it's a way to even out the payments over over time But it's also a way to ensure that the people who are using the the Improvement pay for it. So if you pay for that fire truck That's going to last 20 years in the first two years, and then it's free for everybody People who move in 10 years from now are getting service from that vehicle and they're not paying for it And I know you're going we've got a lot of fire trucks to buy and if you buy every one of them on Cash then everyone is going to pay their share of it But I'm not sure you can do that with the number of high-priced vehicles that we have with two fire Departments and the highway fund. So I'm not saying don't do it. I'm just saying Factor that into your equation because having people pay their fair share is important I did have a question about the first article and the town manager Hiring in the department head thing Tom You use the example of the public works director and I'm not trying to carry Tom Glor's banner here, but The public works director is an EFUD employee and the chain of command goes You know up the chain from the public works director to you to the EFUD board and You know, we've got an arrangement where we have one public works director He gets paid by one municipality Keeps track of his time the other municipality pays that back But I it's just a wrinkle that Yeah, just don't say it's really smooth and easy because it's it's not here That's all Thanks Other colors Yeah, you have ten people right here Such a good job You have a question People are shy about asking questions, there's candy Are there any unknown requirements That the state's gonna let me on this now as a charter town And then have we looked at this to understand what you mentioned policing, right? And I know that's the purview of the town or a municipality. I guess at this point Are those things that I mean is there a statue out there that says a town versus a municipality is Responsible for doing X Y and Z. No, we have other positions out to be hired No, no other responsibilities come with this, okay That was it. Thank you. Okay. Thank you Take your candy No, are we making it if you speak you could get a piece of candy This is still on She didn't get a candy But she did speak earlier Suggested that this would be Potentially our one good shot at getting this Get any concerns met at this meeting or the next meeting before the vote It does have concerns to please address them now so we can address them before it gets to know And she did have some concerns about Us defining how we would spend the money I think we have addressed that while setting some broad parameters. We have said that select board could address the policy and Have public input on how the funds would be spent on an annual basis. I don't know if we've got more discussion on this Yes, Alyssa, I didn't know if Karen or Tom could just speak to the voting process for anyone who is here or might see this later You can get a ballot now. They're available in my office. I can mail them. You can stop by and vote Monday through Friday Otherwise I intend to have the this room utilized on December 5th So folks from 7 to 7 So there won't be a meeting or discussion on December 5th that day is for voting So just to highlight you can vote now You can go early don't have to wait until December 5th if you don't want and if you want to vote by now You contact Karen for a ballot And her info is on the town website And if any other concerns come to you over the next week, we will be opening up the meeting on the number 6 with Another informational public forum on the same issue Next Monday November 6th and after that voting will be open as of now right through 7 o'clock December 5th, so I would say that And I may just be the evening party in this one, but I didn't know that the meeting in December was not going to be an It's going to be just a vote So it's up and down vote for those two articles. No presentation Okay, so now Australia now that voting will be open from 7 until 7 And then we'll be meeting that's Monday night That's to that's Tuesday Okay, and Tom that that process is dictated to us by state law Yeah, no, I'm fine with it. I just didn't it just based off the turnout today. It's just amazed me that we're making Strategic decisions with a very small subset, right? I You know, I don't want to get my soul, but it's informed citizen should vote, right? Everybody should vote, but it's really important to be informed. So so the next meeting I Don't know that I know I Did the orca thing got on so your last like we're meeting about trying to advertise a little bit more that this was happening I did see the front page form. I did see some things actually I would shout out with the roundabout So that's all good. It just and it could be the public is very informed and everybody's on board with this And I think it's going to be quite popular Um But that piece I guess of how the funds will be used is I think we're discussing Right. Well, good. I hope everyone heard you. Uh, Danny, you know something second Yeah, we're just gonna Take what tom said and um, you know, there'll be the informational meetings There'll be more out on from first forum. Hopefully, you know covering the roundabout as well. So folks who Feel informed and you know understand via the what's been published great But also we do encourage, you know, anyone who might be watching or listening to come and ask questions or send an email You know, you can always give a call or send an email to ask a specific question if you have one Um, and then I know Karen is going to publish the slides as well. So if those are going to be available to everybody um You know to everybody in the public whether you're able to attend the meeting or not and then um, the last thing is More of a question since we will likely put, you know, more info about the next meeting coming up Maybe we can even be more clear. Um, I didn't go back and review the other posting But even more clear about which is a meeting and what's just about so we can review that language And if it isn't clear in the language that's going out we can clarify it that way so Lisa you had your hand up I have two quick questions. Um, will the slides from tonight be with tonight's minutes probably I'll put them on the news section. I think Lisa already made a notice Okay, very good. I'll put them on the news. Yeah, they'll put them in the minutes, but I'll I'll try to put them on the home page I can link to that that would be happy to do that and one other quick question was has anybody voted yet? Yes Yes How many voters have you have you actually had yet? Has it been for a minute? I've had three I'm just curious. I think they've only had two and I've mailed one Oh Just if I could make a little commentary And I'd say this book personally as as as a select board member I'm not the hugest one that likes to see big increases in taxes or any increases in taxes and when The local options tax was first presented. I had my second doubts about it But after doing research and maybe this is just to educate some some other folks Is we're surrounded by a lot of towns that also have local options tax You know stoll wilson, etc places where where people shop, you know, they're all going to have options tax It's a very interesting one that tom brought up the hardware store right across the river that's kind of An anomaly, but I do think people I I used to always not go to wilson for that same For just like you said the same purpose I didn't want to pay that extra one one percent But you sometimes you become immune to the one percent and you I like to shop Things in town, but there's a lot of things that you can't buy here in town And you're going to wind up getting, you know, we all get hit by the you know The amazons the cabela's, you know, everyone's charging, you know taxes, you know, that's all and I think that I think that's the Wild card is we don't know how much income is going to be brought in by that And I would like to see that there's a lot if there was a real effect on our Citizens and our businesses I'd probably be opposed to to to the local options tax But I have become a convert. I think it's a reasonable way to help fund government I think it's an important way that we could minimize people's tax increases We do still we still have a lot of seniors here in this town who are, you know, Fixed incomes and you know, they really can't you know, you know any increases in their taxes are going to hurt them in the Pocket book. So I'm a convert. I think Taxes have become a big reason why you know, I think it's not our local taxes. It's really more of our School taxes that and I'm not going to get on a soapbox about that But I think this is a reasonable thing because other towns have it. It's a good way for us to fund Things that we need to do in town or minimize taxes. Let's see Thanks One last time I just want to make sure I think I understand but when when to the discussion a minute ago that was being had about You know the impact of internet sales I mean tom talked about the fact that this would apply But remember it applies to internet sales that the sales tax already applies to so in other words if If you're buying something and there's no sales tax because It doesn't apply then you're not going to pay the 1% But if you if you go online and you buy something and you're paying the state sales tax now because They've all agreed and there's been congressional action and everything else You're just going to pay that 1% extra. It's not like this is something that Is the bolt out of the blue and it's causing internet sales to be taxable if it applies now To what you're buying if you're paying the regular state sales tax, it'll be 1% higher. It's not going to go from 0 to 7% So I just wanted to make sure that we were aware of that and and you know the the hardware store across the Across the river. Yeah, you know, unfortunately, there's one on both sides You can't you can't solve every reality that's out there I mean that the people who do business on the new Hampshire border do this all the time And it's a lot more than 1% and somehow they they managed to make it and uh, you know the There's plenty of services that watterbury provides to folks outside this community And this happens everywhere in st. Albans and my pillar and in barry and burlington There's a municipal overburden that the bigger communities that have the services that have places to shop and Not for profits Which don't pay taxes here and people get services. So this I think it's a way to kind of broaden the tax base And get our fair share of things that we're missing out on now as well because of how the tax structure Is is set up. It's Nothing is going to be perfectly fair 100 of the time. That's just life. So I think this is a good thing for the community And I hope that it will pass Thanks, bill Did that one alibi That's why we're here. We want to hear everybody's not to respond to mr. Sheplock. That's not to be clear I am not adverse at all to the little option tax. I just I my statement's more about the knowledge out there And the lack of engagement at times with the community. That's not your responsibility. That's how we're the people responsibility, right? So I think you've done everything you needed to get the information out Um, it's just these are things that you know when they hit Next year People have short memories. So then it's oh, there's a 1% tax. What happened, you know Well, we talked about this for two, you know, two years so The last thing was the 1% is set, right? Is that a tax that does not get raised it? There's no local Ability to change that the state doesn't change that that's the 1% Because sales tax does change, right? so the state The legislature could change it Okay, okay, wouldn't be but it's not low Good to go Thank you. Yeah, that was my problem Well, we don't know come back again next week. Uh with more if you're good Look forward to it. Thank you. You should have free pizza to get people down to get to work Well, there's a bag of candy Oh, you didn't advertise Good point should have been warned. Mm-hmm. Well, it's got to be There you go. I I looked while I was in the store. I was like, should I bring a cabbage to celebrate? Good point Um, I don't know that we've got any more business in front of us. Do I have a motion to adjourn? So moved second Move in second and all the papers. All right. Hi. Okay. We are adjourned until next monday