 Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Lowy Institute's beautiful headquarters at 31 Bly Street. Let me welcome in particular board members of the Institute who are with us this afternoon, Finland's Ambassador to Australia, her Australian counterpart, the EU Ambassador to Australia, as well as the Finnish Minister for Development and Foreign Trade and other distinguished guests. I'm Michael Fulilove, the Executive Director of the Lowy Institute. Come in to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land on which the Institute stands, the Gadigal of the Eora Nation. I acknowledge their elders past and present. As many of you know, it's been a very busy month or two at the Institute. We've published important research on very busy month or two at the Institute. We've published important research on Chinese coercion, Australian resilience, Australia's links to Southeast Asia, as well as our brilliant Pacific Aid Map. We've hosted leaders from around the world, including the Prime Minister of Singapore, India's External Affairs Minister, the Director-General of the World Trade Organization, and of course, the President of Ukraine. But we are particularly excited that our last international guest for 2022 is the first ever Finnish Prime Minister to visit Australia, Ms. Sana Mareen. Let me just say PM, Teva Tuloa Sydneyan. I might say I used that phrase on the PM's special advisor earlier, and she had no idea what I was saying, which doesn't speak well of my accent. I have to tell you, PM, the announcement last week that you would speak to the Institute prompted a flood of interest from people who wanted to attend, apparently half of Sydney are experts on Finland. We could certainly have filled this room several times over, which is a compliment to you. Ladies and gentlemen, Sana Mareen has been involved in politics from a young age. She served as a city council leader before she was elected to the Finnish Parliament in 2015. She served as Minister of Transport and Communications, and then in 2019 she was appointed Prime Minister of Finland. From a distance, I've observed that Ms. Mareen is intelligent, accomplished and plain spoken, which is, of course, accords with the reputation of the Finns. We saw this quality in October, Prime Minister, when a journalist asked about an off-ramp for Russia in Ukraine, and he asked about a way out of the conflict, and you looked a bit quizzical, and you repeated the question, and then you said, a way out of the conflict, the way out of the conflict is for Russia to leave Ukraine, that's the way out of the conflict, and you walked off. I think, ladies and gentlemen, the technical term for that is a mic drop. As I said, this is the first visit by a Finnish Prime Minister to Australia. I don't believe it's a coincidence that it's happening now, even as Finland is on the frontiers of the struggle to defend Ukraine, because Russia's aggression has reminded all of us in all of the world's democracies how much we have in common with each other, and whether it's Prime Ministers or Foreign Ministers or even think tank directors, we're all reaching out to each other, to our counterparts in like-minded countries. The connections between the democracies are quickening, and that's one of the reasons, one of several reasons, why we are so pleased to host the Prime Minister today. So let me now invite Senator Mareen to address the Low Institute on how a strong Europe can contribute to a more secure world. PM. Dear Director of the Low Institute, Michael Fulllove, thank you for your kind words. Your Excellencies, distinguished guests. I'm pleased to be here to address the Low Institute today. Relations between Finland and Australia are excellent. We are long-standing like-minded partners with the strong commitment to our common democratic values and the rule-based international order. Finland also participates actively in shaping the agenda for cooperation between the European Union and Australia. Both of our countries have built strong partnerships across the world. As the global security environment changes and our common values become increasingly challenged, partnerships based on trust matter more and more. Finland and Sweden will soon join NATO, which means we will be part of the same network of alliances linking us with North America. More broadly, we see countries sharing the same values within the Atlantic and in the Pacific regions finding each other. The change in global security environment is bringing us closer together. Australia has a unique perspective in the Pacific region. Here, many of our common challenges and great opportunities are either ceased or lost. This has been well understood also by the European Union, which held recently the EU-Australia Summit and negotiates with Australia on a new free trade agreement. My distinguished discussion here in Sydney will also give useful background. As latter, later in December, we meet the leaders of the ASEAN in Brussels. But importantly, Australia has always been a key global actor with whom we can make multilateral order a force for good. Nowhere are our common efforts more needed than in our fight against climate change and loss of biodiversity. Australia's new ambitions and leadership are highly valued and timely. We need to move away from fossil fuels and develop cleaner energy solutions such as hydrogen together. We must move forward after COP 27 climate conference as we have no alternatives to keeping the 1.5 degree target alive. Our national aim is to be carbon neutral by 2035 and carbon negative soon after that. Dear attendees, just when the world should be coming together and taking joint action to tackle the great challenges of our times, Russia's war against Ukraine has confronted us all with the new and more serious challenge. Russia's illegal and brutal war against Ukraine, the killing of thousands upon thousands of Ukrainian soldiers and civilians and the continuing acts of terror require strong, firm and global response. When Russia, a permanent member of the United Nations Security Council, preaches the UN Charter with total impunity, disregards and violates international law and commits war crimes, we all have very much to lose in Europe, in the Pacific region and elsewhere. The energy crisis, the food crisis and rising inflation are all of Russia's making. This winter will not only be hard for Ukraine but also in our societies. However, our hardship comes and goes. The Ukrainians are fighting for their survival and future as a free nation. We must continue our support. There are no alternatives. We must do whatever it takes so that Ukraine will win the war. There will eventually pee time for peace. But peace has to come the Ukrainian terms. We must step up our efforts to make Russia's leadership realize that it has only to lose from this war and lose it will. Here I want to welcome Australia's strong and clear leadership and important concrete contributions in helping Ukraine and putting pressure against Russia with sanctions. We are together shoulder to shoulder working to make Russia lose its war. Your role is highly valued in Europe and certainly most of all in Ukraine. Just as the COVID-19 pandemic proved that the European Union can act together against major threats and the EU has been both united and very effective in responding to Russia's aggression. The European Union is now considering new sanctions against Russia. This will be the ninth package of sanctions since the 24th of February. We will likely find a way to limit the import of fossil fuels from Russia even further with this round. Finland is pushing for even harder sanctions that would cover the entire energy sector. Even though we have already diversified our energy sources and build up our security of supply before the war, the energy crisis also hurts as fence. As our most imported markets in Europe suffer from supply shortages, higher energy prices and rising inflation. We should continue the weak and Russia's ability to finance the war. We must make the sanctions more effective. Our focus should also be on closing blue poles in current sanctions and cracking down the attempts to circumvise them. Here too we need partners like Australia. Finland has been an important transit country and tourist destination for Russians. We have therefore stopped issuing tourist visas to Russia's citizens. It became morally unacceptable to allow the Russian's middle and upper class to continue to enjoy their vacations in Europe while their army kills churches and terrorizes Ukrainians. These Russians are largely still insulated from the ugly faces of war. The freezing of the assets of selected Russians, the Oligarchs close to Putin, is an important part of our common action. We should find legal ways to confiscate these assets and use them for reconstruction in Ukraine. These efforts are ongoing within the European Union and we expect to discuss our options in some form or another in our next European Council later in December. The European Union is currently preparing a new package of assistance to Ukraine. This macroeconomics assistance will be worth of 18 billion euros. We are also stepping up our support for Ukraine defence forces through the European Peace Facility. You will now have a training mission for the Ukrainian military in which Finland will also participate. Finland has just delivered its 10th national package of weapons and military equipment, including heavy weapons to Ukraine. When our development and humanitarian aid are counted together, we have given over 300 million euros in assistance in Ukraine and more is on the way. What we need now is the active engagement of the private sector so that Ukrainians can get energy, water and sanitation equipment for the winter. New kinds of public-private partnerships and instruments are crucial. Make no mistake, if Russia wins its terrible gamble, it will not be only one to feel empowered. Others will also be tempted by the same dark agenda. Dear friends, we need to draw the right lessons from the recent global challenges, wars and crisis. In increasingly critical areas of our societies, from medical equipment to new technologies and energy, we have become far too dependent on cooperation with regimes that do not share our common values. Globalisation has lifted large populations out of poverty and we must pursue it wherever we can. Finland stands as a prime example of how openness and global trade can make a nation stronger. That said, openness and cooperation have not changed the world enough. Our dependencies are becoming our weaknesses faster and in more important areas of our societies than we would like to happen. The right lessons from Europe is to build strategic autonomy in key sectors with its trusted partners. We are not building walls but seeking reliable solutions together. I have had the great opportunity to address these important topics recently with key leaders such as Prime Minister of Japan, his Excellency Fumio Kishida, the Prime Minister of India, his Excellency Narendra Modi and many others. We need to discuss it with all our partners and allies, especially Canada and the United States. Dear attendees, with Australia we should join our lifelines together. We see important potential in more cooperation with you in areas such as clean energy, critical raw materials and new technologies. The European Union and Australia are currently finalising the negotiations for a new free trade agreement. The agreement needs to help us in building resilient value chains and common base for developing our skills and know-how. Businesses will be final judges of how our markets integrate with one another but standards, rules and financial incentives matter. Importantly, as leaders, we owe it to businesses and consumers to be open about our long term risks as we see them from our political perspectives. As we make important advances in science, research and innovation, there is an increasing risk that we will also create new dependencies. Our third term regimes will try to exploit them and abuse the lack of level playing field. As digitalisation becomes more and more important part of our most basic services, we must be able to trust technology. Our common lifelines have to be based on solid cooperation in science, research and innovation as well. The EU and Australia should develop a regular dialogue in the use of new technologies and their international regulation. The EU also have many instruments available in concrete terms from its global gateway programme to horizon Europe. They use funding programme for research and innovation. European strategic autonomy is as much about building resilience, deepening European integration and taking strategic responsibility for Europe as it is about being a good partner. Among our partners and allies, we owe this first and foremost to our most vital and long term partner, the United States. We need to take better responsibility of our continent and in many club and today's globalised world. This means stronger partnerships based on trust and shared values. Dear friends, it is very important to build level playing fields. We need to demand fairness from all trade and investment partners in the world. However, the recent wars, crises and disasters have shown that this will not be enough. Open democratic and progressive societies also need stronger strategic autonomy in critically important areas for the citizens supported by trusted partners. Cooperation among progressive democracies is now more important than ever. Our common values, universal human rights and democracy need to be defended with new force, new determination. We need to build bridges across Euro-Atlantic and the Indo-Pacific region. This is the right time for the first ever visit from a Finnish Prime Minister to Australia and this is the right moment to strengthen our bilateral relations. Thank you so much. PM, thank you for those strong and wide-ranging remarks. It will be read closely. I really like the line of common lifelines and joining our lifelines together. Thank you for agreeing to take some questions. I'm going to kick off with half a dozen or so and then I'm going to go to the audience. So start thinking. Let me begin. Your country shares a 1300 kilometre border with Russia. It's often said that the first responsibility of any Prime Minister or any leader is to keep her country or his country secure and safe. How is your conception of your job changed since February? Well of course we are all in a very difficult situation in Europe because of the war of Ukraine and of course it changed the agenda of our government, of all the key institutions, the parliament and we also have a president in Finland that has a key role in security and foreign policy. So of course all of our focus is now on the war, in the war and also what it means to Europe in many ways. And as I said in my speech I think we have to learn lessons from this war. We cannot be dependent on critical matters. Now we are too dependent on energy coming from Russia and that actually means very concrete things. It means that we are financing the war every day because we are pying energy from Russia and we have to make sure that we don't have those kind of dependencies in the future. But foreign and security policy are now the key areas that we are engaged every day in our government and also in our societies in many ways. Or I'm going to come back to those vulnerabilities that you mentioned a little bit later but first of all let me ask you about President Zelensky in October. I was lucky enough to host him on this stage albeit by Zoom. Of course you met with him in Kiev earlier in the year. You're one of the first world leaders to go to Kiev to meet him. What were your observations of him as a leader and as a fellow politician I guess you have a particular appreciation for the task he has. So how have you appreciated how he's gone about doing his job? Well I met President Zelensky many times live and also through Zoom and teams as we all have been doing during the COVID as well. And he has been participating in many European council meetings as well telling us the situation in Ukraine. And it was really memorable the visit to Kiev to Ukraine during the war. And I remember vividly about the different sides of Kiev during my visit. President Zelensky, also Prime Minister Mikhail and others from the government were in the government buildings, bunkers, there were sand sacks everywhere and it was very secure, the holes were dark so that you couldn't spot where we were moving. But at the same time people on the streets, on the parks, they were trying to live as normal life as possible. So there are these different scenes in Kiev and in Ukraine as we speak. President Zelensky is a very brave courageous man and I think the whole Ukrainian nation. They are so courageous right now fighting for their freedom, fighting for their sovereignty and their nation as such. So I think we have to support them everywhere we can. They are so heroic and we must make sure that they will win. I think in that visit you also visited Bucha. Yes and Irpin as well. And how did how did those visits, the revelation of the darkest the darkest sides of this conflict, how did that affect you? Well we visited Irpin and Bucha and saw the mass graves, saw what Russians had done and I was thinking then and thinking still about the regions where there are still Russian military troops and we have seen terrible footage, we have heard terrible stories and we know that there are rapes that are actively part of the war. There are tortured civilians, there are these terrible actions happening every day and the Ukrainians they are not fighting from themselves, they are also fighting for the European values, democratic values and we must make sure that they will not only win but they will thrive in the future. We want to make sure that they can become members of European Union, that they will have a pride future ahead of them. I remember also that Finland were in war, we have been in war with Russia and our story after the war when we gained our independence is a successful one. We have built our welfare nation, we have educated our people, we have a good perspective to the future also from this point. So we have to make sure that also the Ukrainians have that hope that they will have a bright future ahead of them. They are now fighting for their lives, they are fighting for their freedom but they are also fighting for a better future. This is the hope that gives them strength right now and we have to make sure that we will boost that hope, that we will help them and that we will be by their sides the building this better future. Let me ask you about Finland. Given Finland's strategic location and given its history alongside its remarkable social democracy Finland is also a remarkably resilient country. A country that is able to mobilise hundreds of thousands of of people from military service and do a lot to defend itself. So tell us as a progressive leader how has Finland managed to do both of these things, a strong social democracy but strong national security at the same time? Well I think if you ask Finnish people what is the most important thing in our nation and what we want to make sure to the future it's to be secure because of our history. The number one priority for us is to be secure, that we have our independence, that we have that possibility to decide ourselves. That is the most important thing and next week we will actually celebrate the 6th of December our independence day which is always the key day for the year and we are very proud to be independent and we are very proud to also be a welfare society but we have to be wise because we know that we have an aggressive neighbour, we know that we have 1300 kilometers border with Russia so during the same time that we have educated our citizens and building the welfare society, social and health care systems and making sure that we have that well-being at the same time we have always researched our military and we have made investments to our security because we know that that if we don't do that if we don't maintain that resilience and that for example defence forces the future might not be a pride one for us and this is also why we're now joining NATO because we want to make sure that in the future there won't ever again be war on Finnish soil. So let me ask you about NATO because you're right Finland's always taken a muscular approach to its own security standing on its own feet but even as late as last year it probably would have been unthinkable to most that Finland and Sweden would join NATO. I think you and I were discussing a poll this week that said that I think 85% of Finns approve of the decision to seek membership of NATO. Tell us a bit about how your government made this transition this year. How did you get to such a strong national support for such an important consequential decision? Well I think that the mentality and the opinions of Finnish people changed immediately when Russia attacked Ukraine. I just told you that us Finns the most important thing is to make sure that our nation and our citizens are safe and secure and up till the 24th of February. The way to do that was to have working bilateral relations with Russia to be not part of NATO with close partners but not a member of NATO. So that was the way to secure our nation that was the best way to secure a nation. We had the possibility to apply NATO membership and this is written in our foreign security policy papers so that was always an option but wasn't discussed but after Russia attacked Ukraine I think the mentality of people changed immediately. I noticed it changed for me a bit earlier but still it shifted overnight I would say and then we had the process during the spring of joining NATO to gather all the institutions the president the government the parliament but also all the political parties to have this process together the building that kind of not unanimity but very large acceptance of joining NATO and out of 200 188 parliamentarians voted in favor of applying NATO membership because we were on the same page we had that discussion and we worked together very closely like we always do when it comes to foreign insecurity policy we are a small country and we are next to Russia so it's in our interest and it secures our position that we are unanimous when it comes to foreign insecurity policy. This is also something that Finland is known for for its unanimity or this large support of all the political actors and also the citizens when it comes to foreign security policy. And what kind of NATO member would Finland be? Would you send your forces to exercise with other NATO countries? Would you fully integrate your military with other NATO forces? Well we would be a full member we would of course have the discussion later after we will join we will have the discussion later for example whether or not there should be nuclear weapons in Finnish soil or permanent basis etc i don't think that there are anyone to want us to have those but we will have that kind of sorts of discussions later it's not actively discussed now we are focusing on applying the NATO membership and we will be a security provider to NATO we have extensive armed forces in Finland we have a lot of capabilities we are already spending over two percent of our nation's GDP to defence so we are a strong player when it comes to defence and security so we would be a security provider and we also are working closely together with Sweden that applied at the same time and we had very good cooperation and similar kind of process during the spring and had very good connections with our Swedish colleagues and they will also bring security to NATO they have for example very good defence industry when it comes to submarine and and planes and all well thank you for mentioning submarines because i want to ask you about i want to ask you about i i thought i get lead you there because i know you want very helpful now i want to ask you about orcas i know that not everybody in europe was was excited when orcas was announced and president macron was very disappointed and i'm sure you don't want to get involved in too much commentary on australia's arrangements but as a small country that's right next to russia can you understand why in the face of a more assertive china a country like australia would want to tighten its connections to the united states and develop a deterrent capability like nuclear propelled conventionally armed submarines does it make intuitive sense to you well i won't go to details i would only say that the decisions are made i think we should focus on the future and it's very important that we would be able to negotiate the free trade agreement that would boost our both economies that would be very important for for european union for australia and we need that type cooperation between our countries and between our areas but of course i understand out of the august deal of course i understand the worries that that you have on china i think we all have worries when it comes to china and we must make sure that we don't have that kind of critical dependencies when it comes to china i don't mean that we shouldn't trade or that we shouldn't have connections to china of course we do that's a reality and we will also have those in in the future but those critical dependencies that we must get rid of so that we have also alternative trading routes that we have to know how the knowledge the new technologies for our digitalized societies because we cannot be dependent for example microchips or semiconductors or any kind of critical technologies when it comes to authoritarian countries because if those trading routes would be cut suddenly then we would be in trouble our businesses our industries will be in trouble our total whole economies will collapse so it would be only wise to make sure and in advance that you don't have critical dependencies that will cripple your entire economy if there would be some kind of willingness to do so let me ask you more broadly about china how do you see china as as a global player i mean how do you balance the different elements of china's identity i know you've been somewhat critical i think of some of the human rights record of china in the past on the other hand it's a huge global economy it's powering economic growth it's essential to solving the dilemma of climate change what are your observations about china how do you think about china as an actor on the global stage china is a key player china is a big country and key player we need china when it comes to fighting climate change when it comes to fighting biodiversity we need china to defend multilateral international order i think one of our biggest challenge that is shown now because of the russian war in ukraine is that the international ruled based order is being challenged there are countries like russia that is now putting the rules aside and doing whatever they want and this is something that we cannot approve so we must stand behind our values and understand that there is a war and fight concerning values going on in the world and we have to make sure that our values the democratic values will win so we cannot be naive this is the time this is the time to stop being naive also when it comes to china and that is why i'm speaking so much about european strategic autonomy that doesn't mean that we would close all all doors and windows to everybody else it doesn't mean that it means that actually we need much more deeper cooperation between our democratic partners like australia we should have that free trade agreement we should have that that connections when it comes to for example raw materials or new technologies we should have those tight tight connections as democratic countries and cut the dependencies on authoritarian regimes where they are critical you mentioned climate change and your government has been a world leader in terms of setting a very ambitious target there how does the war in ukraine how is that impeding multilateral action on climate change isn't it harder to to make progress at charmel's shake to make progress in multilateral discussions when your when russia is behaving in the way that it does how do you how do you how do you prevent the focus on the urgent crowding out the important well i think climate is an urgent issue and we should do more and we should do faster that's a given and it's in everybody's interest to make sure that that the warmth of of our planet is stopped by 1.5 degrees it will cost us a lot if we won't manage that so it's in everybody's interest it's in china's interest it's in russia's interest it's in europeans and australians interest to make sure that that we will stop climate change and we should also see all the potential we see as fence as our nation wants to reach the climate target of becoming climate neutral but it doesn't revive that it will boost our economy when climate change is the biggest threat that we face actually tackling and fighting climate change is our biggest opportunity for economic growth crimson transition digital transition making sure that our economies our businesses are sustainable it's a big boost for for our economies so we want to show that that when you are fighting climate change you can create new greener jobs you can have your people's well-being to the next level that that you will thrive as a society so we want to show an example all right one more question on politics and i'm going to go to the audience um you're going to meet with the australian prime minister mr albanaisey straight after this event um he leads a government made up of one political party you lead a coalition government made up of five political parties are you a little bit jealous well um of course there are a lot of negotiations when you have uh many partners in the government but this is the finished way we have always have coalition governments and there are always of course problems when it comes to coalitions different ideologies different views on issues and you have to find a way to have uh compromises and and trying to find consensus on on different issues from different also from different value point values point of view so of course there are always difficulties but i think there are also difficulties when it comes to to governments with only one party because then you have the same difficulties within the party so so i think the number of problems is always the same whether you have the coalition government or government with only one part now we never have factional problems in australian politics that never happens all right i'm going to take some questions from the audience the first hand i saw was susanna pattern at the back from the low institute if i can ask people put up their hand if you get the call please ask a brief question make it a question and identify yourself before you ask your question susanna pattern thank you very much prime minister um many people in australia want to see european countries play a greater role in the indoe pacific and many european countries have announced policies to do so i'd be interested in your reflections on how the conflict in ukraine could affect prospects for greater european engagement in our region here thank you well i think it will create more opportunities uh also to tighten our cooperation as i mentioned we have to learn lessons from this war and one lesson is that we need our partners we need our partners we need that cooperation between democratic countries i think australia new zealand are key players in this part of the world but we also need uh japan we need south korea we need india we need many others on board to making sure that there are strength in democracies that we are defending our values that we are defending for example the international rule-based order there must be rules in the world that we all obey if there's not there's only chaos and we cannot we cannot allow that kind of ideology win so so i think this is also opportunity to tighten those relations and partnerships and cooperation so so i think europe will and wants to have a foot also in the in the pacific and and the free trade agreements that we already set up with with new zealand and hopefully soon with australia those only show that that we want to strengthen our partnerships i saw isabel roe with her hand up isabel no no i think in behind you andrea yes hi um isabel roe from the australian broadcast incorporation thanks prime minister for your address i just wanted to ask um what sort of responsibility do you believe that china has to reign in russia and how much leverage do you think that jijin ping has over putain well i think china could play an important role to stop the war if they want it and it's up to china how they want to act concerning the war but we shouldn't only rely on that about china or any others we should make sure that we are stronger and now i must be very honest brutally honest with you europe isn't strong enough right now we would be in trouble without the united states involving the the war in ukraine united states has given a lot of weapons a lot of financial aid a lot of humanitarian aid to ukraine and europe isn't strong enough yet and we have to make sure that that we are also building those capabilities when it comes to european defense european defense industry and and making sure that that we could cope in different kind of situations i have met many politicians from united states and and they all think that that that europe should be stronger they don't see it as opposing united states but they see as partners and i think think that you need to be strong to be a strong partner so i'm fully supporting the european statistical autonomy that we should build our own resilience and also our own capabilities when it comes to defense but also many other matters speaking of the united states your prime ministership has covered both the the administration of mr trump and the administration mr biden have you seen what what's the biggest change that you've noticed in us foreign policy over that period do you think mr trump for example would have played would have supported ukraine as strongly as mr biden has well of course it's it's very difficult to see what would have happened if the current administration wouldn't be be in place we are very grateful to the united states that they are so involved in in the war in ukraine their their value is very crucial right now and of course we hope that they will continue supporting supporting ukraine weapons and help of all sorts i'm very happy that the biden administration has come back to the international fora that they are now involved in international affairs and and that they are keen of building partnerships and i of course hope that also in the future united states would want to be partners and want to build that cooperation between europe and and united states but also or all others we need more cooperation we don't need less we need more and the current administration is involving involved in in this areas all right i saw rory medkaf with his hand up down the front thank you prime minister congrats i should say congratulations on finland joining nato but i feel like congratulating nato on joining finland look my question is really about uh some of the the qualities that finland brings i think the international scene a lot of us in australia are learning a lot about finland at the moment but one lesson that struck me is the culture of transparency in your country i think the culture of some of the service which they quite radical transparency seems to be a real asset in national security countering foreign interference and so forth i just wonder if you could say a little about how transparency works in your country well finland is a transparent country and we have very high rankings when it comes for example the freedom of the press and and and we have very low low uh i don't remember the word but we don't have corruption for example that kind of corruption so so we are very transparent uh and we are also i think very down the earth for example politicians us politicians we are ordinary peoples and and we are meeting the citizens everywhere we are going to the public libraries and our kids go to public schools and and and take care and and we are meeting people so i think it's also very important that we have a society welfare society that also the leaders and the decision makers are involved at the same life of as ordinary people i think that tells a good story of your of your country that it's safe it's secure that everybody's on the same line whether you're a prime minister or the president or or whether you are work in the private sector for example or or be a teacher or or anything so i think we have a transparent country and very good country i'm very proud of Finland yes the lady at the back caught my eye yes Andrea hi uh Helen Sullivan from the Guardians foreign desk um i wanted to ask of the of the fears Finland has when it comes to Russia um and what you know the leverage that they have with you what is the what is the most real you know what is the kind of likely a scenario that you're planning for what do you mean for what Russia could do in Finland so for example you're building the fence well we have a quite extensive military forces so so we're not expecting them to engage threat in that account and we are not seeing anything any military action near the Finnish border actually i think most of the troops are now in in Ukraine so there are less lesser less Russian troops than than before and also the situation in the border is quite calm but of course we are prepared of different kind of hyper threats that we might see we all know that that cybersecurity is very important nowadays so we are preparing for different kind of cyber attacks like or also all other countries are prepared of that we are prepared for different kind of hybrid threats misinformation that's been spread it all over the the dark weapon and also in social media platforms so there are a lot of a lot of possibilities to make a disturbance within societies but i think the most important thing is to give when it comes to for example misinformation the most important thing is to give people the right information and we have good journalists we have good media that will provide that that information and we also have very good or third or third civil servants and institutions in Finland that will give the people the right that the right information at the right time and people trust these institutions that it's also very crucial for example i can give you an example of that there were this this case in Finland where there's were spreading rumors that there was something going on in the Finnish border that there were these big lines of cars and people coming to Finland's sites because of war and because of the the Putin has decided to gather more more troops within Russia so so where there were these rumors spreading around the social media in Finland but right away the the border control the Finnish authority authority authority how do you say it authorities authorities yes they immediately put the right information there they showed showed the footage in the border there are no lines there are no cars there are no no troops or people coming to Finland and and they just told this is the situation right now in the border so the rumor died but this is only one example what kind of incidents there might be speaking of mr Putin many of us have been blacklisted by the Russian state this year for things that we've said but that's nothing compared to you for example you must drive him crazy for which congratulations i mean all these strong leaders on on his borders he probably expected these leaders to go along with the war not to not to fight back is that your sense well i think when it comes to the war in Ukraine the nations that are closest to Ukraine the nations that are that has border with Russia they are the most toughest ones and i think and i have said publicly that we should have listened to our Baltic and Polish friends much sooner we have had many strategic discussions in the european council of Russia and and the Polish and the Baltics have always said that that you don't understand the logic of Putin you don't understand the logic of Russia and for example for a long time Europe was building a strategy towards Russia to close in our economic ties to buy energy from Russia to close in those economic ties and and we thought that this would prevent the war that we would have such a close ties to Russia that it would be total madness to to go to war with with any european countries but this was proven entirely wrong the thinking that we had and the Polish and the Baltics they said that you don't understand the logic behind Putin he doesn't care about those economic ties he only cares about about Russia and the Russian view of Europe and they view Ukraine as part of Russia they viewed as a part of Russia and that's why they're attacking they don't care about the economic ties they don't care about the sanctions they don't care any of that i don't think we have to make sure that they don't have those resources to continue the war that they will they will lose so the the sanctions are very important but but their mentality is very different and the the ones that are very close to Russia they are very tough and and i have very very tough tough friends as as leaders in Europe for example the Estonian Prime Minister Kaya Kallas i think she is great and she speaks so strongly when it comes to Russia yes in the yes in the blue jacket if you wouldn't mind Ariakesh Gnome private citizen this is a bit of a left field question but towards the end of next year we are heading for a referendum on an indigenous voiced parliament i know that in Finland there is the Sami assembly i know that there's some legislation in front of the Edeskunta at the moment on Sami assembly i was wondering if there is anything you could tell us about how we should not be afraid of a voiced parliament well thank you for the question we have indigenous people in Finland we have the Sami people and and actually we have now presented law a bill to the parliament to strengthen their autonomy autonomy and their their place in the country and but of course we also have much to do we have to be very frank that we haven't in history in past we haven't done right when it comes to indigenous people i think this is also the history of Australia i think this is the history in everywhere and we have to make sure that in the future indigenous people will have full rights and and also much more autonomous say in their own matters p.m i'm going to take the liberty of asking the last question if i can i asked a swedish friend what i should ask you about and he said i should ask you about the Finnish concept of sisu which is will or guts or perseverance or tenacity tell us a bit about that is that a key for understanding finland and perhaps a key for understanding you well that's very interesting that your swedish colleague asked that i think that tells something about sweden that they have to ask ask you what is Finnish sisu so it means guts it means guts and spirit it means that and i can tell you that the Finland has gone through many hardships we have have been in in war with russian we have had many hardships within our history and and sisu means that whatever comes whatever comes we go through it we as a nation we will survive and we don't dwell on the past we look forward we look forward and and do our jobs and make sure that our children have a better life in in the future than than their parents had before them so so i think sisu tells something about not that well on the past and make sure that you can cope in any situation and and that you will build a brighter future well ladies and gentlemen we could go all afternoon i apologize to those who've been trying to catch my eye but the prime minister has a meeting with mr albanyzi at cura billy house p m i want to thank you for taking the time to speak to the institute today thank you for giving such a powerful speech you know i like the line about common lifelines i like the way you you said that every system needs rules and if in the absence of rules all we have chaos all we have is chaos i'm also happy to hear a bit about sisu and i think everybody here can recognize that you have guts and spirit and sisu in spades so it's been a privilege to host you we wish you and your country all the best and we also wish you happy independence day for next week so if i can if i can try my finish again ketos palm ministeri marine thank you very much prime thank you