 Good evening everybody. My name is Akal Agwek and I'm going to moderate the forum for the School Board of the City of Burlington for World Four. Joining me tonight are the two candidates, Matin Larok Golik and Erika Radik. These are the two candidates that will be having the forum with me tonight. So let me read the ground rules and we will go straight to questions. First, the candidates meaning both of you will be allowed a minute opening a statement so you have your one minute. Second, all candidates will have two minutes to respond to questions. So when I ask you questions or when a member of public call in, you will have the opportunity to answer that question for two minutes. There may be questions from the public in which case we will take those. All candidates will be given the opportunity to respond to questions from the public. So the question from the members of public takes the priority. When questions come from the members of public, I will just give it to you. Each candidate will be given the opportunity to ask a question of the other candidate so you will have opportunity to ask each other. Candidates are allowed 30 second rebuttals so you can rebut anything that has been used against you with 30 seconds and then candidates have 30 seconds closing comments. So the producer will fill the question to us and so if no question comes from the members of public, then we will continue with the questions I have here. So the first to begin right now is have your, let me just double check the script. Have your one minute opening statement. Mateen, you have the floor. Since you first came, your one minute opening statement. Thank you, Echo. As I said before, my Wi-Fi is not great so I may be shutting off my camera. So I apologize for that ahead of time. But I hope you all can hear me. I am a resident of Ward 4 in Burlington, as you all know, and I'm running for school board. I am a parent of two graduates of the Burlington School District. I'm a former educator of about 30 years and I've served on the school board for two terms, so four years. I have been extremely active in these four years. I have, I could list all the things I've done. I'll just mention a few that I'm proud of. One is that I was co-chair of the superintendent search to bring in a new superintendent to our district. Also part of the strategic planning committee, as well as the BHS and BTC, you know, re-envisioning plans. So those are some things that I've been really proud of. I'm also really proud of the work that I'm doing. Okay, I think I need to shut my camera off. Okay, so hopefully this is better. Hopefully you can hear me. Work that I've been doing at the state level around school funding. So, and I'll get into that a little bit more later, but there is a funding formula that waits for various students and Burlington has been in a position where we are not, haven't been and still are not adequately funded for our student population. And so I've been working on that and I'm super proud of that work as well. So yeah, I would love to have the support and the votes of the people in my community and continue this work. Akal, I can't hear you either right now. I'm sorry. I did mute my, I did mute myself. So I'm sorry for that. Go ahead, Erica, you have the floor. Thank you, Akal. I appreciate that. Hello, everyone. My name is Erica Redick. I am a resident of the New North and of Burlington. I am, I went, I did attend school here in Burlington. And even though I don't have children in the school system, I am very dedicated to the next generation and every Burlington resident ought to be very concerned with the educational quality of our next generation. So I, that is a priority. My husband and I work with at-risk youth and we very much care about pouring into the next generation. And that being said, you know, it is from my perspective that our current school commission, while well-intentioned, has not done a great job of being a good steward of the resources that they've been given by the Burlington taxpayers. And there's a real lack of forethought and critical thinking in the decisions being made, and that's demonstrated in the outcomes, the educational outcomes of our schools. As an example, Burlington High School only graduates about 74% of its students and only 16% participate in AP course participation. We're not even in the top 15 schools in the state, and yet we spend the most money. And so what I would like to see is more care and consideration given into how the resources are being used and ensuring that they're being used towards educational purposes and not things like multiple millions of dollars to rounds of architects. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I get both of you two minutes each so that I can balance it. Now moving forward, I will stick to your two-minute answering question. So let me just go to the second question. Do you support this year this year's school budget of 98.2 million? Erika, ready? You have the floor since you were the second. Two minutes. Thank you. I do not support the school budget of 98.2 million dollars. Again, it just really has been demonstrated that the resources are not being utilized well, and it's as if the members of our school commission believe that all Burlington taxpayers can just give them a blank check at the end of the year. A neighbor of mine whose taxes went up $1,500 from the reassessment last year literally has had food taken off of his plate. He's on a fixed income, and that $1,500 has to come from somewhere. So he literally said, I will be eating less food. And so this idea that we're just going to keep raising, raising, raising without consideration of our neighbors is really just pretty shocking to me. So absolutely not. If they need more money for certain programs, they should be doing what all responsible adults do. They cut the budget. Either you have to come up with more income, which isn't an option for Burlington, or you have to cut the budget, which again is what all responsible adults do when their expenses go up. So you mentioned something that I will come back to later on, but Mateen, you have your two minutes. Thank you, Akal. Yeah, I 100% support the school budget. The school, our school district is the heart and soul of our community. It is an entity that brings value to our community, brings value to our homesteads, our houses. It brings value to all of the relationships that we have. So it is, yes, an investment. Absolutely 100%. Let me just demystify a few things that have been said. First of all, we, the school board have been running a surplus for the last five years. We are not folks who don't understand money and don't understand budgets. We do. We have been running a surplus and investing it anew into the system and saving it, frankly, for the future as well. We have added no new programs to this year's budget. We have not added anything. The only increase is wages and benefits. So I bought a little bit at some of what's being said here around this budget. I also want to just add that, yeah, we do at this point have a high per pupil rate. This is true. It's partially because we had to shut down our high school due to contamination. And we are paying for rent on a building that we don't own. We are paying fixed up, fixed up costs that are necessary to have our students safe and educated. This isn't the case for other communities. We also, as you know, have aging infrastructure, which I think we're going to talk about later. Thank you. Your two minutes are over. It looked like you have difference. You have different on these questions. So I will stay on a little bit. Do you think you need to ask each other a question? I mean, my only question to Erica would be, you know, I would just love to hear some specifics. She talks a lot about cutting the budget and lowering the budget. And as someone who has been working in education, I know that in Burlington we are running on very slim margins. So I would just like to hear some specifics. Yep. So Erica, go ahead. What do you think? Yeah, great question. I would, I will have a question after as well. For one thing, while it is a nice gesture to give raises to the folks in the school district, the teachers and other staff, many of us Burlington residents had our businesses forcibly shut down, lost our businesses, lost our jobs, had pay cuts and all of those other things. And so, and a lot of the teachers and staff make far more than the average Burlington resident. So I don't think that they need raises and I'm sure that's going to make me very unpopular and I'm okay with that. Because, again, the their first responsibility, or I would think is is to is to the taxpayer is to the community to make sure that we can actually accommodate what is being asked without a severe sacrifice. So it's only the raises that you are cutting? Oh, oh no, I'm sure that there is far more. I will do a detailed audit of the school budget to see where things can be can be moved around. I can give you examples of things like I know as an example, the tech center has a avionics program where it's for teaching kids to fly planes or fix planes or whatever. And last I knew one student was in the program and it costs over $100,000 a year. So I mean, that's very nice. But the if we aren't graduating kids out of these programs, then why are we paying for them? Thank you. Thank you. Now you can ask my team your questions. Um, I am I'm curious. You said that we've had surpluses the last five years. But those surpluses have not gone back to the taxpayer in the form of rebates or reductions in our tax bill. So I'm curious, who decided what to do with that money? And why wasn't it given back to the taxpayer when it was determined it wasn't needed? Thank you, Martin. Go ahead. Yes, I will. And I'd love to respond to some of the other things that Erica said. So Erica, if you read the the budget one pager that we recently sent out, this is all underscored. But that money has been was put aside. We've been obviously saving it. And it's a good thing that we have because we're going to need it now that we are in a new building and had, you know, we're removed from our current high school. But yeah, it does. We do take some of that surplus and put it back into into the budget. So it hasn't just been sitting there as you say. And I do just want to add the teachers are not getting a quote unquote raise. They get a cost of living adjustment as well as you probably know this, Erica, because I know your sister works in education. There is a step system by which with your number of years and your education credits, you know, you go up on a step. And that is all something that is set by the district by the state. Okay, I'll stop. Thank you. So the voters definitely see the difference there. You can and I hope you will continue with that conversation during your campaign. Let's move to the next questions. And that is about racial justice. Do you support the passage of H 584, which would require the standards in education design to promote anti racism in schools? Why do you support or not support this bill? Martin, you have your two minutes. Yes, I 100% support this bill that's coming out of Massachusetts. We are living in a time where you've got school boards around the country banning books. You have school boards around the country that are banning quote unquote critical race theory because it makes their kids feel uncomfortable. I have a real problem with this. I do believe that there is part of being an educated person and being educated that is at times uncomfortable. I personally am still bitter at the education I had that was very much a whitewashed history of the country. I did not learn about redlining. I did not learn about the fact that African Americans were kept out of homeownership and the GI bill after the war. These are really important systemic issues in our country that I never learned. And I'm sad. I'm just now learning this as, a 40- and 50-year-old woman. So I absolutely think it's important. I also think we need to use culturally responsive teaching methods in our classrooms that really make sure that students see themselves in the classroom, whether it's in the curriculum or whether it's in images around the room or whether it's on their devices. This is all very important. Am I at the end of my time, Nicole? Sorry. No, you're still happy. It could be at a time now. So keep going. I will entrap you. Go. Okay. So yes. Again, the system that we live in is kind of inherently, not kind of, it is inherently racist. So we absolutely need structures and definitely through legislation. We need structures that ensure that our students are getting an honest and well-rounded education. Thank you. Thank you. You're welcome. Erica, you have the floor. Do you agree or disagree with the passage of H584? Thank you for the question. I would not support the passage of this bill. Racial discrimination and things like that are already against the law in our culture, in our state, in our cities. And as the wife of a Black man, I happen to have an interracial family. And through that marriage have additional multi-racial family members of various, you know, whether Black, Puerto Rican, Panamanian, etc. And so I just really reject the notion that we have an inherently racist system. There was nothing that kept my husband from succeeding. There was nothing that kept our friends and family from succeeding. I mean, I've dealt with sexism in my life. That didn't keep me from succeeding. And so I just really reject this notion that we have an inherently racist system that without special consideration, students of color can't make it. I just really reject that. I think that that actually is pretty racist. And it puts non-white students below white students, in my opinion, and in my Black husband's opinion, that really is the case. And so, and unfortunately, what's happening now in the Burlington School District is Black students are actually allowed to abuse their white cohorts and the teachers. In some circumstances, and I've been told this by the individuals involved. There was a situation with a Black student. She was allowed to then abuse the white student who was taken out of context. She was not making a racist gesture. There are multiple Black students who have been stealing from teachers, who have threatened physical violence against teachers. And those teachers were told to stay silent, and nothing was done because they are Black. And I just think that that is the most racist kind of treatment that we could give to our students who are not white, to treat them like that as if they're somehow less than the white students. Thank you. Thank you. It looked like there is a difference here. Any bottles, Mateen, or we can move on from here. It looked like you don't need, it looked like no, are you there, Mateen? Yeah, I'm here. One minute, if you want to make comment, and then I will give one minute to Erika, it looked like you are different here. Yeah, yeah, I think we could spend the rest of the evening probably talking, easily talking on this subject. So I can't speak to the individual incidences that to which Erika is referring, but I guess I'm shocked when I hear folks say that the system, our system is not inherently racist. I just, there's so much evidence, if you look at our history, that that's just not true. And that there have been impediments that have stood in the way of our BIPOC community members throughout history, and they exist today. So thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you. You have your one minute if you need to to put back Erika before I move on. Yeah, sure. I don't think anyone is denying that there have been racist things in the past. I think anybody who would try to say that clearly doesn't know history, but I learned about redlining. So I don't know about Martin's education and upbringing, but I learned about redlining. I learned about the struggles of black people. I learned about those things. I'm also in relationship with people who are black, who are from all over the country. And again, even if they did have some circumstance of prejudice in their life, they didn't let it hold them down. And even when you talk about redlining back in the 60s and 70s, that's how you had things like Black Wall Street come up and other things where black people actually came together in other neighborhoods and uplifted and supported each other. You had black millionaires back in the 60s and 70s. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. We could go on and on on this. And maybe if I could go back just one minute each, what is, and I will go back to you, Martin, specifically, what is in H584 that you support? What is it in that resolution that you really value that that that you can point to? Well, I don't have it in front of me. So I'm just going on what I've read and what I've heard about it. But, you know, basically putting structures in place that ensure that our students are getting a balanced education and an education that reflects all of the students in the classroom and in the school, that this isn't a this is not an education that only reflects the the white majority. It's so it's just that that equity piece that I think is critical. We know that our students of color perform better when they have teachers who look like them. I mean, these are all things we have data that supports all of these things. And so thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you. Thank you, Erica. What is it is specifically in age 584 that concern you something that you can point and say, this is why I don't support this resolution? Excuse me. I think any sort of resolution or educational program that sets white students against non white students as somehow different and teaches them that they are inherently different because of their skin color is racist. Period. So I think that we should teach history. I think we should teach a history that shows black people being successful rather than just slaves. That is something I would support and that's maybe in in age 584. But so again, I would love education that doesn't just show black people as inferior somehow by only teaching about slavery because there's so much more to black culture and black history than that. But again, anything that inherently separates white and non white because of their skin color is racist. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you to both. You could never have been different. There is a start different year for the voters to see and and I will it look like we have only we are down to five minutes. So I should move to the next. Yes, I should move to the next question. I would have stayed on this, but but I think I think that the voters have seen enough different between two of you to make that decision. So let me move to this question and that would be it. And I'm going back to BHS is cool construction. I'm going back to the money. Thank you. As the school district enters the planning phase of the Neil Burlington High School and Tech Center. What would you like to see in the new buildings? Do you support the current plan? Erica, you're too many. Thank you. I am I am 100 percent against the current plan. It is absolutely irresponsible. In my opinion, to the taxpayers, those of you who were in Burlington a couple of years ago will recall the bond that passed and all of the money out of that bond that has been spent literally millions of over a million dollars in architectural fees to redesign Burlington Technical Center, millions over a million dollars in architectural fees to redesign BTC. And now we're just going to throw that money away instead of including those renovations or those designs with the remediation program. What should happen if we were being responsible is we would remediate one area of the school at a time and then and bring the students back as it's safe. It is it is very nice to send architects to and again they just sent the architects once more to ask for all the hopes and dreams of the administration and the students and the teachers. Without I did not hear that they gave them a budget to stay within. So now we're going to spend millions more dollars on architects to build a school that we can't afford to build. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Matin, your two minutes. Thank you, Echo. So I just want to point out you it's really impossible to say that you don't support the current plan because there is no current plan. We have had to go back to the drawing board so to speak because we found out after we passed our 70 million dollar bond for BHS re-envisioning that our school is contaminated. The way the system works is you decide to do a renovation, you go to the voters and you ask for support from the voters and then your school gets tested for PCBs and other contaminants. So we were held to that process and obviously as you all know our school was found to contain PCBs. Various ranges of PCBs because we have a building that is not a building. It is six, it is seven small buildings each one with its own level of contamination. It's very complex and it's hard to speak with someone who doesn't really understand the situation. Mitigating, testing and mitigating for PCBs is incredibly expensive and it's incredibly complex. So to just kind of brush it off as well why are you spending that money, that money had to be spent. We were asked to leave that campus by the state of Vermont which has very low levels of PCB contamination threshold and do you want me to stop talking, sorry. Thank you, thank you, yeah thank you. So now since we have used a lot of your time, is it possible to get a rebuttal? Is it possible to do a rebuttal on that? We are running out of time, just 30 seconds. I can do it in less than 30 seconds and then 30 seconds. So go ahead. It is not that complicated to remediate. I've talked to multiple contract companies, contractors who have done this kind of work. It's very specific stuff and it is all feasible and it is all far less than building a new school. Thank you, thank you. Last 30 seconds, Matin and we will close the program. Are these my closing remarks or? We run out of time. Okay, Erica please send these experts our way. We would love to hear what they have to say. Obviously I pay taxes in the city as well Erica. I'm concerned as everyone else is about taxes but I'm also concerned about our education, the safety of our students, the safety of our educators. This is a big deal and it's not, you know, to say, oh we can send people back in the okay, sorry. Thank you, sorry. Thank you so much. I'm sorry we have run out of time. I know that you will continue that conversation on the campaign trail. So thank you so much for your time and I look forward to watching your debates go on. So thank you and have a good night. Thank you, Paul and Kate.