 Good afternoon everybody and welcome. My name is Michael Collins and I'm the director general of the IEA, the Institute of International and European Affairs here in Dublin. And I'm so very pleased to welcome you to this webinar which is co-organized by ourselves, the IEA, and the European Commission representation here in Ireland. And of course this event takes place on the weekend of Europe Day, which would be celebrated this Sunday, Sunday May the 9th, and it commemorates the anniversary of the Schumann Declaration of the 9th of May 1950. When French Foreign Ministers, we know Robert Schumann set out his vision to create a European institution which became and has become the European Union as we know it today. This event is also part of an important month for us here at the IEA. We're celebrating our 30th anniversary, so please if you want further details of the many events that we're planning during and have planned during this month, please tap into our website and you'll find all the details there. And today, we're absolutely delighted to be joined by the European Commissioner for Financial Services, Financial Stability and the Capital Markets Union, Maureen McGinnis. And while it's unfortunate that we're now able to welcome her here and get back to the IEA in person in her new capacity as Ireland's European Commissioner, we are nonetheless delighted that she has offered to speak to us today via webinar. Commissioner McGinnis will speak to us for about 20 minutes and then we will go to your questions and Commissioner's answers and we'll take in as many of those as we can. And you'll be able to see and join the discussion using the Q&A function on Zoom, a function which I think is now familiar to almost everybody, but you'll see it on your screen in any event. And please be free to send your questions in throughout the session as they occur to you. And as I said, we will come to them once Commissioner has finished her presentation. A reminder that Commissioner's presentation and the Q&A that will follow it are both on the record. So just to, if I may just say to introduce the Commissioner more formally, Maureen McGinnis is the European Commissioner for Financial Services, Financial Stability and the Capital Markets Union. And before joining the Commission in October 2020, Maureen McGinnis was the first Vice President of the European Parliament from 2017 and she served as an MEP for 16 years and was the Vice President of the Parliament from 2014. And prior to becoming an MEP, she was of course an award-winning journalist, broadcaster and commentator. So Commissioner, you're very, very welcome indeed. Welcome to the IEA, the floor is yours. Well, thank you very much, Michael. And can I say how wonderful it is that we're adjusting to this new way of communicating, although I missed the crowd, if you like, in the room in the IEA building. But it's good to be able to join and it's good to reflect on 30 years. And I want to, I suppose, congratulate you on achieving this milestone. And I wish you well with this wonderful programme of debate and discussion because the IEA has always been involved in shaping and informing public policy and indeed informing the wider public. And a salute to, of course, the Chair, Rory Quinn, to you, Michael, and to all involved in the Association. And I want to pay a little tribute, if I may, to the late Brendan Halligan, a founder member of the IEA. And to say, Brendan, if you're listening, I'm so sorry we never had that lunch because we talked about it so often, but I think his legacy is here for us all to pay homage to and to give respect to. So that's the past 30 years, what has happened. I think today what I want to look forward is to the next 30 years. And I think it's a good time to consider the future. If you look at the past year or so has been very unprecedented, difficult for Ireland and the European Union, we're still coping with COVID, but the rollout of vaccinations I think is giving us all hope for the future. And indeed yesterday, Commission President von der Leyen highlighted very clearly that Europe is to the fore in terms of a distribution of vaccines, and also exports. So we are exporting 200 million doses to the wider world and we have distributed 200 million vaccines to Europeans, and all across member states the rollout is forging ahead. And it's interesting to say that others of course are not exporting and I think it shows the openness of the European Union to the wider global challenge around vaccination. I think it's also true that we have to some extent reached an end of sorts, but maybe a beginning in the whole Brexit process. What has happened in the last while I think it's a good time to look to the future. And it's why we have a conference on the future of Europe which is, you know, for public consumption for public debate. And we hope on Sunday that the conference will be officially launched in Strasbourg. And I really make a plea to people who are interested in in how we will be in the future, both in Ireland and being part of Europe on the key issues that are important to you. And I would might actually change some of our priorities because of having to lock down having to reconnect having to work from home. And all of those things have had an impact on society and I think that will only unfold as we look to the future. And one of the things that we've been very clear on in terms of the institutions is we want this conference to be driven by people. So there are no if you like preconceived outcomes. Today, of course, I'm going to restrict my comments to the future as I see it in the area that I'm responsible for financial services, and specifically banking. And the crisis, you know, has challenged business and the economy. But I think it's fair to say that banks because of the regulatory framework put in place after the last crisis are much more robust and therefore have been able to lend to the economy. But what we need to look out for. And I suppose COVID has accelerated some broader trends. We have widespread digitalization of finance. It's no longer a distant prospect if you like it's here now. And it does impact on the traditional banking sector. We've also been reminded in a very stark way that the natural world can have a huge impact on business and our economies, which means that we need to make our systems more resilient and more sustainable and this is now more urgent than ever. And I think I'm going to have more questions today than answers because a lot of what is happening is evolving and new dimensions are coming into play all of the time. So I want to if you like lay out the foundations and raise some of those questions about, you know, the ideas around the future of finance and the future of banking. Let's start of course in Ireland and in many ways, it is a special case, also affected by broader trends, transforming the general banking sector. But clearly the banking sector in Ireland has come along with since the global financial crisis. The legacy issues are still there. It's still relevant. And Irish banks face higher capital requirements and mortgage loans than banks in most other European countries because of the impact of the crisis. The second reason for high capital requirements is that collateral enforcement is more difficult and slower than in other European countries. And as a result, Irish banks are holding more capital to issue loans. And these may be some of the factors behind the decisions of private banking groups about their operations in Ireland. Beyond those specificities, Ireland is affected by the broader trends that are transforming the banking sector across Europe and indeed across the world. And this is the pandemic where banks have so far remained robust. I think the full extent of the pandemic in terms of our banking situation will only become visible over time. COVID has accelerated structural change and this is unlikely to be reversed. So I don't think we're going to go back to the way we were. It includes digitalization, not only of finance and also this journey that Europe is on and indeed is leading globally towards carbon neutrality to tackle climate change. And we face, you know, tough macroeconomic environment and demographic change. And all of this are transforming the situation in Ireland and Europe and further revealed. And these issues are no longer distant. So we do need to think about their impact on how we can best respond. Look, the immediate priority here in the Commission and across the member states is the recovery from the COVID-19 crisis. And right now member states are submitting their plans for spending under the recovery and resilience facility part of next generation EU. And you know, this is an unprecedented measure and it reflects the nature of the COVID crisis and the need for a big European response. We have a balance of investment and reforms with over 670 billion euros in loans and grants being made available across the member states. If we look at what has happened to the European economy in economic output fell by 6.3% last year. And was the only member state record positive growth of 3% thanks to strong exports. Although, as you know, there were difficult domestic and different domestic impacts, and a lot of variation between sectors hospitality and tourism has been hit across the board. Likewise, public authorities also adopted extraordinary measures to protect households companies and jobs, and the ECB put in place monitoring measures to maintain the lending capacity of banks and ensure favorable financing conditions. Here at EU level we put in place flexibilities in terms of state aid and fiscal rules. And this allowed member states to take unprecedented fiscal measures to help businesses affected by the crisis, including loan guarantees tax relief direct subsidies and loan moratoria. Of course the full extent of the impact of the pandemic as I say has yet to emerge. And we have to acknowledge that the economic impact is very significant we have a steep increase in private and public indebtedness throughout this crisis. And this is the consequence of the very necessary measures against the crisis so we had to acknowledge that the first priority was public health and in a sense, all else was pushed aside in order to save lives and to get people treated and to find a solution to the public health crisis. Therefore the withdrawal of public support measures in my view needs to be very carefully managed and communicated in a very careful way. And of course, against all of that background, non performing loans are a concern, in particular for banks that serve countries and sectors most affected by the pandemic. And the level of insolvencies last year in Europe was very low. But of course we are expecting this to increase in time. And to make sure that banks can support the recovery, they need to accurately and very transparently measure risks, along with ensuring that they have enough provisions to account for these risks. And it's true that if you ignore problems that doesn't help, it just creates uncertainty and undermines confidence down the line. And at the same time, maintaining the flow of credit to the economy has to be a key priority. Banks have to continue to play a constructive role in the recovery, and we have to acknowledge that banks have been part of the solution during this crisis and good work has been done in that regard. But as the crisis support measures are faced out many companies and viable business models may need their debt restructured lenders corporate borrowers and national authorities have to prepare for this in as much as they can. So redesigned fiscal support measures focused on debt restructuring and insolvency solutions or other solvency solutions. These are fundamentally important for viable borrowers and their key to avoiding an excess of insolvencies. And the point I would make here and I've made it to stakeholder around tables that I've chaired. It's really important that banks and borrowers talk early if they feel there is going to be a problem and work towards a solution because when there's no conversation, there can be no solution and I do think we are in a scenario where an unusual crisis has arisen, which has now impacted on previously very viable businesses that have had to close. And I think we have to take account of the context, and therefore engagement early is really really important. I think we really hopefully gathers pace in the second half of this year. I think banks and public authorities will also have to finalize the long overdue post global financial crisis reforms and that's one of the items on my agenda here that the basil implementation. Alongside of this and we all know that there has been a massive increase in bank deposits so those that are still working are not spending because they can't. At least not while the economy is in a shutdown mode. And the question is, will this money flow out of banks when the economy reopens or indeed will only some of it flow and what remains of the large deposits that are sitting in banks and indeed not earning significant or at all any money. And I think this is an important question for our recovery. If we look at digital finance beyond covert. I have mentioned the acceleration of technological change, and we've all become accustomed to not having cash and not needing cash. In finance, there has been a number of benefits around these developments so we have online identity verification that allows customers open banks and use financial services remotely. The growing proportion of in store payments are now digital and indeed contact less and think tech solutions have helped to broaden and speed up access to loans, including loans in response to the covert 19 crisis. Now of course, these impacts are not uniformly positive for everyone. In this digitalization, we see an accompanied measure her banks are closing branches. And there was a decline already by over 6% on average in the number of bank branches in the European Union before covert. And we know that this will accelerate because of the pandemic. And of course, there are also social dimensions to bank closures, including for bank staff. So if we look now into the role of fintechs and big tech changes happening in part because technology companies large and small are increasingly offering financial services. Now this increases competition and may improve efficiency and financial inclusion. However, it also makes the value chains more complex, making it harder for supervisors to have an overview of risks. We can mentally change banking service supply chains, introducing new critical suppliers and a new category of risks that must be managed. It also has consequences for the business model of traditional banks, new fintech on bundle the full service model of traditional banks and big tech companies entering the financial services area, use data and already extensive customer databases. Fintech is a key part of the Irish government's Ireland for finance strategy for the country is aiming to become a world leader in fintech. And I suppose given that eight out of the top 10 global software companies have their European headquarters in Ireland, and over 250 of the world's leading financial services firms are based in Ireland. There is clearly big potential for fintech companies to thrive. For innovation to work in a fair and competitive manner companies entering the payment sector banking or other financial services, whether they are wherever whoever they are or indeed wherever they come from. They need to be subject to the same level of regulation and supervision. And that's a challenge that European and national supervisors and regulators need to consider. And that's why in September last, the Commission south set out very clearly the digital finance strategy for the European Union to help support the digital transformation of finance and there are four strategic priorities. One to tackle fragmentation in the digital single market for financial services. The digital finance is still too national. It's like our banking systems too national addressing this would help European consumers access cross border services and European financial firms to scale up their digital operations. Secondly, the objective is to ensure that our EU regulation enables innovation. New technologies could improve financial services for consumers and businesses and regulation should make sure that innovation is accompanied by responsibility. Third, we want to create a European financial data space, and we want to promote innovation driven by data. And this will enable new products for consumers and businesses, and it will support broader policy goals, such as building a single market for data. It will also help enable access to information we need to make sure that investment is sustainable. And we did a lot in that area in recent weeks. Fourthly, we want to address new risks and challenges as digital finance grows, so do you cyber risks, looking beyond regulation. Some of the questions that arise, like what are the consequences of digitalization and the growing role of technology companies for the banking sector, and by extension for the supply to the economy of financial services traditionally provided by banks. How consumers are we willing to have different providers to pay our bills to borrow from to invest with. And at the moment, it appears that consumers really switch financial service providers. I'm looking back to a 2016 Euro barometer survey. And in that survey, and 71% of consumers hadn't changed any provider of financial products or services in the previous five years. So my sense is that with a younger generation, they have a very different expectation of banking services and indeed are more familiar with the whole digitalization process and more comfortable with it. Other questions arise, can these services underpin a profitable business model when provided separately. So can banks be profitable enough if providing a mortgage does not create a loyal client or customer who will also buy the banks investments funds. Again, what the impacts are on the availability and pricing of essential banking services, and what's the impact on competition, and does this herald broader changes and how credit is provided, and our economies are financed. Now at this juncture I think it's really worth mentioning the possible issuance of a digital Euro. A digital Euro would be a central bank liability offered in digital form for use by citizens and businesses for retail payments. I know the European Central Bank is exploring the possibility of a retail central bank digital currency CB DC, and this would be as a compliment to cash and private sector payments. And the aim here is to ensure that the Euro remains fit for the digital age, and the ECB governing council will decide later into the summer whether they will move forward towards experimentation. The Europe is not alone in this and indeed we are not the first 80% of global central banks are engaged in similar work, and China has been working on this for seven years. Now, I think it's really important to stress that a digital Euro is not just a technical endeavor. It can have far reaching consequences in terms of monetary policy cybersecurity privacy and money laundering. A digital Euro could also have fundamental consequences for banking services and credit intermediation. So would there be a shift away from bank accounts and towards digital wallets. And when would digital euros be held, what will the role of banks be. And as you can hear, I have more questions and answers and I think there are some questions that we haven't quite thought of yet but this is why we do need to have this conversation. This is why we do need an ideas forum for the future of finance in particular banking. On the bigger macroeconomic side of course there are other drivers of change. Europe is an aging continent we're aware of this, you know, smaller populations or at least workforces. But we are developing and I think this is the interesting story from Europe, a new growth strategy built around sustainability, the European Green Deal. And despite the covert crisis, there is no resiling from the direction of travel, the aim is that Europe will be climate neutral but beyond that that we will decouple. There are a few like emissions from growth, and that growth will be inclusive and fair and I think because of covert in particular, we have to deliver on those commitments that we have made. And when you look at the way interest rates are evolving very low interest rates this does impact on banks profitability. And we are not sure how that will evolve over time, or indeed what impact this would have on the bank business model over time. So all of these developments together with growing competition from technology companies. I mean, it's forcing banks to at least look at their cost structure. So we see a reduction as I've mentioned in open bank branches with the adoption of digital developments and new retail trends for saving and investing money and indeed we have seen issues around staff, equally with banks addressing internal concerns, more questions here arise so how will incumbent banks use a physical bank network to serve clients are all generations at ease with fully digital banks, or is a physical interaction still essential for trust and meaningful financial advice and financial advice is another area that we are working on here in DG FSMA for the future. And if you like gross, which is slower than we would like low interest rates, this may also force further consolidation within the banking sector, but so far consolidation is slower than expected, and is taking place largely within national markets rather than across the single market. And the question has to be asked as to why this is happening. And why is it not more pan European. And part of the answer is the difficulty in operating a bank on a pan European basis, because of market fragmentation. Another is the difficulty we have in allowing certain banks to exit the market efficiently. And not for the first time you will have heard that completing Banking Union is a priority here in the Commission, and there are still very difficult issues to deal with, including an effective crisis management framework for all banks and European deposit insurance scheme. I want to move briefly to sustainable finance. And again, I think the covert pandemic has accelerated the urgency of a shift towards sustainability. We've had a very clear and uncomfortable demonstration that our economies and societies are healthcare systems were not at all resilient, and we need to change that. So again, the European Green Deal involves a total transformation of our economy. We want to achieve, as I've said this kind of neutrality goal by 2050 but we have also committed to a very high target of a reduction in emissions by 2030 or 55%. So we're talking about an entire reorientation of the financial system and of our economy. And we're going to need an awful lot of money to do that. We will have of course, public funding but private investment must be unlocked for us to achieve our sustainability targets. And one of the instruments to do that is the EU taxonomy which identifies sustainable economic activities in a very clear way. We will also be asking companies to be very clear about how they report on sustainability. And that's why we have recently the corporate sustainability reporting directive. We are essentially working to green the financial system to green the economy. So these things work hand in hand. And I think also sustainability reporting is crucial to address any systemic financial risks arising from climate change. And I think future regulation in the banking sector cannot ignore this question of sustainability. So we all really have to look at how we reflect this issue of environmental criteria in banks lending decisions and also how we protect banks from possible risks arising from climate change and how we finance the transition towards a low carbon economy. So there's a lot of challenges but equally there's a lot of opportunities for those businesses that believe they have a future and know where they want to go and know how they need to invest that. So there are companies that are really ahead of the curve and are very interested in the work that we are doing here. You know climate risk is more forward looking than traditional risks. So using historical trends won't necessarily be helpful to regulators or supervisors. I think equally difficult to assess is whether risks can become potentially systemic financial stability risks and work to better integrate environmental, social and governance risks into the EU bank potential framework has already started. And already the Commission is assessing all possible options for more sustainable and resilient banking sector. And again we welcome new ideas for the future. So in closing, what will the banking sector look like in 30 years time when I hope the IEA will be celebrating its 60th anniversary and I hope I live to see the day, but I might be stretching it. But you know, this is a question about the future that I think we cannot answer today, but I think we should be aware of all of the different elements that will shape that future as we try and navigate these changes and try and make sense of what they will do to the financial system in particular banking, whether it's profitability or resilience or digitalization or sustainability. You know these all represent and present fundamental challenges and opportunities to the financial system and to our economies. So I think these are really key issues. And again to just say that the IEA is an ideas forum, and that's why today I'm launching this idea of a much needed forward looking discussion on the future of finance and the future of banking. And I think the work you do is really an important part of this conversation, because we know that what we had 30 years ago is very different than what we have today. And in the next 30 years, it will be even more dramatically different. Thank you. Well, thank you very much, Commissioner, indeed for that very broad ranging address and your kind words indeed about the IEA at the beginning of your speech and at the end of your speech and particularly your references to Brendan Halligan who was our founder back in 1991. Lots of issues, lots of challenges affecting all of us, whether I suppose we're at the institutional level or as consumers, citizens, investors or whatever. And maybe just to invite people to send in their questions on the use of the Q&A function, but just maybe to get them all rolling if I may, Commissioner. You know, it's getting very complex out there in the financial world. It is a complex world and any event always was, even before the onset of current complexities, but just in the area of financial literacy, you know, how are people, how are consumers, how am I? You know, supposed to get my head around issues like the digital currency, the digital URL, all these issues in around, I mean, the complications that you've mentioned there, the challenges that you mentioned there, the simplicity that we once have just going into a bank and putting our money there, leaving our money now, face with negative interest rates, all that type of thing, possibly. So how do we, or how do you, at European level, how do we assure that we have a generation, a current generation, future generations coming forward with levels of financial literacy that will equip them to manage this very, very new space and indeed emerging space as well. Well, look, I didn't mention financial literacy, but it actually is the one area of my prioritization in this role because I had the same questions. I was saying to myself, how can any one of us know the financial landscape or indeed ask the right questions when we are going for advice. So there are two issues. First of all, we have worked and are working with the OECD on a financial literacy framework, and we already launched that I think two weeks ago. That's usually important because the OECD have done great work. But also whenever I can, but I'm doing it remotely, I'm talking to Member States about, you know, stepping up on this issue of financial literacy, because the truth of the matter is that those who have less information or knowledge about the financial system are usually those that are comparable and therefore very often pay a higher price for credit than those who are knowledgeable. And I have always felt that morally and ethically that needs to be addressed. So my view is that none of us have sufficient knowledge of the system and therefore that all of us, whatever age we are, should try and tune into this whole concept of having more knowledge about the financial system. If you look at even traditional media, the financial parts are separate from the mainstream and I think that is partly how people see the financial system. And maybe because I come to this role with some, you know, training and long ago in terms of economics and accounting and finance, I also come with this with a consumer perspective. And I have very much said here that we need to make sure that our work here is outward facing to people. So in summary, Michael, what I would say is that I think all Member States need to do more, but many are doing some things around financial literacy. And I would hope by the end of my mandate that I would have visited Member States that I've got the best of all practices, and that we will have in place a very sound basis for financial education, not just for the schools, but equally for the retirement associations or, you know, vulnerable groups that need information about credit. And I see a huge appetite out there for it and there are many agencies who want to work with this on it, particularly now in digitalization because today if you pick up your phone, you can have an app tell you where to invest, and you can click and invest, which you might have asked the questions. Last point, if you look what happened in the US with GameStop, these were retail investors who are very knowledgeable. So there were individuals who clearly had knowledge of the financial system and were able to, you know, beat against some of the bigger hedge funds. And then we have to be very discerning as to who we want to protect because some are very, very tuned in, others less so. So I think this is an area, a big body of work that I'm hoping Member States will, you know, work with the commission on and I think it's would benefit all of us, we make better decisions if we have good knowledge, or at least have the courage to ask the right questions. And I've always been somebody maybe it's my background that I'm always prepared to ask the question, where I'm not fully sure where I'm going, and then I can make the right choices. Okay, and just, I mean, maybe just related to that maybe to some extent, you mentioned the idea of this ideas forum and of course the Institute has a is very much dedicated to the whole idea of sharing ideas indeed. So this forum that you mentioned you do you see that it's kind of in a structured way as kind of a structure or is it kind of a rolling kind of initiative of involving speeches is there any kind of a particular structure to it that you'd like to talk about. Because I'm launching it here because I wanted to have a platform and your association is a perfect place to do that, and we will be looking at how we roll this out, not just in speeches but in a very concrete way. We already have. I chaired some months ago stakeholders in the financial system both consumers, users large and small. We were focusing obviously on covert but I think equally we have to focus on these other questions that are not answered about what, what do we want, but what do we think will happen and can we shape it in a way that is offering opportunities for innovation is positive and we can manage the risks. So today is really to launch the idea, which I think has already been mentioned in the Irish context more about banking in Ireland but I think it's a much bigger conversation. I think it's about finance in the future, which is why I chose this topic to unveil. So we will be looking at opportunities to engage with stakeholders across the Member States around this issue and we have our offices and Member States and we have all of those contexts that will contribute to it, because the rate of change is quite rapid. And I'm sure that I'm not the only one asking those questions but I see it very upfront today. And I always think that with change comes fear, even with, you know, doing all we need around sustainability, some people are fearful of it, but equally there are opportunities. And I think once you're aware of the implications then you can plan accordingly. And I'm doing it also because my remit is financial stability so I need to be not just looking at today's landscape but I need to make sure that we're future proofed in terms of our financial stability and regulation, our focus on entities, our management of risk. So it's to try and pull all of those things together so that we will be forward looking and better prepared. Good. Let me just come to a few questions if I may that are coming in from members of our audience. And just one I see here in fact two related to the same thing. First one, Alan Jukes and second one as well. It says, Alan says, of course our former finance ministry, he says the commission is attempting to make the disbursement of the new 750 billion Euro fund conditional on Member States adherence to the country specific recommendations. He says there's no necessary link between these two. Do you think this is proving to be politically counterproductive and there's a kind of a related question then from or similar question then from Sarah Collins. No relation, of course, from the Irish independent and she says are asked question on the recovery and the resilience plans Ireland has yet to submit its plan to the EU and has been relatively quiet on it. Unlike France or Germany. She asked you think you believe there is a reluctance on the Irish government's part to apply for money that comes with conditions, e.g. on tax reform, and how hard with the commission press Ireland to move on taxation. So. These are with you. You're muted commissioner. I do that to see that you're paying attention Mike. Yeah, on the particular of the recovery and resilience. I mean there's enough lot of work going on here and the priority is that Member States, not so much race to the get their plan in but would come with a prepared plan and that there's a lot of discussion before the actual plan is submitted because of the amount of background work is going on. When it comes to the particulars around country specific recommendations. I always think it's important to say that Ireland is not singled out so that every country is asked to look at its country specific recommendations and make progress on some or all of them. And in Ireland's case there are four, and one of them is related to broadening the tax base, but to to I think Sarah's question about whether the, you know the commission is forcing or whether Ireland is reluctant. So that's being the case. My involvement in this is with the cluster under my colleague executive vice president broskas, where we look at these plans and where we know that there has to be fairness, so that nobody is treated differently. So some member states have got their plans in others are well prepared. Others might come later, and the commission has said repeatedly that they don't want plans in at speed they want plans in that will work, but we want to get the money out we want to get the money flowing so that investment flows. So I don't see it in the way you frame it in the sense that this is the commission either forcing Ireland to do something it doesn't want to because Ireland is well able to articulate its concerns. Clearly there are four recommendations that are for Ireland and there are many others for other countries as well and the commission will on balance look at what member states are submitting that they will do. And others I think it's important to focus not just on tax, you know providing support to companies SMEs through measured to just read these, I think they're important, you know, ensuring liquidity, supporting employment through developing skills. I mean, that's another of them, and obviously as well to take all measures to effectively address the pandemic there's quite, I mean, before we always focus on the one where little bit, maybe as a member state, we feel conscious of, but there is no sense in which the commission is treating Ireland differently than it would treat Portugal or then it would treat Italy or Germany all countries are required to make progress on their country specific recommendations. And I think that when this takes off and I think there will be a sense of a rejuvenation when this money starts flowing. We want to make sure that it isn't just about big projects which it is partly through investment, but also that there are some reforms that are long term and have a lasting impact as well. And on that side of the equation so I hope that answers the question. We've we've two questions here related to the exodus of banks from the Irish market so I think that I agree with the two of them. One, the first one is what is the commissioner doing to reverse the exodus of banks from the Irish market increase competition in the sector and ease capital requirements on lenders and with the commissioner. There are also culture funds to continue to operate in the EU and purchase NPLs from fully serviced banks. That's the first question from Donald Sheehan of the Irish Farmers Association Farm Business Policy Executive and as a second question in related similar to Donald Sheehan from the Irish Times and he asked, can I ask commissioner to expand on what you said about the farm about foreign banks leaving the Irish market and how much of this is down to the fact that enforcing security here is slower and harder than elsewhere. Thank you for the questions. I did mention to that second point that some of the reasons in my speech about why and I say these may because we don't know the extent of the contribution they make but higher capital requirements and more difficulties around their possessions may be some of the reasons why I mean it is up to those banks the private operators to explain exactly why they're leaving the Irish market. But as somebody who comes from a family that used to bang with Ulster Bank I think if my father was still alive he would be shocked to even think that this is happening. And I suppose that's why we have to be mindful that in the future, there will be things happen that might cause me a shock when I reached a certain age. The question asked what am I doing to reverse it's not my role as commissioner for financial stability to reverse decisions by private operators. When it comes to other issues, whether it's competition, there are colleagues here, my good colleague Margarita Bestiger, if that is an issue, this is where it will be looked at. And as I say my role to reverse the second point then around, will I allow virtual funds and NPLs look in December last we launched an NPL strategy, and we did it in December, rather than leaving it till now so that there would be a focus early on a likely increase in non performing loans. And the reason we do that is to alert both borrower and lender that if there are problems please talk to each other early I repeated that point now. In order to make sure that banks can continue lending, one of the things we can't allow happen is a buildup of non performing loans on balance sheets. That's just not going to help anyone and it will, if you like lead to a credit crunch, which will impact everyone. And therefore what we need to see is a market a secondary market for non performing loans that works well within the European Union. I'm not here to call up for any particular entity that might be in that market but I will tell you that the European Parliament, you know have been debating this and working on directive on credit services and credit providers so it's gone through the legislative process with the caution that I had when I mentioned the NPL strategy in December, that maybe because of coming from the member state I do, I understand very well and because I was an elected member of the European Parliament for a long number of years. I've dealt with people who had difficulties with some of those who had bought mortgage packages or loans, and the biggest difficulty was getting in touch with the entity that had done that so my work here is to make sure that we have financial stability that our banks can lend, but also to watch the implications and consequences where we have the selling off of non performing loans, but it is a part of the market that allows the other side to continue lending. So you should never allow that to dilute any of the rights that borrowers have, and how they will be treated. And again I think because of our experience in Ireland in particular we're mindful of these issues, because of the experiences that I referenced. We will be mindful of that but our role is to make sure that the market works, the secondary market works effectively, that there are European solutions, and I would like to see more of that, so that we avoid any of those difficulties of the past, but I would like to think that we would manage to, if you like, stabilize the situation for many SMEs who had very good businesses prior to COVID and suddenly shocked and now have problems, because with a little help with a little bit of a bridge as I would call it they can thrive and thrive and grow. And I think we need to prioritize that and I'm sure in member states this will be a priority I talk to colleagues who have a big tourism sector as indeed Ireland has. And in these areas, we have to be conscious of trying to keep those entities that can get over this difficult path alive. And how we do that I think can be managed between borrower and lender and equally with the member states supporting in the best way possible. Commissioner, I have two questions here that feature the word Brexit, not surprisingly so not quite same questions but I'll give you the both of them anyway and you maybe just address them as you, as you can so. First question is from Mary Brown of University College, WCD, just thank you Commissioner issues as financial services have experienced a hard Brexit. I hope for the recently agreed UK and EU memorandum of understanding on financial services that's from Mary Brown and the second one related to the financial services from Gavin Barrett in UCD. He wants to know how is the future of financial services provision in Ireland different in the wake of Brexit. I'm sure Brexit was going to come up so I left it for the questions but really important questions firstly in relation to the memorandum of understanding. In a way that's a very technical memorandum how we will if you like UK and European Union behave with one another the mechanisms around how we will engage and timing so it's quite a technical issue. And that's going through the procedure internally both in Commission and in Council. The second layer of that will be when the memorandum is in place, we are obliged to meet twice a year but clearly the first meeting will have to set out what are the issues and you know the background to our conversations. It's true to say, and I think it is commendable that the Commission made decisions last year and equivalent so that on January the first while there was a seismic change in the financial architecture there was no disruption of the financial system. And this is still the case today. The United Kingdom granted equivalents to, I think it was over 20 areas, but they granted to the EA as opposed to the European Union, which is interesting. And equally we in turn granted some equivalents that we felt were important to us. And the big question for us as the as a union, and when we talk about open strategic autonomy which is an issue on our agenda is, are we comfortable with having a part of our financial infrastructure based in London which was the heart of the European financial system to some extent, or do we need to look in the medium and long term as to what the risks might have you know attached to that dependency. There are NCCPs and these clearing houses, there is a, that is a sensitive issue. So, when you ask, you know what differences have emerged, nothing yet because the ground was was perfectly laid. I mean what we're watching and listening to our comments and speeches from the UK about what their vision is for the future of the financial system. And given that Brexit is based on divergence or being different, we have to try and analyze carefully what that difference will mean. And therefore we have to be cautious. We're not going to come to the table with a collection of measures that were granting equivalents to the United Kingdom for we will go to the table when it is appropriate and see what is in our interest around equivalents. So that's still in play where we're working with a working group looking in particular at some of the more sensitive financial infrastructure, and asking the question, how and when and, and is it wise to see, could we relocate within the European Union. We saw the chairs trading in the UK moved to Amsterdam so there's been a natural evolution of some of the financial system. And I think Gavin you asked how is the future different because of Brexit. I think the future it will and is different now because we had a very large financial center in London, when we were EU 28. We will have, I think a few financial centers of which London is one, Frankfurt, Paris. And there will, in my view be probably specialization in different centers, rather than one place where everything comes together. And then the future will be impacted hugely by all of these technological developments around digital currencies and all of those things that we are still trying to evaluate the impacts of on the entire financial system. But I'm pleased that the area that I'm involved in isn't the one that's in the headlines at the moment, as you know around other issues related to Brexit there's quite a lot of work going on to try and make sure that agreements are implemented. And I mean my final word on Brexit is that there won't be a final word on Brexit because it is forever. I was just reflecting with my colleague Mara Shevcovic, Vice President that in a way we are having to recreate structures outside of the EU 27 in order to accommodate our relationship which we want with the United Kingdom, and to make sure that all of the decisions that are made in the TCA and the withdrawal agreement are implemented. So there's almost a double layer of work. And apart from some of the headlines I think most of us all of us appreciate that you know headlines sometimes are not the real story and that the real story for me is that I am responsible for financial stability and I have to be mindful from a European perspective in conjunction with our member states to do everything in our power to ensure financial stability. And if there are opportunities for the European financial system, I think the system itself will seize those opportunities particularly in a digital era when having a number of centres is not as big a deal as maybe in the past. But I would say of course the UK are also very conscious and are trying to probably hold on to what they have. But we are not going to recreate the, if you like, the benefits of the single market when the United Kingdom has very much decided to be out of the single market. Thank you Commissioner. Just maybe two questions I'll link here even if they may not be directly linked but just in the interest of time efficiency. A former colleague of mine indeed Bobby McDonough former Irish ambassador to the UK and indeed permanent Brussels he says, he asked how should the conference on the future of Europe strike a balance between ambition and pragmatism. And do you expect any issues relevant to your own portfolio to arise at this conference. And there's a second one here from Paul Sweeney former to you see economics committee Irish rabbi says, would you agree that one of the best ways to combat your skepticism is to demonstrate that the EU is not simply a single market for business. And thus, social Europe must now get a greater priority and urgency from the commission, maybe not directly related but you may be able to write. You are paying attention in relation to Bobby's question about the conference on the future of Europe I mean look there are people who have huge ideas for Europe and there are those who have less ambition or whatever way you would describe it. But I think the most important thing is that people have a chance to contribute to the debate. So both given what Ireland has gone through because of Brexit and we've been like, in a way that's unwelcoming at the center of all of this because we were the most impacted and we had to, you know, with the help of the European Union, get over the impacts and consequences of Brexit maybe it's time for Ireland to, you know, look to what our future in Europe is to what we want Europe to be and that's why it's really important that Irish citizens get involved in this. And I think Bobby, you will know that that we never in Europe go one leap forward we take steps forward. Look at what happened around COVID, the initial crisis around protective equipment, the difficulties with the vaccine rollout, but but but always in the end getting there and always been better for having gone through a difficult moment and stronger for the future. So as to what might emerge from it some people want to really change others don't like the words change or indeed treaty. So you're going to have to balance this somewhere along the line, but it's probably a good time to have the conversation given that we've gone through so much. And yes, in relation to the area where I'm involved. I think this should be part of the discussion because I think it's fundamental that we talk about our financial system our financial health, even financial literacy as I said that we've just discussed. And in relation to Paul's question about social Europe that it's not just about. I mean, I suppose in a way we kind of make this divide even though that these two issues have to be joined because social Europe needs this, you know the buoyancy of the system to provide social services. I think sustainability questions will change both thinking and orientation. It hasn't happened fully yet. I think the debate in Ireland is taking off. It's very tense. One of the things that I think is regrettable around climate change for example and environmental issues is that you have almost two camps one in favor and then another site and there's a clash I think we could do with more informed discussion around why it's important that we tackle climate change, why we tackle biodiversity and how we do it. And this true call that in relation to social concerns one of the commitments we have made is that in this transition we will need leave no one behind. And that is a very big commitment that needs to be delivered on around just transit transition fund and around making sure that when we are rushing towards a more sustainable future that everybody feels they're part of that helping stampede it over in that particular rush. But I think few of us have taken on board the profound changes that are coming both to society and economies and companies and the financial system around sustainability. And I put it like this, that you know it took a long time for us to agree on accounting standards so that we could measure performance and compare company with another. We spend a little bit time we don't have as much time to delay on setting sustainability standards so how companies in two ways how climate change and environmental issues impact the company, and then how the company is impacting to the outside world also around human rights. And we may well end up at some time with the taxonomy around social issues. We certainly are doing more on the environment side so there's an enormous amount of change which does change the focus away from economic issues, or just to social issues, but maybe to blend them better. And I think we would have a better economy and society where we could blend those better. And again COVID-19 has shown for all our sophistication there were sections of our society I'm thinking of women I'm thinking of carers who really have not had a very good moment to have been under pressure. And I think we've all had to think about these things and that should impact on some of the policies not just at EU level but also at member state level. Thank you Commissioner just, we're just conscious of time now and just want to get in at least one more question here. Question here from Mark Coleman who's an long standing indeed IEA member. He says Ireland's EU membership growing international financial services sector and common law system and proximity to the UK puts us in an excellent position to act as a global bridge for the Green Finance agenda. Could you give us an overview of EU Commission work in this area and why you don't represent Ireland, but rather the EU, what are your thoughts on our potential in this area. I think I thank you Mark I think I mentioned you know Ireland's financial base of having a strong number of companies. So we have a very strong financial ecosystem. And I think the government is already planning that Ireland will play a role around sustainable finance. So yes, there is a role there for for Ireland and other member states. So there's opportunities around providing finance towards our more sustainable economy. Once we have the information. And I think at the moment there are huge information gaps. So investors aren't really sure about what they're hearing about their investment portfolio that it is actually matching their sustainability needs. Advancing rapidly work here around sustainability reporting around financial entities that caring how much of their portfolio is actually around sustainability issues. So yes, I think Ireland could play a huge role in this. I think we have a lot to do internally in Ireland, and we can also do a lot in the wider European context around sustainable finance. At the moment I mentioned how we have a build up of deposits in banks, even though interest rates are, you know, there's no return or those negative if you if you're that lucky to have that much but it does beg the question as to why we have not yet developed capital markets for retail investors are comfortable about investing not leaving money on account but investing so these are this is another area that I didn't mention but it is an area, you know getting our attention. And this is capital to the best and shape and reshape our society towards greater sustainability and I think that's an ask that the next generation are already putting to us. And I think over has really advanced that type of thinking. I don't think we're going to go back to the way we were, because I'm not so sure that was a great place, but I think we should learn maybe from some of the experiences of having gone through a crisis, how vulnerable we thought we were maybe sophisticated and developed, but actually an invisible virus is holding us hostage. And we weren't, if you like, prepared sufficiently in terms of our public health systems. On the other hand, look at the speed at which our research or innovation or bright minds were able to come and find a solution and a vaccine. And I think that should give us hope so yes mark is the answer to that question. I'm just going to try and get into more questions one from a number of the audience and then just one final question if I can in the three or four minutes that are remaining but so a question here from David McCauley who's from the Donor the credit union. He says dear. Merade, the Irish credit union sector has proved to be remarkably resilient during COVID and members have shown their trust with growing savings. As credit unions our community focus how can Europe support the unique status of credit unions, and how can Europe further enhance and allow credit unions to grow their social impact. We come back then for one final question. Okay, well, thank you for the question. I mean, as somebody who got her first loan for the car from our D credit union. I mean, I have a lot to, you know, be kind for for credit unions. I think credit unions in their early stages were very much they were essential for communities and for access to credit. And as much as you're asking me that question, David, I think that you probably have the answers because you will know what regulation impacts you either positively or negatively. But it would seem to me that in the landscape where there are some banks withdrawing from the Irish market that the I would put it to the credit union movement to see what it can do to help fill. If you like some of the gap that will exist there what services you can offer and what facilities and what rates you charge so I think it is about you season the opportunity. Now I don't think there's anything in particular we can do I've talked to for example the German savings bank so there's different models and different member states. What I think might be helpful and I know you coordinate at European level is if you have particular issues that might be helpful for me to understand from your perspective, then I'm very happy to hear that but as I said I have a long standing relationship with credit unions for all the good reasons. And lastly to say that it does trouble me in this role, which is about the big financial system, and you raise the issue of, you know, financial literacy. But there are still too many people in society who don't have access to money. And if they do they are charged exorbitant rates. Frankly, I think around social issues that is a big social issue that needs to be tackled and I hope I'll be part of doing that. Okay, thank you. I hope the car is still functioning but perhaps not this day, but finally just if I could just bring us back to COVID and just at your introductory, the introductory remarks you mentioned about the European Union and it's what the role is playing as an exporter of vaccines to the wider world. And of course, topic at the moment is the question of the waiver on intellectual property and obviously the Americans have got out there in front now and look particularly noble in the initiative that they've taken. Just where is Europe on all of this? I think I heard Angela Merkel or Saul Angela Merkel, that's like Chancellor Merkel, and obviously Europe obviously has a somewhat different perspective. And I think I heard also, Mr. Foreign Affairs, Simon Coveney, you know, maybe closer to the American line. What is it or how can Europe advance further in this area and is there a capacity for it to align with what the Americans are now doing? I think the first thing, and I mentioned the figures about what we're exporting and if you look at who else is exporting, we're probably, we are streets ahead so Europe is doing its part. I mean the question is, and Ursula, the President addressed this yesterday where she said we're open to looking at the US idea because we need ideas, but what we need are an increase in production of vaccines so that we can supply the world. And it isn't quite as easy a process as putting on as, you know, a switch or office switch. It's a very complicated process to get production facilities in place, but Europe is open to listening. And also the timeline involved, will it be a long drawn out process or can it be done urgently? But there is no doubt, the realization that, you know, COVID-19 is going to be around for a while. We are indeed preparing that Europe will need a booster dose next year. So I know, Michael, you said you've been, you've got your shot. I think we're all going to get shots again next year so that we will have to have rolling production capacities. So anything I think that can help in that direction is worth pursuing. And I think under the WTO trips agreement there are, you know, within that ways of maybe allowing licensing to work. But equally we need to make sure that there is research and innovation continuing for the next iteration, all for a pandemic of other dimensions. I did read, I think this morning where the Tornish to Leo Bradcar made a comment that in one sense was like having, you know, giving the recipe to somebody but not having the kitchen or the skills to actually produce the product. So that speaks to the reality that as we discovered in Europe, you need a lot of materials and you need to draw it from many places to reduce the vaccine. The world needs more of all of the above. And I think any ideas are worth exploring. And the good thing that I have discovered since we have a new American administration, whether it's on climate change or security issues. There's an openness to dialogue so we can talk, and we can get things done. And therefore I think the word is in a better place to help those to unfortunately whether it's India or Brazil or other places. You know the death toll is horrific. We see the pictures and then we can turn away but they're living with it so it's why we invested in COVAX. And you know even in the worst of days, President Ursula von der Leyen was saying we have a duty, not just to look after ourselves when others were only looking after themselves. So I think when you look back at Europe's record, I think it will stand well. That's a good note to end on Commissioner. I want to say thank you to you for coming and speaking to us, even if it is virtually. We'll see you in Dublin again, hopefully before too long. But as I said, we've caught an enormous amount of ground. I think we could have been going for a little while longer. We've already trespassed slightly on your time. I think we've taken in a good number of questions, haven't been able to get to them all. But on a future occasion, I'm sure you'll come back and join us. We wish you the very best of luck and what is a very complex area, but I suppose it's an area which affects each and every one of us. So good luck with all that endeavor. Well, thank you very much and happy turkeys. Enjoy your afternoon. Take care. Thank you. Bye bye.