 If it gets to the point at the end of that process it goes to the HRC and so there's an opportunity for public input into the demolition. In order to demolish a house or any structure in a local and stored district you have to prove either economic hardship from keeping out the structure or a loss of storage significance. So, you know, say there was a massive fire and so whatever was historic about it is no longer there, that could be a loss of significance. So there are two, those two criteria outlined in the UDC for demolition. What happened to someone in the NCP? I haven't gotten to that. So that's an historic district. Any questions about that? Just about that. Do you have a lot of files in there? Yes. Why do we have to do that in a conservation district? So on the conservation district side, there, historically as it's currently written demolition was not one of the things that was restricted in a neighborhood conservation district. However, we know that people who become neighborhood conservation districts have concerns about how their neighborhoods are developing. And so we have instituted a requirement to at least look at every demolition that's proposed in NCD and notify the neighborhood association and the council office so that then, you know, they can communicate with others as deemed appropriate. And then, but ultimately, we don't have grounds to not approve a demolition permit at the end of that review period unless it becomes historic. And by the way, we want to say we just filed an ordinance request that does help with NCDs in that similar process. So that is going to be something that what we're going through with staff to help to address that very process. We want to see, of course, we're going to have to go through the legal and find out what can we do to apply these same rules to NCDs. But that's in process. No, not exactly. We just filed it and we're in the process of reviewing that and we hope that we can get those same protections. How about a 90 day process? Okay, my name is Jerry Locky and I'm in Beacon Hill. I don't live in the neighborhood. I came here to learn about historic designation, et cetera, and maybe to add a little bit because I was the chairperson of the NCD in Beacon Hill in 2005. I have five public meetings like this with the city sitting behind me. So I know what you are going through because it's basically the same as it looks like with historic. One thing, a couple of things I wanted to say because I need to leave, sorry. On this that the city has put out where it says how is NCD different? The first paragraph is basically wrong because it says that if proposed modifications or new constructions does not apply with the UDC, the permit is denied. That should say NCD overlays all of the laws that are written in the NCD. The NCD overlays the UDC and overrides the UDC as a law. The NCD overlays and is over the UDC and is a law that supersedes and overrides the UDC. We have a slight disagreement. Well, it's not a disagreement, it's the law. That's just the way it goes. And this is one reason why NCD is... You've got to fight all the whole time. I wanted to address this Michigan guy right here about historic. San Antonio by Mark Twain said that San Antonio was one of the four unique cities in the United States. And this is San Antonio right here. This is San Antonio inside of 410. Excuse me if anyone lives out in the suburbs, but once you get out in the suburbs, it's basically anywhere in the USA. So if we don't protect this downtown area, we don't become San Antonio anymore. We become anywhere in the USA. I respect that. I respect that. That's one more thing. I believe there is some urgency here because of the SA Tomorrow plan and because of the corridors that run up from Fredericksburg and Broadway. Because those have a wide swap that encompasses the downtown and the midtown section of the SA Tomorrow. I don't know if you can agree, but it's getting ready to have a lot of so many things happening. And as those things happen, we're the closest to that. And we're already seeing it in our neighborhood. And the 930 West Creek was brought up and we won't go there. How long does it take to operate that CD? The NCD took, I'd say, 6 to 8 months to write. And then how long do you think it took? Or is that included? That's probably included. It was within a year, but it was almost a full year to get the NCD. It's either historical because the NCD is worthless, right, is what I'm hearing. You know, the NCD does nothing if they approve that, right? So one thing, the NCD, you got to please yourself. And it's a lot, even though it's laws, it still is interpretations. And when the city works with developers, their job, the DSD, if you look at their card, is what can we build for you today? So they're going to work whatever goes down there. And the neighborhood usually is notified when they're just working together. How can I get around? How can I work with this NCD to get my plans made? So that's kind of how the NCD works. Even though the NCD is a law, we just had a variance the other day in front of the Board of Adjustments, and I brought it up to the Board of Adjustments and not a single person on the Board of Adjustments knew that NCD was law and ordinance, which that's where you go to get your variances. Now to Mr. Covingo's credit, he is trying to work to get the Board of Adjustments trained in dealing with it because they're basically citizens that are down there. Let's talk about one real quick thing about the urgency. You did mention some zoning telling us, I'll say tomorrow, just to clarify, we're not going to do any zoning immediately. There's going to be some plan amendments. Those are going to take place first. So we have a little bit of ways before we get down to the zoning process. So we don't have to do anything today. Tomorrow we'll do it tonight. I'm sorry, what did you say about it? Overlays that are in place already. We do have overlays. Yes, but don't they prevent all the airport districts? Doesn't that already prevent overlays? Overlays, it just depends on what the overlay is. Overlays are very different. I mean, we have an overlay to protect the recharge zone. So in that case, certain uses are not allowed over the recharge zone. So that's one. You're right, we have an airport overlay, so we're regulating the height of the buildings. So overlays are very specific, you know, to what they're trying to protect. Okay, the scoring has been waiting for a long time. I think it's not right. Thank you. Yes. You mentioned, I think you are putting some concrete on the park and how they have to do spaces, possibly taller than that. So it seems like there's a lot of back and forth. Some reports were not, some properties were not cut out to reach some of the 1%. So that 51%, why can't you just make them historical? And those who are opposed, leave them alone, leave them out of it, and make them a second phase, or a third phase, so that we can stop all the bickering and the back and forth, and those who want it, let them have it. Those that don't, and I don't remember who called me, but I was told on the phone that Valentino Street was going to be cut out because they couldn't get to 51%. That's what I'd like to add. So I guess if we can jigsaw a street, then we can certainly jigsaw. As you said earlier, whatever historical district started with, two blocks, three blocks. Okay, well then those who don't want it, let's just cut them out. Okay, so individual properties are common landmarks, not districts. So that is a different thing. So the reason that people often become interested in considering the historic district designation is because it protects the overall character of a block, or two blocks, or three blocks, or whatever it is. And so to spot zone, essentially, by hand picking, based on the owner's consent, it's just not consistent with... That's what's going on. That's what's going on. That's what's going on. That's what's going on. Because the four structures of Valentino that were built in 1897 for the workers from the Stone Quarry, which is now second garden, were packed by bus or whatever carriage every day from the Stone Quarry to the four houses that were built in 1897. They're on Valentino, however, they were gerrymandered out. And the house was in 2006 on Bistletoys, including the historic district. I don't think that a lot of people here are really anti-historic, necessarily. But the process is going to work. It seems to me it should work in a fair way, in an open way that, you know, if there's a problem with the gerrymandering rule, so here's my advice. When the historic district is heard at the Zoning Commission, if you have a proposal for a different boundary, that would be a great time to make that request of the Zoning Commission. That is something that can happen through the process. You can say to Councilman Trevino when it reaches Council, you know, we really think that these properties over here are not in support. We think you should consider this boundary. And it is the prerogative of Council to consider a reduced boundary. Okay, so I'm sorry to follow up on that. So, I know for myself, I'm on a very small street, and there's only three of us, and none of us wanted at all. And so, it came to us. We're all business owners. We don't know what it is. And so, you're saying we can ask to be cut out. Is that right? Absolutely. I'm going to make that request. I'm going to go to 7-Eleven. You said 7-Eleven, so... I want you guys to do what you want, but I don't want it. You're so... I want to be very clear. Okay, so that right there is part of the problem. It's not what we want, okay? Well, it's because of the chair... There were ten people at the first meeting to discuss this whole process to begin with. There were multiple, multiple public meetings where the entire neighborhood was invited to come. It is not a single individual's decision. It is not my decision. It's not your decision. It's not her decision. It's not his decision. This was a decision that was put forth in front of a group of people who went to the city and said we would like to examine this to see if this would work. Well, what prompted it was to go down, right? And, like, what's going on? I'm not sure how long it will take. Which is exceeding the common... Which is exceeding the common situation, right? It's here now or something like that. I would really like to speak to this. The reason that we cannot say we want this property to be historic and this one not and this one to be and this one not. If we look at this map, this large property right here is on board. It's vacant. It's owned by Tara Mark. There's representatives here from Tara Mark. And it's across the street from their house. But right here is Mr. Audio's property. And right here is Marilyn's property. If they want historic and Tara Mark upped up, Tara Mark can build whatever their zoning allows for. However hot giving chance and that is in place, we cannot challenge it. They have the right to build on their loss within the current zoning. The zoning allows a three-story building. These two homes are one-story, historic homes. If they're giving this lot off south and that is a lot, they can take this area. And it is a big one here. It takes me over a thousand minutes. So let me explain it. We can't force zoning to change the owner of the rights. To change their stuff to apply to other zoning or not. But we have enough. Excuse me. These aren't our properties. These are our six. That can't happen. Because it's more property than just the same. Tara Mark owns their property. We can't say, have this zoning. It exists. And they have their rights to build. That property. We do not think much of the story. And they have, I'm assuming Mr. Turner is in opposition of the designation and that's their rights. You know what happens even though I don't see why you do that. Because somebody left that very surprise and they ended up with a modern something that's a little terrible. This is my property. There was a question about there's two different types of zoning. There's your base zoning and then there's the overlay zoning. Your base zoning so if you have a base zoning or single family or you can do a single family you can have an historic single family district, right? You can also have multi-family and then we can put a historic overlay on that so you can have a historic multi-family district. You can still have apartments in historic districts. That's dictated by the base zoning. Just wanted to clarify this. But the design is, it has to go through the review process. And the public is to hear about exactly what you need to say. I would like to be correct. There's an opportunity for public interest. Correct. There was a hand over here. Okay. Thank you. You're welcome. Yeah, I did here for I bought my house 13 years ago and it was for sale for $35,000. I thought I could buy a car or I could buy a house. So I offered $60,000 and they accepted it. I put every dollar I had which was $60,000. So I played the symphony. My house got broken into twice. And I was staring in front of a crack house. We didn't have a meeting. Nobody cared. Nobody cared. My house got broken into. I didn't want to go historic then. I don't know how many drug deals cocaine crack was going on across the street for me. We didn't have these meetings then. Nobody cared. Do you understand? And then a little thing happened. Great Mr. Castro 2020, we're going to change downtown. Everyone's like dude, are you nuts? There's nothing going on downtown. And then all of a sudden the pearl got built. Now, I know it's like to lose my job. I want to publicly thank David for changing my legacy. And everyone here whether or not you vote for this or not this man gave at least $150,000 to you. You should be thankful. People that have let me tell you something. When I came here 13 years ago I was afraid it took granted in my house. You know why? I was doing anything. And I'm telling you, if anybody wants to there was a house up the street that monster, that orange thing that was for sale for over 400 days at $350,000. So for you people I respect you and I love you but I want you to understand that our destiny has been changed by people that have come into this neighborhood and made huge financial changes to all of us. Whether or not this goes historic or not we're arguing over something the pearl came and it changed everything. So, I want to first acknowledge David I want to thank him for my baby's baby because we're going to be able to afford not have, I don't have to live up to my mother did it. $1200 a week. This is incredible area. This whole area of the Oreo cookie is now the life Gucci center almost part and the part that these people developed built it will go into the millions. No, I think that's not appropriate. It's a horrible idea. And then here it's a compromise. It's a compromise. It's not a shit place that are wallowing. Is that a fair assessment? Let me try it. It can be a compromise. It is not a historic district. It is a step in a way towards a historic district but it does not come with all the protections that a historic district comes from. It doesn't come with all the responsibilities that a historic district comes from. Can you write into it where it gives you a little more protection? Yes, you can. You can add some protections but it will never be it will never be the historic district. It's a distinct district. Well, let's go through the process and designate the story. It actually thinks that there's been some discussion online. I don't know if anybody here is a part of the next door app for our neighbors but there have been some discussion online about this because 233 West Craig has come up as a vacant house where it's a realtor's investment dream, right? This is the type of place that you're looking for because it's one of those big, beautiful, old houses. And it's been purchased by a developer. It's been purchased by a developer and Tammy Kaylee from Alta Vista has put on here and Denise Stalka from West Fort. West Fort is looking at a historic. Our councilman told us without it he would support the owners who want to demolish. We lost a grand old corner home in the Big Mansions. It angers me. They told us to do a neighborhood plan. Committed neighbors spent hours and hours and developed a good plan. The city told us that won't get it done. Get MCD status. We did. They said still not enough must be historic. The remains to be seen as historic really will protect us. Or is just another smoke stream. Further down on that, Tammy Kaylee from Alta Vista started updating our NCD, which is very updated since we faced challenges that didn't exist when it was established 15 years ago. Well-meaning, but the language leaves leeway big enough to drive an 18 wheeler through. And the developers abuse this. So when we're talking about an MCD versus a historic, you're talking about a public process and public input versus a thing that somebody puts together at some point and if nobody pays attention to it or updates it or maintains it or if you don't see it once putting it together, right? Then nothing happens and the developers continue to do what they want to do without input from us. So why doesn't the city allow that though? It's almost like you over have your choice and you're going to start trying to get through to the development side. So why is there not more rules on being MCD? We're looking to strengthen the rules of the NCD. We want to provide... So a lot of what occurs and I have to agree. There's been cases where because something happens we get notified after the fact. But we have in place now a notification that is at the beginning of the planning process. This allows the neighbor associations, the neighbors the council office staff to begin a more meaningful discussion. So we are trying to strengthen those specific outlines that we think could be helpful and potentially be a compromise. There are... So what I'm saying is that we want to do is we want to educate you. And we also want to learn what can we do? We as a council office and the community gatherer we want to either help strengthen current NCDs or help those people who feel like NCDs are not enough to go historic. This is important. Not everybody wants to go historic. Some people want to stay in NCDs but we are hearing that there are loopholes and sometimes we get caught sort of behind a ball saying, wait, we wish we would have known about this and we started that. We have a process in place that helps to begin that because we believe when we can start the communication early, that is very, very helpful. And that has helped this particular office on many, many cases. I think I had a... That sounds very reactive. I'm 930 West Craig which has an NCD construction. This happened recently. They're still building these three-story houses. That picture, please hold that picture up again. That picture, it's three stories. Those are huge stories. That is a two-story building on the left of it. Do you see? The left building is a two-story building and that is three stories and it's currently under construction. It's so reactive to say, oh, now we're trying to fix it because this happened, it slips through. It's working on it. It trusted the city. And so that is a great point. It's not reactive because we didn't know about it. Wait, how do you apply for permits? They have the place very... They want them to come to us. No, that's on the program. Let me answer that. I'm trying to answer that. Not true. Again, and I'll have Rod and Steph explain to you as well. We do want to have more of that conversation. And of course, as you know, this is the kind of thing that we feel, why we're here tonight to have more communication. The reality is that there's things that we don't see every little thing that happens. Especially when somebody pulls permits. Our office does not review every single permit. We don't do that. But what I have asked us to do, I'm getting to it. Let me answer that. You're being inside there. You're not showing the truth. We went to your office multiple times before the ground was broken. We listed at one point almost a dozen violations of our NCD. Eventually we narrowed it down to there's an absolute violation of four of our NCD requirements. The only reason in my opinion that you guys are considering historic you, Mr. Sanchez, have broken the NCD system. You didn't follow the rule. That's why 730 Gray is the poster child for what everyone is discussing. Thanks. Welcome. Once again, this is why we're working with city departments and development services to provide that very thing. I think it's easy to say that. But the reality is we want to provide notification. We're moving to a more automated service so that when something comes to a plan review we will get there. Can we get back to the discussion and the question? I do want to answer this. We're going to answer this. As I mentioned, NCD is not a historic district. It lists the design guidelines which we have to follow. Obviously, we disagree on what those design guidelines are. Well, let's get reading list. We're prohibited. And if you twist the words you can maybe, I don't understand how you talk to us. That's what we want to do. Read our NCD. There's no way you can sign that. We read it and then we apply what we believe it says. We are we're doing our job. What we're doing now is we're looking at the NCD Are you working for the neighborhoods or are you working for these developers coming into the neighborhoods? Because it feels like you're helping them get through these problems. Our job is to look at the law and look at the project and see if it complies. We have no choice. We have no choice. If you should report it. So, let me go ahead and speak. So my name is Catherine Andes. I'm the manager over the zoning section. In my section does the plan review for permits that are applied for in the neighborhood conservation districts. So let me speak specifically to 930 West Craig. 930 West Craig is a multifamily and they're 33. So if someone wants to build multiple units they can. It's called an apartment complex. In this case it's a condominium. A condominium is a form of ownership. It's six units built on one lot. So it's multifamily. Beacon Hills, NCD standards say specifically related to Hyde that multifamily is allowed three stories in Hyde. So it means No, it is not. It's three stories. So there's a definition in the Beacon Hill NCD that defines what a story is and it follows that. It meets the NCD criteria. The problem is that it is multifamily zone property in the middle of a block. The rest of the block is zone single family. That's what inherently the problem starts. It starts with the base zone and there are several pockets of other multifamily zone lots in Beacon Hill as well as Alta Vista that have the same issues and so because there are these holes in the NCD or if I should say it doesn't require that the structures be tied together that they be together as in like they be attached. It doesn't require it to be attached. Therefore they can separate it and that's why they're allowed three stories on that lot. We can only enforce the rules just like if you were to come in and pull a permit and you wanted to pull a permit to put vinyl windows and if the NCD says well yes you can allow vinyl windows and if my preference is vinyl windows are horrible you should put wood windows. I can't deny you that because the NCD or the code allows you to do it. So we can't insert our own interpretation or our own personal opinion onto a permit. We have to enforce the code. We have to enforce the code. So we're not allowed to have been allowed in a historic district to not have happened. That's three stories. So here's this underscores the big difference between the two and both Rod and Kat pointed out the fact that if an application is submitted for permit in an NCD that meets the letter of the law staff does not have the discretion to deny that application. They must approve the application. In a historic district part of the review is that it has to be assessed as it relates to historic guidelines that are in place and the Secretary of Interior's standards and the overall character of the neighborhood and there is discretion. The commission has discretion and looks at properties to determine what their nature of the neighborhood is. Again we're faced with no choice though. You either go to a historic or you have an NCD which has no teeth. So is there an option to create an NCD that has some teeth when you take action for regulations that doesn't happen? If that was the case if there was an NCD that actually had some teeth that would protect our streets from something like that happening like you did on 930 Westbrook would you still all be in favor of historic zone or historic district? Historic public process. But if there was more regulation on the NCD it would help me to understand that because my point is I'm trying to let them know that I'm a historic multifamily or I have to go to a historic and get told what to do on my own. There are a couple of different ways that you can respond to the question. One is to go back to what Kat pointed out about underlying zoning. If you have concerns about what can be developed on a property based on the underlying zoning then you can also work with your council office and the development services department to amend the underlying zoning what you want your neighborhood to have to allow. But there are obviously property rights play in and it is harder to change the zoning if a property owner isn't in favor. Not impossible but it is harder. It's not a done deal. On your question about can you make the NCD stronger? Yes. The councilman is articulated and Rob has said staff and the council can look at those regulations and potentially could strengthen them. There is always going to be a difference. It is never going to get to the point where you have an NCD minus the public process so you can just come down. It's never going to be as much protection as a historic district. That's not just the city of San Antonio making that decision. Historic districts are enabled by state law they're envisioned by the state legislature and so the state legislature grants to place limitations on properties that are designated as historic. Those same abilities don't exist for NCDs at the same level and so there are limitations on what you can regulate at the NCD level. I have a quick question about many residents on the eastern side of the mistletoe coming from Ocala most of the houses are fixed up but passing my property and my husband's property suddenly all the houses become much smaller houses. Several of them have been restored. Several of these two gentlemen who raised the value of the property done consistent renovations they don't clash with the name of it or anything like that. I'm a little bit confused as to why we have to have historic as though we're made to fear that all this development is going to come. Next thing you know they're going to carry down your name to your neighbor's house. I mean all that is going to happen if you're not having the possibility that's often the conversation. That's often the conversation. I look right next door where they demolish where Terramarck wants to put whatever they want to put back in and put it back in. Mr. Terramar, can we even consider 12 months or eight months or nine months to write in a CD are you going to wait to build your property? In their favorite houses on the street that look like they're ready to go down to you as soon as that person finds it passes away or their family doesn't have an interest developers are going to buy it or they're going to have to maintain the integrity and maintain the integrity. They're going to have to build in that eight months it takes us to write it in CD to pass this chance. I was thinking that many of the people who lived in those homes were 50, 60 years old many of their homes are decrepit I'll be in this room but something that we say that only suburb is going to fall harder on those elderly without money within old homes that should be restored. Let me address that one aspect of that we do offer a number of opportunities for public education and outreach and also assistance we have our office administers a program called STAR which stands for students together achieving revitalization we've worked on over 100 houses in our local historic districts where property owners need assistance to maintain them so that is a resource that is potentially available to owners that are in need of assistance we also have other similar projects where we work on houses to help property owners through that process so that is an option available in local historic districts through our office So at this point if it can be so historic is that going to stop Charimar from what they're doing or are they already through them? So whenever a proposal they would submit for HDRC review and so they would have to go through the process and they would have to comply with the historic design guidelines like character consistency and scale and setback I don't think I'm going to have a case by a lot of librarians but I think you can make a report on this so now we don't want this now we can't mark a turn on this property it's not going to sell it it's not going to sell it I don't think it's going to sell it if they no longer want it to develop we develop all around downtown and we take great pride in the product that we do we spend a lot of time with the neighborhood of which most of which have been very receptive to what we do and we try to fit within the neighborhood the plan that we presented to the neighborhood what they planned that would I would say have 99% chance to improve through a historic lift we did all the right scale we did the right window treatment that's the number that's the whole thing we're going to have to write on the number they would have a 6 and just to be clear I have not seen these proposals I cannot comment on whether or not what they were planning to do how it would be received whether or not it goes historic there's a certain amount of density that is allowed by the base zoning so often the arguments I mean I've heard the term 3 story thrown around quite a bit that is allowed in some of these pieces of property whether or not it has its story so the aesthetics are the thing that's going to be well, scale is determined by the historic designation the number of units could the multifamily would still be allowed based on the base zoning but the scale of the construction that's why it's design review the scale and the setback and the overall character would have to be consistent it depends on it depends on the property for Charlie Turner's property on 4 is 3 stories it's 35 feet max 35 feet max as it's currently zoned the base zoning is 3 stories 35 feet max in height do you live in our neighborhood? no but I do can you come in and filter what's in our neighborhood? I have moved into Westport I am now dealing with the NCD for my own personal home and I can tell you what I listen to here isn't what I went through personally as far as getting the permit to launch the house I would love to say that it was impossible 90 days or so to go through the demolition process that building was not in this building there might be an event let me let me write it back in for a second we're kind of starting to rehash similar questions here we're happy to answer your questions if there's any new questions that you'd like for us to address rest your arms let me talk ultimately if it's clear that you will need to have some conversation among yourselves have some discussions we're happy to come out again in the future don't feel like this is your only opportunity you could reach out to any of us with questions we can host additional meetings we'll be expected to have 100% consensus before we can move forward with the process is that the expectation now from what we're doing here that we have to have 100% consensus I don't think 100% is even possible so no, I don't think anyone anticipates that there'll be 100% in either direction the desire was just there's no hurry necessarily either is to make sure that people have the opportunity to have their questions answered just to clarify historical district designation will not dictate or determine the amount of units that go on a proper aesthetic is that correct or incorrect correct, it doesn't change the underlined views this is all not going to accomplish anyone no, we're applying for six I have two questions one, Mr. Karim let's repeat how forthright you said if you were to subdivide your property can you then build two multifamily units maybe the commissioner should answer that question if they divided their lot is it then RM4 for both blocks yes it is so the RM4 carries with the property so if it's subdivided into two RM4 is for both blocks and RM4 allows up to four units if it meets 4,040 each left has RM4 to meet the setbacks for RM4 so it's got to meet the side, front and rear setbacks, as long as you can do that you can build your structure is it your intention to divide the lot? yes we actually own two we have two blocks we have one property of the block but we already have two so that's from the very beginning we're planning on so it could be 4 and 4 but you're not doing that so what he's saying is that the way it's configured today is actually two blocks so right now it's already two blocks each one has RM4 on it it looks like one because Fair County appraisal district has it as one account and they do that for everybody's property if you have 225 foot with blocks you see it as one square it represents 50 feet in front it's because you own both blocks it's one account so he has two blocks today so each block meeting the 4,000 square foot minimum block size requirement gets up to four units on each block and whether it's a historic district or not you will be able to put that many units on it because a historic overlay or an NCD overlay does not govern legal use of the property but the historic historic has a way to scale that's what overlay districts address the design of how it looks what is that? what do you have unused property? I forgot to turn to you how difficult is it under the story to build a property that's not legalized underutilized it's the same process that's what we talked about earlier new construction goes through the commission process and we look at setbacks of the character of materials designed it doesn't mean that it can't be modern or it has to look like a fake historic house it could look like this like used historic material should use historic materials but if they have that sort of there already well materials consistent with historic I'm sorry I wasn't exactly sure so the guidelines speak to what should be arranged what kind of roof forms you should have so that there's consistency in the neighborhood to maintain the overall character no I mean again I mentioned this earlier I really would encourage you to take a look at our website sapreservation.com if you haven't there are a lot of resources there and whether or not you come in historic district our historic design guidelines are actually a really great resource for owners of older and historic properties in general there's a lot of information about overall maintenance concerns and things like that so I really would encourage you to take a look at but you can also see what types of things the HRC is looking at. I would also encourage you to review our economic impact study that was done by Donovan for a couple of years ago and one of the reasons I thought of it is your question about how hard is it to build actually you probably would be surprised at the number of permits that are issued in our local historic districts it clearly demonstrates that districts are not frozen in time in fact Mr. Turner's building in a number of other historic districts and so it is absolutely not about stopping things from happening or freezing in time it's about managing that change so that the overall care to the neighborhood is consistent. Can you see there how long that process will take? How long will that process take? The application process of the HRC is actually one of the shorter of any commission the application process is 19 days from when you submit the application to when you're first heard by the commission we do encourage people to come in earlier than that and work with staff and take advantage of the design review committee so that you can get input early on but the actual time from submittal to getting to HRC is 19 days and the time do you do target structures again? Well it depends on you I mean you have to go through the permit you also have to go through the development permit the services permitting process There's a lot of questions there when you have to answer are you zone correctly? If you're not zone correctly you have to go through the process for that if you're not planted there's a process for that if you have all that satisfied the commercial so it's hard to quantify but the codes that you have on post now how many volumes of codes do you have right now? we're just a regular we're just a regular how much do you need for a historic district? historic is a chapter and one of the codes so I just want to thank everybody for coming we want to be respectful of all the time that we have we have here I got you so I just want to say we're going to be wrapping up because we're very appreciative of the church allowing us the time to be here tonight let's go ahead and take a couple last questions so that we can wrap up okay so yes yes you've been very patient I'm not sure what to say to this situation but I am from west for it and we are a mild working group so I think what's happening to us is in your future and I want to address the question about and the house becoming available I live in a 1916 home on almost a half acre it's a phenomenal house and almost everyone who looks at my house tells me for God's sake you get ready to sell this and call me so I want you to understand this house is in pristine almost pristine condition I called a realtor she told me someone's going to buy this house and raise it and I said what do you mean and she said it's worth more to them destroyed I do I have a right also with their private historic status which is what I'm going to do but if you want to preserve your neighborhood what's happening to us is going to happen to you your values are going to go up and when they do people are going to find it more economical to destroy your home so you might just think about that I think that's a very worth that when they submit an application it will be reviewed but to my knowledge we've not received an application yes but it's earmarked already it's a priority it's not a place until the decision is made by the city council so if they were to present a plan it would come to you guys let me just write here they process because this is in the process requirements are that if we decide we would like to build something before we convene to do the building permit we do have to go to the historical commission to present a proposal to them and they would review it just like it was in any other neighborhood in the city for the neighborhood the council or the commission doesn't just look at this neighborhood these guidelines are for all of the neighborhood it doesn't just say oh it's only for this one or for that one so those guidelines are applied basically to all the areas so it's not specific that will offer these houses or these three kids overall I just want to make sure that you have to do that because I'm having to do that that's the only way we can proceed but again as we started very early on in the meeting it doesn't require anyone to do anything so if Mr. Heller isn't moving forward with this project yet he doesn't have to I just wanted to confirm that because me as a resident I have an application and I've gone to meet with you guys and I've done all of that so I just wanted to make sure that he as a big developer guy has to do the same thing I have a different income level than he does so I just want to make sure that the second question is I would like to know when and we know when this is going to be decided whether it's going to go to store or not because I am meeting and I'm doing all of this and so I kind of I've got the work my stepmother passed away I inherited the home it was built in 1910 it's falling down and it needs everything under the sun I didn't got a loan to rebuild the house and I was a little girl and I'm saying to live in it someday and I'm all for the historical because I don't want it to be torn down like she was saying it's because it's happening it's happening we can pretend it's not going to happen it's happening it's happening it is it's happening for you so what I want to know is and we have to take this it will be going to somewhere in the U.S. in your life so okay we do need a wrap up because this is we didn't borrow the space I think that this is important again this is all part of the discussion I hope that we can continue this discussion it's really important that we all work together this is the neighborhood as was stated there's a lot of discussion still to be had know that we are seeing that May 16th that's going to zoning but we hope to have more conversation before then we hope to have your contact information we'll do what we can to try to maybe clarify some questions we'll do what we can to stay in communication and maybe even hold another meeting in the interim as well we want everybody to feel good about all the information that we discussed tonight and as we move forward everybody can feel good about what we're trying to do so thank you for being here tonight we really appreciate it