 Hey guys got a special treat for you Jade and I once again did a video collaboration talking about the season finale of the series finale of Supernatural And just kind of our thoughts about the fandom and the season and the show itself the discussion Which I originally thought maybe would have taken no more than half an hour went on for an hour and a half I'll either be splitting the rest into another or maybe two more videos depending on how it goes and how our conversation went through It otherwise enjoy the conversation enjoy what we talk about and you'll be seeing us talk about more throughout the week Hey guys new surprise to you for 2021. Jade and I are back once again And we are doing a little bit of a long overdue video, but we're finally talking about the finale of Supernatural What our thoughts about it were and just There's a bit to talk about but first off Jade. Thank you for doing this again considering you you've moved and all the All the adventures you've been on the last little while. It's nice to do a video with you again Thank you. I appreciate you giving me the opportunity to Talk about Supernatural Well, I appreciate you dealing with me and my like sometimes very bad getting back to you at the emails It's it's okay because I do the same thing It was it was an yeah, well 2021 was a sorry 2020. Sorry. I'm already writing 2021 into it but Last year was certainly an interesting year Of everything but amongst that was the end of a show that some of us have been watching for 15 years a show that had gone on for 15 years and To say that there is a divide in the response to it is a bit of an understatement The INDB reviews are a plethora of emotion But there doesn't seem to be a lot of people who There's very very few who appear to be in the middle if you were to say it like that And I feel that you and I are kind of in that middle ground. Yeah, we can see what's good But we also can see what's really bad Yeah, so like when I made my first video about the finale I titled it Everything I wanted in the worst way possible Which I feel like was very no, that's a good. That's an accurate. Yeah, cuz I I have many issues with the finale. It's just like On one hand, it's like this I've loved the show so much over these past few years It's been hard for me to be like critical of it because I'm just I've just been so like oh my god I love it so much but like now that it's over and like that's it. It's like damn There's there I just feel like there's a lot more that they could have done in this finale that They had the opportunity to do and they didn't do it. Well, it's you can kind of almost say that with the entire season, right? Yeah, the fact that we waited we waited half a year for seven final episodes and of those seven episodes Ten the first three were filler episodes Especially the one where they went I can't remember which one it was Carrie dragged me to hell or something the one where they went to they got that phone call from that person that they apparently met as kids and There was that Baba Yaga thing which I remember sitting there going Why are you doing a retread of something that we've seen a billion times now? Do something that's actually meant to be about the finale and then they did unity Which was a actually not a bad episode and I felt that every one afterwards despair was garbage and then inherit the earth was It was passable at best So the spares episode 18, right? Yes, that's the one where things just went to do-do so My with my like opinions on the finale and like the last few episodes I feel like I liked episode 18 mainly because Castiel's confession to Dean But like aside from that like Um, I didn't really think that there was like I At that time I was really hopeful that this finale would turn out How like I would picture it kind of obviously I've never been able to like picture supernatural ending in general But it gave me like a for me personally it gave me like a little bit of a hope that hey, maybe this finale won't be garbage um and like after they took cast and Billy episode 19 and that that one's inherent to earth. I I Don't even know what to think because I know that was like supposed to be like the end of the series arc Another series the season arc for season 15, which like I could get behind But then with episode 20. I kind of feel like They just took everything Just oh, it's it's hard to even put into words Yeah, it was essentially it was them like The majority of that is just Like little fan service fan service fan service and then an incredibly over long death scene followed by a Montage where you could see that them the the seams were splitting like they were trying to cut as many corners as possible in terms of budget and The wig oh the wig is it is I was showing it to some ladies who Were on the show that I worked on and one of them happened to be the woman who gave Crap one of my Crowley's mother. Why am I completely blanking on the name Rowena? Yeah, she was the first one to do her hair She was the one who gave her the hair that would be used for the rest of the show And she was when I showed her Sam she's like, oh my god What did they do? So it was being passed around work. It was being my it was being made fun of amongst On fun for Vancouver film groups. It was it was horrible. It got destroyed on Twitter, too Oh, I bet you're on. Yeah, I don't know if you're on like Twitter a lot, but that's I do know that Destiel was trending when episode 18 came out above the US elections and above Putin resigning So like Twitter was up in flames, which yeah, and that that too like I'm I'll be honest I don't think that's I think that was as close debating as they could possibly get I've I'm not really a shipper of it. It's just not my thing. Yeah. I'm more so think that they're bros But I've my opinion was if you're going to do it actually just get the fucking balls and do it rather than they I made I make a comment. I think that that's the that's Andrew Dab Holding the carrot as low as he possibly can but no one can actually reach it and that's why I said everyone's like it's confirmed They're like, no, it's not it's it's it's baiting that is bait. Well, what's from? Oh from Mad Max. That's great Yeah, I know Misha actually like He like kind of confirmed that it was like that steal was like kind of a real thing But also he's not the writer of the show No, and I and then Misha Misha is is a little kind of interesting himself admittedly like I Like the guy and admittedly he is he can be a bit Sometimes he's a little bit much, but I the fact that there was that weird Spanish or was it Italian Italian? It was a Spanish dub. So I actually mentioned this in my video. So What people were like upset about and I I understand this because I do ship Destiel And I feel like it's up to everyone's interpretation of the show to come to their own conclusion on that Even though I feel like there's been a lot of subtext that leads to deaning cast You know being a little bit more than bros, but again, it's up to interpretation But where was I going with this they yeah, so the Spanish dub the Spanish dub version that was released I think in South America After Dean after cast says I love you to Dean and I you Yeah, he says and I you in Spanish back and then caskets taken by the MD but in the English version Dean just like sits there like So like He called them rogue translators Which I mean Everyone I know people on Twitter were saying that they're gonna take the Spanish dub as them confirming. Yeah, so like I stand it It was it was kind of just odd that Like one that's a really kind of an odd thing But again that does happen when things are translated admittedly like when you have dubs are different translations There's always a little bit of change in the dialogue But I thought that was kind of a very very impactful one But I thought the thing that made me kind of a bit about it was just how pointless It was not pointless, but I guess more underwhelming because this has been something that Dab it at had teased for a long time and it was like that's it That yeah, that's it baited. He baited And I thought I just I think someone had made a comment that it was kind of funny that death was knocking on the door But I just I think I hated I didn't hate but I thought that Billy's character was just so Boring at this point that I couldn't give a crap. I was more interested in the empty But then we had just seen the end. Well, this was one of the reasons why I hated despair It's because Jack died again, and he was brought back Again all of in the span of like five minutes and yeah And and I think I was like that I I thought that that was just so ridiculous It made the Jack character just even more pointless and then the whole Ex machina thing with him being a power vacuum which oh and then my oh then when Michael portrayed them Lucifer came back killed a reaper then killed death as this there was so much in That last episode that I was like, okay, you're you're you're trying to give a lot here Yeah, that Honestly episode 19 like I When I think about it I kind of like forget about that happening just because it was like so much Because they bought back Michael and Lucifer and like oh that was that was a yeah I was very disappointed with Michael too. Like, you know, you had teased him very well, and then that's what you do with them But because like I liked the idea of having Michael back earlier on and you know I I fucked with that episode actually kind of like a lot. It's just uh, I am I just It was I think it was what was the context of it was like they Were like explaining to Michael that like God was like fucking shit up and everything and yeah He's an asshole and then all of a sudden you say yeah, you know what oh Lucifer has been brought back Yeah, it was I Don't even know how to like explain that because I don't I didn't mind like the last like the ending of episode 19 because I Kind of like I liked how Throughout like that episode they hinted at something being up with Jack and then you don't find out until the end Which I mean I wasn't expecting that with the whole power vacuum thing I knew Jack had to defeat him in some way. I just knew that that probably had to do with it I just didn't know what was gonna happen And then when that did happen, I was actually genuinely shook and I I I'll admit I liked how I can say that the fact of removing Chuck of all of his powers I thought that was a good idea But it keeps him alive. Yeah, but I feel that you could have used him in carry-on Which is what I guess The the essay that I'm talking about that's kind of one of my side ideas is that Chuck could have been used as an adversary in the final final episode rather than Random random vampires that that cameo to Yeah, but obviously I think COVID stuff probably did affect some of it some of it not as much as people think it did Um, yeah, no, um someone pointed out like oh well like look like in my comments. I made a I Remember the comment exactly but in my video. I had mentioned how like People were using like COVID as the excuse for not bringing back certain people which is valid Yes, there is some valid credit some points to that. Yeah, yeah And but the one thing I mentioned was the fact that in the last scene after Sam and Dean have their little bra moment in heaven it cuts to the whole cast and crew and oh, yeah That they're not wearing masks. Yes, there's like one or two who are you can see there's a few of them But some of them aren't in the middle of that probably wasn't the best like they shouldn't have done that but yeah you know I went back to work right at about a month before supernatural dead and Yeah, everyone on set has to wear masks. We get temperature checks There are certain shows now that like they do like a nose check. They do the Yeah, the tickle your brain thing. Yeah, they do that about every some big Netflix ones do two a week There's a building that they bought Netflix in particular. They spent a million dollars on it It's going to be their own COVID testing center building So they don't have to hold up life-lapse because admittedly when the film industry went back to When it went back into action the amount of tests in BC went from something I'd like maybe a few thousand every day to 70,000 But yeah, no COVID did affect certain things, but it may or so meant production The reason why most people one one of the key people who's not there is Eileen which Nipped a lot of people myself included but What they would have had to have done is Have her come up from California Isolate for two weeks because this is what we're doing with all American actors They isolate in their hotel room for two weeks Then they come to set they do their thing and then they go back home again But then they have to isolate again for another two weeks and production has to pay for almost if I'm not correct all of that So as we saw with the final final episode, they were cutting so many fucking corners in terms of budget Like they couldn't even give Dean blood as he's dying like they gave it a little bit on his back But if he's supposedly dying he should have been like from the mouth to But And then the masks to the vampires weren't wearing masks because of a COVID They was just because they didn't want to do the CG effect that that a hundred percent why they did that Oh, yeah, and like a whole concept of the vampire mimes just For a finale that aggravates me a lot just because I feel like yeah It's like Sam and Dean like have been fighting vampires all their life But I just feel like for like their last hunt. It should have been demons Yeah, or like something I don't know That's Cuz like on one hand It's like supposed to show us how like they take away the God how like they don't have the God armor anymore Which even then that's kind of like leaving a lot up into interpretation That doesn't like I Don't know. I feel that it I Understand what he was trying to signify with like the ordinary rebar, but it is It's a bit of a stretch in terms of what they're asking the audience to accept I I honestly Part of me just wants to forget that episode 20 even happened. I'll take episode 19 as the ending of Supernatural Any day over that just cuz I personally feel like you know with With Sam and Dean it's like hard to picture them having a conclusive ending and I feel like if they had left it open Not only could they come back and do a reboot or a movie or something like that in order to like give them a proper ending Not like this But it's just I feel like it would suit their characters more if you know what I mean Just because like we don't have to know what happens until like their very last moment of being alive But on the same hand like I do like the fact that Sam and Dean ended up in heaven together I just don't like how we got to that Oh, well, that was something that I feel like instead of spending 10 minutes with Dean dying from slightly irritating back pain You should have spent more time on Sam like Figuring out his life like yeah, exactly because he yet the episode and or that the part ends on the montage of him Walking up the stairs looking at the room looking super depressed like oh, I guess I'll just go on killing things Uh and then all of a sudden he's got a kid. I was like where the fuck is the transition there? Yeah, and speaking of um before you mentioned Eileen And I under it like um I know that like bringing her back would be like a difficult thing to do But they could have like Done subtle things in order to photoshop her into a photo or some shit Yeah, or maybe even have Sam teach his kid, uh Dean jr Sign language. Yeah, exactly show the faceless wife have him sign or something like that It's just like they have the opportunity to one include her. Yeah to acknowledge that it's her Yeah, and especially to have like representation for people who are hard of hearing Yeah, I make I make that exact comment actually in my essay that's going to be coming um But uh There was something else that oh the other thing that kind of I felt was such a cheap take away was when Bobby said that castiel he brought he brought castiel out of the empty and then they fixed heaven us No No, we didn't even get a voice dub or anything. Well, I figured you should just kill him Don't no like yeah, don't bring him back Again make that sacrifice actually mean something make it that like castiel doesn't exist on any like He's not even in the empty. He's just gone like white from existence my whole issue with um with castiel in this finale is not like uh His confession I felt like was very you know heartfelt and true to his character It's everything that happened after that. Um because you know he disappears. He doesn't matter. Yeah and you know Dean maybe mentions it once and It's never addressed again until you know They it just never gets addressed and he isn't even in the finale, which is something that I've I I take issue with the fact that castiel wasn't in the finale just because I feel like as a um one of the main Obviously, I know that like with covet. It's really hard to get more actors on set So I try to keep that in mind, but sam dean cast right If that like the show has been about Family and like the family that they make that isn't their blood family And it just kind of felt like If supernatural if I watched the first episode of supernatural I could tell you exactly what I could like the ending would be Because it just kind of threw 15 years of character development out the window And because you don't even get a name drop of like half of the people Oh, I feel bad for um, oh for Kim Rhodes For her uh for oh man. Why am I blanking on her nat? Why am I blanking on her name right now her character's name jody jody there we go Yeah jody I I you have no idea what happened to jody last time you saw her she technically poofed Yeah, same thing with like all the apocalypse world people. Oh that that just Uh, what's felicia day felicia day never came back Alternate bobby never came back like it was it he I think that when dab did the whole apocalypse thing and he brought the people over he's like Oh, wait a minute. I actually have to do something with them. Ah, you know what fuck it. I'm just gonna forget about him I yeah, no it there was so much opportunity for season 15 to actually have things but instead they focused on I don't know. I've actually to be honest I've have In speaking with people like on this show that I worked on not only was the makeup department part of it But there was some ad's that were actually on the show one of them actually in fact was an ad who had been on the show for Literally half of its existence And he did come up to me to ask me was like, oh, what did you think of the last episode? He thought he asked me about 19 and I was like Oh But um I've heard a lot of different interesting stories that I I don't want like or I really want to preface. There's no It's just from what I've heard from these people which admittedly there's a lot Like the word of mouth passes very very strongly in the in the film industry, but Apparently Jared and Jensen actually had a lot more creative control than what I've from then from what we've seen Um, they are the reasons why the show is going on as long as it was um, apparently also that and then uh It was robert singer and then who said we're done We don't want to make this show anymore and you're not going to get anyone who's going to want to continue to kind of I hate to say the word but feed your ego um But yeah, it was It kind of was a little bit tumultuous at the end of the show like there was that one episode What was the one I hated the most last call? Which was essentially a giant homage to Jensen eckles like the episode was all about him and his beer and singing and whatnot And I was like, this isn't a supernatural episode. This is a Jensen eckles tribute episode see I um You know with the narrative that that's been kind of pushed in the fandom from what I was aware of was that um Jensen and Jared didn't really have a say in what happened in the end of the show and that it was their decision to come to it but I I actually didn't know that You tell me it's kind of like it's it from what it's Well, because it was a very contained family like there was what was it? Some people had been working on that show not there wasn't many left who had started at the beginning But there were some who had been like the transport crew apparently were the same team for four like the last 11 years Um, there was grips and lx departments that have been working on that show for 10 plus years Um, and a lot of them were like, well, what the hell did we do after this? But that's why that that's feeling of kind of I would make the comment in the ladders And how the seasons went on like it just felt like it was getting lazier or more more complacent Like there wasn't as much interesting camera work Like I'm seeing from the first four seasons so far is there was a lot more effort put into it Yeah, and it just kind of was like, oh, let's go to work do the thing and go home um But once you go when you go on for something like that long Complacency is going to happen whether you want it to or not It's um, you know, I yeah I I agree with that throughout like the seasons like the show has gone on longer. You can tell that the effort that they put into Everything, uh, you know the story and the camera shots and all that stuff. It's like they have like The opportunities to do so much more with it And like especially with this last I what where my issue mostly is is the last episode. That's where I um You know, I could like swallow all of season 15 and the entire In like the entirety of supernatural had The last episode not been what it was Yeah, I I find it funny that it was like I I remember saying was like I think this this is going to this show Is going to end with the brothers dying I didn't think it would be that way like dean. I was anything correct, but sam I was not um, but I don't know the There are some like there's some elements. I don't mind like I think the part where when dean all of a sudden says You remember when I came and got you from your dorm Like I saw that throughout that entire scene that I was balling my eyes The first part of it was just like, oh god. He's so hammy. Oh And then he said that it's like, oh Hey, that's relatable because he said I was scared. I was too. I was scared to ask you for your help But then and then there's like, okay, you can go now and then he's like by sam and I would just remember going So it was so hammy um But I don't know like the pie thing was It's it's hard to kind of talk about dean dying for the third time and having it mean something like And I say third time like I'm meaning legit legit death Because he legit died in three. He legit died in 10. Sorry nine, which um something that I keep going back to when I'm doing my essay is How he died in season nine is technically how he should like that's how he should have died in season 15 They're just trying to regurgitate that death Very poorly Yeah, um, I get that because I I feel like with um, I don't When I was thinking about like what the supernatural finale would entail of I knew that I was gonna be hurt And I knew there was gonna be things that I wouldn't like about it and there was gonna be things that I like loved about it um And with like dean's death I just kind of felt like that was a cop out because there were You know, they could like you said before like they could have had chuck come in maybe like I don't know. I don't really think Chuck could like really hurt sam and dean but like if well without his powers, but like They could have brought him in and like I don't know made something that like follows the like what they just dealt with off season instead of just Oh, they die on a vampire hunt and it's I've always pictured The like their death if they were going to die. I wanted them to die together just because You know, sam is my favorite character and him having to live His whole life without his brother really got to me um, just just because uh They both deserved so much better and they both like basically fought for this um freedom that You know, they've been fighting for like basically all of their life and they finally got it and then like A week later dean gets killed on a fucking screw So they could have gone out something like butch debt Butch Cassidy and the Sundance kid like gone out blazing like I feel that would have I almost think that could have been an ending and in itself on that Yeah, like if if they had gone out in a way that was like, um I don't know say like it wasn't like four vampires, but it was like 30 Or something like that then like sam and dean don't really have that much of a chance against like 30 vampires But like if they just cut the screen in the black Then then like we'd know what happened. Yeah, they went out fighting. Yeah, that as well as what was something else You, uh, I think you were in in your comp in your list of things to talk about You think that if jack was had become what he was don't you think he would have rid the world of monsters? Yeah, so that was something that um, you know when I think about um I this kind of feels like a chuck ending. You know what I mean? um like tragic so I think that like if jack was to become god Why did he bring back cast? Why did he leave all of these monsters still there for sam and dean? He fixes he fixes heaven, but that's it Yeah, and he says hands off, but he's clearly not hands off Mm-hmm. So I don't know. I thought it was I again though like for three three years of building up a character who was essentially a child um I don't know. I just I never got behind the the the jack thing. I just It I felt I kept waiting for the character to have like an actual importance above being What he was and it always teased at it and then like, oh This is it. This is what you've been like, I don't know if you would actually been building towards this with with chuck I think that you Had an idea and you're like, oh shit But then again dab proved over the years that he didn't have a consistency in terms of keeping to the ideas that he had um he couldn't he was almost like a A dog like that could easily be distracted by something else I felt that Thanks for watching the video My name is nitz and you might remember me from the animated cult classic tv show undergrads It's been a while But i'm happy to say the click is finally getting back together in an all-new movie Thanks to a successful Kickstarter campaign But we are still asking for your support to see any and all updates about the upcoming undergrads movie Be sure to check out and like the bring back undergrads facebook page and with any luck. We'll see you guys soon