 The other thing is that the venue for over half the sessions is in New York Historical or Museum of City New York or Brooklyn Museum are and we do with the museum educator do gallery walks So they actually have and which is nice to live in a big city like that Because the point of doing that is for them to see the image in its own And usually some of them are huge. They have no idea how big they are They see details that they couldn't see even in the picture in America blow-ups But secondly that they bring the youngsters back for field trips and the museum educators and Brian and I try very hard to adopt and to model a rigorous method of looking at Images whether it's a photograph or sometimes we use the quadrant where you you know have the Piece of paper and you're only going to move it and look at this and that's good for kids and good for teachers too Because their eyes naturally are drawn to the central figure usually and they We tend to jump to conclusions without looking carefully So what do you see and then what does it mean and what is the evidence for that defend your conclusion? One of the things that is nice about our unlike other aspects of teaching history it seems to lend itself to talking about feelings and What do you see in that migrant mother in Dorothea Lang's picture and what is the evidence that that you see shame or? Or pride or desperation, you know specifically talk about how The photograph shows that or the painting so that's a lot fun. What does it mean and Then one of the questions and we work with good historians and good art historians who? Know that one of the things that even in their field is What don't we know and So it isn't like here's all the answers. I'm going to pour into your head But if it's really a good historian or a good art history person they talk about things that are That are unknown that there's two or three or four different schools of thought about that's possible He posed it that way because and what do you think we don't just take the teachers to the museum? So oh, it's great. We're increasing their content knowledge We're increasing their content knowledge we're building their pedagogy But now we're bringing up a place where they could bring their students to and that's their local institutions They're really good institutions and they've got the training to do it now They go there and it brings it all together nicely from the professors to the And Phil and I to the museum educators to the teachers and all the way down to the students