 Thank you for staying with us. You're still watching the breakfast on Plus TV Africa And now NMP CL has pledged to produce two million barrels of crude oil daily Joining us to discuss all of this is Nick Agouli the public a public affairs analyst. Good morning, Nick Thank you for joining us Thank you Okay, so let's just get straight to the crux of the matter NMP CL has pledged to produce two million barrels of crude oil daily As of right now, we are currently producing about 1.35 million barrels Can we get to two million barrels so quickly that they are pledging for that at the moment? Nick, we need to clarify the statement of the NMPC because Uh, it doesn't seem to be right The 1.3 million that you have quoted Is Nigeria's crude oil production That is not NMPC's crude oil production is Nigeria's crude oil production meaning the entirety of the production in Nigeria Uh by all the upstream operators in Nigeria including the international oil companies the indigenous operators and the NMPC itself So when NMPC says we are going to produce two million barrels of crude oil per day they needed to clarify whether the two million barrels is Nigeria's crude oil production Or this is crude oil that will be produced by the NMPC itself because The last time I checked I was actually trying to check correct numbers You know, uh, so I don't have current numbers, but the last time I was aware the NMPC as a company We're producing around about 150 000 barrels of crude oil per day through their upstream entity which was called the national petroleum development Nigerian petroleum development company That was the name of the of the upstream as uh as a company in the NMPC And that upstream company the headquarters is in Benin or Saple Road. I know them very well, you know So so that that that was NMPC production. The last time I needed was about 150 000 So when they say they are going to produce two million barrels I am saying is it the NMPC that want to grow their production from 150 000 barrels to two million barrels? Or they are referring to Nigeria's production Currently at about 1.3 million 1.4 million barrels to two million barrels. So I think uh, we need to ask the NMPC to clarify what they mean here because it's not it's not very clear Let us at this point assume that it is going to be the totality of what is produced in Nigeria Remember that the OPEC gave Nigeria a quota that they have not been able to meet and all that So we are worried that okay now that they're projecting two million barrels per day in 2024 What were the problems in the first place that made them not able to get to that Benchmark that was given to them by by OPEC and then How are they addressing them? Are they all going to be able to address them so much so that they are going to have two million barrels per day in 2024? You are in the oil sector Enlighten us. Do you think the problems that made them not able to produce uh up to the quota that was given to them Will totally disappear in 2024 and enable them get to 200 million uh two million barrels per day It's a very valid question and You know I think Nigeria has a real budget problem Which we're not even talking about because our OPEC quota was 1.7 million barrels Lat year or this year that were We're finishing and we couldn't meet up without OPEC quota. So for 2024 OPEC has slashed our quota down to 1.3 At 1.38 million barrels meanwhile Nigeria's budget Is predicated on 1.7 million barrels of crude oil production every day. I think it's 1.78 million barrels every day at 77 dollars per barrel oil price And if we cannot grow our production To 1.7 million barrels, which is the valid point that you are making here that what magic Is going to be at play to enable us add 400 000 barrels of kudo air production every day To the numbers that we're currently churning out to enable us to meet up with the budgetary provision If we can't foresee that happening then it means that Nigeria's 2024 budget is already in crisis Because if we cannot generate the revenue To fund the budget Then two things have to happen. You see that we will not implement the budget fully Or we have to go and borrow again to fund the budget so The question is that at 1.3 million barrels now. What is going to happen? If we have to grow production to 1.78 million barrels Given my experience in the way it does. I mean I work in the way it does over 20 years here in Nigeria and overseas I know it is possible given the capacity that we have Let's not forget This country Nigeria Produced over 2 million barrels of kudo air per day previously I used to work for share in Nigeria and at the time I worked for share In the in the late 90s into the 2000s Share alone as a company Produce over 1 million barrels of kudo air per day share alone We want to talk about all the other operators So it means we have the capacity Installed for us to grow production to 2 million barrels The question is that is the government courageous enough sincere enough To face the issues that are militating against our producing 2 million barrels If they are yes, we can achieve it But if they are not and they continue to pay lip service To the issues they were not going to be able to achieve that because as we speak today the government itself Acknowledges that about a million barrels of kudo shun has been stolen. You know So the government addressed that situation and said look You will steal one barrel of kudo air and will fix an appointment With god for you Tell the the statement of kudo air will stop We have a Nigeria with with the armed forces. We have the army the navy We have the the the the the air force Who are who are should be taken over by chief or different staff each of these armed forces have a chief And then the chief of defense staff is dead. Then we have we have Nigeria security are simple difference. We have police. We have a di a we have m i a We have all sorts of security apparatus in Nigeria and yet We have to turn to a private security firm To come and provide security to our oil installations You know in a way that suggests that low this entire architecture because let's not forget Even this budget that we're talking about Defense carries the highest chunk of the budget Every year year in year out this time around 70 you know, so We spend money On security and the security is not being provided So we now have to spend more money to go and bring in a private security firm to come and police our oil infrastructure This is what i'm talking about sincerity in government because i know that if president wants to deal with Once and for all the issues in our oil industry in Nigeria He can do so But he has to be prepared to take on the powers that be Those who are behind the stealing of this crude oil those who Are sponsoring this people those who are they are covered he has to be ready to say between you guys And nigerias I am going to start with Nigeria. So business as usual has ended Is a precedent ready to take on this fight? That is the million dollar question I want to say million dollar Let me say that's one billion naira question that is on the table Okay, so since we're on the premise of NMPCO might not be the one producing all of this Crude oil which is 1.35 Yes, they're about Dangote is about to produce as well and dangote is producing fuel not not Yeah, yeah Okay, but then with the fact that dangote is coming in as well Is there a possibility that dangote might start to produce to help or are there are there going to be other? Companies who would come to ensure that we can also Produce this quota that we have of about two million of course Nigeria's oil and gas industry is very effective to investors globally if We now is too very much attractive to investors globally But before I even make one comment. I think there is something I would like to say You know the nmpc is the biggest problem in the nigeria's oil and gas industry We speak about this thing all the time A little nigeria has actually even think that nmpc is a regulator. It's some sort of government company I may say it's a regulator of the oil industry A lot of nigeria don't understand that the regulator of the oil industry used to be the department for petroleum resources dpr That is not defunct with the passage of the petroleum film industry art The department of petroleum resources is now being split into two So there is a regulator for the upstream business Which is the upstream commission? And then there's a regulator for the downstream business Which is the downstream authority? So I have a commission regulating upstream an authority regulating downstream the nmpc is actually a player I mean, let me let me use the central bank. Uh, so that maybe nigeria can get this better The banking sector is regulated by the central bank. So the central bank That is a regulator The central bank is regulating the zenith banks the gt banks the fidelity banks the union banks the first banks the uba In the oil industry The equivalent of the central bank in the oil industry is not the nmpc It is the upstream commission For upstream and the downstream authority for downstream the nmpc is just like zenith bank It's just like uba. It's just like Fidelity bank or name any bank the nmpc is a player in the oil industry It's a company that should be making profit for nigeria But what the nmpc has done Which president should be looking into things like this is Why the nmpc so imagine imagine that if let me go back to banking to make it very clear for nigeria so imagine that in the government of nigeria owns a bank That is competing with zenith and union bank or call it nigeria owned bank Instead of nigeria owned bank Making their own profit and using it to pay their staff And pay all their costs what they do is that They go and gather the profit of zenith bank union bank uba everything into their own account And then the last time using that money to pay their staff when their staff themselves are producing little or nothing This is what is happening in the oil industry and i hope This analogy is painting the true picture of what is happening because the nmpc as a company Instead of producing their own kudo air producing their own gas Refining their own kudo air and doing all that they are not doing any of those things The nmpc have been spending humongous money exploring for kudo air in the northern nigeria since i was born They have been exploring for kudo air northern nigeria. They have not succeeded in producing One single barrel of kudo air in the world of northern nigeria if they have our needs to contradict me Even in the southern nigeria the nigeria data where they are like i said the last time their production was officially 150,000 barrels per day This nmpc without doing much Now go to take the kudo air produced by chevro by mobile by chair And then they sell it when they sell it they bring the money into the nmpc They spent the money into the nmpc It is what is left that they now transfer to To the federation account and as we know for a long time now they have not been putting much in the federation account The question is that how we share And mobile and chevro give nmpc the kudo air that they are producing the reason is because Chevro share mobile all those international oil companies in nigeria are running joint ventures with the government of nigeria So like i worked in chevro i know that the government of nigeria owns 60 percent of that job venture And chevro 40 percent i work for share i know Nobody's telling me i know that the government of nigeria Owns 55 percent of that job venture and then for the 45 percent used to be owned by Three international oil companies who they have almost sold to indigenous operators now So what happens is that if chevro produces one million barrels of kudo air 600 000 belongs to the government of nigeria Why 400 000 belongs to chevro corporation in the u.s The nmpc goes to take that 600 000 barrels from chevro and says it And then they take the money into the nmpc so he Hey If it's a government bank going to uba to go and take A money that uba is making on behalf of government Then they put the the the process in the nmpc they sell it And then They now spend the money on themselves It returns you to know that the nmpc is paying some of the the highest salaries In nigeria and the monies are not coming If from the revenues that they are generating the monies are coming from the crude oil produced on behalf of nigeria By international oil companies in jump venture with the government of nigeria and the nigerian people consequently And they are spending this money If president in the book is interested in reforms In the oil industry the first thing he must do is to take the nmpc away From the crude oil that is being produced for nigeria by the international oil companies Remove any pieces hands from it If president in the book is he can create a department in the presidency Or even in the minister of petroleum and say you are the one responsible for taking the crude oil from chevro From shell from total from a jeep from from Mobile and selling it on behalf of the government wants to sell it put the money straight into the federation account So that the nmpc should either swim or sink On their own oil They should they should cook their own because you see if the nmpc were not taking the crude oil produced for nigeria by these IOCs The nmpc would have long been bankrupt Either they would have been bankrupt or they would have become more serious More serious in the sense that they have four refineries that as we speak are refining zero Paris or crude oil They needed to get the refineries to be working so that they can make money and pay their staff If they don't refine the staff get nothing But right now they don't refine as they are doing now The the oil coming from the IOCs is they are feeding them So this is one message that president in the book must take on board Remove the nmpc which is a clear business away from nigeria's share of job venture crude oil production Let the nmpc work for themselves and pay their salaries That is the first thing that president in the book must do And then subsequently we'll answer your question whether we can close this production Like I say we have capacity for two million barrels that capacity is still on the ground We only need to take certain steps to unlock it like if we deal with security we won't lock it if we Deal with the Okay, so that's another problem. I want to talk about Because let's say using the chevron job venture the government has 60 percent of the job venture Chevron want to spend one billion dollars to produce oil Nigerian government must bring six hundred million dollars One chevron corporation us will bring four hundred million dollars because Nigeria is finding it difficult to fund the job venture You find that a chevron's program is not being operated and that is the safety with all the other It is in shell immobile in total energy panel of that So if the government is not bringing the money Then they plan to produce more oil in Nigeria is stored So if the government decides that Instead of funding these job ventures You don't privatize the whole thing let private sector bringing the money Do the work I as a government will be responsible I mean we will only be interested in taking the taxes that come from this It will be so much investment in the sector and what are we talking about two million barrels? Can we talk about three million barrels? Even five If we allow private sector investment to actually invest in Nigeria without this interference from government Well, I wish we had more time to discuss this because it's really a turning issue But at this time we need to really wrap up And Nick would like to thank you for being a part of our program. We may continue this discussion some other time But for now, this is where we drop it. Thank you so much for being a part of the show Amen Okay, let's take a short break and when we return we'll be talking about what is happening in river state stay with us