 Actually, it's unlisted, but we have a new Wi-Fi on the roof of the Amar building, so people can come and use it. We're testing that, which is pretty cool. All right. Well, good. Let's give it a go. Let's give it a go. Are you just getting some sort of like here up, or what do you get, Aiden? Yeah, mostly there on the close-ups, and then I will go to a Y. All right. I know it's a little loud with the cars, but... It's a little loud, but it's urban. We're in the city. Yeah. Well, it turns way louder than bad, apart from how you used to do it. It used to be a drug dealing building right here where we're sitting. Oh, really? This was a building. Oh, here it was at. It was probably knocked down in about 1991 or two. You were here already, right? Yeah. All the drug dealing... And it's not even like, you know, there's the mayor of the city hall. Yes, right. All right, so... I'm ready. I can give you a countdown. So, am I all right like this? Yes, you look great. Yep. All right, you all set? Yep. All right. So, in five, four, three... Hello, this is Bruce Wilson, and I'm here with my guests. We'll talk about our guests in a few minutes, but I was going to welcome everyone to Street Talk Promont Show. We haven't done one in a long time, but finally we got something to talk about. You know, we got our group. And Brian's going to help me talk about it. And this show's topic is youth on boards, on city boards, particularly Burlington city boards. So, I want to welcome our guests, Brian Pine, city councilor of Burlington, the man. Thank you, Bruce. The man. Good to be with you. Thank you, sir. Yeah. Thank you for joining us today, you know. He's probably the only... Maybe he's another city councilor or something who knew about youth on boards that we kind of created in 2003 with the help of you and some other city councilors. Jane was on it. Jane O'Dell. You might. Jane O'Dell. Joan Shannon was on it. And then Peter Clavel signed off on it. And who else on the person? Kevin Curley was on that. Oh, Kevin? Kevin Curley. Wow. He signed off on it, too, didn't he? Yep, he did. Awesome guy. You had tri-partisan support. Well, you know, back then in 2003, you know, we actually created Youth on Boards in 2001. And our Youth on Boards was youth... Well, we created Youth on Boards for Arrow because the service for India incorporated. But we also... Youth on Boards was through our Youth Advisory Council, which were students from every high school in Chitty County. And we had... Yeah, every high school in Chitty County as well as Rutland County is in Rutland. Yeah. And actually in Fairhaven, too. So all these Youth on Youth on Boards from high schools around were very strong on making sure that their peers and community understood that you had a voice and that they need to be heard. And that in everything that, you know, I think everything that we're doing today is for those youth, you know, particularly the high school kids that we work with. And I'll tell the high school kids what they're doing is for their little elementary and middle school kids. Right. So we're all working for a common goal. But sometimes these high school kids who have incredible ideas and suggestions are overlooked. They don't even look that young. I'm going to tell you a story, Brian. I'm going to tell you a quick story here. Right. So I would take part of the youth service providers and move them along the state with other youth nonprofits that work for you. And I love them all. But when I go to these meetings, like we had these big meetings down at the Montpere, Capitol Plaza, our hotel and whatever, and youth will be on our agenda item. It will be the agenda item. And nobody brings youth to the meetings. I bring youth to every meeting that have youth in the Idaho. And I will tell my youth, like last time we did this a week, I had youth at Rutland. And they had all those wonderful people there. And then they were talking about the events. They were doing about Shannon and me. And then Shannon and some of the events that they had. It was one person, Bruce, one person. We had nice dance, 50 people came. Which I thought was incredible. You know, one person and a man. Where there's no drugs, not going to go out for the safety. It's a place of the outlet. How big is that? It's a winner. It's a winner. It's a winner. So they asked me, Bruce, we know you had a big dance. But how many people come in here? Because Shannon tell them, you know. And Shannon was like crawling under the table. Kind of like, oh no, no. And I said, they said, what's wrong? Oh, they didn't go too good. And she said, no, they didn't go well. You know, we told her, we told her, all right, the rest of the youth board said, we're not going to show our face no more around. They said, well, how many kids came? She said, 185. 185. You hiding underneath the table. And she said, yeah. They said, what, why? She said, well, we're going to get over 300. You know what I mean? You know, so because they work with, we work with all of them. Like, you know, she's working out, rather than high school, real rivers, out of queen. And so, so it was funny. It's funny because my point is, like, it's not my job to, to venture here on the area. It's their job to do it. And my job is insurance for the building, get the building, get the security, get the, you know, make some money. Make some money. That's my job. And so, that's what I've been telling a lot of people for years. That this youth kind of, you know, there's that job to meet their own people. And so, and I mean, when I heard that, I like, I shook my hand, you know, because I knew that that's why you need to be on boards and help make the decisions about the things that even anybody does. So, Brian, so here we are. We're going to do this again. You want to explain a little bit what we're going to do. Sure. Yeah, we are. City Council has a lot of pressing items right now because of COVID and the city budget. And we have to make some, some key appointments and some decisions around those issues. But we always, I think, have the ability to carve out some time for issues maybe that don't have, like, a deadline. And this is one where we could put this off for some period of time, or we could just, you know, take it on and try to address it and, you know, decide and resolve to move on. And so, I think the youth on boards idea is, well, personally for me, it's so, it has so much power to tap into our young people because young people bring their energy, their ideas to the process. We benefit from them, and they benefit from that experience. So it's a true win-win. You know, it's an opportunity to give young people a meaningful voice in the way our community is operating and structuring, structuring things. So I think that this is, you know, there's really no downside to this. What we want to make sure is when we bring youth on board that we do it in a way that gives them the support to be meaningfully involved, not just to be a person sitting at the table. It's one thing to make sure you have a seat at the table, but to be able to act and speak up and use your voice sometimes takes a little bit of support. And so I just want to make sure that we do this in a way that builds the skills of our young people so they feel that their voice is both effective and is being heard and that's really important. So I think that's a key thing. And I think that, that's a measurement from the youth on board that we created in 2003 is that they really didn't have their own, they didn't use their own, they had it, but they didn't use their own voice to create youth in the island for themselves. They like, you know, like just imagine yourself or I imagine myself on a finance committee, right? And I've got 900 pages of numbers and then people are talking around me about, you know, this dollar go here, this dollar go there. And I know nothing, but then at the end of the day so I like, I don't have really no comments. I just maybe vote on it. A vote, the youth on board didn't have a vote, a real vote, a real counting vote. And so this time I think we both we are on the same page is that our youth create their own agenda item, you know, if you want to find this committee and then you see five dollars somewhere actually in the budget. Figure out how you can use it within your school to buy an art supply or something, or video equipment, right? Right, right. I think the some of these vehicles are loud. The most excited about Bruce is your commitment to not try and speak for young people but to create opportunities for them, spaces for them to be able to heck, realize their own voice and develop their own voice and their own identity. So I think that's really important and I think that's what we can do here. What we need to, you know perhaps engage young people in a conversation about is what kind of support is going to be the most beneficial, the most effective in helping you serve in this role and have it be something that you really feel good about, you know, making an impact. And we have some people we can talk to about that who serve. There were people who served on the school board in the past, people who served on the police commission, the planning commission. I think we should be talking to them to find out how to make sure this is done in a way that, you know, really is more than just, I hate to say the word but I think I should say it, is being a token being that one person. Exactly. We don't want tokens. We're for the subway. They're not good for the boards. We're not going to have that because you know, we're not going to have no tokens, you know, not at all. The thing is too, and I agree with you, is that yes, we need to get to one thing. I have a new board president from Veronica. She's a BHA software and she's been working with us, you know, to help us pull together this meeting for you for the boards for the City of Brooklyn and she came up with a lot of different things. And so she's also have emailed all those people who you talk about who's been on the served on the commission, the police commission and quite things. One of the parks she told me. And so she's already in contact with people with the experience of everything. So she's on it. I give it to Veronica. She's an organizer. She's organized. She's like, Bruce does not do it this way. I'm like, yes, man. I don't mess with none of you, man. They make that thing, you know, they think about it and process it and talk to their peers and figure out who was the best way and who I'm on it. Micromanage them over. I don't do that. So I'm very excited about new form boards through the city. So we're looking at, so you gave us six things that we might be able to present to the City Council. So I don't remember six of them, but do you remember them? What we covered was which boards do we want to focus on? Because as you know, there are several dozen of them. And not everybody's going to be interested in things like the Cemetery Commission, for instance. I don't think so. Although I hear they're dying to get in there. That's a good one, Brad. I grew up in a funeral home, so I have to have those jokes. You gotta have them. But I think the key thing for us to think about is if a young person steps up to serve can we link them to something they're interested in? There will be young people, by the way, who may not be math wizards, but they think of the budget as a document that helps you implement your ideas and your policies. So they may not be that interested in how the numbers add up. Most of us aren't that interested in that, because numbers are numbers. But it's really what those numbers represent in terms of our priorities. So if we set aside priority for senior services and for youth services and how much we're going to spend on supporting our early learning initiative for children who wouldn't have access to good quality childcare and those types of things, that's the kind of stuff I think young people are going to be pretty jazzed about. Yes, I agree with you. So that's the whole thing about it. They need to just be involved and like I told Veronica, you're going to see the whole genesis going to be about all of these 900 pages and finance committee about dollar, gold, park, dollar, so you're going to have that because we've got to keep the city rolling. And you're going to have all these same type of agenda items and all the rest of these private board. But you must create your own agenda, youth agenda item. You can go by, you listen to that and say okay, come up, talk to your friends and figure out what can you do with the Parks and Recs committee. Oh my God. Man, I'm going to have to like throw like, can we do this? Because all things we do at Parks and Recs, you too. Can we do this at the Parks and Recs? But so these type of things that they did do and so I'm excited. I'm excited too. The key thing is we're trying to get is that age group that we often miss and that is right after middle school kids and early high school years and giving them an example of role models and people they can aspire to be kind of like. They can look up to them and say actually that person is very involved in the issue, whatever they care about. Maybe they care a lot about bicycling and they're going to really advocate for bike lanes for instance. And I see that as something a young person can look to another fellow young person and say that's a way that I'd like to get involved when I get to be whatever 17, 18 years old. So you've got to give people a reason to be engaged in the community and to give them an opportunity for that and I think what better way than to get them involved in making local decisions. It's an incredible part of our democracy plus we also hear everyone talking about young Vermonters leaving Vermont and not coming back. We've got to keep them here and one way to keep them here is to make it so that they are genuinely part of our democracy. You don't just vote every few years. You've got to be more than that. And we have a program called United College Club and it's primarily students from UVM, St. Myers, Charleston, North Carolina and Middlebury and we worked since 1999. So we work with them with job, job shally, mentoring, tutoring, internships. I have six interns. But all through the years since 1999 they are like, yeah, I can't wait until next year. No, I've got to go for whatever trade they or field. They got a lot of help here. They got like, you might be able to give jobs to the software engineer or something in IBM or you know, you might be able to get jobs somewhere like that. But not really. You know, if you could do it to a high-fitting like that, you can get a job here. Patience is better than well. Which by the way the trades are dying in Vermont. People entering the trades. So the average age of the trades person is 57 years old. Which means as they age out, you got to place them in new people. Otherwise we've got no people to do the work. And that's what we're facing right now. We're importing people to do those jobs is what's happening. And so that's the problem since 1999. We try to get those college students to stay. We love Vermont. We want to stay. One year or two. We try to get a job in the area we're in. And I'll tell you something. And I still see today is that I see like college students who work at going to school at UVM or one of these colleges. And they work at a restaurant. And you try to get their little money. And so it's how they make their little extra money. And then all of a sudden I still see them. Now they're the manager. They're running the restaurant. Right. They're running the restaurant. Let's say they're in like social work. They got MS, not MS, maybe a BSW or whatever. Working in areas that graduated. Now I got all this bill to pay and they're working in the restaurant they were working at while they were a student at one of these colleges. That pays their bills. Now they're the manager. I don't see them planning to you know four or five years later I still see them planning to work within their degree. I'm like damn. You know what I mean? It bothers me. Because I know they want to be something. They had a dream. Not only they have a dream they got a degree in it. They couldn't actually do it. They couldn't actually do it. They stayed in Vermont. How about that? They couldn't work here in what they wanted to do. So we have we created this program at UVM called Design Your Own Internship. Because it was easier for me to help them do that. People who were my interns because we knew they wanted to be a city council. We worked with community economic development. I talked to Brian. I was like Brian can you talk to this kid about what it tells to do this work. So it got to a point where we knew a lot of people. I can ask you if I didn't know. You know somebody I can talk to for this kid. Absolutely. So we came with Design Your Own Internship. It was so much easier since then. I always said let's help us with some of our stuff. Like you know we want to help you with your goals. Sure. That's what we do. We have we have four kids set awards. It's a big deal. So I said we love kids set awards because you know throw off a little bit. It's for the safety of courts and police and families and schools for the safety of youth and families. That's incredible. That's the most important thing. Man Sally God bless you Sally. I hope you will. I like to think of it as the a friend of mine calls this the conspiracy of goodwill. Yeah. People of goodwill coming together to make sure that we take care of one another. And really the work that I think around this youth on boards idea Bruce is unique because what it says to young people is we don't just want to serve you. We're not here just to serve you. We're here to give you an opportunity to serve your community. We benefit from your voice and your ideas and energy and input. And you may get something from it too. But it's not a one way relationship we're serving them and giving them services. Right. I'm glad you said that because I talked to one thing I talked to want to come out. It's like I don't know how many years we've been working with Bruce High School to provide community service opportunities because they need 10 hours per year 40 hours to graduate. And so within what we're trying to do I want to make sure that high school kids are back on track providing opportunities for these kids and maybe some of these individuals who might want to do their 10 hours with some of these youth board members that would be awesome to pair up like a mentor or a federal. And that's just my idea but I might sit out my mouth and see if we can talk about what we're thinking. You already know that we're going to make sure that we get 10 hours of students involved in some community service projects or something which is what they should do with community service. We don't say go clean up dog crap out the car. We give them meaning, like you said things they might want to do in life over at our arts program or music program or work within our centers or something create an event or something or they come up to me people who graduated from high school and some college still come up to me and ask me can they be a part of something. That's one thing I'm like wow how wonderful is that and so that's the most and I think as you know this is what I get out of it it ain't economics it's not about cash it ain't about the money you've been amazing that way Bruce I've known you've been doing this wow yeah I know it's not about the money it's about when somebody graduated I feel like I graduated because I know what they've been through I know what they were saying well, Charlene Fu was a great stuff, different things said Bruce when she graduated I saw a girl in high school I don't want to go to Middlebury you gotta pop fly from all the colleges but you know she came from China she worked really hard so we need some people she had four point two or three and I'm like so we worked hard to get our letters and the thing and she sent them to the University mall and they picked her up in Middlebury and she was like that's a success story I know there's dozens of those I can go on for a day but what is it, May 10th we're shooting for May 10th let's try and get it done we're shooting for May 10th we're also around new phone boards and basically she's got a key point of what she's going to be saying is how important is it for you to be on boards what she's going to be talking about you need to be more feel more valued and also that you should be yes and I want to make sure we're doing everything we can Bruce to to reach young people who may not normally be reached by these types of programs so I'm thinking I'll just say it aloud the average sort of middle class or every middle class white kid whose parents went to college they're going to get these seats unless we make a special effort to reach out to young lower income kids that kind of thing we've got to make a special effort we can't just put up a sign and say whoever shows up is going to get it that's not the way she agrees with that that's coming to the fire we've not discussed about recruitment for an application process you can call it recruitment how are we going to recruit we feel that we are going to recruit them by using certain events that we do I've got some stuff that's going to be booked out and I've got some other things in Burlington that's going to be working on so I want to this is the way we both said we do can help us get a seat like it's in cafeteria we have figured out but maybe you talk about planning it because they don't have a principal right now acting principal I talked to her she sent me planning it they would welcome you with open arms as far as coming in I just don't know are the students gathering like that I don't know we have to make a special something special we talked about like like giving birth having a special moment a different time we have different types of we have a way of different types of showing up and you're going to get another kid another type of kid so we know how to do it we just got a true we don't want to overwhelm you got a hundred kids showing up right and then you still got to wean it out this person is this dad they they groomed him right exactly that's what I want to make sure we don't just you know and then this kid kind of meets some type of maybe a risky risky kid living in a high risk environment economically challenged we like you a lot but you don't go to school you're not grateful it's cool if you get to talk to youth building try and see if they have something they can reach out to non-traditional programs same with what's scuba hand why is it the one behind bhs all those students are from somewhere else most of them live somewhere else not all of them, there's a few local kids I don't see jay from ever we coached here we both parked together you guys love cj I presented for those kids many many times I bet they learned a lot they're all different things you guys have done we've done some things I had another one those kids are something they are so unique these kids they are so unique they aren't part of a group or any of that you'll see them all 30 kids are all marching to their own drummer wonderful that is so cool I gotta give those kids because I just want to see how can I help them they are so cool time to create something for them all right those kids are something anyways the thing is I'm not gonna we gotta come over to the group that's hard the easy part is just passing resolution that's the easy part the hard work you gotta amend it the application I don't know what to tell you I think it's called application maybe that's what we gotta do I don't know how many questions it's gonna be on it you should probably simplify the one that everybody else right now people are filling them out because it's for all the city boards and commissions are being filled in June and so people are applying like now by the end of the month May month from now applications are due for boards and commissions but this would have to be a different process I'm not sure I'm trying to figure out what how many questions there would not have been at all I think you want to look through what's there now in the application it's online, just use that as the starting point it's online it's in the clerk's office I mean they gotta that's a standard for them yeah it's got most of the information but you can get rid of some of it for the younger people so I don't know I'd like to be able to say this is coming to this kid maybe they you certainly want to turn out a few young people to the May 10 to show support to show there's interest to kind of build a little momentum and then once it passes then the hard work begins you go to places like the boys' curls club you go to King Street you go to all the reach out there yeah they got a new girl I haven't been I've been inside I live right around the corner from that nice building they deserve it they started in 1937 easy for me to remember when they started they've been there that long that's a long time they were like fiscal wages for everybody they did do that for everyone in the beginning they were that's right and Roxanne of course took King Street to a whole new level he took it to another level easy for her yeah when I worked at King Street and I you know Roxanne what's that? and talk to donors and nobody said that's too much nobody would say no I didn't hear nobody say no to her but it was so funny she had me write this grant she started to affiliate herself I just got trained through the Department of Health from HMNA so we went through a program together with Anne King Street so she wanted me to write this grant telling her to write this grant and she gave it back to me in certain areas she had like red exes I was like no she put red exes on it you know because of her I would did she help you that way? of course she wouldn't let a grant go through that it had to be tight the whole thing wasn't red exes I passed I got like a C minus but it was new for me too it was new but I fixed it we got the grant so that was good if it wasn't for Roxanne Leopold and Penrose Jackson I would be doing this for God I love them both so much Penrose you walk in her office downtown Bruce I need you to see you God Penrose won't see me so you walk in there you talk about walking on the carpet her desk is so clean we got a pencil and a pen it's like the most structured person I have ever known man and she is my even though you getting chewed out she's still smiling and you don't feel so bad I mean she's still in love after all that I know but when you're time to go you want to run out of that I'm gonna walk real slow I've talked about her she gave me a little story about that same story you got to love them both so here we are so May we hope for Maytiff we'll present to the city council on Zoom on Zoom right now about Euphorne Boards I mean I know Jack Hanson he was very excited about it I talked to him a long time I was very excited about Euphorne Boards you got lots of you got a lot of we just have to make sure we're putting it together we got to think about how we put it together so before we go maybe I shouldn't say it on there but I'm gonna say it anyway because that's nothing bad everything we do is all good so Brian I'm like oh god Brian so I'm with other cities because I wouldn't know the mayor I said I was gonna tell him about what we're doing and how you can help him with Euphorne Boards and soon when we get done we come to your town and they're like yes so I'm gonna ask you now go to other towns with me of course that's a given I'll help you with that thank you folks come on bring it on I'm meeting with David Henry the vice-chair of the city council I think with maybe this mayor talk to city manager before she's moving on to be city manager in South Burlington Jesse Baker, she's phenomenal you've got to talk to her there's nobody who hasn't thought about every aspect of the Muruski city government you got to remember I'm a commissioner I've already talked to her she let me get into Euphorne so she starts in July she goes in the office in June 1st and then she starts in July Kevin Doan was our guy the city of South Burlington adopted us and the city council they put it in late they gave us money to run our program so I know she's gonna be in South Burlington they're next this is only a spark because of the redevelopment of Muruski the good step for her damn good step I'm proud of her I told her I was proud of her so I'm meeting with the vice-chair her son was on my youth court he was on my youth court and I spent years two years on the union you go to the University you better go to Euphorne for free save up your money for graduate school but go there for free that's it you're not gonna go there he was like you're gonna take your part in the EVM good school too college program. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, there we go. All right. So, Aiden's given us 30 minutes. So, we used it up? Yeah, I think so. Did we use it up? You're good? Yeah, you keep going. Yeah, just like to get us wrapping here. We're just wrapping down. Well, we're going to ask you some questions about, we talked about, I think we covered as much as we can, and that's going to come up. Yeah. Yeah. About you, for sure. We covered that. Yeah. So, let's talk about what's going on with Burlington City. What's going on with, what's happening? City Place? Downtown? Well. Is that what you're referring to? Yeah, City Place. Okay, City Place. So, the City Council had to sort of revise the agreement we have between the developer and the city, and that happened back in March. We revised that agreement. So, the ball is in their court to move through the process. So, they went through the process means you got to get a new zoning permit, because it's a different project. It's not the same project. So, when they went to get the zoning permit, they got it. But some people filed an appeal. So, that appeal is what they're dealing with right now. And I actually think that most of the appeal is centered on the debate about how much parking is enough parking. Like 10 more spaces, right? No, I think the original plan was for quite a bit more parking. The original plan? The original plan. But it's a much smaller project now. Right. So, and this is just an instinct. The city's rules around parking have changed dramatically. You don't have to provide in the downtown, we decided most cities are doing this now. Let the developer build how much parking they believe is right for what they're doing on the building. So, the city essentially lets the developer determine the level of parking needed. And that is the issue that's really, I think, you know, the disagreement right now is over whether that new rule for parking should apply, or whether they should require to meet the parking requirements of the old rule. Well, the old rule's gone. The reality is if we're going to move away from reliance on just the automobile, and we're going to have people walk and use the bus and ride their bikes and all that stuff, you've got to get out of the car. And if you have every single household owning two cars, right, we're done. We can't go that way. We can't do that. A lot of young people, by the way, don't want to own a car. No, they don't. They don't. It's a waste of money. It's a huge amount of money. That's why a lot of those houses love to stay here. That's right. Because they can walk all around, you know. Like they'll walk down from UVM downtown to have a social, you know. Yeah. So that's the big issue there. So I'd say it's stuck in a legal battle right now between some people in the community who decided together to sue them and the developer. That's where it's at right now. It's not the city stopping them. So some people that decided they want to sue them are, for day one, they didn't want to have nothing. They thought that project wasn't going to be, they should do it. There are some. I'd say that's a small number. That's pretty small. That same because they're suing them. No, I'd say some, the number of people who want nothing there is a very small group. Yeah, well, I'm not going to go there today because it's already been passing everything. All I'm trying to say is that, you know, I've been in Vermont since 89. And if you want to go skiing or, or you go like south, right, if you want to see the foliage, you go south. You know, you go, oh, look at the foliage. You're not going to find those things in Burlington. Sure, you're not looking for them. They're not looking for them. You see, would you look for them? It's like fishing, the marathon. The jazz fest. Jazz fest. Right. You said it, right. You dress all up. Festival fools. Festival fools. Yes, all that stuff. Yeah. So you're looking for that. And you're also looking for, like, where I'm from, Chicago, the largest city in the state to provide the most economics. Sure. That is going to bring in the money. That's the girl with the job, bringing the money, bringing the money, bringing the money. So whatever it takes, I mean, you know, you don't go all, you know, it's too early. I can ski. You got to stay up to times. Right. You got to stay, you know, you got to be open for business, but you don't want to be up for sale. Right. Yeah. No doubt. That's the difference. No doubt. Right. We're open for business, but we're not for sale. And like, you know, you got to keep our everything, our infrastructure good. You got, you know, like, like, like some parts of, um, somewhere in Arizona, southern part of, you know, Burma, they still don't have a Burmese school, you know, whatever, whatever, Burmese, I mean, Burma, she's got to have it all. Bam, bam. And then here's a project who bring in economics to the city. 420 new housing units. Vitalizing the downtown marketplace, man. Oh my God. If you got to spot downtown, you can't, you can't wait, you can't wait. And then they talk about, I don't know if you guys think about doing what you need to plan. Open up Cherry Street all the way down because, you know, that'd be perfect. It needs a lot of work, right? You just need to open it up down to the waterfront. You know what I mean? Because it's a lot of things going to happen. That's been a dream for a long time. That's an old dream. Yeah, I know. But um, Joe Cardin and them were like, please do it. You know, they ready for it. And so it was like in Pittsburgh, they got these, they're like elevators almost. You get inside and you go down to the waterfront. Oh, yeah. That's what somebody said that we said they call, they call them the finiculars. Finiculars. Finiculars. Yeah. I know still, um, what do you call it? The gondola. They had a like, put the gondola on it. That'd be awesome. But you know, the whole thing is that, with that project, it's going to bring like, you know, they got green space. It's an L-E-E-D project. You know more about it than most people know. That's the story. Yeah. Well, I know most about it because some of the people are on my advisory. Sure. You know, and so while I'm following, I presented here on their behalf like four or five times and brought you to talk about what they do for nonprofits like us. You know what I mean? Um, and, um, by the way, so I was trying to, to one of our peoples at Davos Investors who always like help us out. I'm like, you know, we need this many, this many dollars better than that, you know? He's like, Bruce, Bruce, how mad is that? I just made $240,000 to the city. And so I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, damn, how much money. I get this guy like, I got five dollars. So I'm glad all that's over. You know, I, you know, I got a car. There's no battle between the city and the developer right now. It's really some of the residents. There's a handful of people, five or six people filed an appeal and they're allowed to do that. That's the process. It'll go through the process probably this summer, maybe sooner. Yeah. And they have a, they're ready to go. That would have incredible investors. Oh my God. They got, they got the incredible investors. They really do. They ain't, they ain't not joking. They got, and good thing about a lot of them from, they are from the bottom. Man, they got, whoo, that's the thing's got to go up. Like, I remember when at first I've been working with these guys since 2013, probably around the time they started doing the development. And we were just talking and laughing about it when we got to the problem and like, Bruce, one of their owners, like, Bruce. In Chicago, if it makes sense on paper, you know, and everything is economically and in the Indian, you see everything coming up for the community around it. You just dig the damn hole and you start building. I see you right here. So we always, we always be laughing much unique that way. I still, Brahmars like to think we're still kind of a small town. Yeah. Yeah. Well, not that you can't think small in your larger cities. Okay, where you are. Yeah. Even, you know, even Mayberry, Mayberry, you know, like with Andy and them, they, they were bigger than the rest of the town. Right. The rest of the town. Right. They were still, they had the big building, the court building, the, you know, the, you know, the, they still were bigger than the rest of their small little. Hold on. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So without, you know, so people gotta think like that. Right. You know, if they, I mean, what could, you know, they didn't, didn't people say about the height? You can't see over things. Well, the building was going to be 14 stories. Now it's 10. So that's not a big, that's not as big an issue. It's just not as big an issue because 10 stories is a louder than the old zoning. So the zoning changed and allowed them to go taller. In the end, they didn't need it. I know. I changed it all. Yeah. Yeah. I was like, I got 12. I said, you got changed all of this. Yeah. You know, but so, you know, the thing about this, it's a lot of like, I mean, when do you think it's going to start building, man? Good Lord. I have no prediction because it's all right. You're part of the court. Yeah. You know, I don't have no idea. I have no idea. I have no idea if the judge is taking, you know, evidently taking testimony now or where they're at right now. I mean, it's in what's called the environmental court. So that's where we'll get decided. It's very obvious that, you know, that if the parking is under old rules, old rules, old rules are gone. Yeah. Not an effect. Right. So I mean, someone's making an argument there and it's just a legal issue to apply what set of rules get applied. You know, so that's the issue. And I think the judge needs to, that's what they're going to be deciding is what rules apply to the project. Old rules or the current rules? It sounds like it'd be like a stalled process. I can't see them winning that. Oh, how in the world can you win that? How can other people win that? No, no, I never went to law school. Yeah, I don't know how you can win that. I can't say. How can you win that? Do you want to eat the end to your neck? Yeah, okay. Somebody. Somebody, anybody. How do you win that? If you're down to 10 stories and you were at 14 stories, 90 down to 10 stories and so you don't need 14 stories worth of parking, you only need 10. So that's less, a lot less. I don't know how many units are on the floor. There's a total of like 420 units and there's about 420 spaces for parking. So they're arguing that it's not enough because the ground floor, the ground floor would be retail shops. But in retail, if you're really a retail shopper, you're probably using the parking garage anyway. So you're around the corner, Lakeview Garage, the one that serves, you know, the old Macy's, the garage, that one. Yeah. Well, they own that one too, right? They don't own the garage. The city owns the garage. They own Macy's, the building. All right, yeah. Yes, which used to be Filene's. Yeah, that one. Yeah, they own the building. But the garage is owned by the taxpayers, bro. Well, I'm like, because I know they want to build a hotel right there, the Macy's. And I was going to the spa, they wanted you to build a hotel. And I'm like, please don't tear that building down. Not yet. Don't tear it down. He's like, we got to tear it down to build because it's just don't have a structure to build a hotel. I'm like, please don't tear it down. Now it's our high school. I know. And I say, I say, see? Aren't you glad I said you didn't tear it down? It was only built 20 years ago. It's not a bad build. I know, but I could have said what they mean. But you know, to those developers don't need nothing. Sure, that's nothing. Get rid of that. For them. They sell the brakes, somebody come and sell it. Sure, if that. As quick as they get rid of it, the happier they are. So you might know about this. Because I've been kind of curious about it. So now I know the church or the charity. I've heard it's on the market. I don't know if it's on the market or not. I don't know. Yeah, we should buy it. Whoever buys that, you know, based on what's going to happen across the street, they can sell like anything. We're balloons and it's going to make it real nice. I don't know what the plans are. It's a private sale because it's the church. It's got to be approved by the pope, though. Yeah. Pope Francis has to approve the sale. My friend Dave got a fly out there to Rome. Go Dave, go to Rome, baby. Bring me something back, man. Well, all right, so it was great. Yes, sir. Thank you, Mr. Pine, Brian from City Council, from Burlington City Council, friend of mine. Ward 3, man. That's my ward. Ward 3. Hey, thank you. It's downtown in half the Old North end. Downtown, half the Old North. Thank you for voting for him, everybody. Thank you. Please, thank you. But he's going to help us with the U-4 board again because we started in 2003 with this, and I'm already got going to help us with U-4 boards across the state. So thank you. It's a growing movement. It's a growing movement. Hop on the train. It's going to be, it's going to be a big deal. I got, you know, I got other people from capital labs. Sure. Yeah. They should. I'm talking about the governor's office. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So they should. As I say, the fifth floor. I know. Fifth floor. Okay, so I'm going to tell you a story right quick, right quick before we go. Here's a funny, funny story. Now, I'm, I'm, I'm, what's the other Republican? Jim. Jim, sorry. Now, you know what? Jim will kill me because he can look around the room and know. There's 88 people named. How do you do it? I don't know how you do, but sorry, Jim. So anyways, so I'm at the, having a meeting at the Youth Service Provider's Network at the, what's the name? Capital Plaza. The Chara's or something like that? No, the Restaurant and Hotel. Oh, yeah. But anyways, yeah. So we have a meeting there. Youth Service Provider's Network meeting there, and, and so Jim told me, Bruce, where are we at town? Come see me. You know, so, you know me. You showed up. I don't care. I don't care how weird it might sound. You showed up. I showed up. I'm like, well, you said, come on. So, so I walked around, go around the back, and they walked the elevator. They like, where you going to see? I say to the governor, and they say, oh, you got an appointment? I said, no, but he said, come see me. So then I get upstairs. They didn't even go upstairs. And then, so I go to the front desk and they got this bulletproof all around his thing. But across the room, it's got this, they have this, like a press room. Yeah. And it was full of press, you know. And then, so I talk to the receptionist, and I say, they said, where are you? I'm Bruce Wilson, and I'm here to see the governor. He said, you got an appointment? I said, no, but he said, when I'm around, come see me. And I'm feeling like he's a college, he's a guy from a good college, feeling pretty damn stupid right now, saying, you know, same old thing. He said, come see me, you know, if you're around. So, so who's sure enough? He comes from around the back, found the bulletproof gym, the governor, gym doc walking. He's like, Bruce, Bruce, what you doing here? I said, while I was across the street doing some work with you, certified, you told me if I'm around, come see you. He said, come with me. So I goes with him to the press conference in the room. I don't know nothing about it. They could have been talking about Derry Cattle or something. Derry Cattle, I don't know. And all I know, I'm saying, next year, I'm doing it. He's making sense. Yeah, whatever. I don't know the whole. So he brought me over to the press, so they had to get down, he thanked me and gave me some little drink. Yeah, nice, you probably still have it. Yeah, he glad that I came over. That's a great story. I know, so it was so funny. Yeah. You know, it was so funny. I still laugh about that. What a small state that you I know, you know, hang out with the governor like that. You couldn't do that mostly. No, you think you could do that in Illinois? No. No, you couldn't get that close though. No, you couldn't get that close. No, first of all, I seen Bernie do that a couple weeks ago. He's at the Hanifords. He does his own shopping. You know, I know. He's a funny guy. You know, you're like, Bernie, I think he know, you know, my boss. You know, I've been working with a beautiful guy, you know, since you got here. Yeah, I love that guy. Yeah. When you arrived, he was just finished up being mayor. You know, that long ago, was that long ago, he was mayor. Mayor. Just finished up. I think LaBelle was just starting. So funny. Yeah. All right. All righty. I'm going to get to another thing at 3.30. Okay, sir. Hey. All right, boss. Thank you again. Thank you channel 17. Thank you. Straight talk. We're turning strong, right? All right. Good. Yeah. Yeah. All right. I see you, man. Yep. So this thing got to go to battery part. You don't have to go to battery part. Oh, yeah. No, no, it's, uh, it is really convenient being right across.