 Nigerians only want to hear President Bahá'í says human rights lawyer Femi Fálaná and stop the influx of killer-hurtsmen. Cleric urges President Bahá'í well this is plus politics and I am Mary Anna Cohen. Human rights lawyer Femi Fálaná S.E.N. has urged President Mohamed Bahá'í to speak to Nigerians saying the Minister of Information, only speaks for the federal government. And on the issue of banning of open grazing, former Senate leader Sen. Aileen Dumé expressed his disagreement at the decision taken by the southern governors. He noted that the insecurity problem in the country had nothing to do with open grazing and that it varied by ego, political zones of the country. He also requested that the government stop the salaries of politicians to get the needed resources to tackle insecurity if that would solve the problem. Well joining us to discuss this is Baba Tundig Bada-Mosi. He is a former ADP Lagos stage humanitarian candidate. Thank you very much for joining us. Thank you very much. Just to quickly correct you, also a former PDP senator of candidates. Great. Very last one, from Lagos East Central District. All right, great. I am in the PDP now. Ah, great. Okay. So let's start by looking at the situation in the country of course you and everybody else who's in this country understands that we have been facing different kinds of insecurity. But the most important thing that everybody wants to hear is the voice of the president. First things first, people have been worried as to why it took the presidency this long to even act on the issue of killer herdsmen. And here we are now talking about all forms of insecurity in the southeast and the south-south in the southwest and of course in the north-central. Of course we know that Boko Haram has been at it for so long but now we have different strains of violence and terrorism and of course abductions and kidnappings now are the order of the day. So I'm going to start by asking, do you stand by what Senator Dume is saying because he's saying that the governors are not prioritizing the most important thing and that banning of open grazing is the list of the problems that we have in the country. What's your take? I personally think that Senator Dume is speaking from both sides of his mouth. The fact is the herdsmen are a very, very serious problem everywhere. Massacres of women being raped, of farmers being killed on their farms and he usually starts with cows wandering into farmland and destroying crops belonging to farmers. Now, if we're going to stop, if we're going to stand the tide of these security issues considering the reluctance, the apparent reluctance of the security agencies to engage these herdsmen whenever they engage in these criminal activities of criminal trespass, vandalism, arson sometimes, burning farms, criminal assault, murder, a lot of time. If we're going to stop it, then we have to start with banning of open grazing and I think the southern governors have done exactly what should have been done over two to three years ago when some of us started shouting. I remember I started the argument that we must stop eating fulani beef because if it's beef, if it's cows that are causing the problem, then perhaps if there's no market for the beef that they're producing, then maybe the incidences of killings and robberies and rapes and all sorts of atrocities will start altogether. So we've taken an important first step but I think it's not quite far in. I think we ought to also perhaps look at the issue, the economic issue, the issue of engaging economically with the herdsmen. We have to stop eating beef, stop eating fulani meat of any type. Just need to stop. You're taking me to a question that I kept for later but I'm going to ask it because of what you just said. You referred to beef and cow as fulani. I don't remember going to the market to ask for fulani beef. Yes, I understand that. I'm sorry, I'm going somewhere. Let me just... I understand that. But the fact is the majority of meat that is sold in the markets today in most of southern Nigeria is from cattle raised by fulani. Now we have to make a conscious decision to decide whether our lives are more important than the meat that we eat. Now we need to make a conscious decision. The state governments need to make a conscious decision. End of story. We lost you there briefly but let me go to my next question. This issue of herders versus farmers has now metamorphosed into banditry. It's now metamorphosed into abductions and kidnappings where ransoms are being asked for. Before it just used to be an issue of oh, your cattle destroyed my farmland and then we're fighting you or someone gets hurt and then more people come and then it's just, you know, fighting. But now it's killing. It's AK-47s involved and now students from universities are being kidnapped. Five of them so far in Kaduna had been killed if I'm not mistaken and then some have been rescued but then the Greenfield University students are still in custody. So my question is why did we let this linger for so long? What do you think was responsible for the lingering that has now metamorphosed into something that we are unable at this point to deal with decisively? I think mainly the problem has been irrational political correctness and in a lot of cases fear, irrational fear where I am faced by people who clearly want to kill me my immediate reaction would be to defend myself. That would be my immediate response defend myself by any and all means necessary. Now some of us saw this coming as far back as 2011. People have seen coming from as far back as to 1989 when the Abuja declaration was made that Nigeria was going to be Islamized and right underneath that was the idea that there should be some kind of fuller the empire of Africa which Nigeria would be the capital of it. Now when Buhari started weakening during the campaigns, I told people I said these are crocodile tears. This man is not coming for Nigerians he's coming for Fulani's and we will land the lesson very, very grievously when it does take over. Now we have land the lesson we'll land the lesson between 2015 and 2019 and yet Nigerians refused to internalize those pestings and allowed this man to get back into office again in 2019 now. That is unforgivable. That is beyond political correctness. That is from going from the idea that someone from the south west now suddenly thinks that the time is right for him to compress it. You know you have to put it down eventually to greed, sheer naked greed and power mongering. So they allowed Buhari to get into office just because they wanted to become president and they will chase that presidential ambition at the cost of as many lives as it takes to get Buhari through the second four years and I really think that time is up for him for Buhari himself. He needs to get out of that office so that Nigerians can stop dying like flies. Let me go to the essay and statement about the president speaking to Nigerians because we did not really hurt the president to dress us, do like a state address to address the issues. We've heard the information minister we've heard the presidential aid speak on this issue or put out press releases but the president has not necessarily spoken on this issue. Now Fermi Faluna, before he called out Mr. President, in 2018 I'd like to take you back I think I was on the radio at the time and the senior pastor of the Redeemed Christian Church of God in 2018 was asking the president to stop the killings, killings were happening in 2018. I remember where he said that if these killings are not stopped we might not have free fair credible elections he might also impede elections in different places at the time and then fast forward to 2021 we're still here asking the president to speak and deal decisively with the issue of insecurity in the country there seems to be a pattern here but for someone who's played in the political space for a president who has wanted this office four times and he's now in that office why is it so difficult for Mr. President to why do you think, because I know you're not in his mind but why do you think he has not spoken to us and if he did speak to us and address us what good would it do? I have personally of the opinion that the killings are not stopping because Mr. President does not want them to stop. How do you mean? Mr. President wants these killings to continue for whatever strange reason because he's the president of Nigeria the president of Nigeria is the most powerful democratically elected president in the world in terms of the constitutional powers that he has he has a wide range of constitutional powers that he could reach and put a stop, a final end to these killings by the full and his body will not do it because I believe this is my personal opinion and I'm entitled to it I believe that his part and parcel of a full and his expansionist agenda I mean imagine the governors of the southern states deciding that they were going to pass laws to end open grazing and then some idiot full animal comes on TV, forgive my French comes on TV the other day and says that full and his were not consulted and we want to ask the question how many southern Nigerians were consulted when full and his started shooting people how many southern governors were consulted and the president sat down with a bunch of other full and his people and decided that they were going to initiate a new security policy for the South South and the South East how many South Easterners and South Southerners sat in that meeting when they made that decision so southern governors democratically elected or whatever that's worth sat down and for the benefit of their peoples decided that they did not want any more open grazing and if one comes out and says no full and his were not consulted he must be out of his mind but it's not actually but that man was speaking I'm sorry to speak over you that man was speaking that man was speaking in his own capacity he wasn't speaking as a mouthpiece of the president neither was he speaking as a forerunner of Mr. President so why are you really saying that the president or this full and he person and the president has some full and expansion agenda I'm yet to see your facts as a president who had been in the high public office before this is not the sort of patterns that you would expect from somebody you know you would expect a little more decorum a little more circumspection from somebody of that time but it didn't happen why because he knew that the entire full and he establishment starting from the president down to the presidency down to the ministers and so on and everybody else the entire security apparatus he knows that they are behind all of this so he's confident enough to come out and challenge democratically elected so decisions that they have rightfully have properly taken to protect their people let's move on to again Senator Aline Dume he's proposing that public political office holders salaries be slashed and those monies be used to fund the army now let's not forget that Senator Dume is the chairman of the senate committee on the army and he's saying that the country needs to take care of soldiers there have been many issues coming from our security forces down from welfare to moribund fighting equipment I have had former soldiers and former people in the army who have been complaining that the army is not being properly taken care of they've also complained about the fact that there are malls in the army which are helping these terrorists one way or the other it's more like a spanner in the wheels of fighting terrorism how can we speed up and engage our soldiers and encourage them especially because of course they need that encouragement if we must win this war against insurgents and for a president who's also this is supposedly his constituency should that not be his priority let me start with the statement credited to Senator Dume I want to believe that he did not do that because if he did then he's been clever by modern half and the reason I say that is because the minister of finance came out the other day and said that the army had been giving so many trillions over the years to buy weapons and so on and the weapons are not forthcoming and when they do come the weapons end up in the hands of Poco Haram you know you saw Poco Haram he explained MRAPs that they currently seized from the army and as you said yourself some of your friends and I have colleagues and friends too in the army some of them have angrily retired some of them are still there who complain that there appears pollution as some in the Iraq with the Poco Haram people to the effect that there is a definite feeling amongst people from a certain part of the country that they are being targeted for elimination by people from another part of the country within the army we lost you for a second but can you hear us go ahead okay so there appears to be some kind of conspiracy high level conspiracy to eliminate people from a particular part of the country fighting men from a particular part of the country and I say appears and visibly there appears to be this conspiracy to kill off people from a particular part of the country by people from some other part of the country who seem to be in cahoots with the terrorists, bandits Poco Haram whatever name you choose to call the jihadis that's what I call them because they all seem to be fighting for same cause I mean look at Shiro for instance Niger State where they said bandits came and they took over Shiro and bandits and taken over there we saw was Poco Haram flags going up in Shiro two hours away from Abuja, the federal capital of Nigeria now what does that tell you and the president is sitting pretty not saying a word there doesn't appear to be any sense of urgency about the Shiro situation instead the army is throwing all its resources into the southeast attacking all killing civilians killing people that's all we're hearing about we're not hearing about engaging the terrorists in Shiro the bandits or the Poco Haram whatever name they're called by in Shiro two hours away from the capital of Nigeria two hours away from where the president of Nigeria is apparently sitting refusing to address Nigeria well for those who have been asking the president to speak press men were at the presidential bill today as the president was celebrating Eid and he did say a few words and did emphasize that he was going to deal decisively with the bandits I don't know if my producers have that audio would like to put it out so that you could listen to it maybe you could pick something from it I don't know do we have that video because I want us to listen to it alright so we will play that video before this conversation is over so we can hear what Mr. President had to say he talked about the resources that are available to us and if these resources are available and are enough for us to deal with the situation that we have at hand let's take a look at that it's an audio but of course we have Mr. President's picture on it and then we would come back and have this conversation with the land so that we can get enough food for the country and even export and we are hoping Nigerians would understand the problem Nigerians know at which stage we came 2015 what stage we are now both on security and we are going by the constitution we are doing our best but with the resources available and the manpower available to us we are working very hard and I think the National Assembly is cooperating very well with the resources available to us they are certainly giving us priority in our requirements and we are doing our best the important thing is the at least must make the attempt to understand the military if we order a warhance and armored vehicles it takes time for the manufacturers it takes time when it is brought here eventually shipped here training institutions training the trainers this is a very very long process and even if you can have contact with the retired military they will tell you the difference between the time we came and now how much hardware we have got how much training we have done if you don't know the difference in terms of security and without security you can't do anything and in the south south our big surprise and this affrontment is what is happening in the north west and we are dealing with it so that's the precedent I'm sure you could pick some things but if you didn't I'll just put you through it because I wrote some things down he started by asking farmers to go back to their farm lands because of course he is afraid of food shortage he said that Nigerians need to understand the problem and to see where we are now and where we were in 2015 he says also that the national assembly has been cooperating with them to give them all that they need to deal with the situation at hand he said we are doing our best he also talked about the fact that we have been getting enough hardware and they've done a lot of trainings that if we don't believe we can go and ask the people in Boronu and then he also states that he's shocked and surprised at what's happening in the north but that they are doing their best what's your take I find the statement that statement to reflect very clearly how the precedent is removed from reality for him to suggest under the prevailing circumstances across the country where full anti-cattle rarities and terrorists are going deliberately, quite deliberately after farmers and farming communities in my opinion in an attempt to instigate to create farming to create food scarcity which we have succeeded at doing by the way for him to suggest that people should go to the farms I find that very disingenuous I find it borderline genocidal and I say borderline genocidal because I've had direct experience almost direct experience a friend of mine was kidnapped in Niquorutu he's a very popular man very well known now as I'm mentioning the most beautiful that they've run about a month ago a friend of mine was kidnapped shortly after another person another person that's known to me was also kidnapped again in the Niquorutu area around Imota on their farms so farmers have been targeted and the people that kidnapped them were identified very clearly to be full anti-cattle rarities we finally managed to get both of them free by paying huge amounts of money the police were not the DSS were not everybody just said pay and get them out of there at the end of the day for the president to suggest that without any concomitant increase in security present in communities is almost as if it's promoting genocyte or facilitating genocyte that's what it sounds like to me and I really would suggest any farm in communities country if you want to go back to the farm then make sure that you are very well armed and prepared for an attack by full anti-terrorist or full anti-cattle rarities and I make no apologies to anybody for calling them out for who they are to borrow your word it's disingenious to just blanket call every person who's a terrorist you know in a certain community in Nigeria you can't say that these people this particular ethnic group is responsible for all the terrorism that we have been experiencing in the country yes there are people who have been caught who are seemingly from that full anti-extraction but does it mean that because when you keep saying full anti-hurst I mean I'm just playing the devil's advocate here it makes it look like every full anti-person should be ostracized because one full anti-person are committing also forms of violence and atrocities do you know back in the early 90s when the OPC were running riot all over Lagos a lot of Yoruba people spoke up against their activities the president at the time was a Yoruba man Olushez Moabasson John he spoke up he actually picked up members of the OPC at the time Dr. Federal Fashion and Gani Adams he picked them both up to put a stop to what he perceived as and what everybody could see was some kind of international violence amongst the OPC factions now that was the president this president has his kinsmen running around killing people all over the place doing far was that OPC ever did in the early 90s as I said and he has to avoided avoided either talking about it or engaging them in any way and I see that as an application a very very serious application of this part and it's one of the reasons why I've been calling since 2015 for his resignation it either resides or the Senate does their job the National Assembly does the job that they forced the thousands back out and in pitching too many people have died to keep this man in office too many people have died alright finally before I let you go before we wrap up this conversation now that we've heard I'm sure a lot of people have watched that video of the president speaking about dealing with the issue of banditry do we still need the president to address the nation the president we have no idea that that was in fact the president because we didn't see a video well there is a video there's technology available to make anyone's voice sound like anyone's I'm telling you that there was a video he was interviewed in Aso Rock during the Eid festivities today and that was the president well that's the story we're told there's nothing that there's nothing that emanates from that presidency that I personally would believe anymore nothing well I'm telling you again that the president spoke and we saw his face but I want to say thank you to you but what's unique about Amosie is a former presidential sorry former senatorial candidate for the People's Democratic party here in Lagos state thank you so much for speaking with us alright we'll take a short break and when we come back the president of course is still at the table who was still asking Mr. President to stop the influx of fuller knee herdsmen into the country yes we'll be right back