 Again, we have Professor Sun Jia-sui. She's our friend, as you probably heard the introduction a few days ago, given by David. He was, I don't know why he made faces. Sorry. I think you probably know Professor Sun's work because she's really quite active in the media studies and also in the past few years, she's really focusing on Indigenous medias. So this is one particular lecture she actually presented to contribute to our publication project. This is something that Taylor made for the Shen Yi project. So this is quite a different topic from her usual thing, but you can see, again, because she's such an expert in the media studies, she presented her presentation with loads of multimedia presentation here, so you will be totally entertained as well as informed. So let us put our hands together and welcome her coming back. Okay, thank you. I'm going to present for this session is Indigenous media uses the means of cultural change in the period of transformation of cultures in Taiwan. So I'm going to look at the media in the social and cultural context and I will have an overview of the Indigenous media in Taiwan first and then focus on two different perspectives. One is about cultural sustainability and the youth's audience, and the second one is about cultural creative industry. So you are going to do a two different side of the media. Indigenous media can convey significant cultural and social meanings in Taiwan, but all of this talk is to show different cultural forms of Indigenous media in Taiwan and investigate roles which Indigenous media check in the changing culture and social context in Taiwan. Indigenous media also build a connection between the Indigenous culture and the white world. In the cultural policy aspect, Indigenous media not only keep tradition, also enhance opportunity for creating possibility for further facilitate different cultural forms such as Indigenous music and Indigenous craft. So later I will talk more about music because the radio part actually provides a good channel for a lot of Indigenous music to reach wider audience. When Indigenous society encounter changes, Indigenous media become an important cultural and social means to engage with Indigenous social movement, cultural changes and maintenance of Indigenous language. So this talk also explores representation of different Indigenous media forms and reveal cultural translation among different Indigenous culture and language in Taiwan. By taking over of the development of Indigenous media in Taiwan, this talk endeavours to analyze and explain ways in which Indigenous media strengthen the identity of Indigenous people, show the cultural heritage of tribes, help to maintain Indigenous language and also become public appeal for debating about Indigenous issues. So here I'm going to give the overview. When people talking about Indigenous media, first of all we are thinking about the Taiwan Indigenous television news. So I'm going to, so for the pre-media one, Indigenous perspectives that I monthly may be viewed. I think the first one is more influential because there are more people looking at the television one. And the radio, the special one of radio is because some program actually is all designed by Indigenous language. So it's not the program is not spoken by Chinese but spoken in their own language. Also a lot of music one. Right now I think I have a lot of young people using their own language but produce some. And this is a very good channel for them to let the people understand the music and also get no more about its content or what kind of social issue involved with the music. And new media and social media, they are very diverse. Media force actually connected through internet. I think more than one people's paper actually mentioned about this, like they are learning language but they have different community through internet and connect with each other, like Sai Xia. Sai Xia actually they design APP and through internet. They are many words sometimes they don't know how to say in a correct way. So in a foreign on the internet they can discuss with it or sometimes they find a problem and then they seek with the elder people to find what is the right way to express the certain issues. And they also build certain kind of identity through social media. So internet play an important role in the modern tribe because it also connect with young people and elder people through new media forward. To talking about indigenous television news and indigenous knowledge and they are cultures sustainability and youth audience. So they are four main points. First one to investigate the ways in which indigenous television news convey and transform indigenous knowledge in Taiwan. The second one is presenter acting as cultural agent translate and adopt news from different ethnic and cultural backgrounds. And the third one indigenous presenters not only translate news from different language but also translate across different cultural space. And the final one is about youth audience. Very focused indigenous television news, media culture workers and young audience. The methodology are used counter analysis of news program in indigenous news. Also interviews of presenters and also do audience research for undergraduate student. Indigenous television news has become part of education system to sustain indigenous cultural language and indigenous knowledge to benefit the young generation. With social change many young indigenous people actually grow up in cities and do not have opportunity to learn their own native language. Therefore it become a difficult language choice for the producer of the news when producing indigenous news. I think it's not only happening in indigenous news sometimes also happening in Hakka. Sometimes a producer feel they actually try hard to do good news but not so many audience really see them. And for natural interview actually I asking many presenters and anchors and check whether their children can understand their own language. But even their children sometimes they speak yeah because they are in a good position so they stay in the city so that's why their children also couldn't they are they are growing in the city it's more like hand children not like indigenous people. But if indigenous news and program only making news for elder people when they are getting older who are who will become the audience to looking at all of those news. So right now it's kind of important for the people to find a way to train the young people also can get to know their own language. So later they actually have some children program start to use indigenous language teaching system to let them can get access with their own culture. Indigenous knowledge cultural sustainability and use of this they are different indigenous language in Taiwan and to cope with this range of indigenous TV news. For casters have anchors with different indigenous language backgrounds to produce news from a number of ethnic groups. However there are debates when selecting which subtitle to use. Most people in Taiwan can understand television news by the subtitle even though they can understand indigenous language. Other people insist that indigenous television news should not only report indigenous language the subtitle should use roman spelling to make it fit well to the spoken form and sound like the indigenous language. The indigenous television news anchor originally work as indigenous language teachers or priests. There are very few people who retain the ability to speak an indigenous language and can report for the public. Most of them are over 50 years of age. That's I think somewhere else in the last talk why they are not the young people that's why because they are language teacher or they are priests so they know how to use but the younger people they haven't have this ability to report it and these are the reception from the young audience. When I saw the old anchor's report of news with my own language I could sympathize with him. The anchor was from my village and more than 80 years old. It does not enjoy good health but continue reporting a desire to sustain our language. It makes me feel I should learn my language well so the young generation can turn over to sustain the cultural and language. This is one response. Here's another one. I feel that anchors are too old and I don't understand the language so I tend to switch to other channels with the young anchors who use language which I can understand so you see different perspective. Indigenous news often report news about problem of indigenous issues which makes me feel hopeless. Most of the people who appear in the news are farmers workers or working classes people. They are not people who work in office. It makes me feel that most of the indigenous people cannot find good job in their village so need to go far to find better jobs. I think the indigenous television should report more positive news instead of just reporting the news which focuses on problems of indigenous issues. The news is a bit too heavy showing news with all kinds of problems and I think this one also echoed the previous talk talking about many people actually couldn't find a proper job but if you keep showing the problems for all these he looking at the news it didn't really like encourage them to do something good so I think later this opinion also they also care about this one and put more positive news with that. Young audience perspective also points out that indigenous news should report about more modern issues. It is essential for a reporter to try and report traditional issues in a modern form and link with modern issues. So I think if everything is traditional sometimes it's hard to attract young people because they feel that's something too hard to connect with their own life and also the music is not only the traditional one they also need to combine with some modern music or modern design so more and more people would like to see all of the news and learn from it. Media and space. Craig talking about literature become a means to create culture space for consumers. So radio drama and everyday life full belief and common value and Biden image community. Radio drama is a media space interacted with society in the UK and also I think the media in Taiwan can also do the same thing. The anchor of Beno when indigenous ethnic group indigenous language news this one give an example to show how indigenous television news convey and sustain indigenous cultural knowledge. By reporting news about Forest Museum in Taidong he utilised ways in which indigenous elder introduced the wisdom of mountains to emphasise the value of Beno places upon presenting nature to young people. It's more like an environmental education in an indigenous way and right now actually it's quite popular a lot of tourism designed this way. They guide I think many people from Hong Kong and different parts of the world actually they find the news first and then just go to the village and they are elder people teaching them how to cook in the original way and introduce the environmental issues with them so it's more and more connection through the news to combine with different connection but no more living in mountain regions develop indigenous knowledge to interact with nature the elder introduced the Benoan indigenous knowledge through the news report they also teach them how to use the knife because the knife can use different way to not only cut the tree also find the rope so there are a lot of indigenous knowledge actually contain in the news. Train young people how to stay in accommodation without the trees. Yeah so many people actually they like to see all kind of loose news and learn something new and later they can also go to the tribe to experience about it work in different ways when in mountains region to ensure they will not destroy the environment so there are a lot of education also involved with it. The Benoan indigenous news also record upon the choir at the beginning of the festival. The singer usually sing early in the morning between 3 and 5 a.m because it is very quiet we see enable the choir to sing in a peaceful space in a humble manner so the singing can be here and convey to God then God will give permission for the star of the festival. It addresses the relationship of Benoan tribe heaven and land it shows the humble way of Benoan people to God and nature so it's the news it's not only a news it also have a lot of value original from the tribe through news and to let people understand indigenous knowledge. Many presenters in indigenous television news encounter problems when reporting news and events about which local village people may not be able to understand or even issues which did not exist in a local cultural concept. They not only report news but also become the cultural translator of different cultural boundaries through the reporting process. A example from Sakinu, one time Taiwan anchorman in indigenous Taiwan ethnic TV news, the waves from nuclear power generating plants become an important issue in Taiwan. Some people are closely linked with the issue because the waves from nuclear power generation may be located in their village so that's why I just see the news and that's why they go for demonstration so media actually tap part in the social participation in Taiwan and respond indigenous people's opinion. Difficult for the anchor to report this kind of news in indigenous language because there's no words in the indigenous language to describe the chemistry of the waves. Some indigenous people may believe the waves to be an evil spirit that's how they transform use different concept to describe it to use word which indigenous people can understand when we pull the news so everybody can get a sense about what it is. The anchor must bridge indigenous life to a modern world and at the same time transform indigenous knowledge to embrace modern issues in reporting news. The anchor must be aware of modern issues but also be familiar with indigenous knowledge. Do social issues need to be translated and explained to indigenous people? Cultural sustainability must also be conveyed to the young audience to help them protect their homeland and the indigenous way they interact with nature. So conclusion for this part put different subtitles with the same news counter and show in different time for audience to choose. Introduce new vocabulary in the news with modern issues. Presenters for indigenous themes to be successful in its go to sustain indigenous culture. It is essential for a reporter to try and report indigenous issues in a modern form and link with modern issues. Minority media can be a tool to fix for social justice and that's the one like the hunting one because it really causes a big huge attention and actually a lot of law people actually try to involve with indigenous lawyer to make some change for to make the justice for indigenous people. Indigenous news should have more positive reports to inspire the young generation and enhance their ethnic competence. Presenters become the cultural translator of different cultural boundaries through a reporting process and sustain culture. And I'm going to skip this one. And the second part is impact of media on indigenous Taiwanese literature. Example from a publishing and creative industry. And I think this one is also about a story that is in indigenous way. So there are four points. First one the impact of new technology is effect upon the development of the publishing industry and it's linked to the indigenous and Taiwanese literature. Second one the connection between indigenous and Taiwanese literature publishing and cultural creative industry. And the third one media space and cultural landscape. How the contents of a book can be transformed into different cultural forms, cultural products, different media forms and linked to the change of cultural landscape. And the final one cultural development through indigenous and Taiwanese literature. And what I'm trying to say is media is not only media. Media can connect with different ones. It may probably just start from a story but later it can become different on media form also interact with different societies and networks and from not only bring the impact we see in the nation also can go to wider audience. This talk regards publishing as one kind of media in its pro-indigenous and Taiwanese literature in the framework of media culture society with the development of new technology and the cultural policy of promoting cultural creative industry. Indigenous and Taiwanese literature has become transformed to different media forms to interact with Taiwanese culture and their stuff. Taiwanese literature has been regarded as a concept of text in this talk and its role of mainstream perspective. People assess Taiwanese literature through different media forms. The media impact of Taiwanese literature when transformed to different media forms connect with different social issues such as indigenous movement, cultural imagination, transformed stories to interact with history, local cultural landscape and media space to connect with local people and form new network. So this talk will deal with some of opportunities and challenges that the Taiwanese publishing industry has come from in the transition from a domain, a domain printed media to an increasing digital media form. I think I just show you some. Now this is a story of a princess following. So you can see a little. It's more like a legend. Legend of indigenous stories and from the legend they are also different kind of music and this is one way of like transformation from a story to the media form and this is the second one. This is a Daya story. They are tracing the song. So you can see this one and this is Senekou Balai. So you can see. It is not only movie. They are also different kind of like the painting in one with it. And this is a TV drama talking about Ushou event. That's a very important history event and it becomes a television news. This person, they are indigenous people. So it's not only elder people also young people participating in it. So from the production process, many people just part in with the production and also they are a lot of wider influence to reach a different different kind of ethnic ethnic group. So this is the book Virgin and the painting actually with many some detail to explain like that. So they are also contain some indigenous knowledge with that. And this is Mona Luka, the story with the important people in indigenous history. This is a different version of Ushou event. And this is a very famous painter to paint all of Lo's story and this is Helty. This is a musical address about a doctor in Alishan Zhouzu and the story also become musical and show in different places. I'm going to show you some. This is Taiwanese literature but I think indigenous literature also can do something similar. This is Laihe and Laihe's story also linked with different cultural landscape like the museum and this is music and this is like the work. Different people can walk through it. So literature and cultural landscape. The landscape embody a cultural imagination of literature and literature reshaped cultural landscape. We get representation of cultural heritage, renovation. It's only that that's not only related with Taiwanese literature also can involve with a lot of indigenous language. So it's like literary park guided tour, literature camp, building connection with everyday life and people. So you can see media just a starting point to connect with different kinds of social network. And Zhong Yi He, this is another example from Haka. So from the story and then you can go to the real landscape and then they are museum and different expression with that. Okay, so this is Laihe and cultural landscape. It's a transfer local community and connect local network, cultural space of cultural communication and connect the story also local landscape. New cultural map and cultural imagination actually really mapping the landscape in different ways through different story. From Taiwanese literature publishing to media space and cultural landscape, literary space and a connection with cultural society and new mediation for Aboriginal people. So that's another way I'm trying to address story can be a starting point and then it can become different kind of media form to link with a different kind of social network and it is not only to strengthen the cultural identity, it also can bring different kind of network so different kind of media form. The transformation of the stories connect the identity, cultural preservation, thank cultural network. For example, like the music one, Sumin is a good example because a lot of people will be here and then all of those fan people just start to love Indigenous music and I think his music also cooperate not only with different media form also with the group from different countries. For example, I attend one concert in National Music Hall, actually he's he use Indigenous music to come with Okinawa music. So there are a lot of mixing music. It's not only the traditional one, it also mixing with many new way of possibility. And the way of the danger, the literature transform media has been used for different purpose but away from their original meaning and intent. Let's find yesterday when Dale talking about some Indigenous film, I think the story is it's not only story itself, it shouldn't be like another kind of Disney or Hollywood just with the skin of Indigenous factors. I think it's important to know of Indigenous knowledge and value and to create something new but with Indigenous spirit in it and that's an important factor for the media when they are trying to show in the Indigenous news or when they do some different creation. I think it's not it's not Indigenous everything if they contain something with Indigenous factor, not necessary means that's Indigenous. I think it's important to have something more sophisticated and contain the value with all of those media and then Indigenous media can become an important platform to connect with different things no matter culturally or socially and then can make some change in Taiwan society. Also it can become a platform to link globally in different ways. Okay that's my talk. Okay I have two questions but it's really quite interesting to see how you divide the talk into two parts on the one hand you are tackling the really about Indigenous news and in basically in the broadcast in Indigenous TV station right the next one is more general mapping about the cultural landscape so my question for you is first is there's a very clear general sorry generational specific sort of content and media for example radio seem to target on more elderly because they have to speak in Indigenous languages but blog online thing is much more younger people's media how are you going to what are their strategies to attract Indigenous people across the board are there any kind of strategies they you know they use to really expand and outreach to different you know conventional groups another thing is to do with you you said young people seem to be complaining about it's always talking about problems so if there's always then you said oh maybe we should be more encouraging talking about nice things but you are from journalism background as well as me so you are not encouraged as well as well you're not encouraged to just gloss over things so how are you going to provide a certain kind of strategies to on the one hand really truthful to to what's going on but on the other hand you know how are you going to encourage people to aim for better things for the first question I think the audience are very diverse so let's for example they design different kind of news like for the elder one they have the Indigenous television news that means they use their own language but for the young generation they have daily news and that's why they use Chinese title with that so they can reach different audience and on the internet actually the age group different age group they all use internet to form different kind of community and discuss something different for example like social movement why quite a lot of young people they have like the internet group and participants in it through the internet but also they are elder people they probably participate for social movement even 40 years ago so two groups probably have different strategies to target about the nuclear power waste but they all use internet to connect with different way it's not only one answer and or one way to participate with the social movement so they are different group of people with different age but they all use new media to discussion or to provide different strategy and also language one because people are interested with different things so they all have different kind of group for example like language one or like they use internet to sell the product or aircraft for the for the tribe and they are also young people right now they are also like new farmer they are actually with new technology skill and but they use different way to grow plants and to marketing them or invite people to go to the go to the tribe or they design different kind of a tourism but it's a more they put a lot of indigenous concept or knowledge with that but they also need the help of elder people because they are kind of the uh can contain all flows of wisdom so internet become one way to bridge different age group and also invite people to join them in a new way so that's our first one and for the second one I think later they still address the problem but they also provide the possibility to solve it yet so it's not only address the problem they will also provide different ways or become a forward to let people pay attention about the issue but also try to solve the problem so in that way it's not the problem is just the beginning and then later they will follow up with how to solve this problem for example like if they are people they did not get a good job in the tribe in what ways they can they can uh they are a new connection with that or they are a lot of uh social harassment in the tribe sometimes and in what ways you can improve such kind of situation so it's not only the problem itself later they have a discussion with that so it's not only a negative part um sure originally I would like to have Xiao Wen's question but since this being already being handed to you sorry about that I'm sorry yeah um uh I'm very interesting in the last part uh like last year I went to the like a literature festival in in Zhanghua city like I I think like the same day they did they achieve is luckily is uh Leihem memory hole is in the Zhanghua city one of like with the most population of Zhanghua county so if if we want to have uh these stories as a kind of cultural map or like those photos like how we did to Leihem and how we did to the tribe so first first question is how to make people to be there like the traffic issue yeah so if we have a cultural map on the mountains how to make the people into the mountains yeah and second about the translation problem like because those stories are not original written in Chinese so will it happen like when you do some translation how to just just like in the in the tv channel if you do the translation how to respect the trip language yeah sometimes the some problem will happen in translation yeah and the final part I said one most important thing part of this who can rest the phone like yeah the money issue yeah so who can suppose these stories as become a kind of cultural industry of village the first one actually um right now many uh many tribes they actually have special vegetable every year for example I know Su Ming actually also participate one in uh for for Amis music festival it's in the mountain but normally the indigenous television news will broadcasting about the tie and place and they sell the ticket so actually quite it's sell sell very quickly because they are a lot of fans they like the music they like to participate uh with the events and if they also have transportation arranged with that so I think it's they are the whole program has been arranged in the proper way and they connect with the news or they have program to uh to introduce different kind of events and sometimes not only uh the tribal culture itself sometimes they also invite uh the singer or the uh the the artists from outside and also they are showing the film not only we see one one tribe sometimes they are different tribes connect together so people actually tour in the whole Taiwan in different tribes so I think they attract people in different ways because they are different kind of art form and different connection it's more like a festival but in uh link with indigenous culture so uh people participate in it uh through different ways so I think for the transportation one right now they do uh put in a more modern form and the second one for the translation uh first of all sometimes people don't care about the language because even you don't know language if you sing the song you don't know language you still can enjoy the song and there are many art form you don't need the language you know how you see how people make all of those are crap so it still attract people not necessarily use the language but in terms of literature I think right now many people actually would like to it's like disney this like people speak English not they use all of the content the stories from global it's not only from one language but you can adapt long story to different kind of language but the most important thing is how do you speak this in this story in a different way with modern concept and that's the one indigenous story or indigenous legend also can be terrifying in this global war and to connect with wider audience the answer all of your question money oh the funding one sometimes the festivals sell the ticket so so they can they don't need sometimes government will support and sometimes they are also some traveling actually don't like to raise the money because they want to keep their original way once they have they have people support and then the economy and political power maybe in France how can they control the whole event and so sometimes some tribe they they prefer just they are a lot of volunteer they can use yeah so when you you like that kind of culture and then you will just go and do it and tribal people sometimes do many things together it's more like community sense so it's not necessary about money but people organize it probably just they like it so they do it yeah thank you my question is because the indigenous people has many different tribes or from your nature we all we only say indigenous people as media so I'm wondering the different type of different language different culture different background how to in in your research how to is the yeah I serve or to clarify or to compare which other or compete which other at this is first question and second questions because actually the government puts a lot of resources on indigenous culture and education like Dong Hua University your students almost quite privileged position in even more produced than the the normal students they normal yeah they get obligate job guarantee some students and also the recently the pts get a biggest budget to make the the tv program sorry I suddenly forgot the the tv program the name of the program I only remember the director is tau rei yuan like drama yeah tv drama recently just start and pts very very big the the story is from a uh uh medical doctor he wrote the the story and talk about how Taiwan the indigenous people is the in the 16th or 17th century to uh first international incident to uh fight with the western to connect so they put a lot of uh uh budget money on this so I I so I don't know why how but it's very um how to say it because on the one hand as you say uh some programs indigenous people do their own from their own uh perspective the program but as I said the pts the director and the novel writer all hand uh people so I don't know what's uh how how about uh we say called indigenous indigenous people how to view this yeah and sorry and then the third question is how do you feel but nice compared in the front of president of this for so long time she continues to do you mean the how the media they'll be changing and how indigenous uh media or people how do this yes um first of all I think when we say indigenous that means very diverse indigenous people and different concept so uh when you are talking about compete is that uh for example like news uh indigenous have certain language uh at least at least certain language uh television news so they separate uh different time for example Monday is for Amis Tuesday is for Taiwan Thursday is for Dao Friday is for like it's different because it's they are not 13 days in the week so one day have different sometimes a large time in Japan yeah and also subtitle sometimes it's like Amis with Chinese title for example five and six and with indigenous like roman spelling is like seven to eight for example like this so uh you got to remember your tribe is which day yeah and sometimes they are showing it because it's it's unfair if only choose one language the bigger group I think for other people they are not happy with that and that's not because it's also important for the in indigenous television news is to sustain different kind of culture of different kind of language so let's uh there are a lot of debate for years about how to program this in the proper way but I think that's so far they did it so this one I'm uh I'm trying to answer the first one but also a program because they are different legend different stories so they can produce with different kind of media for like TV drama or like cartoon or like animation so I just show you some example but there are so many different kind I also feel like the documentary film or like the adaptation type of film so but based on the story of its original legend so they are different kind of media form originally from different kind of story from different tribe so they can we can all see it from the it's indigenous television news is more like a platform but different kind of producer different kind of media form they can all find a place or wait to connect with it so I think that's more like a practical uh usage right now in the indigenous television news and why is that so question I think they just keep reporting it but even indigenous people probably with different point view is not only one way to thinking about how to demonstrate or how to talk at this issue some people agree with that some people with some people not so I think it also depends on the reporter so they are also different kind of social network engage with this issue and some can be very radical but some prefer in a more peaceful way but um but I think it's important to have the chance to make different opinion they all have possibility to show in the television news all program I was going to ask that same question as Charlotte that was my my my my uh my first question but my the other question was about audience so who exactly is uh uh the indigenous TV stations target audience um to what extent can it also reach hand viewers or non-indigenous uh because one of the things that's come up in a lot of the discussion the last three days is misunderstandings lack of interest or lack of awareness of indigenous issues so that leads to the question about how does um indigenous media get into mainstream media so could you comment for example on the relationship between um indigenous TV and other media forms for example public TV or um private media right now I think they actually have some exchanging news program or cooperation way so sometimes some indigenous news also they just change the subtitle and they also show in the mainstream television news not only thematically being used or just pick and choose sorry um because different television programs have different kind of cooperation or sometimes when they see the news they feel it's important they also um also show in the mainstream and also they are it's kind of diaspora of the journalists themselves because they are a lot every time when the chairman of indigenous television news change and they are some reporter will leave but sometimes they leave and then they they just move to the mainstream news so there are some indigenous journalists actually working in the mainstream television they are also producing the news related with indigenous issues so I think that's different ways when sometimes it's programmed exchange itself sometimes the people have been trained in the indigenous news later who work in the mainstream television news so they are more and more awareness about indigenous issue in different kind of channel actually my question was going to be very very similar along the lines of I don't know if this is working but I hope I'm loud enough that it almost feels my thing is like L1 L2 acquisition first and second language acquisition and research shows the two biggest drivers of that are the language being spoken at home which you kind of touched on and extensive materials as we call them in that language which would be like the media and you talked about modernizing it making making it more interesting but also related to David's question it feels a little tokenizing like here's the mainstream news in Mandarin and here's your nice little thing in Bono and oh isn't that cute and how do we mainstreamize that so that it's news for everyone in such a way that we can support language preservation to make it extensive materials that you know that support this and to what extent do we need to also shift our focus on getting older members of various groups to speak their native languages at home which is an issue we see across Taiwan including with Taiwanese in the north Haka people are just not speaking the language to their kids where do we need to emphasize it and how far do you think we've come I don't know I don't think about the answer yeah they right now the education system also trying to provide an environment for example for Indigenous students they are right now they are hoping to provide environment from the family to an elementary school to a university if the whole system with Indigenous languages I think Maori people have already done it but right now they kind of try to adapt this one to Taiwan but we are not quite sure it will be successful or not and that's also part of the reason you are talking about a lot of budget for the education system right now they want to train a lot of like Indigenous language teacher so in my college all of a sudden so many people come to my college and try to become language teacher so the more and more people get to know their own language sometimes they probably can it's more like a small community everywhere in Taiwan so they can train young people and also combine with different how media are born so I think the cultural identity actually strength through all of these efforts no matter from education from from marketing or from different cultural product let's that's how although there are also some people debating with that yeah well research shows that children like children that go to language school even if it's their native language of their culture just do not learn the language the same way as if they've also they're also speaking it at home but without the extensive materials of media for them to watch they're still not going to acquire it so how do we put these all in think to make that happen it's still your responsibility yeah but I've been thinking about the example of Saito Ke Balai after the movie I think Zheng Zhi University actually have a lot of people start to learn uh Saito Ke language there was even a type of times article about it but I went to ask her and she said it was like half a dozen people that expressed interest how many people do you think learned how to speak it that was zero maybe one maybe like one dude was really smart one dude is really okay thanks why don't wait thank you but oh no no he has already cute and then you all right thanks uh I guess mine is a question or some thoughts based on the the previous questions so I'm just thinking that we're talking about indigenous media the issue of that nation is is very important because this this concept is not something that we can just take and for granted so we must ask how should we define indigenous media is it is indigenous media some media that is produced by the indigenous people or is it media that is produced for or consumed by the indigenous people or it's indigenous media something like the media about indigenous people I think this distinction is that could be really helpful because it can links back to the like different parts of the the cultural industry like the production and consumption and representation which will be helpful for like a when they think about like cultural change in terms of the more normative kind of way yeah this is also the issue a lot of debating with that but I think right now it's more like anything related with indigenous issues or if they all including in this concept because for example like indigenous arts some indigenous artists they don't like to be clarify us indigenous artists because although he's he he is indigenous people but he would like to be regarded as like a no artist yeah he don't like to be clarify us indigenous but also they are people stay in the tribe more than 20 years and people just regard them as one of them and so how do you define indigenous it become very confusing in some way and so if you if someone know better knowledge than the indigenous people why not he couldn't be regarded as one kind of indigenous people so what's your definition my definition is if about indigenous media or sorry I think if I will not use the uh identification of in terms of ethnic I will in my because I of course if someone boom as indigenous is indigenous but if someone you do pay attention about indigenous issues and do a lot for indigenous people I will think he can be he or she can be part of indigenous community yeah but you can't change your ID card but yeah but you can probably change to high because can't go the other way according to to yesterday our ways was saying how difficult it is to be categorized us uh indigenous I think we can answer another question is like who is British it's not only yeah so how many is there yeah that's the example of that yeah so indigenous media is not only someone born with indigenous identity I think if he do involve with many indigenous affairs I think he can be regarded as one of the indigenous community yeah I'm happy yes I agree with that last comment but just an intersection with the previous questions about the pluralization and how to represent I think including David's comment about what kind of audiences are being catered for I think one um position that I would suggest that we need to consider is that when we use audience research within a media framework we are liable to reproduce the present or formulations of the present because constructing the audience around a kind of you know what would you like scenario in one form or another will reproduce institutional representation as it is or has been projected so to pluralize particularly within a minority framework we would need more kind of agencies of representation which come from a more grassroots and organic background this has been a particular problem in the UK you know to this day we are unable to pluralize our media despite repetitive attempts to do so and all all of the attempts that we had have always reproduced elite formats in minority groupings and I would imagine that that's something which all of the kind of indigenous communities would be struggling with wow thank you I think it must be a comment right do you want to respond to that I think that's a good comment on that note I think do we have our yes break yes oh oh maybe we have the time to just take one more and sure one please everyone's getting doing this yeah so thank you for your engaging talks so we've talked a lot of media and those are all based on language so that makes me thinking about how about using media without language and I'm sure there is at least one possibility choreography yes and the reason why I think I'm thinking about dance is because um recently there is an institute called a high-ranking dance research institute it's orchestrating a series of conference which are of course dance centered but also it invites scholars priests uh poets filmmakers to give talks in order to preserve cultural identity historical memories and also express political discontents so that makes me thinking about the possibility of using bodies dance as a platform to express and preserve these cultural identity so could it be a possibility yeah yeah I think in dance is always important for indigenous culture and I think the indigenous news also reporting a lot of related issues and I think for indigenous people sometimes music and dance also convey a lot of history and and uh uh the cultural background with that so that's why uh in for example there's one one news I didn't show you for example like uh benan tribe in the during the next land new years festival they dance overnight but when they dance overnight is they are showing the whole history so the dance itself is contained in history through dance they just generation by generation to that the younger people understand their own culture and also the singing the singing also no languages yeah that's no language but the the singing even the song itself with a lot of meaning like when they do hunting they have different kind of like different kind of shouting but those different kind of shouting means something different so people can understand people can understand what does that mean there's no language at all but of course it says a lot for about their culture actually yeah sorry we have one more question very sure very sure he's promised me that's not actually a question oh another comment a comment and a comment for to to uh sorry what's your name oh that's very rude what's your name yeah to his uh comment uh I can uh how to say um make it more specific and uh yeah uh yeah uh suming came to germany to berlin actually two years ago and what we have done is picnic and then we've done in a circle with german people and yeah taiwanese fans and even though we don't understand the language we have german interpretive and english interpretive at the same time so yeah no we don't thank you but actually wien wu jia since 1990 so it's not like only cherry okay okay on that note thank you so much and thanks uh uh you know fantastic talk again