 Welcome to Out of the Comfort Zone. I'm your host, RB Kelly. You're watching OC-16 Television and today, well, we'll get to that in a minute. But first, let's start out with your book of the week. So, this is The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg. And this is, well, I know you've all got New Year's resolutions, you've got habits you want to change, things you want to be, improvements you want to make in your life, and in the world. The thing is, those improvements, they hinge on your habits. So if you want to figure out what habits are working for you, what habits you want to break, and you want help breaking those habits, then you want to read The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg. You can find that anywhere that sells books. So that's The Power of Habit by Charles Duhigg, and I think you'll love it. Now onto our body language tip of the week. This is something I actually brought up to a group of HPD officers this morning when I was invited to speak at the training academy for the HPD. And as you know, if you're being arrested, what do they always say? Get your hands up, right? Get your hands in the air. The reason is, if you can't see someone's hands, a part of your brain is always wondering if they're hiding something, if they've got a weapon. It's wondering what they're up to. And it's actually a really powerful doubt that we create in someone's mind when they can't see our hands. You actually see this, the group that trained me at the Science of People. They did studies with trial science. They studied jurors looking at defendants, and they found defendants who talked to the jurors with their hands out of sight under the table. Those defendants were seen as more sneaky, untrustworthy, and deceitful. So whether you're dealing with a police officer, whoever you're dealing with, make sure that your hands are always visible for them to see so they can see your intentions and they can relax and trust you. Now that's the body language tip. That's the book of the week. And I'm really excited because our guest of the week is actually someone I really admire. We're actually like, I'll give you a little preview, a little hint. In the future, she's actually flying here to Hawaii to put on a workshop with me. But I've said too much. Let's start. This is our guest, Susan McVeigh. Hi, Susan. Thank you for coming on the show. Hi, Arby. Right? Okay. Yeah, we'll just focus on your head. You can leave your hands out of it for now. But Susan, I really want to thank you for coming on the show. I really appreciate it. So thank you for having me. I'm super excited. Me too. So first off, Susan, can you explain to our viewers what it is that you do? Sure. So I am a business sales strategist. And I help business owners, entrepreneurs close more sales because I mean, without sales, we have extensive hobbies. And that's not what we're meant to do. But ultimately, having both income and impact while living lives of freedom and flexibility, because ultimately, that's what a lot of my clients have left, usually nine to five or proper careers like me behind in order to be able to do what they love and still be able to make good money doing it. I like that. So you help people to make more sales. Because I know there are so many people, especially here in Hawaii, who we don't like to make sales. We don't want to be that pushy sales person, that sleazy sales person. So what advice do you have for people who have that secret fear? Yeah, the secret or not to a secret fear, because I've had so many people come up to me. And my slogan is I'm the anti sales sales coach. And I help you post style with more ease without the sleeves, because sales gets a bad rap. And what I want people to think about is, as humans, we all are in the business of selling, selling is really just helping people to make a decision that they otherwise wouldn't have come to on their own. And so it's really about teaching, helping people learn a little bit more about what the problem is that they're facing and being able to get a solution. And that regardless of whether you offer a product or service, anything that you're doing, if you're a parent, you're a teacher, you're an educator, whatever it is that you do, if you're trying to get people to do something that they otherwise wouldn't normally do, you are selling. And so selling is service, selling is natural. And the more that we can remove some of the stigma that's attached, where you have the thoughts of the sleazy car salesman, no offense to any car salesman, or sales women that might be out there in the audience. But that's, that's what we've grown up thinking about with sales. And a lot of us, we have a fear, we have a fear of asking people to pay us. We have a fear of doing what we love and getting good money because oftentimes it's something that we would do for free. But it's our passion. It's our purpose. It's our gifts that God has given us. And it's something that we feel really good about. And so sometimes it can feel uncomfortable having to ask people to pay us in order to have this driving business that we ultimately want. That makes a lot of sense. So Susan, what's some of the advice you give to your clients to help them get over that, that difficult conversation and that fear of accepting money? Well, first, I want you to really know that if you are ultimately helping people with whatever you provide through your business, or through your service, if you're a sales professional, then ultimately, you're helping somebody else. So that's what I want people to think about is, sales is helping, sales is serving. And you would never, you would never sell anything to anyone. It didn't need your help in the first place. So as an example is if somebody didn't need their own car, you wouldn't sell them a car wash mitt. It wouldn't make sense because they have nothing to wash. But if they had a dirty car, then you might sell them a whole bunch of stuff because it's going to help them take better care of their car. And so when you see that you are really a facilitator and helping your people lead better lives through getting solutions, the problems that they're struggling with, it makes things a lot easier. So sales is serving sales is helping. And if you aren't able to help somebody, you're not going to bother them anyway. So it's really about finding the person that needs your help the most and being okay to offer your help. And ultimately, if they're willing to take it, you'll key to receive the money that's equivalent to the value of the services that you're rendering. Interesting. So it sounds like you don't work with sleazy sales people, the people who would sell you anything if they could. So you only work with up with the upright people who really are trying to help people. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, my background is corporate. I was a long time sales leader working in corporate finance. And I was there, you get a bad rap regardless of what you're trying to sell. But this is how I've lived my entire life. I'm an introvert. I'm not a natural born sales person. And I don't, I don't teach a cookie cutter approach. I think, as long as you have an area of expertise, and you feel really good about the services that you provide, then yeah, you can never be too pushy or too effusive about the good work that you're doing, because ultimately, you're helping more people. And the more that you can talk about how you help people, the things that you've been able to provide to them, the solution, the transformation, the outcome, and the change that you've thought about, then you can feel good about sharing that information that ultimately it will attract more of the right people to you. So no, I don't work with the sleazy sales professionals. I don't teach aggressive or pushy tactics. Mine is based on relationship based selling, which to be to be frank, it takes longer, because it takes time to build relationships. But ultimately, they're way more meaningful, because you're being right by that person. And even if the person you're building a relationship with, can't use your services, chances are much higher that they're going to connect you with somebody else that's important in their life, that you could actually help. So I think it's a win, win, win all the way around. And I think you're right there, because I've worked with, I haven't worked with, I have dealt with sales people who are very pushy, and are trying, are trying to get me to buy their product. And it's when they don't take no for an answer, or when they don't respect your, your polite deflection, that's one of the biggest signs to me that they're not actually watching out for me. They're just trying to get what they want. So the idea of taking it slower, just building a relationship and seeing where that goes, that I think in the long term, that's a much smarter approach than just like bulldozing through the interaction, trying to cram your product down people's throats. Yeah, I mean, there's a time and a place different buying personalities require different ways of selling. And you need to be able to match, you need to be able to match that person. But being able to recognize where people are at and realizing that the bulk, the bulk of the majority of people out there, they don't want to be pressured, they don't want to be bulldozed like you had mentioned. And they really want ultimately to be heard and listened to. And if you take the time, and regardless of what you sell, or what service you provide, if you actually act as an expert, and you are now an advisor, you have become invaluable as opposed to just a commodity, another business selling a widget, or that service that is on every street front or every corner or every social media platform out there. So it's really about that relationship and positioning yourself as the expert. So you can be that go to person and that trusted person for not only the client, but ultimately, people who are going to refer other clients to you. And from a body language perspective, your approach makes a lot of sense as well. Because relationships, you're able to slowly build it. And I've sometimes had clients where they see me speak, and they sign up for a call and they buy right away. Like relationship, these sales, they don't have to be slow. Sometimes they are. But the relationships you build, they seem to be so much longer lasting than the relationships you have with someone who comes in, crams a product down your throat, you don't know how to say no, so you end up buying and then they disappear and you're like, well, what am I supposed to do now? Yeah, absolutely. And that's where when you focus in the, it's like too much in short term, without really thinking about your long term gains, your long term business strategy, then you're ultimately your customer retention plan. You do yourself a disservice because all of the things that you just described, I think we've all had personal experience where we've been in a situation like that, you get more customer complaints, you get newer customer referrals, and ultimately you get higher percentage of refunds, which nobody wants to deal with all of that, because it's just a pain. And so if you take it a little bit slower, you really identify what you need to do, what your gaps are in order to solidify your sales process. And if that means you need to get better at relationship building. And I love what you teach around body language. I think it's so critical. We miss the clues. People don't always like to see no, especially if you're selling to women. Women make the bulk of the buying decisions and purchases in most households nowadays. And so if you don't know how to sell to women, we buy very differently. And oftentimes we don't feel comfortable vocalizing our opinion or vocalizing how we feel in that moment, especially with somebody we may have just met because we're not comfortable. We don't trust them. We don't believe that they're going to believe us. And so that marrying not only what we say, but what we don't say and what your customers say and what they don't say is really important to be able to homeless still. So you become a better sales person. And regardless of whether you're a professional salesperson at working for somebody else or you are a business owner, you have to master sales because it's the way that revenue gets generated and you continue to make money and stick around for the long term, the longevity of your company. That's the whole point of being in business is to make money. Hopefully you're making a positive impact, but you're there to make money. And I love what you said earlier about how women have a hard time saying no. That is something I hear from my female clients all the time because they don't feel comfortable saying no. So Susan, that's something I'm going to ask you about after the break. But for our viewers, just hang on just a minute. We'll be right back. We're taking a short break and we'll be back in a few minutes. This is out of the comfort zone and I'm your host, Arby Kelly on Think Tech Hawaii. This is Think Tech Hawaii, raising public awareness. For every game day, a sign of designated driver. Aloha, welcome to Hawaii. This is Prince Dykes, your host of The Prince of Investing. Coming to you guys each and every Tuesday at 11 a.m. Right here on Think Tech Hawaii. Don't forget to come by and check out some of the great information on stocks, investings, your money, all the other great stuff and I'll be your host. See you too. Hello, welcome back to Out of the Comfort Zone. I'm your host, Arby Kelly with special guest, Susan McVeigh. And we were just talking about why sometimes it's so hard to say no to a pushing salesperson. Susan, do you have any advice for people who are struggling with this? Yes and no. Some of you give me to practice saying no. And that means you need to be able to say no or voice your opinion or the everyday thing. So sales is a skill and it's a muscle. You need to practice it. And so if you're finding it hard when your spouse or partner asks you, what do you want for dinner? I don't care. But really you have an opinion. You need to start breaking your opinion. You need to start just articulating, no, I don't want this. You might not know exactly what you want yet and that's okay. But the more comfortable that you can get without feeling like you're offending somebody, the easier it's going to be for you to continue to say that and to take out the emotion from the word. Most people don't want to hurt somebody else's feelings. They don't want to be seen as a bad person for someone you know, like, oh my gosh, they're gonna think of me. So the more that you can just practice saying no and even just practice asking what you want, the easier it's going to get for you when it comes to a situation where you have to exert yourself and it should actually matter, like there's some skin in the game. A lot of times when we have that amount of pressure on us, our first instinct is to like walk away, right? Like you just walk away and try to avoid the situation in the first place. So the more that you can practice it, the easier it's going to get. So when you get into a real situation, it's gonna kick in, right? It's just like anything else that we practice. Over time, it's going to become second nature to you. So the more that you can do this in your day-to-day, the easier it's gonna be for you to do it outside of your day-to-day and start moving it into more of the professional or business realm. That makes a lot of sense. And what you said, Susan, about how if someone doesn't want to say no, like feeling the pressure, they just like kind of cave and then disappear. So for you, salespeople in the audience, if you've ever had someone say yes, I'd love to hear more. Or yeah, that sounds super interesting. And then they disappear. Here's what's happening. They meant no, but they said yes. And since you couldn't read their body language, since you weren't paying attention, you heard yes, even though they were saying no. Watch for that. But Susan, you mentioned you have some advice for some of the salespeople in our audience. What advice would you have for them if they're just just starting out, just looking to start making more sales? How can you help? I think that the biggest thing is to not forget that you're you're talking to a human being. And so a lot of times you're you're given training, maybe you're given no training, regardless of what the situation looks like. You start acting weird and uncomfortable because you're so focused on the sale and the dollar value of that customer to you in the transaction that you're trying to have go about. So there's a couple of things. It's people to people. So don't forget that you're a person and they're a person. So don't be weird about this. Just act as if you were talking to your grandma, your aunt, somebody else that you would care about who is a real life person to you. And secondly, don't focus on the transaction. You want to focus on the interaction. And what I mean by that is again, instead of thinking about, oh my gosh, if this person buys from me, all of a sudden I'm going to make X amount in in sales revenue or this is a commission that I'm going to generate. That person starts becoming less of a person and it becomes more of a transaction transactional instead of an interaction where you're actually paying attention to what they're saying. And I love what you just shared earlier because if you pay attention, if you know the clues around the body language, but also you are taking the time to ask a better question and really not be afraid to dig in. This is where don't go surface. And so many sales professionals and business owners, we feel uncomfortable because we don't want to go there. We don't want to keep asking. And again, I want you to think you're an expert. You are in the rule of an advisor. So when it's like when you go to your doctor, you don't expect your doctor to just sit there and you give them all the answers and just know the doctor is asking questions and then more questions and then more questions and then more questions. And you're thinking like one is this ever going to end. And it's not to say that for every customer, you need to send 20 questions. But I'm going to I'm going to challenge you and say, are you actually asking enough questions? And what types of questions are you asking? Are they the right questions to read your client to figure out for themselves that they actually need your product for service and ultimately for you to learn that as well. Because remember what we have shared at the great beginning, which is you're never going to sell anything that somebody doesn't need or want. And the only way to do that is by asking the quality questions up front so that you have that confidence when it comes time to make the offer, make the clothes, do your pitch, whatever wording that you want to use. It's comfortable and familiar for you, but you don't always then freak out and start to feel uncomfortable because you already know, you know in your heart of hearts this person they desperately need what it is that you're going to offer. And they're going to be so excited because it's taken the time to actually listen to them, hear them. And now you have perfect solutions to help them with their struggle. I absolutely agree with that. And I know sales scripts, sales scripts have their place. It's helpful to know what you should say. But I think it's even more powerful when you're asking questions because you can actually figure out if someone needs your product. And it's happened to me so many times where someone jumps on a call with me and I'm asking them questions. And by asking them questions, they actually figure out that they actually do need my product. Like they sell themselves because of the questions I've asked. Exactly. Yep. That's it. So Susan, I know I'm sure you have intrigued a lot of the people in our audience. And I know because I know you personally, there's so much more to talk about. So we've got just between five, 10 minutes left. Where can people go if they want to learn more about you and what you do? Sure. So you can go to my website, which is SusanMcBae.com or on Facebook, SusanMcBae there as well. And would love to be able to connect and find out a little bit more about your audience members as well. A lot of what I put out in terms of my content and the things that I talk about are inspiring to some people just telling me what they're struggling with so that I can continue to help and do my part in raising down the sales stigma because I'm here to see more self-sneed millionaires, jillionaires really. I'd love everybody to be able to make as much as they possibly want while continuing to have that huge impact and ultimately love what they're doing even more. Sales is the first step. And it's funny today I was on another training and she said the number one thing everybody needs to focus on in a business is sales. Once you've mastered sales, then you can start thinking about systems and processes and automations and all of the other things that can do some heavy lifting for us. But if you don't know how to sell and you don't have that process nailed down, it makes things really challenging. So there is a very specific order of things at least that I have learned that I believe in, especially when you're trying to build a freedom-based business. And so that's some of the things that I generally talk about when I'm helping my clients and my students. I read a really interesting statistic that said if you took all the money in the world and divided it equally between everyone, everyone would be a millionaire. And I'm not suggesting we take money from the rich and give it to I'm not suggesting that. I just think it's fascinating because there is plenty of money for everyone. And so many people they're stuck in this mindset of, oh, I can't go into business. Oh, I can't ask for the sale. There's just not enough. There's just not enough. And they're stuck in this scarcity mindset. But if you actually look at it, there's plenty for everyone. If you just figure out how to ask. Absolutely. And this is the thing. One of my very best friends in the online space is also a business consultant. And we focus on different areas. But ultimately, we help the same basket of people. And so you would think, well, how could you possibly be friends? Well, because of that, right? Somebody needs you specifically because your story, your background, your experience, your perception, how you teach things, how you come up with your product is very unique to you. So you don't need to worry about all of that, but you do need to make sure that you have the skills. And luckily, sales is something that you can learn as a self-professed, like, hugely shy person. I stumbled into the sales world and became an expert at it selling well over $600 million between myself and my team. If you had asked me straight out of university, if that was my picture for myself, that you were crazy. So if I can do this, you can do it. Anyone can do this. It's just a matter of figuring out what you need to learn and being able to have the right road map that feels good for you. And so if you ever have been taught sales from somebody else and it felt really awkward or uncomfortable and that person hasn't been able to adjust, I'm going to say that they probably they weren't as great a teacher as maybe they were a salesperson and not everybody can do that. I love that. And I'm not the best sales person, but I am the best sales trainer. I've learned that over my experience. And so for me, I, I'm, I'm really good at teaching sales and I sell myself. Absolutely. I know how to do it now, but it's been a process. I didn't learn that overnight and certainly did. I was not born with it. So if I can learn it, you can learn it. I love that. And I love what you said earlier about how you were teaming up with someone else, even if you sold to the same group of people and viewers that's also what I'm doing with Susan, like Susan and I both work with sales people. But I wanted to bring her onto the show because she's awesome at what she does. And because in the areas where I am really weak, she's really strong and vice versa. So that's actually why we're teaming up in the future. We're going to, as the months get closer, it'll be sometime in the summer, we're going to be doing a really awesome sales workshop for sales professionals. So keep an eye out for that. It's coming. It's in the future. But Susan, thank you so much for coming. I'm so glad we could clear our schedules and get you on to this TV show. Really glad you're here. Me too. It's been a pleasure. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you, Susan. Now, viewers, I know there is so much more to talk about. I wish we had more time, but I just want to thank you, viewers, for those of you who are in small businesses, for those of you who are in any business and for those of you who are supporting these businesses. That's how our country stays alive. That's how our economy keeps working. That's how all of us make enough to eat at the end of the day to just keep living. So thank you for supporting your local businesses. Thank you for supporting each other and thank you for finding the drive and the courage to step out and start your own businesses. Thank you for getting out of the comfort zone. And I hope you get even further out of the comfort zone this week. Thank you, everyone. Have a wonderful day.