good morning good afternoon wherever youare on the globe uh this is works ofeurope 2020 withits second day of presentationsuha first note is that i just made achange to the schedule for todayuh the presentation fromdmitry komnikov from bitwise works wason the scheduleto be to follow up lewis rosenfall hispresentation on the roadmap for arc osbut that has been moved to the eveningand after lewis rosenthal's presentationalex taylor his presentation will be upuh with hiswith this update on the arc noaa packagemanager sothose two presentations have beenswapped around in the scheduleuh first off is lewis rosenthal and hewill be giving us an overview of the uhplanned road map for arc os 5.1and what all of the planned features areandwhat they have all been working on andwhat we are going to expect for version505 of uh arc os which seems to be closeto release sowe'll now switch over to lewis live thisis actually not a pre-recordedpresentation this one is livebut i suggest that it's easier if youuh ask the questions later we'll monitorthe uh irc channel and the youtube videostream for thatso if you have any questions it's easierif you canwrite them down and thenask questionsat the end of the presentationlewisthe floor is digitally yours so welcomethank you thank you hi everyonewe've been chatting anywaysaying hi seemsvery veryodd buthi anywayumsorry i'm a bit underexposed if i am uhit's just the layout of my office withmy my windows behind me and we finallyhave somebright sunshineon east coasti'm gonna i'm gonna mute my speakersover herejust because uh they're making somenoisesouh we're gonna start with the umthe uh the first slide which i supposeis up right now i'm not looking at thelive stream so i really have no ideaumi'm going to give you a quickwellsort of quick overview as to what we'vegot umcooking for 2020and that will start withumarc os 505 andwhat we're working on with 5.1so slide 2 pleaseokay i turn my speakers back on becausei realize i have absolutely no way ofknowing if there was anything going onon the far end of this call soum all right sobefore we getuh into the into the weeds here let mejust run down some release terminologyso that we're all clearonwhatwe're talking about when we discussreleasesa major release is a major versionnumber so we had os 2 1.0 one uh 2.0 3.04.0um you could argue that world 4.5 wasreally warp 5 but ibm didn't call itthat so we started arca os at 5.0 that'sa major releasewill there be a major release of arca osumsixprobably but we haven't planned that farout yeta significant point release is not quiteas drastic as a major release but itdoes have new featuresumall of the work that we've been doingwith the 5.0 release cyclehas beenmaintenanceumfixes uh enhancements to theinstaller and of course the updaterwhich was a new featurebut generally we don't addnew contentduring umduring maintenance releasesthat would be for a significant pointrelease so when find out one comes outwe will have new featuresas well as new languagesbecause as we know 5.0is still english onlyand as i say the last bullet point onthe slide a bug fix or maintenancereleaseall the 5.0 releases that we've had havebeen maintenance releasesuh 505 should be the last oneand then we'll move to to 5.1next slide pleaseso505 is scheduled for release this monthum it'swe're very close we're in the laststages of the last datajust ironing out a couple of thefinal wrinklesuh that will be released this month uhthat's the way it looks from here todayunless something major falls in the nextcouple of days5.1 will be the next significant pointreleasewhich is probably going to be sometimein 2021uh we'll go through a normal releasecycle with that the same way we did with5.0 so we'll have 5.1.15.1.2i don't know how many 5.1s will haveand then ultimately we'll get to 5.2we have not planned outwhere 5.2 is going to beum we're really focused on 505 and then5.1next slide pleaseso in 505we're going to have the debut of usb 3support xhci controllersyou'll be able toinstall arc os on a system that is usb 3only for the first time everand you can do that with a usbstickuh and a usb keyboard and a usb mouseall connectedto the xhci controllerand your installation should justrun like usualwe have an updated flat 32 for the firsttime inthe entire 5.0 release cycleour cache is working in fact 32 nowuh it's not a speed demon performanceenhancements will come laterbut it is much more stablethaneither thethe0.9.13 release from net labswhich is our immediate predecessoruh and it's certainly more stable thanthe fat 32 that we've had to datewe have an updated union release 226which supports more mixers in factnext to me i havea thinkpad t560that had no sound on it whatsoeverand with the latest uni yard it's gotbeautiful soundumand in fact the audio in this laptopknocked my socks offit istruly amazinguh 505 will also have updated mozillaapps everyone has been clamoring for[Music]something newer than firefox 38.8and c monkey 235 so we have firefox45.9.0thunderbird 45.8and c monkey 242.9[Music]which isn't really an official seamonkey release it's sort of in between242 and 243.umandum[Music]the apps arefairly stable from mozilla appshow's that fora disclaimerbut they aremuch more useful today than the olderversionthey do stayin the same placeum in the same manner as the the old ummozilla apps so we're not installingfrom rpm yet uh we haven't made thatchange to the uh to the packagingif you if you're doing an updatethey will replace whichever versions youhaveunder the programs directory in yourinstallationsamba has the samba client has beenupdated to ford.11.5which is a current shipping samba fromthe upstream cyber projectthey've made some changes to[Music]what they consider to beminimum requirementsfor connectivity inthe later samba 4.11 buildsand we've made changes in archimapperto help mitigate those for people whoare runningumothernetworkhostswhere we were connecting before withouta problem we need to sort ofuhback levelsamba 4.11 so thatit will negotiate with those thingsand the first one of the of archimapperuh it will promptas to whether you want to relaxthe smb oneuh restrictionnormally smb1 is consideredumdeprecated at this pointbut uh so sambal 4.11 will start offnegotiating at smb2which means that you won't see your smb1hosts on the networkwe prompt now toallow you to set that specifically soyou can see those thingsand there are various other applicationsthat have been updated in the package asusualdrivers are the latest uh the latestavailable buildsandthe unix compatibilitysubsystem is updatedto the latestthe latest packages availablewe now include usb audio for class 1 andclass 2 devicesselectable in the um thehardware selectionsexpand the usbofferingsand you should see an option to selectusb audio therewe also includea utility usb auto switchthat you can add to umto start upit's just a an object in the multimediasetup folderand that works like a traditionalheadphone jackso if youplug in your usb audio device audio willautomaticallydefault to the usb audio for output andif you disconnect it it will switch backto your internal audiosome people may find that useful itdepends upon what your usb audio deviceis and how how you have it connected youhave it connected all the timeand you want to switch back and forththat'snot all that helpful to you butif you plug it in and unplug itthen it's it's pretty handy to haveand we also um allow a selection of usbethernetdavid did a new driver for the moss chipusb to wired ethernet adapters it's apretty popular chip for those devicesyou can select thatinyou can select that inpre-boot and you can select itin the um the actual installerand we have some locale and keyboardupdates uh because as you know ibm leftoff with warp 4.5 in the 1990sessentially well before at leastand the world has changed quite a bit sowe'reworking to try to keep current withthose changesnext slide pleasewe have some exterior stabilityenhancements in 505umso the installers should be morereliable more robust than it had beenbeforeyou can now select virtualbox questeditionsuh installing a virtualized environmentyou can do that from theselection pagethat's useful when you're installingunder virtualbox if you're installing ina virtual machine under anotherhypervisordo not install those guest additions forvirtualbox because they won't workthey only work with virtualboxalso if you're planning to run thevirtualboxhoston arca osdon't install the virtualbox guestadditions because they're specificallyfor arca os running as a guestunder virtualboxrunning on something elseyou can now select your kerneland yourumadd results during the updating processwe now set those aside switch back tocommand as the umas the default shell so we can getthrough the uh the update process andthen we flip that backto what the the customer had beforewhen we're all donealso broken paths we see lots of brokenlive path statementsumbefore people with big problemsbut they're reallydlls in the right directoriesand the path makes umsensebut wedeal with that in the updater now sothat that should notstop us from from getting the softwareupdatedand the disk utility logichas been improvedinstallation on systems where we shouldbe able to installnext slide pleaseso 5.1everyone's going to takesignificant time um probably 9 to 12monthscould be more than thatsome languages are closer to being readythan othersbut honestly the 5.1 contenthasn't beenfully laid out yetso the trunk of our development tree isstill focused on 505and not 5.1um so while the translations are comingalong really wellthey'repretty much at the 505 level right nowso we need to get the the new content inthere for 5.1and get those itemsuh localized before anywhere near readytoto do a 5.1 releaseso the following slides are going to bevery forward-lookingum a lot of these things are in our planbut we haven't started working on themyetplease don't take this as any promisefor delivery of anythingumbut this is what weuh this is what we intend to do for 5.1as of todaynext slide pleaseso we're going to introduce an upgradefacility because it's kind of silly torelease 5.1 and tell everyone okay nowyou need to reformat your drive fromarka os 5.0 and reinstall everything torun under 5.1so the upgrade facilitylike the update facility that we havenowwill take any arca os 5.0 release andand upgrade thatto 5.1that's at least the plan we haven'tstarted working on the upgrade facilityyetsometime during 5 the 5.1 release cycleprobably not5.1.0 but somewhere along the linewe want to introduce a migrationfacility for those last holdovers stillrunning ecscertainlytomigrate those ecs installs fromeastwest 102to arca os5.1possibly we can we can migratehow far back we can go with themigration facilityrealisticallythat's in the plan for the 5.1 releasesiteall right so main standard tweaks andenhancementsumwe've talked recently about adding apage exit checkso for instanceum when you're on the networking pageand you selectibm file and print if you forget toselect a net bios protocolfile and print will not be installedand when you get done with that ofcourse you wonder well where am ifollowing print objects wellyeah you don't have your phone printobjects becausethe prerequisite for file and print isnot bioswhat the page exit check would do wouldstop you from leaving that pageand remind you that you had toinstall a netbios protocolumthere are other places where the pageexit checkcomes in handyuh that's just one example so that'sone enhancement to the installer that wewe plan to introduce in 5.1another thing that's come up recentlyhas beenuhthe issue withsystems wherethere have beenfor instance experimental packages uhinstalled from netlabs xand thenwe come along to do an updateand we can't complete the update becausethe experimental packages on the systemare newer than what we shipfrom the releaserepositoryin the arc os mediumsohalf the installation doesn't completewhat thethe 5.1 plan would uhincludewould be the ability toallow accesstoremote repositories during theinstallation itself or the up or theupgradeso thatwe can get those newer packages and theinstallation will complete there's a lotto consider there we haven't consideredall of theall the downside to that approachbut it seems likeit'sof it would be a valuable uh change forus to makeand more locale fixesuhnext slide pleaseso we'd like to have the new audiodriver based on freebsdin 5.1umthat doesn't mean that uni route isgoing away even if we do have the newaudio driver uni yard would still beshipped and still be availablewe have no plans to pull that outso if it worksgreat continue to use itbut we hope to have the new audio driverwhich would support moremore chipsin 5.1 we'll have to seewe really want to enhance snapand update it to support at least intelhd videoumthat work hasreally not yet begun in earnestumwe'll see we'll see where we where we gowith thatnew selective installers uh if anyone'sused selective installin arc osuh you would have noticed that it'sstill the workforce selective installutilitywith some of thebits and pieces masked out so they don'tmake troublewe want to replace that whole facilitywithindividual selective installersthat are focused on one specific thingso it becomes a much more modularselective install processand then all those objects would go intoone folderso that you could selectively installa new keyboard layoutora new i o boardsomething like thatum[Music]improved session support umalex mentioned yesterday that uh in uefithe dos session support sort ofsidesteps a lot of the problems thatwe've had recentlywith systems removing bio supportrequired by the dos subsystemwell we'd like to have thatimproved session support for biosinstalls as wellsome of us still use dos applicationsevery dayand dos isreally importantalso there is a hugepotentially huge untapped market in theretro gamingumareaand there are some great dos and win 3-1games out therethat we could play beautifully on arcaosif we hadreally really goodsolid reliabledos andwino s2 support on these modern systemswe're going to rewrite archimappercompletelywith someluckplanningstrategizingit would be niceto haveuma samba4 based serverat the same level as our samba fourbased clientswith one universal gui availableto manage both of themsort of likepeer networking but for sambain one placewhich would removethe confusion that users have betweensharing resources and accessing sharedresourcesit would put everything in one place andthe user would no longer need to beconcerned withhis samba server versus his salva clientit would be oneunified packagetying into that would be credentialsmanager because credentials manageris going to handle our kerberos ticketsfor usas well asntlmv2uh username passwordsfor mainly for uhsamba sharesso those three lost bullet points onthis pagego together as a setthat's part of the 5.1 planas i say we haven't startedthat work yet well credentials managerumwe have in beta butnot the way it it should end up in inall of this when we're donenext slide pleaseso a new rewritten printer manager rightnow we have multiple objects formanaging printers and creating printerstraditional printers cops printers we'dlike one unified printer manager to rollthem allthat work hasn't started yet but it surewould be nice to haveumthe desktop notebook background pagefrom the days before wallpaper wascalled wallpaper and it was still calleda desktop backgroundhas had some really reallylong standingissueslike the double entriesumand the lack of being able tobrowse around[Music]comfortably to find new wallpaperwe'd like to fix thatso that's in the plan again that workhasn't started yeta new hardware manager there are acouple of interesting replacementcandidatesumso we'd like to put in something that'sa little more useful than what we haveright nowmulti-macwi-fi driversthat's another thing that people havebeen clamoring to seeanddavid's attention has been focused onusb 3 rightfully sosothe the wi-fi drivers are in the in thedriver queueandwe're really hoping to be able torelease those sometime in the 5.1 cyclea new desktop search utility you know asdrives are getting largerfinding things that we have is becomingmoreof a problemand many of us waste more time duringthe day trying to find thingsthan we really should especially as ourmemories are starting to go umso there is astandard desktop search utility opensource called recall and we did a reportof that foros2we had to update that port andintegrate that with thethe desktop a little bitbetterand ship thatas the default desktop search utilityand i would search for content in openoffice filespdfsumlotussmart suite filesand so on and so forthjava 8 would be really nice to haveour java 6 is really starting to showits age it's not very usefulfor modern javaapplicationsagain java 8 work has not begun inearnestso this is really a forward-lookingstatement but it's something we wouldlike to have in 5.1can we do thatfor 5.1.0probably notcan we do that sometime during 5.1before 5.2quite possibly because i would expectthat the 5.1 release cycle is going torun two to three yearsso sometime in thereit's entirely possibleit's in the plannext slide pleaseso you'd also like to have it selectableinthe installeras to whichplatformis preferred for the systembeing installedright now we default to i-686 for theunix compatibility subsystemuh it is possible to change from i-686to pentium 4 after installit's not pretty it's not easy but it canbe doneit is so much nicer to start off on theright foot and selecttheumthe proper platform from the get-go sowe want to add that into the installerthat should not be a terrible thing andwe do shipthe pentium 4 packagesin the installationright nowsowe're prepared for that that changethat'sthatumselection is almost a given for 5.1 atthis pointwe're going to add some new text editorsand calculatorsum creature comfortsumright now we have a very limitedselection of editors and calculatorsthat we shipuh so we'd like towiden those horizons a little bitum there's a movie nc serverumthat andre the silken has put togetherbased on ultra vnc that worksreally really well and we would like toswap out thevnc server and viewer that we're usingnow for that oneuh so that'ssort of in the plan we haven't reallylooked closely at what it's going totake to make that changebut we'd like to do thatwe have started looking at improving theimat config settings for better out ofbox network performanceremember that thethethe network stock tuningis only moderately improved from whereibm left off in the 1990s when we werestill doing dial-up networkingsofinding a set ofuniversalumtuninguhsettingsthat work forwell i say universal almost universaliskind of difficultalmost every machine and mixis differentin so far asthethe stock tuning is concerned everynetwork is differentin so far as the stack tuning isconcernedwe'd like to improve what we have nowwhile not breaking it for other systemsso it's a it's a careful process but wewant to include that in 5.1we'd like to includealongwhich goes along with ournetwork securityphilosophysquid proxy and provoxyavailablefor system-wide useeither individually or chained togetherwith a configuration guiagain that hasn't even beenhasn't even been sketched at this pointbut something that would providean easier setup than the entirely manualprocess that's required now to get thetwo of them working togetherthat will go a long way to keeping userssufficiently anonymizedandimproving network performance forbrowsingso that's in the plannext slide pleaseumnvme is the successor toahcinvme isspecifically aredesigned for use with solid statedriveswe do not have a driver for nvme yetbut more and moreportable systems are shippingwith nvmecontrollersand the specificationsquite oftensaysata or nvmewhich doesn't do us a heck of a lot ofgood uh when we only support one of thetwosonvme is probably the next um the nextdriver ondavid's workbenchi don't like toto speak for him butwe've had a number of discussionsabout the ordering ofumof device driversto be developednvme is pretty close to the top of thelistafter uh finishing usb 3.multi-mac wlan that i mentioned beforeis also in the listumdt audio which was friendlythe digital transfer agent dtawhich allows for windows 3 1audio to be routed to unionultimatelythis componentwill allowdos audio through a virtual soundblaster device driverto also be routed to auto union or thenewuh audio driver the new universal audiodriverthat'sthat's thetheoverarching plan for that componentso what it does then is it makesthe windows um subsystem in arca ospart of the main system in other wordsthe system will not go mute when youstart running windows 3 1 applicationsagain this plays into the need forsupporting those retro gamesqt5 which of course is available now andthe new qt5 based browser which isupcominguh we want to include in 5.1 that doesnot mean that we have any planswhatsoeverto remove the mozilla applications themozilla apps will stay in the 5.1distributionas long as they're still usefuluh butsinceone of the other design principles ofarca os as with os2 isfreedom of choicewe would like to give users the freedomof choiceto install more than one browsermore than onebrowser platform sofirefox c monkey and qt5are the logical choicesumalex talked yesterday about uefi supportwhat should they view 5.1thatthat development is truly moving alongvery quicklyand we do plan to release uefi with 5.1shouldthose modern systems that we have notbeen able to touchto this point in timeagain the warning not all of these haveeven been writtenhave even been sketched out have evenbeen anything more than a line on a wishlistbutthat's the plan from herenext slide pleasefinally um localization for 5.1we have workingat the 505 levelgerman spanish french italiansimplified chinese japanese koreanand dutchnow those are in various stages ofcompletiongerman and spanish are probably the mostcomplete of the whole group of thembut they're all buildand they all have various componentsthat have been translatedthe ibm stuff of courseis translated for all of them and thenbits and pieces of the third partycomponentshave been translatedin process we have russian andtraditional chinese russian is reallycoming along well so we're going toprobably soonstart building russian in in our betasand we can do more languagesit's all a function of um the marketif there's a need for more languages wewill do more languageslanguages that are the toughest ofcourse are languages which were neveravailable for os2 in the first placefor for warp 4or for mcpremember thatmcp narrowed the list of languagesconsiderablyso we have the ability to drop back andstart with work for as a base for ourlanguagesbefore work four not having the wordfour components available becomes apretty tedious processnot impossible it can be donebutuh it would be difficultumwhat does this mean well it means thatumconversational klingon is probably notgoing to be released with 5.1i'm just throwing that out there i don'twant anyone to get false hopeum[Music]butwe can do more languagesuhif should the need arise andand this is the the key part of itas long as we have translators to do thetranslatingit all comes down to translatorsumi can read probablythree to four to five languagesi can get by readingi would not trust myself to translateany of thoseandthere's nothing like a translation by anative speakerthere's nothing like it soumwe need we need translators forany new languages to comeon and that's about what we have plannedfor 5.1 and that should take us from2020into2021and with that i'm going to switchcameras and we can chat a little bitluis for your presentfor your presentationumlet's see here i'm just looking to seeif there are any questionslet me check the youtube channelwell there's an off topic question fromhdrw ifthe new qt5 browser will be to do thateveryone see me now if if if uh the newbrowser will be able to do recaptcha yesit will and firefox 4d5 already does itsothe user hdrw you need to you're probably usingfirefox 38 and that's outdated so youneed to upgrade or get 5 arc os 5.05and siegert lewis is asking on theyoutube chat if umuh german is going to be released inwith version 505no505 is going to be english only and um5.1 will be the first uhthe firstnon-english versionsi'm just looking on the chat here ifthere are any other questionsthe irc channel so farby the way there's a question we triedto reach you during your presentationbutwhile you were talking it sounded likeyou were in a thin can because the audiois verydistorted how close is the microphone toyour mouth because it the audio cameacross very distorted there's themicrophoneokay yeahso i don't know why i mean should i havemoved it down further should iif i put it down here is that any isthat any better now it seems to bebetter from my perspective at least wellseehad i only known i pressed the button onthese crazy usb speakers and they theyturned offsohey let's sorry about that no problemagain[Laughter]um i'm well it and there were some smallbandwidth issues so in some cases halfof a sentence dropped out but thatseemed to be more of a bandwidth issuesomewhere along the roadum i'm just looking to see if there areany other questions on thechannelyes people are now confirming that theaudio is betteri was wondering if people had any otherquestions for uhlewis regarding uharka os in the road mapand as usually you need to wait about 20to 30 seconds due to the delay on the ontheon the stream[Music]yeah that's a more generic questionthatdavidantonello is asking on the youtubechannel here i'm just reading it off thescreen that i have on the side of mewhat about more compatibilityinteraction with modern devices slashtechnology androidcloud services usb smart card etcwell aside fromxhci support class drivers are aseparate issue soif there are specific class drivers thatare needed for various usb devicesumthey can be donebut we don't have specific plans for anyat this pointother thanum supporting more usbumethernet chipsandprobably usb wi-fi at some pointumotherconnectivity to i'm not sure what otheruh i'm not sure whatcloud service connectivity would berequired that we don't have and i cananswer this one david anatello is askingfor cups updates well you can just fireup arc noah package managerand download your updates that way sowell we ship the latest uh the latestcups that's available from um the netlabs release channel right nowso if there if ifcops is in need of an updatethena ticket should be opened at um at thebitwisegithubpage i guessand and i can also partly answer uh davethis question about connectivity i meanconnection to cloud connectivity soundsa bit like uh like a cloud serviceadvertisementsorry to sound like that but when itcomes to connectivity to the cloud imeanforservices likegoogle driveandthere are a couple of uh pluginsavailable for the net drive softwarethat yuri dario made from italythatallows you to connect to some of theseonline storageserviceswell there's a web dev uh plug-in fornetdriveumof course you need to have the full netdrive license in order to use non-sambapluginswith netdriveand you can get a full net drive licensefor a very modest feeand you can buy it through the arkanoaweb shopend of shameless plug umbut the the web dav plug-in works verywellumi that's what i use to connect to uh tonetlabs no it's it's not just web devthere's also aplugin available for example yes dropboxyeahi don't think there's one for googledrive butespecially with the new upcoming qtbased browser which will be much moreup to date and the firefox html5 engineyou should be able to connect a wholelot better to services like google docsand google drivesure you can you canactually you can write down all of yourpersonal informationand just submit that directly to googlethey're waiting to get your informationright now you can send them whatever youlike yeahread read the license agreement of 70pages where you sign away everything ofyour privacy including your dreamsanywayum let's see here there are somequestions on the let's see here theumthere is are no questions on theuhyoutube channel currentlythere are a couple of questions howeveron the irc channeland somebody is keith 13 is asking whatis the reason not to have languages forthe arc os 505 releaseokay sothe reason why we were going to releaseuh german and spanishin 505andthey're not quite ready to go yet soinstead of holding up 505foruh german and spanishwe decided to let 505 goum as english onlyandbekeeping with our philosophy thatfeatures are introduced inminor releasesit made more sense to releaseuh localizationsin 5.1 than in 5.0sowhat this means is that we will probablyhave more languages initially availablein 5.1 than we would have had in 505 and505 will now ship soonerthat's the reason whyokaythere's also another question i don'tyou're also on the irc channel i thinkthat's an interesting question the userwith the cryptic username a one twothree four five six seven eight nineis asking is there an sdk available forusb device drive for development for thexhei stack i guess that's a question fordavid that we don't know that's aquestion for david because if if thereisgoing to be an sdk available he would bethe one to make it availableoh and just another question popped upfrom davidantonelliand having worked on ecom station ithink this is something which is waydown on the priority list i assumewhat he's asking for is is there a planto improve pm graphics display likesmooth phone display and icc colormanagement and alpha channeltransparencyto put it flat out i think your answerwill probably be no since we still don'teven have native video chips at driversupport soi think that that would be somethingthatthat wouldumprobably follow enhancements to snapwhen we getwhen we get an enhanced snap and we candrive the these hd video chipsand we can support retina displaysthings like thatthen we can look atumenhancing the the graphics umsubsystem itself butthat stuff is way down on the list yesand i actually work these daysi work for a company that developsindustrial printing applications and weare currently very busy with icc colorprofiling and i can certainly assure youthat is a expertise field within itselfuhyeah i won't uhyeah it's it's that's going to be a bigchunk of work for you guys anyway so umlet's seeare there any other questions here i seethere's somechatting going on on the channelbut i don't see any further questionspopping up here let's see here of thereon the youtube channelthere are currently also no questionsummr faulty is just being his usual selfbut he doesn't mind when i say thati think that's just about itokay soand actually that's perfectlyoh wait a minuteno there are no further questions sothank you for your time and the goodnews is we're actually within time westarted on time and we end with a fewminutes to spare before alex canwe can push onto the stage next souh oh wait a minute there's stillanotheri haven'tuhoh always two user i will deal with thatquestion he's asking about a bitwiseworks donation for open office and hesays question about for lewis butthat's not your departmentnot particularlyokaythanks lewis i think that those are thequestions thatthat peopleyeah there isyeah okay oh yeah there's one morequestion about graphical boot displayand animationum that alex answered that questionyesterday in his uefa presentationthere is going to be still book logosupporting you with your fight but ifthat's going to beuhif that's going to be with animation idon't knowi think these are a bit icings on thecakeor a cherry on top of a very large pieand we've already you guys got alreadyenough on your plateideally the system should boot fastenough thatyou would not even have time to enjoy ananimation during the boot processumbuti don't think that we're going to haveanimation in the the bootloader but wewill have a boot logo we'll havesomething to to put on the screenokay okay lewis sorry we can't give youcan't hear a virtual applause i justwanted to take the warp 4 sound with theclapping hands and uh and play that inthe loop but uhokaythanks for your timeumand then we'll now move over to alex hisuh presentation thanks louis stayhealthy and we'll see you online thankyou bye-bye sounds good bye-byeokay thanksokay um we'll take a very short breakwhile we prepare alex's presentation andwe'll probably beresuming the video stream within thenext two minutes or so while we preparethepre-recordedregisteroh okay actuallyalex's presentation will go live nowumit is a pre-recorded presentation againso but alex will be available live afterthe presentationto answer any of your questionssoi would suggest thatyou can start a presentation right nowpleasehello everyone my name is alex taylorand i'm an osu software developercurrently working for arkanoidi'm the principal developer of arkanoidpackage manager or anpmwhat i'm going to talk about today iswhere anpm stands in the year 2020and movingforward sowhat is an bmas i just said it stands for arkanoidpackage manageralthough you could say it's actuallymore of a package manager managerwhat it does is provide a unifiedgraphical front end to other packagemanager frameworks specifically yum upto nowand starting with the upcoming version1.1warping as wellit runs on modern os2 systems not justarc osand is designed to make packagemanagement easy or easierfor average usersand the software is open source licensedunder the gpland pmversion 1.0 was first released in2015. as noted it supports the yumpackage management frameworkwhat is thatwell to describe yum very brieflyit installs software using rpm packageswhich is a format that originated on redhat linux but has been widely adoptedelsewhere since thenit uses centralized online softwarerepositories to provide these rpmpackages which lets clients see when newsoftware is available or existingsoftware has been updatedit provides dependency managementmeaning that it will also downloadinstall and update dependent packages asneededand it installs updates removes andotherwise manages these softwarepackages using a transaction basedsystemso that's what anpm version 1.0 providesa graphical front end toothe current version of anpm is1.0.4 which was released last yearokaylet's take a look at how anpm works withyumfirst of allit requires the os2 yum rpm frameworkif you don't have this installed thenthe first time you run a npmit will offer to download and install itfor youas written a npm is a mixture of vxrexthe graphical user interfacespecifically and a collection of pythonscripts which make up the interface withthe yum engineevery yum operation launched within anpmis implemented by starting a pythonscript which runs and reports itsresults back to the guithere are a few other special taskswhich are implemented through externalutilities for examplewget is used to download the initial yumrpm install packageopensslis used for password encryption anddecryption when working with securerepositorieswhat are secure repositorieswellnormally yum repositories are configuredusing text files which are located inthe edc yum repos.d directory under theunix root path on your systemrepositories which require a user id andpassword for access can be configuredusing this method as wellby simply including the user id andpassword in the uri address in theconfiguration filenow because these are text files doingthat is not very secure because anyonewith access to that file can simply readthe password from itthis is a particular issue under os2which is a single user operating systemand doesn't normally allow for fileaccess restrictionsso to get around this what a pm does isstore information about securerepositories in a special profile filewith the password encryptedwhenever a yum operation is launchedwhich requires access to repositoriesthe passwordis decrypted in memory and passed alongto the to yum via pipealong with the repository address and itdoes this foreach and everysecure repository that you haveconfiguredthis means that the unencrypted passwordis never stored on disk it's encryptedand decrypted using a unique fingerprintwhich is derived from the computer'shardwarenow if your computer hardware changesthat signature obviously will changehoweveranpm is smart enough to recognize thisand will simply prompt for you tore-enter the password one timethat will then be encrypted and storedwith the new hardware fingerprintlike any complex systemoccasionally something may not workquite rightif this happens there are a few ways youcan try and troubleshootthe first thing to figure out isis this problem caused by yum forexamplea problem in a particular ibm package aproblem on the repository or somethingin the yum engine itselfor on the other handis it an anpm problemit's important to know whichso that the problem can be reported tothe right peoplenow if you can't determine this then youcan report on the arkanoid bug trackerso we can work with you to determinewhere the problem lies and if necessarypass it along to the right peopleat any rate to see if it's a yum problemtry to run the equivalent operationusing the young commands that are shownon the slidehere you might also try using the yumcleanup and maintenance commands whichare available in the yum tools menuthis can sometimes help if the cachedata on your system has gotten corruptedor out of syncthe next thing to do islook at the anpm log filewhich is called anpm.logand resides in your log files directoryanother thing that you can try isrunning a npm in debug modeand you would do that by running a npmfrom a command line and adding theswitch slash debugthis will open a debug console withvarious trace output alongside the mainand pm window this output is also savedto the file anpm.dbgwhich is located again in the log filesdirectorythis information may not be especiallyuseful to you but if you end up openinga ticket on mantis it might be veryuseful to the nice people who respond toyour ticketuh finally if a npm actually crashes andyou can usually tell when that happensbecause you'll get an error pop up witha message like error online whateverum if that happens look for a filecalled ampm.e.r.rwhich should be located in the amdprogram directoryokay looking at some common issuesrelated to a npm and yum specificallyfirst up a lot of people see this one amessage saying error rpmdb checksum isinvalidnormally this only shows up in the anpmlog filebut in some older versions thisoccasionally made it through to the guialthough i think we've managed toeliminate that by nowyou may also see it by the way if yourun yum from the command line in anycase it's a harmless message which iscommonly generated by yum when doingvarious thingsit is normalor at least in the last couple ofversions of yum for os2 so you can justignore it if you see itanother error message you mightoccasionally see is a long string ofgobbledygook followed byno more mirrors to trywhat this message generally means isthat one of your young repositories isofflineand the aforementioned string ofgobbledygook should actually include thename of the offending repositoryunfortunately when this error occurs yougenerally have to wait for the networkrequest timeout before it comes backso when that happensyou will probably notice a npm stallingfor a while before the error messageappearsand if you encounter this messagebasically all you can really do is waitfor the site to come backonlineor for the network problem whatever itis to clear itself upor else you can just temporarily disablethat particular repositorywhich you can do in the repositorymanageranother thing you might occasionally seeis various types of strange messageformattingso if you get a pop-up messageand it looks really strange like thewords or sentences are run together oralternatively if there are spacesbetween every single letter or even linebreaks or there are lots of squarebrackets in the messageah this is basically because yum is veryvery inconsistent about how it returnsmessage textit returns message text in a whole lotof different formats often with noobvious rhyme or reasonso when we're calling a yum function wedon't always know what format messageswill come back in now a npm tries todetect the message formatting and parseit appropriatelybut this has been a bit of a trial anderror processthe yum api is a very strange beastanyway hopefully most instances of thishave been found and fixed by nowbut if you see a message like this byall means report it to us we'll probablyjust sigh and say we'll see what we cando umat any rate it's a cosmetic issue iunderstand it's a bit strange when yourun into it thoughnowwhen you're using a npm there are a fewthings that it's generally best to avoiddoingdoing any of the following things is notsupported by us and we stronglyrecommend not doing themthat doesn't mean you can't try it ifyou really know what you're doing andare willing to accept responsibility forwhatever strange things may happen as aresultit also doesn't mean that we're going todeliberately break things if uh if youdo try these things it does mean thatthey are quite likely to cause problemsand if they do you're pretty much onyour ownfirst upif you're using 40s 2 or any other shellreplacementyou really should not set it as yourdefault system shell and by this i meansetting it as your osu shell inconfiguration so that it's usedsystem-wide instead of cmdxcis not necessary to use it for us tooand it can create problems not just witha pm but with any program which reliesheavily on the command interpreterwe simply cannot support running a pmunder such a configurationreplacing a core component of theoperating system like the commandinterpreter is inherently riskyit might workit might not if it doesn't there is onlyso much we can do about itthat saidif you can demonstrate to us that thereis a definite error in a npm and it'ssomething that's within our power to fixwe will be willing to take a look at itthe next thing that you should reallynotdois run the update all command while anyexperimental repository is enabledespecially the netlabs exp repositoryby all means if you need to installparticular packages from an experimentalrepository go aheadwith the usual caveats about installinganything labeled experimentalbutrunning an update all while one of theserepositories is enabled is not a goodideabecause you're going to be pulling inarbitrary packages which arefundamentally experimentaland haven't necessarily been tested forall possible configurations orcombinationsif you do this again you're largely onyour own with respect to theconsequencesnow it's experimental for a reasonthe third thing that you should avoiddoing isinstalling the yum rpm environment on anetwork drive or another transientvolume and that by that i mean setting anetwork drive as your unique root volumethe yum rpm environment containslibraries and other files which areessential for many things which may needto be working as soon as the systemfinishes booting or even beforeso putting them on a drive which mightnot be available until sometime afterthe system boots upis not likely to end wellso those are just a few caveats for youwell that was a brief rundown of anpm inits current public incarnationas i briefly mentioned at the beginningthe next major release of ampm is goingto add support for warpinglet's take a quick look at that nowwe plan to release ampm version 1.1sometime in 2020.now this adds support for warping in thefollowing respectsit can installupdate and removewpi that is warping packagesand it enables viewing and downloadingwpis from public warping repositories ina manner similar to how yum repositorieshandle rpm packagesthe intention is not to replace thewarping guithe two main reasons for offering thesupport in ampm are as follows firstas a convenience to usersso that you have one central place whereyou can manage both rpm and warp inpackagesthis is particularly useful in the caseof arc os which includes several warpingmanaged componentsthe other reason is so that it's easyand convenient to provide updatedpackages over the internet for softwarethat has been installed via warping andagain this is particularly useful in thecase of archive osbecause as i said it includes severalwarping managed componentsthat saidthere are a few things thatdoesn't do with respect to wpisfirst offdependencies are reported by the warpinggui itself during installationbut when you select to download apackage from a repository a npm has noway of knowing if additional packagesneed to be downloadedyou will have to download all thenecessary packages yourselfhowever the repository itself should ifwell maintained provide all of thenecessary packages in one place so youshouldn't have to really go hunt themdownfor wpi installation and pm actuallyopens the warping gui so when youinstall a package you'll see the usualwarping interfacethe reason is that warping is inherentlydesigned as an interactive installerwith install time options like installpath selected components and so on soyou do need the gui to manage thoseoptionsand we're not trying to replace orre-implement warping we're simplywrapping some convenient newfunctionality around itthe nice thing about ampm's warp andsupport is that you can go in and seewhat packages have updates availableas long as they're available on aconfigured warping repositoryand you can download and install themstraight awaythis is very useful and it not onlymakes it easy for users to get softwareupdatesit also makes it easy for developers todistribute software updateshow it works sothis feature will require warpingversion 1.0.23or later which is still to be releaseduh publiclyand pm interfaces with warping usingboth internal codeand external tools such as the warpingcommand line interfacefor working repositories these areconfigured in a manner similar to youngrepositories amdm stores the informationabout these repositories in a specialprofile file called working.rep whichlives in the amd directoryand since warping repositories can beeither public access or passwordprotectedit implements a similar scheme forencrypting passwords to the one that'sused for secure yum repositories that idescribed a little earliernow again there are some limitations toanpm's work and supportit can only detect updates for wpi'swhich have been made available on aconfigured warping repository such asthe arkanoid wpi repositoryso ampm doesn't know about wpi's whichare simply uploaded to an ftp site likehogs or wherever because that isn't setup as a repositoryas mentionedwhen you go to install a wpi it will beinstalled by opening the warp andinstall guiwhat this means is that for each wpi youinstallyou have to step through the gui foreach onethis makes it impractical to batchinstall a large number of warpingpackages in a single operationif a wpi file has more than one packagein it which is quite commonthenif any of the packages within that wpiis updatedthenwhen you're looking at it in a pmit will mark all of the packages in thatwpi as having updatesthe reason of course is that you willhave to download the whole wpi and runthrough the install process for itwhether it's just for one sub package ornotalsoif there are multiple versions of apackage on a repository then all of themwill be shown separately in a npm atleast as of now we may tweak the designa bit in the futurei'll show you in a bit what that lookslikeas i just mentioned uh it can'tautomatically download externaldependenciesuh also you can't look at the details orcontents of a working package which isnot yet installed the way that you canwith yum packages that's just thelimitation of how warping is designedand finally uh not all of the filteroptions in the a p and gui are availableuh when working with warpingrepositoriesokay so at this point i'm going to givea brief demonstrationof a npmnow we don't have time for a full ampmtutorial sowhat i'm going to do right now insteadis just highlight some of the newer andor less well-known features of anpmso every time a npm starts up it queriesthe yum engine for the current state ofpackagesfor currently installed packages yumreads this information from your systemfor available packagesincluding installed packages withavailable updatesyum has to get this information bydownloading it from each configuredrepositoryand this can take a bit of timeespecially if you have multiplerepositories configuredor if there are any network problemsnow it does cache this informationso if you run an pm or yummore than once per day it'll just readthis information from the metadata cacheinstead of downloading it againand if you don't likeit doing this every day you can changethis interval in yum's configurationanywayso we have the installed and availablepackage lists this is what a npmcurrently looks like as i said thelatest version is 1.0.4so as you can see there are three dropdown boxes at the top these are thepackage filtersand by default it shows all matchingpackages which means all packages thatmatch the current category installed oravailableorsearch results if you just performed asearchnow you can change this to packages withupdatesas you can see several of these packageshave green stars on themthis indicates packages that you haveinstalled for which newer versions areavailable on a repositoryand it actually showsyou uhhere what the update version is and ifwe can scroll over a little whatrepository it's available onnow if i change the filter to just showpackages with updates it'll only showthose green starred packagesnow thepackages with updates filter willactually result in the same contentsbeing shownin both the installedand available listsalthough thedetailsand the way the fields are displayed maybe slightly differentthe other option in this drop down isnew packages and i've seen some peoplemaybe not quite understand what thismeansthis has nothing to do with packagesthat you've installed recently orotherwisewhat this isnew packages refers to packages thathave recently been made available ona repositoryso if i select new packagesi can see here that nothing shows up andwhat this means is that nothing has beenadded to the repository or to anyrepository that i have configured withinthe last seven days which is the defaultinterval for what new refers toif there had been packages added in thelast seven days then those packages andonly those packages would show up hereand under installedonly those packageswhich have been installed and are newwould show up here sothat's what that doeschange it back to all matching packagesyou can also display the software uhgroup that packages belong to you uh youcan filter on that ratherand i'm not really sure how useful thishonestly isthese categories are not defined by anpmthey're actually defined by the packagesthemselves so anysoftware category i'm going to scrollover heregroup they're calledwhich is defined in an rpm package willbe added to this list and it's prettyarbitrary in fact i would saysemi-randoma lot of package authors put theirpackages in some rather strangecategories and some of them don't evenbother to specify oneumas you can see they're fair number inthe unspecified category and this isjust installed onesavailable yeah i mean look at thatthat's about this documentation thereare a fewproductivitynot very manyagainhow useful this is is debatable but imean it'sa standard feature that's supported byrpm sowe we expose that featurenow under the available package view theall repositoryfilter is also enabledthis isn't enabled under installedbecause it has no meaning there butunder available you can view thepackages that are available on aspecific repository so for example onthe arkanoid repositoryit's these packagesnext thing i want to mentionis thesethe actionsfor when you have a package selectedsoif you go into the selected menu or justright click on a package after selectingitthe menus are the same hereyou can seevarious actions available install is theobvious onei'm looking at the available packagelist here so the install option isavailableas well as these other onesand in fact what i'm going to talk aboutfirst is these bottom twoso you have informationyou can see in the list here it providessome sort of summary information abouteach package including a very shortdescriptionas well as the group version numberplatform repository and so on umbutif you go into information it actuallyshows you a little more detailso you see you have here a column ofsome of the fields that we saw beforebut alsothe url that's associated with thissoftware if there is one the licensethat's associated with this software isif there is oneand a longer description which actuallysometimes at least umdescribes what the software really doesand i find this very useful because ifyou're looking at the list here umoftentimes this uhinformation here isn't terriblyinformativelike i meanlooking at this who would reallyunderstand what that meansbut you can get a bit more informationby going into the information menu itemandsometimes it's a bit more useful i won'tpromise it always isnow if you look ata package which you have installed butwhich has available updatesactually ohso let's saycairoand choose informationyou'll see there's actually now twocolumns one which shows the informationabout the currently installed versionand one which shows information aboutthe version that's available on therepositoryalthough the url license and descriptionare generally uh are the same becausethey'rethey're sharedanother one uhanother option in the menu that's uhpotentially fairly usefulis the contents and this actually showsyouthe files that are in that particularrpmand this can sometimes be useful ifyou'rewonderingwhere a particular file is or if you'rewondering what actually goes into eachpackage andwhat's going to be installed where uhyou'll see unix root as the the leadingpath that just means it gets installedunder whatever your unix root directoryis which is generally the root directoryof a driveon this system i believe it's drive eso in this casechiro2.dllwould be installed to e usr libso going back to all packages heresome of the other optionsin thesemenus again you saw installupdatethis package doesn't have any availableupdates and it's already installed sothose are grayed outuh you can reinstall a package thoughif for some reason you need to do soobviously you can uninstall itand umthat last onecalled get specific release ispotentially a bit interesting becausethis wayuh this is where you can actually downwell you can geta particular release if you don't wantthe latest version normally when youinstall or update you will get thelatest version that's available on therepository if you're going to getspecific release you can actually choosefrom any version that is currentlyavailable on the repository so for glib2you can see the repository offers all ofthese versionsnot including the version that's alreadyinstalledsoi currently have 2.33.12-2i can geta couple of versions olderfor both the i386 and i686 platforms ican get a slightly less old version onlyfor the 686 platform or i can get anewer version than what i have whichwould be the default if i just chose upupdateand as you can see it tells you what theaction would beif you select that one and continueso yeah once you've made your decisionif you want to go ahead you can justclick continueand it will either downgrade or updatedepending on what you've selectednowumif you're not uh too familiar with yumrepositories i imagine most people arebut just in case you can configurerepositories through the managerepositories menuand this just opens the window here asyou can see i've got three repositoriesconfigured this one is part of the arcos installsystem it's always disabled afterinstall you should not mess with it infact you can delete it if you want it'snot used after installationand then these two are pretty standardat least on arc os systemsthe net labs stable repository and thearkanoid stable repositoryyou want to add a repository i justadd yum repository you can edit themremove them and here is you if you wantto temporarily disable one here you candisable it as wellif you make any changes in thisrepository manager it'll refresh thepackage list once you close that windownow i want to show you quickly a coupleof things that you can do with the yumconfigurationmost peoplewill not generally need to do this butsome people so it can be occasionallyhandy soi'll just demonstrating here my unixroot drive is drive eandif you go oopswrong wrong slashes um so if you go intothe etc um directory there's a filecalled yum.confthis is the main yum configuration fileand there are a few tweaks that you canmake here i don't recommend changingmost of thesethe one you might occasionally find ause for changing is the debug level ifyou need to debug some problem thatyou're having in particular if you opena ticketon either arcanoa or possibly net labsyou might get asked to change the debuglevel uh to generate some informationfor the ticket so the number goes up tonine i believe the default is two whichis not very informativeactually i'm not entirely sure that 9 isall that informative either but it'smore informative than 2.these ones you don't want to mess withgenerally speakingbutthese are these are all default settingsby the way now these three are settingsthat i've added these ones that arecommented out here and they bear some uhsome mentionso pluginsif you enable this setting it enablesyum pluginsand yum plugins are essentially wellthey're plugins they add optionalfeatures to yumwe don'tgenerallywell in umour arkanoid does not ship either a npmor the yum environment or arc os withplugins enabledmost people don't need them enabled somemore advanced people might find themusefuldiscussing what plugins are available isreally beyond the scope of thisdiscussion but if you do want to installany yum plugins you would have to go andchange this settingjust so you know it's hererecent now i mentioned before that whenyou look at that filter in ampm thatshows new packagesit shows by default packages that havebeen added to a repository within thelast seven daysif you want that to show a longer timeperiod for examplehave new packages show anything that'sbeen added in the last 30 days you couldchange you could set the recent value to30.um i don't know how useful that is butyou know it might be in potentially somecasesi mean you can set it even longer youcan set it to 60 if you like umagain not sure how useful that isbut uh this one umi actuallymentioned briefly early on in mypresentationthis tells how often the metadata cachewill be expired what this means is thisis how often yumand by extension and pmwill go out and check all of therepositories for updated packageinformationby default it will do this once a dayso once a daywhen you start a an pm or running yumcommand it will whether you wanted to ornot go check all of your repositoriesand download the current packageinformationif you think that's too often you canchange it herei've set it to three daysour repositories aren't really updatedterribly often so you can probably getaway withsetting this to a bit less often thanone day i don't recommend setting it toolong because if the information that youhave is out of date then you're notreally going to be able to use iteffectively so exercise this option withcaution but it is here if you reallyfind that having it go and check everyday is just a bit too muchalright so that's a npm as it currentlystands i will now give you a briefpreview ofversion 1.1 which is ampm with the newwarping supportsoas you can see it looks slightlydifferentthat is to say the left-hand panel hereis slightly different and it's updatingthe repository dataum because probably because i changedthat setting i think that force is arefresh first time you do itbut anywayunder installed you now have two twoviews rpm and warping and the same underavailableand these are pretty self-explanatory soagain the rpm one isthey're just what they were beforethey work the same way they look thesame as they did a second agothe warping ones arenewsothis is a list of the currentlyinstalled warping packages and this isthe exact same list that you would seeif you went into the warping guiwhich is usually under your install willremove slash or pin folderand so i have these packages installedi can uninstall none of these haveupdates available so i can't update themthe get specific release option is notavailable for weapon packagesand as for information this is a bitdifferent for warping packages soi'll select an pm yes anpm is a warpingpackage and so in fact it does show uphereso this information panel for warpingpackages it actually shows theconfiguration information that is storedfor that package in the warping databaseandso this isworkplace shell object creationdirectory creation some other stuffthat's stored in the databaseas well as a kind of descriptionand the full name of the package aswarping sees itand for contentsthis is pretty self-explanatory it showsall the contents in that package andthese files are relative to the targetinstallation directoryso in this case since work since ampmwas installed to the sysapps and vmdirectory these files are relative tothat directoryforavailable packages these are packageswhich are on the warping repository thati have configured but are not yetinstalledand there are actually no updatesavailable at the moment so i can'tunfortunately demonstrate that but ifthere were updated packages on thewarping repository they would show uphereso again this is pretty self-explanatorythe install option is enabled here anduninstall is disablednowget specific release can't be used herebecause warping works a bit differentlyin fact as i mentioned every availableversion is shown in the list hereseparately andthat may be tweaked before we go ga withthis i'm not sure there are still a fewrough edges that should probably besanded off this but uhit is it is pretty close to uh releasestate i would sayuh so for information and contents thesecan't be uh used forpackages which aren't installedbecausethe packages only exist on the remotewarping repository and there is no waywarpingthe mechanism that warping provides thatwe are using to implement repositoriessimply doesn't provide a wayto transmit this information to and pmwhich is whythese options don't work when you are inthe available viewand just quickly looking at repositoriesoh you'll see there is now a wpi toolsoption availableherebesides the yum tools option the onlything it has at the moment is an optionto clean up the metadata cacheand downloaded packages which should befairly self-explanatoryandi'm getting a bit short on time so i'lljust finish by looking at the repositorymanagerthis is where bothrpm yum and warping repositories wouldbe configured so you can see i now havea warping repository type warpinghereand i can edit itthis is basically what it looks likeit's pretty much the same except whenyou go to create itunder add you have to click that littlesquareyou now have the option wpi repositoryand you would put in the name thedescription and the url and if it's asecure repository and requires apassword you would check the box theresame as for a young repository so theconfiguration basically works the samewayand that is basically that avery quick high level overview ofnpm's upcoming warping support i hopeyou found it interesting andthat is something to look forward tolater this yearokayumthat was alex's presentation on arc noahpackage manager soi think that kind of addresses along-standing issue that we had in thecommunity that we had warp in but wedidn't have a way to download thepackages and do some version form ofdependency checkinglet's see here let meget the ircumchannel here and thethere was a question somewhereyeah that's a question from martin iknow the idea of a pnm is a differentthing but it wouldbe great if the graphical style canevolve into something kind of an appstoreuh what kind of app store i mean there'sno such thing as a standard app storeumi mean if you mean something that lookslike a glossy magazine with uh like thethe google play store um no offense butall i can say to that idea is yuck umi i i reallyyou know when i when i was loading up acertain linux distribution to play witha few a few days agoumi noticed thatumtheirpackage management gui was basicallyyeah it looked like a glitzy sort of appstore that was offering to they kepttrying to make recommendations for meand hadfilled up the screen with glitzypictures that didn't provide any usefulinformation and i was justthinkingget rid of this stuff and give me a niceclean list of packages and categories soi can find what i need and not beuh have all of this stuff thrown in myface so uh i i i consider the currentdesign to be more of a feature than ashortcoming but maybe that's justme maybe i'm old-fashionedwell effectivelydespite from theapp store appearance missing with glossybuttons and advertisement chasing youall the way around the world with googlecookiesthere is an option in am pm to searchthrough the list of provided packages isthere notit's wrongyeah you can you canumfor for yum rpm packages yes uh wethere is not really an effective searchfacility for warping packages yet butfor uhyum packagesthere are various search options you cansearch bypackagename string or you can search by filenamethe options even on the toolbari'm just looking at john eric larkinsaying thata pm only handles libraries i don'tthink that's true but the thing is thatthe netlabs repository primarily hasdlls in ityou've got for example the bash dll andi think also cups updates it's just thatthe net labs repository i think consistsfor just about 90 percent of dlls thatare packaged in different rpm filesum you know i should say ampm does nothandle programs at all it presentswhat's available on the repository so ifyou have an issue with thepackages that are provided take it upwith the repositories that you've gotconfigured and the people who run thoseso i did did you still want me to keepmy video turned off uh i don't know ifthat's making it hard to follow what i'msaying with audio onlycan the video be turned on againyeah you can turn the video back onokay um where's the buttonokay um any any more questionsi'm i'm i'm looking at the irc and theyoutube channel simultaneouslyarnold is asking if uh on the youtubevideo stream if a tree view a title fuelas alternatives to the current viewswould doif that would be possible i guessuh of of the packages or of thecategories the the categories arealready shown in a tree viewumthe packagesi meanin theory yeah we could we could easilyenough use an icon like a desktop folderstyle icon viewi don't knowreally how useful that would bebecause you wouldn't be able to see asmuch informationi meanif you think that would be useful as afeature i'm sure it could be added[Music]um we we are somewhat limited in termsof what what types of controlswe canwe canuse umwe're using a standard os2 presentationmanager container control for thepackage list so you know it's it'slimited toumdetailed view tree view and icon view upto 40 by 40 pixel iconsso if you want like um128 by 128 resolution png images that'snot likely to happen but again i don'tknow that's especially uhvaluablei think that you kind of alreadyanswered this question as a questionfrom benand he's asking what about rpm slash wpifile clashesi thought you already had a slide inyour presentation that kind of outlinedit's a bit of a generic question buti assume he means that if dll is forexample present in a wpi file alreadyand it's already installed on the systemhe didn't go into further details it'son the irc channel right now thatquestions yeah umwell clashes between files in uhrpms are alreadyas you can see in version 1.04 there'salready logic to detect thatwe have similar logic in the uh the anpmuh outside in the wpisupport in the sense that uhyeah i think i think we've alreadyenabled that logic i'd have to doublecheck this a lot of these features umsort of still underdevelopment buti believe there is similar logicalready in there forif a wpi contains a file that is alreadyin ain an rpm package uh or vice versa thereis at least somesort ofchecking umi i have to double check that though i'mnot totally certain if that's going tomake it into the first version of thisand there is another question and ithink it's kind of a broad one it's fromuser a123456789um and he's asking will a and pm be ableto update over the internet wpis thatshipped with the arcos isowell uh yeah that's almost the point ofthis uh this exerciseumbeing able to do that was one of themain drivers in fact behind adding uhwarp and support to ampm so that userscan actually conveniently go and updatetheirinstalled warping packages over thenetwork but you do need to have thewarping repository configured umobviously and the packages have to be inplace on the repository at the momentbecause this is still being set up onthe back end as welli don't believe the repositorythat we havefor developmentyet has all of the packages on it butonce we roll this out obviously thatthat will be mademade availableandlewis uh is going to have tobeing the guy in charge of therepository he'sgoing to have to decide when and howthat happens but i'm sure he'llmake sure that's in place before we golive with thework and supportuh let's see did i read over anyquestions in herethat was already answered when will aand bm be availableblue is already answered that there isno eta for the next arc noaa packagemanager[Music]um[Music]well i can translate it a bitdifferently and i've had that requestvia voice on multiple occasions is theregoing to be something of thecapability to display at leasta picture of an applicationnot per se dll but when you for exampledownload some software thata repository can also display aan image like for example of a mediaplayer or remote desktopumi have no plans to add such a feature isuppose if it's if it's um sufficientlyrequested we could look at it but we'resomewhat limited by what the metadatacan actually contain in terms of thesepackages you know rpm doesn't as far asi know have anyum field in it it's uh package format tocontain stuff likepictures and so on uh so you know we'dhave to add an entirely newmetadata system on top of it which isum i i suppose it's technically feasibleto be quite honest i can think of betterways to spend our development uhresources but uhif if this if there's a real clamoringfor this i suppose it could be uhconsidered yeahuh just so that people know uh if youtake a look at the website of arc noahand also look at past presentationsalex is the guy that does a lot of thecoding on the back end of thearc os installerthat in itself is more than just aprojectbigger than you'd want to know alex alsodid an outstanding job on portions oftheecom station installed back endbut that in itself is a big job justlike maintaining all of his utilitiesand he probably has auha toil a uha roll of paper a mile long with a to-dolist that he probably wants to work onbut an anpm also sits somewhere on thatlist of many items to do is that a kindof a proper translation[Laughter]you could you could say that i'm notgonna make any specific commentsokayum let's see hereas i was saying voice is also planningto still launch its rpm repository iknow that has been on the role for along time butyes voice is also involved with a lot ofother projects includingcollecting funding for bitwise works fortheir new browser to move forward anddoing warp stock etcand as you probably also noticed thereare a few active people behind that butthat's always the case in the os2communitya few people pushing the locomotiveforwardlet's see are there any other questionsi see here some general discussionin the irc channelthere are no questions here[Music]no i don't think there are any furtherquestions thenall right umlet's seeyeah okay umoh hold on something in the youtube feedhere ummeta packages again that's somethingthat the the packagers themselves wouldput together umwe had a question asking if there's aplan to manage uh meta packages such asthings like print subsystem um you knowrpm already supports that concept umbutthe packager would have to put thattogether andagainwhat in pm what we're doing in ampm isessentially providing a front end topackages thathave been made available we're notreallyum or i'm not really in the business ofumputting these packages together in ingreat quantities soif you want for example acomplete cup systemmeta packageyou'd probably want to talk to thepeople who are putting the cops packagestogether and ask if they would make oneforuh for that purposethere's another one on the i there's anold one the irc channel from os2 userbut i justkind of bluntly answered it what's theright way to update a npm from 104 to 1101 to 104 i think download the uhdownload the a pm installer and run itthat's iti mean it's it's a warping package so itithasit tracks the version that's installedandwe'll will install over itself quitecleanlyyeahit's not actually as complicated as mostwindows software is with a lot of scaryregistry keys and and dll classregistrations you have worked on somewindows installers at work and uhand i've seen some things derail onwindows systems but thank goodness onos2 it's just a matter of running thewarping installer clicking next and uhthat's just about it i guessyeah yeah basically umit's not complicated keep in mind a pmis aa fairly self-contained graphicalprogram itdoes not maintain the package databaseitself it does not maintain the packagesitself or the software so uh i mean justupdating and pm doesn't do anything tothe packages that you have installed orthe database that uhthey they useand i haven't had the time yet to workon it but i'm still looking forvolunteers to start building warpingpackage uh sorry not warping rpmpackagesto collect them in therpm owes to voice as you've seen lastyear we had asmall demoof vlc media player and that's of courseone of our dreams as a community thatyou could just have the repository ofvoice added and thatpopular applications can be installedthen readbrook also made aaa warping package of the embellishviewerand you could just download it from therepository and was installed that's itand that's of course uhum[Music]i'm sorry i was just reading whatthey're on the uhon theokay that was no questionanyway we hope that to expand uh the uhthe amount of packages and applicationsthat are available so that uh usage ofthe platform[Music]oh wait a minute there is athat question was already answered byalex about metadatasoi don't think there are actually anymore questions right nowsouh and i think it's time to uh to saygoodbye to you and see you in half ayear because then probably somewheresomehow warp stockin north america is going to happeni've heard some rumors but it's not forme to comment on thatso thanks for your time alex and thenwe'll movethethe digital stage onto martin itube withhis presentation on community resourcessouhthanks for your time and hard work onos2and uhwe'll move now on over to martin thanksalexbye-byeyeshello there i'm martini tourbidder fromos2 worldandi'm going to talk about some resourcesfor os2 collaborationuh and um well this is my first timein war stop europeand i'm very happy to be here infrankfurt frankfurt it's greatgreat historic buildings thearchitecture is beautifulnow just kidding i'm here at home veryquarantinedthat there was no physical warps ofeurope but i'm very happy to be in thevirtual in this virtual editionso what i'm going to talk aboutis what i'mdoing right now some stuff i'm doingtrying touhto to organize someof those two resources and what i'musing for collaborationsolet's go aheadso this is in factmy goal preserve all those twodocumentation softwarea possibleso what is going on right now we havethat many osu software is disappearinghow the software disappearwelljust some sites get abandoned isp justdump the hosting and delete all thefiles people just doesn't care if theywrote some a os to software some timeago today you say no nobody is using iti don't care and they justerase them from the websome sitesthat used to have software share wherefreewareare no longerpresent and nobody has taken up a capnobody has careabout what happened with it with thatsoftware so there are of course thereare there are the people of the os2community are trying to grab everythingrelated to os2 and maybach apps but buti'm also trying to find more otherresources and try to consolidate it onon on the places that we have availablethat i'm going to talk aboutin the next slideso i'm going to start with the os2 worldwiki which is uhit's it's amedia wiki script where i'm putting aall os 2 related documentation i canfind all these two arc os any commentstation of courseand i'm using it to store known softwaredevelopment topics because for softwaredevelopment we have another wiki onnetlabs that is idm2sowhat i'm doing with this week is tryingto put different kind of subjects likearc os hardware reports when someone onthe forumstell me oh this laptop this member isworking i try to grab some details and iput it on the wiki so all other peoplecan find that informationas referenceand if they are searching some somespecifichardware reports that you find on thewiki also trying to do some softwaredescription and putting some picturesfrom time to time i like to test allsoftware and and if i find somethinginteresting that i never saw in the pastbefore i like to takeor even if it's not interesting also itry to take like a little snapshot ofthe software and put a wiki page withthat picture and the links to downloadthe software and try to put what is thatsoftware aboutand also i try tolook for oldcd sharewarei call it cd shareware projectthere used to be in the past several acd-rom distribution that have that hasos 2 software isluckily for usthe internet archive like to preservethose kind ofthingsand they have an image of thatof that programs so people can upload itso i don't know from time to time someof that images search what is inside andfind maybe some old interesting softwareor even driversand try to organize it on the week alsopreserving different kind of osu relatedarticles i'm trying to put in all thearticles there and also the part of aofficial coursewareand trying to preserve that thatthat that educational material that ibmused to provide about os2let's check it out on theon the on the site okayso i have here my virtual machine withmy archive os virtual machineand we are on those two wall wiki pageso first well the first category that ihave is what i was talking about about ahardware report i have this the thehardware informationand i try to organize itas best as possible like computerslaptop tile i don't have them clientsdesktops i don't have serverssome audio cardsand then adapters drivers and some toolsdown there we have some tutorialsand that work that i would that wasbrought some time agogeneral information i only have somewireless information but i think thatthe most important here are or the mostcurrent information here aremotherboards and laptop computersif i go to motherboardsi have tried to organize the the latestmotherboards that have been reportedwith arc osandand with date chipset socketmodelandtry to put it on thisthis table here and i don't know maybemore information on each one for examplelet's try this gigabyte let's hope ithas some informationokay yes it has information here's thegigabytea ba for a 450m as 2ha model i have some little picture heregeneral information like socket chipsetprocessor support release date is alwaysimportant to know if it's something newor old i'm trying to organize thingslikea from the late the last 10 yearsand the other one i also like the oldstuff but the old stuff is going on onlike an archive page but it's also but ialso like to have also the the old stuffnot to delete the old stuff but alsohave it stored somewhere else and tellpeople it's all stuffokay so here we have the important thingis thethe hardware reportuh and what the people tell me or whatthe person told me that um that isworking and not working so for examplethis is the the sata port forsara con the sata controllerand i have the hardware idand thewell this is all the hardware the vendorid and device id which is like theunique identifierthat that can also helpuh to other users that say oh i have thesame hardware id and on this my mainboard is working so maybe mine will workand i have to trythe same things that this user tryso this is the report with the hardwareid and which driver has been used tomake that thing work okaymaybe some general comments it can beconfigured on this processor and networkworks and and any trickthat the user did to make that minimainboard work and the full hardwarereport i knowthe hardware report is being longtedious but it's also interesting tohave it in on a different page just incase someone wants to search and searchfor details to know which devices doesit has here we have an unknownthis is because the the pcidatabase was old for this reportokay but it's also important to storethis report on a different page forpeople that wants to search or if i'msearching for a specific hardware idmaybe it will point me to that hardwarereport and then i can find which deviceuses uses it okaywhich motherboard uses itso this is formain boardsokay i have some different models herenot all are completebut i try to put as much as informationi can get from the user reporting thisand also that the rest of the communityis also free toto join and and make me and help meimprove me improving this pageokay this is the part ofmotherboards now for example laptopshere i tried to keep thethe newest laptopfrom 2010uh to to today and i have here thearchive list from older laptops okayof course this will change every fiveyears i'm going to send the rest toarchive i don't know how it's going towork but here i got some of the newestreported laptops that works on arc oswith their comments i try to do somebasic rating which this is one this isvery bad it doesn't boot this is goodenoughand i don't have any one that is verygood because wireless and usb 3 isalmost always missing fromfrom the support on these laptops let'stry to see one here we have a picturegeneral specs also the device is justlike a member trying to grab thehardware id this is the intel vendor idthis is the devicei leave for this audio devicetrying to grab everything here we havethe comments how i installed ithow how the user installed our ecommercestation or arc os and the specifictricks for eachcomponent okayso this is and here we have the hardwarereport that is always niceto have the pci report i think also inthis machine there is also the usbreportyeah there is also usb report which thethe the internalusb devices that are connected on thislaptop okaythe pci reports only reports pci stuffand it and it tells you yes we have thisusb likechipset connect to the pci that but itdoesn't tell you what is connected tothat usbthechipset or your usb device the usbreport or ls usbcommand will let you knowwhich usbthings are connected thereokayso this is forthe hardware's uhthe hardware thinguhi was also tell you thati'm trying to do like a little softwarecollection of worrywhat i found is not completeand this is the category that i haveandi i it goes growing day by dayi sometimes i work on this sometimes istopand well if you have some software i'mgoing to go to audio applicationsand there are some subcategories like cdplayers andand so forth this is system master audiovolume that was recently released byjohn eric i have some screenshotsand what is what it does and i have likethis i try to keep this standardtemplate for versionvendor if it applies auto licensedownload and version number so so youcan download it you can click it and itwilland it will send you to hubs to downloadit no so this is how i'm also trying tocategorizeand software i think i'm never going tofinish with this there is too muchsoftware there is little time but wellit's kind of fun to go little by littleand see how the things growokay so this is this was the softwareside of the wikiokay the next thingthat i want to show also in those twoworld wiki is that strange project thati'm doing likesearching from cd-roms and trying tocheck the stuff that it has like youknow like some years ago i started to tograb source code related to us to anduploading on github andand having likea way to haveaeducational source called materialfor for the public that can be searchindex so they can find it in an easy wayand it's very very easy to have a jiton that page and share the source codeso i'm just dropping everything there tobe searchable index so i find somesharewarescd-roms that used to bethat there are just wellthere are now available on the internetarchive since they are a public librarythey can't do that they take a copy ofthe cd and put it online so i check forthe source code i also review whatprograms that it have to have this thereis something interesting maybe is ifsomething is soldand hubs has it at the hub site has anew version i just leave the new versionif it if it house doesn't have it sometime i would love it to help even ifit's all at least to have one version ofthe hopspeople may like it or not butat least we have the software there tobe able to beat a level and i alsocollected the old artwork that used tobe on cd-roms they they the cereal roomsused to have some artwork some bait mapsthat it was kind of fun to see how thethe 90s was okay so this is the citiesthat i have searched for these threethings and then i have somesome other cities on the pipeline withthese red marks that i'm going toeventually search and try to consolidateuhdefine thewhat i have found and what i have a blogto the wiki or maybe hubs or maybe tosome other place some other source likethe os2 world picture galleryso this is how i organize myself to knowwhich cd-roms i already have a processesand which ones i'm missing and this listis going to grow also and i have ofcourse the list of relatedos to cd roms which is a lot longer listof cd-roms that are available on theinternet archive that people just cansurf and download and and try to see ifthey found something interesting fromthat all city realmsnext the next thing that i'm going toshow is also that i'm using this topreserve some articles that is like themost common thingsit have onon a wiki articles i have some oldhardware reviewsand i don't know i remember i made thison 2002and this this kind of articles aboutthese deviceswith those two i try to consolidate alsosome other stuff from the internet ihave several other articles from laptopsand some oldio makeup revive devicesand maybe some some other from ost.p.ethat gave me permission tocopy all the information from that siteon that articles here on the week sothis is the most common thing of tryingto write some articles how to is also alot of articles about how do you do somestuff on os2 on arc osandthere are some information also to tocheck out hereokayand the other thing that i do that itold you that that i'm using the thewiki is also for acoursewarethat was the educational materialthat a ibm used to providetolet me search wifi in itokay ibm console course where it's downhere on project pagesi was not able to find it so ibm used toprovide thesethese coursesfor a fee to the publicand then try to consolidate all theinformation of all the availablecourses that the world this is the webserver courses were for i was able to iwas able to find this material from thisis a quick samplefrom the os2warp server for e-businessfive days training okay that was anenhanced lab training with literallywith lectures focus on providing skillsyou can go in inside theresearch all the information and for thisone i got ibm permission to um[Music]to to republish the documentation herehow the instructor accessor guide thestudent excel sitei think that the bigger ones are thestunning student notebooks also theinstructor guide whichwhich was deeper to to help the theperson getting thethe course this is thecopyright permission that i like to puton topand this is the famous student bookare like i don't know three threehundred pagesof learning material of a hands-on labandthat you go step by stepand to learn to use os2 web server foryour businesssoi know i have this course from someyearsnowbutmy crazy dreamwill be to eventually have all thesecourses and it's very hard becausethis was not a material that was sharedor that was supposed to be on pdf formatandthat was too soumit's kind of hard to find i havesomething to find i could find forexample this was i always to merge intraining services but it was it is it ishard to find documentation that we needto scan i need to ask permission to ibmlawyers they will give me permission andi will be able topass a postdate hereso if you ever were to a formal trainingand you still have the student notebooka very hard to find instructor notebookbut if you have a stunning notebook isis very useful please let me know andlet's see if we can scan it and i willrequest permission to ibm to republishthe courseware okay so this is all forthe australwikilet's keep movingokay now i'm going to go to theidm2umas you may already know idm2 is like theresourcefor all os2 the development materialit has articlesit has somedevelopment software development reviewsandalso the api informationalso some other projects like the configsys documentation projectsoadm2 is abasically a organizingin the different topics of the of thearticles that it has there likepresentation manager development relatedarticlesusually i try to put the thethe wiki articles here and some externallinks on the right andand we have differentdifferent topics like somawhich is thewhich has all the workplace shelledumalso documentation on how to compile aclass how to createa software for the workplace shellokay driver developmentand it has a i had been trying to alsoput all the articles here andif i don't get permission to post thearticle here at least have it uh link itso we can find it in a in a single placeokay the interesting thing that i havebeen working on on theon this wiki is a list of os2documentation hereand i have somewell we have tried here to organize thedevelopment inbooks material red booksin the different versions of os2here we have like the basic manuals thatused to come on the toolkit controlprogramming a control programinterface dpi presentation manager theseare the official manuals that used tocome on the toolkitthen we have the red booksalso the right bookshave been alwaysall like all of themwith some exceptions all have beenavailable for freeyou can click the linkit will send you to theopen library where you canread thethe red bookwithout any kind of restrictionbecause this used to be a freefree material okayso here we have a red bookokay so we also organize it by versionso if i don't want to see the older onesthere are on a different pagethe interesting thing that that we havebeen working is theretail books seeyeahso we have the retail booksandit's organized also byby os2 version and also by subjectso we have like differentkind of topics here and we also havesome bookshas linksuh to also the open library since theinternet archive and the open libraryare is a public library they have a onthe copyright on the u.s copyright lawthey have permission toa copy books and put it available ontheir library so we have like the os2application programmer guide and we canalso read itand check it out for reference here'sthe i'm going to go to the first pagehere's the coverandthen the full book that can be readhereokay and we haveseveral booksanddifferent topicslike a very interesting topic for us itwas going to be always presentationmanagerbooks here are several presentationmanager booksto createapplications with user interface rightand some system object modeland also i think it's here yeah alsodevice driver developmentuh the one from well the one from stevenmaestriani had only always been onlinefor for like a long time but we alsohave the other one from raymond westwaterfromdevice driver development which is asubject that we we like material rightso this isthe the the booksthe book section of the idm tooon the wiki the thethe the thing that i i think i willnever going to finish but at least i tryis the the api projectthe api project is supposed to try todocumentevery functionof the different apis that os2 has ialso have included some third partytheme parisapis also that can beumthat also are also documented hereand even try some draft version of theportedapis fromthe linux world that we have availablewe are we're not going to put the fulldocumentation of the api because theseone are already on their own web pagesbut at least to let know the developerthat we havethese libraries that can be usedof course that a lot of libraries aremissing hereand let's let's go back to the os towarp apiand yeah we have like the kernel levelapis drivers contour programpresentation manager system auditedmodeland several more and just to check the idon't know the presentation devicedriverapi and we have all the functions and wetry to create a page for each functionand try to have like some kind ofstandard way to put it like thedescription the syntax parametersreturnssome sample source code andand well i i think i'm never going tofinish thisthat will i keep going a little bylittle and it can be interesting to havethis on a wiki format that is easysearchableon the internet that having on an infilethat yeah it's the same thing of the inffileinf filebutuhthose kind of files are for for a personthat does not have install os2 are hardto to watch there are some windows ofcourse there are some windows umreaders for thein filesbutit is not very commonthey are not indexed by google that kindof files okayso this is the api project from theidm2okay let's move onalso if you want to helpthere are ways you can collaborateyou can register to us to worldand you will have access to the forumsto the wikiyou can collaborate with contentdocumentationsource code screenshots hardware reportsopinions are also importantconstructive opinions of courseand and yes we can use the forum peoplehas um reported hardware on the forums ijust transfer it to the wiki i can alsogive you access to the wiki to those twoworld wiki to help me with thatumremember that we have hubs to uploadsoftware os to site also umalso mirrorhubs and also tries to havelike a good repository of software thereandand if you have anything else you havesomethinguh that is notalready public and you want to find away to share it just contact me directlyand we will see howwe can make it work tomake it available for the communityso if it's from ibm we can askpermission to the to the ibm lawyers iknow the the process thereso we can do ituh so we or at least try it uh justcontact me and let me see what we can dotogrowthethe available knowledge to knowledgeon the in the internet when you call ialways put this slide here when youcollaborate online remember what willwheaton says don't be a dick try to beas nice as possible i know that itshould be likeavery basic thingbut is sometimes uh you lose patience uhpeople are not understanding you thatit's that is a good moment to say okay ijust move onit that doesn't it it is not useful toto use sarcasm toto to get into a fight that nobody'sgoing to win sojust move on let's try to helpsomeone else in any different thingdon't try to to push things if they arenot movingon the online forums when you arecollaborating so always remember thisandwell thanks for your time if you havesomething related to os2 documentationsoftware video source code in vhsmagazines things that are not availableonline alreadyjustlet me know let's try to preserve itlet's try to have it online here's myemailand let's see we can find a solution onhow to put it online let's see if we canfind uh we can request permission let'ssee how can we do thatthank you very much for your time i'mgoing to beon the all in the irc chat for questionsand well have a great work stock thankyou very muchsorry the video ended we've patched inmartin uhfor uh for questions from peopleare there any questions let's see herei'm looking at the youtube stream rightnowand the uh irc chatthanks for uh grabbing all of the uhsource code together that you've beenspending a great part of your life onyeah and all of the coursewareyeahjust in case i'm wearing the samesweater to keep continuity updatei'm liketwo months here in confinement for forthe quarantineuhso thank you for taking me out of bedand i come here loloismyit's a new cat it's the first time ihave a cat in my houseand wellhe was both here onfridayand of course two days the first twodays everybody in my house was happywith the cat now i'm the one taking careof himas we always say here at home is that acat doesn't have a boss but the cat haspersonnel to serve itandyou better get used to it it's it'salready putting the claws in yoursweater soyeahbut it's gone okay uh let's see here arethere any questions i'm just lookingthere and umi don't expect too many questionsbecause i'm always talking about myopinions so well everybody has theirdifferent opinions so sometimes thereare notnot a lot of questions just totell you something i was watching youthat you have on the backa book that says prepare for osucertification that was actually thefirst book that i was able to scanand ask ibm permission to publish itonline so that bookumis already available online the one thatyou have on the back that right here idon't know where it says prepare for osucertification you can alsocheck it online yeah that's goodhave you been able touh how have you been able to getpermission from ibm have you got aspecific contact at ibm or you sent arequest to and they are then generallyable to acknowledge it since it's oldstuff that's not very useful for themanywayyes they they have a process thatyou submit the material is some lawyerin ibm check it out and if it's not ibmconfidential if it's notuh well it will not because of them anyproblemand if ibm owns the 100 of thecopyrights of that element they willgive you permission it will take somesome days some weeks but but an ibm putyou some specific details that they canask you to take it outif they want to and they put theirconditions right but they allow it to umto put it available online for free fornon-profit after they have checked itout and and get your permission rightokayso that's good that that's good sothat's how i was alsoable to to release the educationalmaterial for os to warp server for yourbusiness because it's obsolete in onefrom from their perspective they are notselling it anymore and from the othersideit's their own copyright that can bereleased sothat's why i was able to do that andthat's what i'm trying to do i'm tryingto search for or to findmore courseware material which was therotational materialthat ibm used to provide for os2trainingand scan it and we'll ask for permissionand put it online soit's going to be hard because the worldthat that material was not supposed tobe distributable it was only forstudents on the official on the officialcourses so if anybody has one of thatlet's contact me andwe will find out how towork it out yeahlet's see herewell i'm not seeing any questions pop-upwhile we discussed all of the nice legalmerry-go-rounds within ibmsookay um any more questions going oncegoing twiceanybodyoh wait uhjohn eric is asking here if there is onthe video on the youtube video progresswith sub and vx rex is askingare you busyjohn eric larker is asking if there hasbeen progress on uhsap and vxracksoh noprobably[Music]were you working on getting vxracks fromsapyes that is now well it's almostimpossible i was talking like like ayear ago or two now it was a long timetwo years agouh about that possibility butthe issue was that people from asap sapdidn'tdidn't care anymorewellsap bought the company that made thatthat compilerthe development tool and of coursesometimesit was i don't remember it was cybasethat by that company and sap buysideways something like thatand of course sap doesn't even knowwhy that they have the ownership of thatprogramandthey don't want to move forward withthat so i'll like two years ago i losttrack of the people oh that'sinteresting that's interestingboth lewis and you have been runningafter sap i just see here that lewiswrites on thenetlap on theirc channel that i was the one workingwith sap so you've been both huntingafter sap to try and get them to moveyeah yeah but but i lose track heresome years agoyeahyeah they didn't just they didn't careanymore and i don't know maybe louisehas some more money and they can he canoffer something i don't have nothing tooffer there they so so i don't knowgood luck lewis and i hope that he canhe can makethat product available againthere is another question on the channelbut i think that the answer is just veryrudimentary simple always two usersasking how do you get permission topublish magazines books when thepublisher no longer exists i think it'smore or less has to do withwho owns the copyright and then you needto figure it out and get permission fromthat person or publisheryeah that is well that is almostimpossible when the publishers no longerexistand or or if the author died like fiveyears agocopyright law says that things arepublic domain depends on the on the onthe country like it's 70 years after theauthor dieson that casethe good thing is thatthe internet archive it does not have totell does not require that formalpermissionto republish that things because the u.scopyright law says that public librariescan reproduce contentsand make it available to the people ofcourse that the u.s copyright lie a lotdidn't didn't say if it's electronic orphysicalsosince the internet archive is a digitallibrary it online in a digital way ifthe author or the publisher complains tothe internet account they they just takeit down but legally a public library cando thati as a individual or or a company cannotdo that a public library has thatspecial power in the u.s copyright lawit's strange right that it's well it's atwerk that works for themyeah i've been in the same positiontrying toto trace down owners of os2 software orgetting permission to distribute devicedrivers at the time with ecom stationand trust me it's a legal hell to gothrough especially if the company islocated in the united statesyou you get if you don't have the rightcontact within the company it's aprocess that takes months but anywaythat's uh yeah i know i and well that'sthat's a hard part and well there's sofar thatsimple can simply getlost on this gray area betweenbetween what is this very area calledabandonware that in other words yeahit's illegalbut there's no one there to sue you sowell it's a great area i think oh os2user is asking if there is a copyrightholder and the very simple answer is yesif i now write a poem or an article andi publish it depending on the countrybut in most cases the person publishesit has automatic copyright and thus hasthe license to distrib to to organize hecan decide ifumif hewhat he wants to do with a certain uhpublicationand it's up to the author to givepermission yes or no you cannot takethat permission just like thatyesof course it depends on the local lawand the license that is possiblyattached to ityeah i don't like it as well yes ofcourse that depends on the license butit can be like i don't know licenses aremade in the imagination of people so alicensecan be well it can be as restrictive oras[Music]as loose as the author wants to andmaybe maybe say i own the i have theownership that thing and i'm allowingthis publisher to sell it and i'm lovingthis one to use it for free and and i'mallowing just this little part of thebook to be used for that and for that soimaginationsplays a a veryinteresting role on on this on theselicensing thingsso it's not thatany change over time the people changeover time so maybe one day he say nothis is restricted this i don't want toshare it tell the people to pay andafter 10 years they say no i i don'tcare it's already paid i want to shareit with everybody so it's not wrong tocontact that person and say okay youused to sell in the past let's make itopen source today what do you think andwell that's how so many uh osu softwarehas turned or open source on the last 10years which is a thing that i support alot uh all the open source pointsremember that well when i when igraduate from college in 99 open sourcewasthe world of the devil microsoft used tosay thatyou while you're going to give this awaywhy you want to share the source codethat it's a scene and now 20 years afterthat open source is the one that is thethings that are that are runningeverything in the world all the cloud isbasicallyin open source and open standards so itis a different way to see there there'sa more diff a broader question but ithink that's maybe a bit outside of thescope of the presentationand we don't have lewis here to answerthatuhdavid anatolantonello asked do you think 02 worldcanwork together with arkanoa to presentfor example once a year an arc osfeature put to the vote by the communitywell it can be well i have arelationship with we can do wellanything what we we can um agreed on uhlet's well just contact me andlet's send me the idea and we will seewhat we can do no no no knowing arkanoaand if we've just seen louis'spresentation i think that the verysimple answer is is that they're a smallcompany and their development resourcesare at 110 overload currently already solet me see the idea because i don'tunderstand let me check uh do you thinkthat can like to present for exampleonce a america or a featureput on the vote by the community yes thecommunity can vote there is no problembut well let's see and if luis agreed wecan do it we'll justjust need to to see what happens i don'tknow the future can be onon on this thread the arc os strategy orthat well it's an idea let's discuss theidea on the os2 forum and at the endpeople are the ones that take the choiceto say i don't want to support this iwant to support itso there is no issue with that umit's just wellit's justhaving the people to support the ideaandif it's a good idea we willeventually maybe it will get developersokay but i don't i don't think thati i don't i don't like to reject ideaswithout without further analyzing i ilike discussing it because we on theforums because other people give yougive you feedback and try to fit andimprove the idea in a way that can bedoableokayokayumsee i was not expecting too muchquestions that well everything is freeto this to be discussed on the os2 worldforumrelated to os2 of course there is offtopicit's aforum there but we'll use it with careandand oh just just one thingwe still have time i'm also i don't knowthe last days i have beenchecking very old tickets on the netlast svn for example and i have beenclosing the really old ones that do nothave any feedback anymore like 10 yearsagouh 12 years ago some old tickets soi i thinkit's good also to to try to help on thaton that umon that way uhbecause well developers like to havefeedback and bug bugticketsbut they they like to have the theum like theoh the requirements the things that arefailing right thereyou don't have and don't lose timeasking the developer please upload thelog please let me know which version iuse and please give me that please giveme that so for people that are notdevelopers like me i think it's good toto also check the the tickets andrequests oh please give me more feedbackand let's build the case to show it tothe developer uh to don to don't makehim lose time trying to investigatewhat's going on and getting the thefacts there so on the on the net laptopssvn i'm also trying to close some veryold old tickets of people that are notbrave giving feedback and we cannot knowif well and it's like 10 years ago wedon't even know if they still have thehard work so i have been closing somesome tickets on unionand on fat 32 so if if someone has aticket that is closed and they don'tlike it well i expect some hit but thewellwe need moremaintenance in the community as we allknow we've got very few softwaredevelopers and driver developers sothanks for your contributionum are there any other questionsbecause i actually still need to do somepreparation work for the bitwise workspresentation and have dinner uhwhich is up at seven soumif there are no more questions i'd liketo put the uhthe stream on pause until uh one until 7pm dutch timeand in the meantime i'll have dinner andget dmitry set up for the uhfor the stream at for his presentationat 00 pm dutch timeokay that's good okay thank you for yourtimestay healthy therethank you bye-byeokay thank you martin for uh forconnecting uh from uh from ecuadorumwe are going to uh have uh a dinnerbreak here in the netherlands lunchbreakin new yorkso uh we'll be back in approximately uh70 minutes for the last presentation ofthis digital warp stock europe2020 um soenjoy dinner lunch or otherwise whereyou are on the planet sleep well andsee you then at thenext presentation okay thank you byehello everybody we're back we had aslight delay we're stillworking on the last presentation that'swhy it was moved on the schedule butready for the last presentationuh this alsowell has taken up quite some of my timeas president of voice i've beeni started the funding campaign for a newbrowserin october 2017.you have certainly allnoticed that on all of themailings that have gone out and the newsitems and thestatus updates on articles owes tovoice.orgumif there's one thing that's that's keyabout this is thatdevelopmentsorry that was my other laptop that wascatching upsoftware development on os2 takes timewe've goteffectively the way i always see it isthat we have arkanoa doing the operatingsystem and bitwiseworks keeps what as irefer to it the gtc slash libsy factoryrunning to put it simple that's theframework that's used toportand compilelinux source code on os2 so that we canrun up applications like open office cupsprinter driversfirefoxc monkey thunderbirdon os2 there's a whole list ofapplications that currently all builtupon this framework but in order to keepthat maintained you we have somevolunteers in the communitybutit's certainly true thata large portion of the dlls that areused to compile the current applicationsare maintained by bitwise worksand a lot of people people simply takethat for grantedbutwithout that work from bitwise worksthat's part of the os2engine in the locomotive that wouldsimply shut down there are continuousupdates neededas you'll see in the presentationbitwise works is now maintaining between250 and 300 dllsand the number keeps growingum and that's all being done by onedeveloper and two people that arehelping him out souh the fact that we can currently runall of the software that we do on alwaysimported from linux is to a large extentattributable to the work that bitwiseworks is doingandthe the major thing that was that's nowwithin reach is the new browseruh dimitri is on the other channel canyou please patch dmitry infor thepresentation go aheadokayhello everyonei'm just waitingi'm just waiting for the video here am igoing yeahokay yes okay go aheadyeah you can start dimitri the slidesare liveokay i'm alreadylive okay great so hello everyonemy name is dmitry kuminov i'm frombitwise worksand i'm going to give you some moredetails about uh about what we we douh what bitwise board doesso is the first slide on the screenright now yeah move the slide pleaseyes it isokay sothe second slide pleaseit's there it's about what bitwise worksdid and does who's on the bitwise worksteam right rightso who is on the bitwise works teamuh bwwb twice works gmbis owned and operated by sylvan sherfrom switzerland hello cylin if you'relooking if you are watchingus right now then it's uh herbicbarn fine from austria and then it's memeeting kuminovfrom russiaso the we are those uh three people whodo all the stuff in uh here at uhmidwives boardsas roderick already mentioned i'm theprimary devil developer and uhsylvan andhelp me a lotdoing what i donext slide pleaseyep next flight yeah againuh as roderick already mentioned thebitwise works is i i think i can saythat is the major software vendor forthe os2 platform at the momentwe doaccept theoperating system internals we do all theother stuffthat of that higher level which iscalledend userapplications and support in theirsupport libraries sothis is what we do andin the last two month 12 months sinceour previous presentation we updated orcreated from scratch around 160words of cross-platform softwaremost of theseports are software libraries which areused by end user applications and anduser applications are those you use onyour os2 machinesand we really work hard to keep allthese numerous libraries at their recentversions so that they would include allthe current features all the bug fixesall the enhancements and so onand all these libraries are required torunbigger end user applications such asthe qt5software development toolkit which isused in a large number ofapplications such as firefox such asopenoffice such as poplar and qpdfu thecups printing netframework and this uh list is actuallyreally really biguhnext slide pleaseyeah it's on the screenokay thank you uh soall these libraries are universal theyare not done for a single for somesingle particular application they areuh used in many many applicationsunlike special ports uh which are doneby some other developers for with twoand for other operating systems ourlibraries are suitable for anyapplicationandby the way this is why one of thereasons why we introduced the packagemanager which is called rpm yambecause it's simply impossible to managethe installation of all these librariesotherwiseandthe other benefit of such an approach isthatwe fixsome library we make some bug fix or addsome new feature in ithave each and every application whichuses this library benefits from thatimmediately after youinstall in new version of this libraryand all these small libraries well notof them not all of them are actuallysmall but uh they uhdon't require a lot of time from usbecause they are maintained really welland thanks toouruh our frame our build framework whichwe here it was created over all theseyears portingsuch libraries doesn't take a lot oftime from us and doesn't take a lot ofsponsoring units from youso this is about librariesnext slideit's it's displayed you can go onyeah okay so nowlet's talk about some bigger projectsthat wework onfirst of them is qd5 which we announceduh several years ago and weuh talked a lot about it uh during ourlast year's presentationand this is uh cutify for those whodoesn't know this is thevery one of the of the most popularuhdevelopment gui development toolkitsused byuh software developers to create userinterfaces fortheir applicationsthere are many many applications uhbased on qt5 which uh are nowuh which which we can now port to os2they may be easily ported to os2 so thatthe os 2 community can have them as wellthe next big piece of what we do isclipsylipsy is the keylibrary which is usedvirtually in each and everyapplication on your machine libs isthecruntime libraryso it's the runtime library from the clanguage which is used for the majorityof applicationsand then there is also lipsy x this isour extension tothe lipsy library which has someadditional featuresthereand the next bigpiece ofof our work is no doubt gcc gcc is the cand c plus plus compilerwhich is used by by all software wereleased since many many many years thisincludesfirefox this includes openoffice andeverything else every single library isbuilt with gcc gcc's gnuc compilerwe had a very old version of it beforeit was versiongcc version 4.9.2if i remember correctly and it was likefrom 2014and uhwhen we started working on chromium iwill come to that part later we realizedthat we desperately need a new versionof the compiler so here came gcc9.2.0 this is almost the this is thelatest major line of development andalmost the latest version every otherworld has at the moment it has all the cand c plus plusstandard features all these new fancythings are in and we can use them forosu developmentour next big project is of course apacheopenoffice which we haverecently updated toversion4.1.7 it was released on the 29th ofjanuary of 2020andour next big project is of coursethe web browserthe operating system cannot existwithoutwithout the browser so it's simply amustas you all know before that weuhworked for many years on firefox and weprovided firefox to the osu communitybut then we asyou already know as well uh then wedecided that we stoppedworking on firefox for reasons you canget from our previous presentation iwill notgo into detail here so now we areconcerned about bringing a new browserto the os2 platform because becausewithout it it's simply thereand this new browser will be based onqt5 we will talk about that later nextslide please next slide pleaseit's on the screenyeah thanks some more details aboutlibsyas i already mentioned it's thec runtime library which is used and inevery application out therewe started our own fork of this libraryuh backin the last year because uh its originalmaintainer nude osmundstone hello ifyou're watching usuh stopped actively contributing to itbut we desperately needed new featuresand there so we had to forksince then we've made uh hundreds ofcommits and bug fixes andadded a lot of new features28 28 lipsy uh tickets were closed anduh eight lipsy x tickets were alsoclosed it means that we implemented allthese new features and fixed some oldbugs thatdidn't let us go further with all ourgreat ports of libraries and softwarewe also introduced some manylong-standing missing featuresand added them to the current lipsyversion and themost significant one of them is a whitechapter support that was missing since10 years or something like thatit's it was needed for gcc 9it was needed for chromium for qt5 etcso we had to add it and we did thatnext slide pleaseit's on the screenokay thank you it's a qt5 right so thatyou understandokay okay so some more words about qg5our one of our bigprojectsuhwe started uh porting thismodern toolkit to os2 uh in mayuh 2018and uhand in in in august wellin april uh we released some demoversion and we talked a lot about thatduring our last year's presentation andshortly after that on in august uh 2019wereleased a complete version of qt5.11.0uh it'salmost a complete version of the toolkitexcluding the qt web engine library iwill talk about that a little bit laterand we did it as promised to thecommunity it tookalmosta little bit more than a year anduh just as we promised i repeat that andit is completely free of charge so wedid all this hard work free of chargefor the community anybodyanybody can download these libraries usethem with applicationswrite their own applications with themor use these libraries forsomeone else's applications freecompletely free of chargeand uh in synthetic in september 2019 weupdatedqt5 to the latest version5.13.1 it was the latest version by thattime now it's uh 5.15uh already out butwe are not going to go there doesn'thave a lot ofdifferences which makes which makedifference on os2doesn't have a lot of updates but wewill come there but not now because ourprimary focus now is the qt webuhbrowser companyweb engine component next slide pleaseit's on the screenokay thank you so qt web engine what uhwhat it isuhto keep it short it's theuhit's the library it's actually a singledllwhich providesmodern browser support for anyapplicationand uh this uh company this module isactuallyuhit's actually uh it containschromium under its hood and chromium forthose who doesn't know is theis a piece of softwareyou can also call it a librarywhich is used by googlein their product called chrome chrome isa very popularweb browser out there i'm pretty sureyou know thatso chrome isuh made runs on top of chromiumeverythingthat chrome shows on the screen when youvisit some web page is rendered by thechromium enginethe chromium engine all is alsodeveloped by googleand this con is being is still beingdeveloped theyuhreleased new versions quite regularlyuh and this project is really really bigit contains almost 80 000 source filesuh uhfor comparison qt5 itself contains just12 000. so you see it's six times morethis is just togive you an impression how big thechromiumweb engine iscan can i can i interrupt you brieflythereyeah sure of course i think youmentioned when we had a phone call aboutit that just to give another comparisonwhat type of a huge monster this is i'vegot a note that you said that on yourmachine that runs with an intel i7 witheight coresuntil now the rough estimate is thatcompilingall of the sources into a dll is roughlyan estimate about 10 to 12 hoursyes and it's a really rough estimate itcan actually take more because i haveneverrun it as a whole yet because it's stillstill working progress so it may be evenmore but 12 hours is actuallyquite a bit already it'si i for example i work then i go tosleep and then when i wake up the nextday it's it might still be running itmight still be buildingthat's how and there was another thingabout chromium so that people understandwhy we took this browserengine is that uhit seems it's so good that even windows10 users who run microsoft edgeeffectively run the same engine becausemicrosoft its latest browseredge that they introduced in windows 10has switched over to the chromium webkitengine as wellyeah this is a very good note actuallyand it proves that chromium is quite asuccess quite a successful productand this is whymicrosoft decided to use it as well sodid we so well not not us butthe qt5 team they decided to switch tochromium fromapple webkit they used apple webkitbefore but then they decided to drop itfor for a number of reasons and switchedentirely touh chromium this is whyuh we don't have it right now i mean uhwe already ported qt where uh applewebkit when we were working on qt4because qt4 usedapple webkitbut nowqd5 uses a different engine chromium sowe have to do it again we have to portchromium nowand uh also to get you some uh someunderstanding of what's going on herewhen i work on chromium uh there are uhthere are around the fifteen hundred andfifteen thousand and six 600 compilationunits uh compilation unit is asource file which the compiler the gcccompiler which uh have been talkingbefore uhtakes to build uh an object file thatthat then is then used tobuild an application so there areuh15 and 600compilation units like that andthere are many of them consisting oflikeuh two or three dozen separate sourcefiles so it's a really huge amount ofworkand out of these 15 000 around 60percent are already successfullycompiled on os2 by now so it's about 7000uh compilation units still to gouh and as i already mentioned forchromium speaksspecifically for chromium we had to pourgc69 to os2 which also took us a coupleof months because it's not a it's not apiece of cake cake it'sit's a compiler it's a very serious toolfor developers and it requires requiresa lot of effort touh to have it runningand then we had to do numerous numerousupdates to our lipsylipsy xports and uhand to a lot of otherunix and other cross-platform softwarelibraries which are neededfor chromium which are used by chromiumthis is these libraries includes i i seeyou this is a library that does all thetext uhtranslation from one uhcode page to another code page and allother things regard related to thatthere is also ffmpeg library which isresponsible for displaying for exampleyoutube videos andall other audio and video formatsand many many otherlibraries for example we even had toupdate python to fix enough to fix anumber of bugs in python python is ascripting languagebecause python use is used in somelibrariesneeded by chromium it's used by chromiumitself to run the build process and somefeatures were missing in the os2 port ofpython so we had to fix it to getfurther with chromiumandeventually chromium iswhat weactually need right now to bring you anewweb browser we choseand the falconis built uh on top of qt5 and on top ofits qt web engine which which haschromium under the hoodsoeverything we do herewithin this project we do to get a newdecent modernbrowser on the os2 platformas i said we chose falcon you can googleits name and youyou will get more details on thatbrowsernow next slide pleasenext slide pleasecan i by the way make a short footnotedmitry yeah sure go on yeah just forpeople think that he still has 7 000source files to gouhas you said it all depends on what youbump into there are certain days thatyou canplow through 500 of those files right itall depends what you bump intoyes exactly i can i can there are dayswhen i build like 500 compilation unitsa day it's pretty much it's pretty muchbutmy next slide is also about that so iwill clarify on that as wellyeah that that slide is on the screennowyeah okay very good souh the qt web engine development goes alittle bit slowerthan we plannedyeah we have to admit thatuhand i am trying to i'm gotry to explain why it is like thatuh well uh first reasonis quite general it's uhit's just more difficult to compile uhsoftware to compile uh libraries andapplications on os2 than on any otherplatformmodern platform like linux mac os orwindowswhybecauseos2 isshowing his a its age since like 10yearsandwelackconstantsupport fromsoftware when vendors for the os2platformtheyall these uhthe maintainers of all these librariesi've previously mentioneddo do nothing for us to they do notsupport os to do not support itofficially at least so everythinguh which needs to be donein those libraries and in thoseapplications to get them running on theos2 platform has to be done by usby me by sylvan by herrick by some otherpeople but it's us who uhmust do it and there is nobody elsebesides us to do that and that's whyit's it's going pretty much slow andanother reason is thatdon't know upfront what we bump into onthat road it literally looks like that istarta new compilation session and wait untilit failsand when it uh and when it fails i lookat theplace where it failed and try tounderstandwhy it failed and only then only at thatpoint i can actually see what is thereason it may be a bug in our port itmay be some missing feature it may besome outdatedversion of some library that does notlet the build continue like it was withtheicu like it was with ffmpeg like it waswith python and many other libraries orit may be even somecompiler feature that our compilermisses and this is this was the casewith gcc so we had to stop our chromiumwork completely because it's simplyimpossible todo two such big projects at the sametime i had to stop any any qt or qt webengine work and switch completely toporting gcc version 9 to os2 of coursewe have paul smedley which who supportsa number of uhsoftware and libraries for os2 we reusedsome part of his work when working ongcc 9but we had to do a lot of our own workwe had tobring white character support which wasmissing there and it was missing inpaul's ports as well so we had to do itfrom scratch and we had toupdate our leap support to make itpossible so it's like a chain ofdependencies and etc etc so it took liketwo months to bring gcc as our dimensionand these kinds of bumps happenall the time when i workon chromium as i go and this is why it'shard to predict when iactually finish it and this is uh whyit's hard topredictwhat will be the next failure and thisis why it's so slow and uh as roderickmentioned beforewe have touh to see as we go see it as we goin factin fact justto to tell people in the communityum there are also other people that uhthat sometimes jump in with adviceum for me one of the respected communitymembers that does a lot of developmentand you've heard memention his name many times is stephenlevine he also keeps an eye out andgives gives advice to uhbut the bottom line is it's uhit's uh it's a lonely battle to get itdone you're getting there but uh yeah ijust want to emphasize it again thatthese guys are not workingin a cave somewhere and hammering at itas they move forward they're trying todo it as efficient as possible soand there are other people externallywatching as well soplease move on sorry about that yeahyeah yeah andit's it's you can there is simply noother way for us for the always twocommunity to go becauseeverything is done by the same three orfour people and we have togo here and there to make this trainactually running anywhere at all so uhso this is how things areand uh just to mention and qt5 is itselfis ready since august last year and uhexcluding theweb component which we are talking aboutright now and this is readyto be used you caninstall it with yum or with anapm package manager andwrite your ownnice applications for os2 or port someexisting applications it should bereally easy if this implica applicationsdo notuse theweb engine componentso qtv5 itself is ready it's only theweb browser component which is missingand which is i'm currently working onreally really really hard and i mycurrent estimate is that it will takeanother monthto go through all these uh files uhthrough all these 7 000 compilationunits and it's a it's really doable thistime maybe even faster but again itdepends on whichpumps iface on that roaduh again if if i face them if if notvery good if i facesomething i have to switchtosome other project to fix it so that ican continue with the with the webbrowser companyandonce it's done once we have qt one oncewe have chromium ported andwhich means we have qt web engine portedas well because once chromium is readyqt web engine will takehalf an hour to compile or somethinglike thatuh i will switch directly to falcon tothe falcon web browser and it will takelike a week or two to get itright up and running on os2once we have chromiumup and running it will justone or two weeks because it'smostly cross-platform code and all thedirty work is already done either in theeqt5 library itself or within ourchromium worksoonce chromium is readywe will get a browser really really fastuh and that should be a next slidepleasethat's also consistently what we havecommunicated is thatthe bulk of the code is in those two inis in those two frameworks qt and uhand the webkit and effectively to put itextremely impolite the browser is quoteunquote just gooey most of thefunctionalityso that's what i also like to say ifsomebody else is completely dissatisfiedwith the falcon browseruhyou can try and port another current qtbrowser that is out there and you cancompile it for os2 as well it's going tobe a little endeavor to get the buildenvironment working all of the sourcesare availablebutthat's the other benefit if somebody inthe community really thinks that falconstinksum yeah be our guest there are optionsthere are optionsyou're not tied to just the firefoxbrowser because it was either firefox orfirefox it wasyeah it was a bit like buying a trabantwhat color do you want it black or blacksookay uh let's move forward and nextslice please next slide please yeahsoyeah so these so-called gcc ellipsesbitwise work this is ellipsis factorywhat it isthis is uh our tool chain which we useto board all the software wework and all other people working on osto use exactly the sametool chainwhich consists of the gcc compilerand the ellipsis library these areits two core components besides thatthere is a bunch ofdifferent development tools which wealso we haveported them to os2 first and now wemaintain themsoand there is just a small really smallgroup of uh people worldwide who work onuh always to software about six to tenpeople around the worldand they all use thisfactory we all all these people use gccwith a few exceptions like there thereis a one or two projects using thewhatcom compilerbut still this compiler often needs theellipsey library for some otherlibraries andwhich brings us back to our factoryand all these people useour tools and use the dlls bitwise worksprovidesand maintainsand currentlywe maintain around 300 these dlls thesearelibraries third-party librariescross-platform libraries likeformedconfig library like uhfont engine library like i i see youmentioned already like umffmpeg like uh xml libraries and there'sa number of those libraries which makeuh which allcurrent applicationsconsist of and make use ofall these uhhundreds of deals are provided andmaintained by us bybitwise wordsand as i already mentioned in one of myearlier slidesuh all these libraries are also used byall these bigsoftware projects uh provided by us orby other people in those two communitieslike open office like sambal like copslike mozilla like ud and java and etcetc actually all of those i've justmentioned are provided by bitwise worksas welland all of them depend on lipsy anddepend on gcc because they are builtwith gccso this is what uhit is our gcc lipseffactory next slide please next slidepleaseit's uh it's on the uh on the screenokay thank you and now uhhere comes thethe interesting partwho payswho pays this uh who pays this all workuhfunding the bitwise workscompanyuh recently os2 boys does a reallyreally good job collecting funding forusand uh this job uhjust uh keeps things running it's reallyit's really really important it keeps usafloat itlets bitwise works go on with our uhwith our continuous development with allthese gcc war with all these qt5 workandwith all this chromium workthe problem is that a small group ofpeople donate money and uhas already as roderick already mentionedmany people think that bitwise works forgranteddoes everything for granted and for freeand they can have everything uh from usfrom for granted but of course it'ssimply not true because it requires alot of manpower all this work that we doand we need to eat we need to live andthis is whywe need some moneyand as roderick already says with uhkeeping saying that all the time freesoft software does not grow on treesanduh open software despite the fact thatit's open softwarewhich means that you have all the sourcecode available and can douh some work yourself it still needs tobe funded to keep it alive and it's assimple as thatno fundingno no updates no software updates no newlibraries no new applicationsvirtually no nothingnext slide please may i add a smallpointer to thatyeah of course because i think you willagree with me where it says owes tovoice that's effectively methat's truedoing a great job on findingfunding for for our continuousdevelopment that's no doubt about thatone of the things where it has gone thatfar and i thought i just highlight thatto some extent is thatand i'm actually still waiting for anext shipmentof old os2 software toarrivebut all of the proceedings that i'vebeen scraping together old hardwareselling old ibm ps2 keyboards onlinei've actually been sitting here at thedining table cleaning them with a brushand taking the grease off and shippingthem actually everywhere i've actuallyshipped keyboard these old ps2 keyboardsto russia and australiabutthose features yes they've all gone forabout 50 to 75 euros i've uh thanks tomartin eterbeeder some of the ebayuhauctions have gone actually completelywildthere was a couple of months ago therewere a few people that were literallyfighting for a couple of these os2memorabilias like a denim jacket fromthat i think any willis ora guy from the netherlands donated thatwas finally sold but the bottom line isis thati i like working on os2 butit's to some extent actually ridiculousthat uhwe have to get to the point where i'mworking in the evening hours to shippackages all around the world and ithink approximately 20 or 30 boxes withalways two items left towards all sortsof directions getting in maybe two tothree thousand euros in proceeding in inmoney to fund uh dimitri so that you cankeep on working butthat i just thought it was fair to givea slightuh peak in how much works work it takesto provide additional funding and that'syeah yeah okay next slide pleaseyeah so in order toto overcome this difficultywe are thinking on other options on howto gouhon from now toto continueour development and to to find somefunding to let us running furtherand one of our ideas isto introduce sponsorship plans for theupcoming browserwhether it will be falcon or somethingelse it doesn't actually matterand this is our current idea on how togo on with that so that we could getsome funding to continue working on iton thebrowser uhuh a version of browser uh with a fixedhome page pointing to bitwise homepageuh where you can read theabout everything we do will be availablefree of charge so it will be uh somesort of an egg screen of some kindandthis version will bedistributed for freesouh each time you start a browserpage or a tab in a window will be openthat will direct you to our web pageand the second option will be tobuy us to buy a sponsorship unit whichwill cost uh30 or maybe 50 euros it's still to bediscussedand uh with the sponsor sponsorship unityou willget no fixed pay a home page you will beentitled to some level of support fromus you will be able to report us bugsand to getsome instant feedback from usuh you will also get some direct supportfor browser updates and you willyou willuhyou will not have to payfor it again and againuh so you will get an update each uh sixmonthsfor what you payuh people whoalready sponsor the browser they getfree access to a period depending on howmuch they sponsored yes soonce your sponsorship runs out of uhtime there will be some uh period whenyou can use the new version free ofcharge and then you will have tobuy and sponsorship unit againand this will be distributed as wellusing our rpm distribution network butwe will use a separate passwordprotected rpm repository for thatso this is one of our ideasand if roderick has anything to to addhereyeah welljust to clarify umi don't know if that came across clearlyupdates for the browser would beavailable free of charge to communitythere will just be a delay of let's saysix monthsbut as dmitry said yeahwe just have to make some hard choiceseverybody has just seen thispresentationandwe can present ourselves a fantasy thatwe can distribute everything free ofcharge butit's simplya fatto morgana in the desertsomething is needed to put somebodybehind the desk and to continue to writecodethe the sources coming from otherplatforms in some cases need custom-madepatches for os2 to be written and it'snot like you can just hit the compilebutton and out rules a project soumyeah this is still under discussionand yeah and and just to emphasize thisif people think that this is unfairuh the sources of the all of theprojects uhwill be available without delayotherwise that would be a violation ofany open source licensesoif anybody uhwants to compile itgo ahead but you're certainly going toneed some spare time to get the wholebuild environment to workand the other thing is that i'd like tomention bitwiseworks is alreadyeffectively doing this for the lastcouple of years with openofficeopenoffice you can make a donation tothe bitwise workshop and then you get adownload url for the binary so youeffectivelypay for the support of it and get the os2 binaries bypaying for it soin that in that retrospect this isactually not really such a new ideaand in fact it's it's kind of a goldenroad in between you can still get thebrowserbut if you don't want to pay for thepremium support well then you get lessso i just thought i'd emphasize thatokaynext slightlyyes no no no i will tell you well i iwould just like to add a couple of wordshere as well yes i was maybe not veryclear about that about what exactly whatuhscheme exactly we will have for all thatbecause it's still uhwe are still thinking on that on abetter solution here but but we willhave to come up with something and thisuhit will be uh basically for support youwill be paying you will you will bepaying not for the software itself butfor support for usmaking it built for you and if you don'twant to do it you will be able to takethe sources as already uh as roderickalready mentioned and do it yourself sothis is how we see it can goand can let us survive and still dosomething for theosu community and once wecome up with a final idea we of coursewill share it in detail with thecommunityuh now next slide isyeah it's on the screenyeah thank you andthe last point to mention here isthat bitwise works maymakes nobody rich unfortunately ofcourse[Music]here at bitwise works wouldlove if it would make them rich butfortunately it's simply not true andthere are uha few things to mention a few a fewimportant things to mentionfirst silvan and herbie puta lot a lot of unpaid towers in uh whatwe do it means that they do somethingbut they don't get any money for themfor for their work it's uh they don't doas much as i do of course much less butstill they do some work and they do itbasically for freethis is uh one of the things which isimportant to understand and the seconduh important thing is sylvan evenregularly paysputs his own money on the table heregularly provides extra sponsorshiphimself it's like uh 2200 or of to 500 euros a montheach month he does thatjust toto get things rollingthis is very important uh to understandfor for for every everyoneand as um roderick already mentionedalso or all source code is uhavailable online uhand it's available for free because it'sopen source it is our enjoy productwhich is very specialso everything we doevery singleline of codetailored for always to we put online andeverybody canmake use of that workin addition to everything else so thisis uhhow thingsare here atbitwise worksright now and the next slide please nextslideokay well so yeah that must be it yes ifthere is anybody having any questionsor if roderick wants to add anythingi'm ready to answer or to comment onwell i'll i see that everybody is stilldiscussing on the irc channel the famousuhplush animal that i got from uhmr faulty at warp stock the the the os2elephant which was from ibm salesdepartment but i'm certain there aregoing to be some questionsbut there's about a 30 second delay inthe stream soi'm just waiting for people uhwell actually i think this one of thereasons that the os 2 voice foundationdid the sponsorshipand the only reason that we did that asa non-profit organization is because ourcharter allows that and alsoumit's it's open source work so itgenerates the uhuhit gen it umit uh it it it's beneficial for it'sit's beneficial for everybody there isno profit motive the source code is nothiddenoh well and gucci just transferred uh ahundred euros for the uhvoice qt development thank you so wowthat's great thank you very muchso are there any other questionsregarding this i know that a lot ofpeople in the community have beengoing like well it's not finished yet ican understand that i hope that thispresentation has givenan insightwhat okay wait a minute umi'm going to repeat my question okayokay the first question isum[Music]there's there's the user a123456789have you considered compiling aunix-like operating system and then linkthe object code with an os2 linker seemsto be less involved than maintaining acompiler and port and potentially letsyou better utilize your hardware andtest decrease compile timei'm not sure i got thequestion actuallycompile some unix operating system whatdoes it meanfor os2 or what like a virtualized storeno no the question is literally and i ii also don't understand have youconsidered compiling on a unix-likeoperating system and linked object codewith those tooyeahcross-compiling now i got the questionthe thing is that the uhunix operating system does not uhwell actually uh it's it's an option buti'm not sure that it will be simpler imean we canwe cancompile onlet's sayubuntu and get a out object fileswhich we then linkuhonon on an os2 machine yeah this is a wayto go buti'm not sure it will be much faster andmuch easier because thethe the thethe most uhslow slowing down part in this processis converting from a out from the a outformat cr which gcc creates tothe omf format which os 2 natively usesactually uh what this uh person suggestsis uh to some extent whichis what we are actually doing because weuh uhuse gcc to create uh linux object filesand then convert it to convert them tothe os2 format but we do it on the os2machine because we have gcc 9. it wasn'tas difficult asworking on chromium itself because wealready had previous ports of gcc and wemade a new port on top of them of coursei think that uh doing what he suggestswould would take more timenow sylvan sylvan isn't here but there'sa question on the youtube channelum and if people are wondering what thenoise is in the background that is theuh electronic water cookerumno it's it's here at myplace umthe question that mark dodell has what'sthe status of enjoy firewall is thatstill being developeduh i'mi'm not a developer of enjoy firewalli'm not responsible for that i thinkif silvan were here he would answer thisquestion better than than me i am notready to give you any feedback aboutenjoy status but as far as i know it'sstill being developed i still i see somecommits and some work going on on itwhat i see here also is from new walltowers some web pages require morefeatureswebgl is often a requirement simply torenderi'm not sure that it's it's already arequirement i haven't met asinglewell i'm pretty sure there are siteswhich uhwon't rule around otherwise if you don'thave webgl butuh i don't think that there are lots ofsites like that at this point becauseit's still experimental andpeople think how to use it besti don't have any site like that inon myother machine which is mac os driven uhbecause i use a browser with openwith all opengl functionalities turnedoff and i have no haven't seen anyproblems right now but of course at somepoint it might become a problem butthere are solutionsmaking a softwarerendered opengl support is not verydifficult notmore difficult than gettingchromium itself up and running it's it'sreally doableit's even simpler of course thanchromiumokay ummartin itube is asking i don't know ifdmitry used uhuh or has somebody answered thatquestion alreadyhe's asking i don't know if uh dmitryused javascript frameworks like node.jselectron i was wondering if the qtwebkit engine port itcan it open the door to also ableto port some javascript standaloneapplication to os2it's um it's as simple as that chromiumcan render it can run uhsuch applications and with someknowledge of qg5 you can actually make astandalone application that will do thatit's uhthis is how slack isdonefor instance uh and yes yes this is thisis another benefit what of what we areworking on right now once we havechromium once we have qt web enginethings like that will also uh become ourpossible yeah okay yeah there's ananswer already on the irc channel thatit's answeredumi hope people understand that uhand and i just have to be honest here inmany of the discussions i sometimesheardthathow should i put thisthat uh putting up a schedule for thesetype of projectsthat the estimate can be made betterif the project management is better umno that's a general statementthat that thatthe thing that i that we've that thatyou and i that we because dimitri and iboth worked on this presentationtogether that we've that we hope that webrought across is that simply softwaredevelopment on os2 is not the same as onother platforms where there is a wholevariety of libraries available and thewhole build systemyesall these libraries are supported bytheir own teams this is a very importantdetail herethis is what we don't have on os2 thereis no support teams for no librariesonly us as already mentioned we have tosupport all these libraries which uhwhich other plot platforms have specialdedicated teams to support we don't havethat luxury not at all and this is whyit's really hard to it's not a it's notabout management uh thethe thing is that the amount of work youhave to do to analyzeuha projecton such a level that you could predictits completion better than we dorequires amounts ofthis this amount is comparable to theamount you need to actually port itsoin our case again in our case given oursituation given that we that that welack separate teams working on each andevery library in this in this particularcircumstances it's uh it really makes nosense to go that deep it's uh just thesame amount of time you need toactually port it and actually fix thatbug or bring this very version then toanalyze everythingand uh estimate how long it will take sothere just makes no sense there'sactually a question here from alex isthere any thought of making aquote-unquote gcc legacy rpmuh so that people who still need tobuild uh applications using gcc 429he says that he's reluctant to updatethe new uh tool chain libraries toversion nine because of his developmentworkuh well it's not um directly possiblewith rpm because in rpm you can onlyhave one versionof the compiler of course we canhack around it totomakeit possible to have two versions byrenaming files and doing all this stuffbut it's not a simple it's not a simplejob it's there is a lot ofpathsconfiguration files inside the gccitself and there's a lot of dlls whichwouldall have to be uhsorted out somehow so it's not an easytask it's much if you really need thatit's much easier to justbuild gcc for yourself and have a localbuildtailored for your local pathsand use it instead it's really not thatdifficult to build it andthere is detailed instruction on ourwebsite in on our githubwebsite dedicated togcc it's all there it's not thatdifficult at all and you can even useumthe zip file containinggcc 4 builds made out of a set of rpmfiles which we release for each rpmand it's available on ourhttp websiteyou can actually use that and but youwill have toplay around with environment variablevar variables that set up paths tolive to gcc libraries to gcc includefiles you will have to play play aroundwith them so that you wouldput you would point them to a locationwhere you unpack this zip file you cango this way toookay but i'm not i'm not sure we willinvest time in making uh an rpm for thatokayum[Music]let's seeyeah are there any other questionsi'm i'm kind of curious to see howpeople view the plans thatthat there's going to be kind of ashareware version of the browser for itbut that people also understandwhy this is being donewe just simply again get the impressionthat too many people just like to hit onthe download button and take it forgranted that the software is therei'm going to be honest that people havesaid thatsylvan has received private commentswhere people saidyeah but i've already paid for arca oswell to put it extremely bluntthat's not how it works in os2 that'sthe realityandif peopledon't like that reality thenthat's it the point is we need to havefunding to keep this train runningand uh yeah we can choose togive everything away free of charge butif a large portion of the people are notdonating that's the end of the trackit's that simple and then the messageand then the message is migratethat's all i can say so i know it's abold statement butyeah yeah i i can't i can only secondthat uh without support from thecommunity without sponsoring we aresimply deaduh bitwise works is dead and we will notbe able to speaking of that that slideis on the screen now you can sponsorbitwise works via their webshop they'vealso got a patreon accountandmost of thesourcesi will have to admit that sometimes tosee what bitwise works is doingit's a bit difficult to follow becausethey've got sources on githubdo you also have projects on sourceforgeno no no no ever almost everything is uhon github and we are movingeverything there from uh track fromnet lap server step by step buteventually we will move everything fromthere to get hot because it justmakes our life easier and simpler andgiven that we are very limited onresources it's it's just the only way togoyeah at the moment yeah and i i would uhi i would like to stress it out onceagainuh as opposed to other platformseverything every single libraryhas to be done by us againand uhfor windows for linux formac oseach library has their own maintainertheir ownsupport team andsome of these teams are some of theseteams include hundreds of people andthere are even full-time uh developersin these teams uh we did we simply don'thaveall these and all these developmentteams do not support os2 they don't wantto know anything about os2 they don'thave osu machine machine machines theydon't uhwrite go always to specific code theydon't test it on os2 machines they don'tthey don't do nothing and this all hasto be done by us i want to stress itonce againyeah thank you wellas you can see i think that we're stillin a pretty good position judging by thefact that uhwhat we can all run on os2but but the gcc compiler again showsthatonce you get running behind on certainportions it simply takes time to pick upwhile other platforms have switched to anew compiler and one of the reasons thati think that this uh sponsorshipschemeis actually going to work better is byproviding more funding to bitwise worksonce they can maintain the currentlibraries and the applications we can wecan stayup to speed and one program that theyhave that demonstrates that that is notanother theory but is a proven realityis open office since the meet since uhyuri daario is working on that bitwiseworks has been able to stay currenton theopen office build from the apachefoundation and not long after the apachefoundation releases an open office builda new version on os2 is released that'swhy it's important that that is also whya couple ofabout two years agowe decided with voiceto shift away from firefox developmentbecause it was a never ending cycle ofmadness on fixing patchesand we hope that with the new browserwe can actually reverse that trend andthat bitwise works we'll keep some timeleft to work on other stuff such as javayes optimize this process fireworkfirefox was eating justtoo muchtoo much of our time becauseit's it's afirefox is even bigger than chromiumit's like 200 000 source files in thereit'suh 2.5 times bigger than chromium and itwas simply impossible to manage by 200health people yeah this is really it'sreally crazy project and there are likea hundred of full-time developersworking on cro on firefoxand we have only twopeople working on it are there are thereany other questions on theyoutube video stream or theum or the umuh or the umthe irc chatand i'd just like to emphasize againpeople that have already provided thesponsorship os 2 voice has a list ofthose people and the people that havesponsored now if you pay 20 euros westill have to discuss that we'llprobably give you access for half herepeople that have shown to be generouswill certainly betaken into account and not forgotten anddepending on how this is all going to beset up if for some reason youare left out in getting free access andyou are entitled to it send bitwiseworks or me an email and we willinstantly correct that so just toclarify that that the people that havesponsored are not going to be left outin the cold in any way that's certainlynot our intentionyeah yeah sure of course just write usokay okay dmitry i don't think there areany more questions at least i don't seethem here on the youtube channel and theuhand also not on the youtubeson the youtube uh stream so uhi can just show the last slide then ohcan you move to the last slide pleaseyeahof courseokaythank you everybody for attending uh onthe schedule there is still aa a brief warp stock closing sessionuh well dimitri you can stay thereif you want and thenwe can ask any other people uhthis is then the end of the first uhvirtual warp stock2020due to the corona crisisas i said personally i'm i'm i'm to someextent and following the development ofsome form of a treatment for thispandemic with some interestso let's hope that there is quickly acure for thisand that we can actually get togetherfor a real warp stock again which i'mactually hoping is going to be next yearin frankfort in germanyone person i would really like to thankand i don't think that he's currentlyhere on the irc chat i can't see him hisname is thomaslozelandlast year at warp stock i was reallypleased and so happythatsomebodywhen i asked who wants to organize warpstock and instantly thomas said well iactually want to do it i went like huhcan somebody give me a pinch in my armi've been doing this for probably 10years so anyway uh we've got a we've gotan affordable youth hostel in uh suddenin the south of frankfurt which is verywell connected byuh by train and airplanefrom over europe and the rest of theworldsoifif the covet problem is solved then wehope todo warp stock europe again physically in2021 in frankfurtumare there any other os2 oruhwarp stock questionsdo would people like uh voice touhpick up on a certain activity would youlike to contributethere was at least one person that sentme abrief summary ofwarp stockeurope i'm just looking at it one slightmomentoh yeah that was sent by chrisand he made ashort posting i'm considering postingthat to the articles always to voicewebsitesorry i'm just looking hereyeahthere's a thank you from mr faulty fororganizing warp stockso yeah it's kind of an open-ended[Music]session i'm just waiting for the uhdelay in the youtube streamsorryuh is dimitri still onlineno not the audio okay noyou're not lying i'm still onlinewaiting for questionsi don't think that uh there are anyother questionsuh os4 would like to uh thanks for theinteresting presentations wellyou can thank us but you can certainlythank the people in the inbehind their desk that they put in thetime to create the slidesalex certainly uh was this year's uhwarp stockcinemarunner-up he had threepresentations showing us what you can doin your spare time for os2so that deserves a virtual round ofapplause from my perspectiveumwe've so yeahmy closing words are you knowit's 2020 and uhthere are all there's always doubt withpeople oh no os2 is doomed uh yeahthere's going to be a day that this uhplatform will no longer be able to runwell we've just seen uefi in actionyesterdayit'sit's there it's undeniable it worksperiod andi've been testing it on other equipmentas wellsoyeahwe are working on the browser that hashad some setbacks we've tried to explainto the best of our abilityumhowuhwhy thatis the caseworking on os2 is is you simply needuh very driven and uhumuhpeople that want to push on to keepgoing it takes a level of enthusiasm butuh yeah that uhthat's what this is all about okay thenuh i'd like to say everybody uh thankyou for watching the video stream wehave had a uhaverage uh amount of viewers of around50 peopleon the stream sokeep on working on os2 keep the forumsaliveand i hope to see you all next yearthis is uh nightcare the netherlands uhand this is the end of uh warp stock uheurope 2020 the firstvirtualvirtual versionuh thank you for joining stay healthyand see you online orin my mailbox thank you for watching