Dennett vs McGrath - Part 7 of 9

This is a debate at the Royal Institution in London between philosopher Daniel C Dennett and professor of theology Alister McGrath. The debate is on the ideas presented in Dennett's book Breaking the Spell, such as the concept of the meme and the evolution of religion.
The debate is moderated by Madeleine Bunting.

Daniel Clement Dennett (born March 28, 1942 in Boston, Massachusetts) is a prominent American philosopher whose research centers on philosophy of mind, philosophy of science and philosophy of biology, particularly as those fields relate to evolutionary biology and cognitive science. He is currently the co-director of the Center for Cognitive Studies, the Austin B. Fletcher Professor of Philosophy, and a University Professor at Tufts University. Dennett is also a noted atheist and advocate of the Brights movement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Dennett

Alister Edgar McGrath (born 23 January 1953) is a Christian theologian, who holds both a DPhil (in molecular biophysics) and an earned Doctor of Divinity degree from Oxford. He is noted for his work in historical, systematic and scientific theology.

In his writing and public speaking, he promotes "scientific theology" and opposes antireligionism. McGrath was until recently Professor of Historical Theology at the University of Oxford, but has now taken up the chair of Theology, Religion and Culture at King's College London since September 2008. Until 2005, he was principal of Wycliffe Hall.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alister_McGrath

Category:

Education

Tags:

• debate
• God
• religion
• atheism
• atheist
• meme
• Christian
• Breaking
• the
• Spell
• Daniel
• Dennett
• Alister
• McGrath

[dgdfhfghgfhgfgffjhj]

The last woman is an example of the defense mechanisms Dennett described.

If someone tries to apply logic to your religion, deny the validity of logic.  "Faith is a living experience" is a vague way of dodging logic. She doesn't have to understand her trickery, she just has to remember the phrase and react.

"Horrified" is another one. Don't argue against an idea, be offended by it! This plays well with the first, because that kind of reaction is good for calling up irrational memes.

[oppenheimer12]

I'd like to think The Rock is interested in this debate

[huwrj]

Who invited that woman to this debate? How about shut the fuck up.

[Lahi53]

@hymnofashes Saying that Xenophobia is inherently tied to religion doesn't add up. Speaking only for Xtianity, following Jesus' teachings would seem to lead to the opposite way of relating to others, namely radical inclusion. Martin Luther King, Jacques Ellul, Tony Campollo, Dorothy Day...just a few of those who have been radically challenged by Jesus to love in this way. Of course hate exists in Christian groups too, but I don't believe its inherent, but rather hypocritical and anti-Xtian.

[SubconsciousGatherer]

She's afraid to test people of faith on their understanding and comprehension of their own theology, yet religious schools and colleges abound? Are they not testing in these institutions?! She wants to make ignorance untouchable. She wants to give a continual license to superstition.

[Sidnelsom]

We dont give a fuck if u were a atheist, MAKE A DAMN GOOD ARGUMENT YOU ASSHOLE!

[nontheistdavid]

LOL McGrath talking about rationality? 

[BloodOfRayne]

@Gnomefro I get that, but you seem to be saying that thoughts themselves only follow a kind of evolutionary ideal and therefore just like pysical evolution don't hold any real water! That as we grow, our thoughts grow with us implying that whatever we think is simply just another step in our evolution as a whole. Problem: if this is true then why the diversity in religions, and why has the world as a vast majority held to the teachings of Jesus Christ more so than any other preacher?

[Gnomefro]

@BloodOfRayne "How do you study the process' of thought in a physical way? There's nothing organic about the way people think! O.o"

If you look up the term "meme" you'll quickly realize that ideas have some key characteristics in common with biological creatures. Namely that they replicate, mutate and the ones that manage to replicate most successfully in a given environment tend to dominate and crush alternative ideas.(Possibly by killing the host creatures of alternative ideas)

[judomuerte]

@dgdfhfghgfhgfgffjhj I felt it was a rather fruitful debate until this point. This whole debate is just further proof of the incompatability of science and religion. The moderater is clearly biased against Dennett, insofar as choosing the questions directed against Dennett, then the obviously dangerous question of the McGrath's arguments being aplied to all religions. Why do all theists run for the hills when the FSM argument is brought up.

[NathanJSweet]

Dennett talks about secular religious research as if it is in its infancy and nobody has studied religion. Plenty of people embark on religious studies and come to the same conclusion:

Studying human behavior is a difficult! and unsure task! I think Dennett wants the surety of the hard sciences to exist in the humanities, when it just isn't possible. His theory of consciousness has been soundly rejected by most mind experts, why should I listen to him on religion?