kvar energy savings unit power factor optimization Industrial application part 2

The meters don't lie! Rich and Rob prove how your facility is held hostage by a poor power factor.

Category:

Science & Technology

Tags:

• kvar
• energy
• savings
• unit
• power
• factor
• optimization

[vacman1353]

5occerboy, shame on you for not doing your homework. What these units save are your (I squared R losses) and depending on your motor loads and distance from the transformer could be significant. On facilities that are billed with for Power factor penalties we turn out to be heros. Whats your power factor?

[taylortownmayor]

Yeah, very slightly. I wouldn't call that minuscule amount much of an increase though, 20~30 watts isn't much, but yes will cost you more!

It is due to the capacitor supplying VARS to the system and raising voltage. The reduction in line current due to the capacitor will also reduce voltage drop.

The slightly higher applied voltage will raise the power just a bit.

The important observation is that the watts don't change all that much even though pf is changing dramatically.

[billfenn2]

The video actually shows that the KVAR unit consumes more watts. Homes are billed for the wattage that they use. Look at 1:44 in the video. It shows a power factor of .822 The display below it is KW or killowatts (what you pay for). The reading is 2.48KW. Move the video forward to 2:36 and you will see that the KW has INCREASED to 2.52 when the power factor has been corrected to .999. This video actually shows that the KVAR unit is consuming more energy.

[shieldcracker]

Let me set the record straight power factor correction, raising the power factor as close to one saves energy. This video is misleading, lowering the amp draw on a load by raising the power factor does not make the load more efficient and thus saves energy. By lowering the amps the losses on the branch and circuit feeder are reduced and that is where the energy savings come from. The watts to the motor or any load stay essentially the same. POWER FACTOR CORRECTION HELPS WITH LINE LOSSES ONLY.

[lordandprotector]

If you have an old kwh meter that is really just an amp-hours meter, AND you have a low PF due to lightly loaded motors, this will make the power meter turn slower for the same or even higher actual power usage. It does NOT save any power/energy. And the descriptions given by these 2 guys are absurd. All it is is a capacitor, in parallel with the load, to balance the inductive portion of the load. As Nikola Tesla spins in his grave!

[taylortownmayor]

Sorry though for ignoring that small of an amount. During the day I deal in megawatts so I might not pay attention at all to a difference of a few KW here and there.

[Gigivr6]

Read what you write, as the pf encrease so does the KW, so it will end up costing the costumer more!!!

[taylortownmayor]

@Gigivr6

They DO show watts. His meter shows KW when it shows power factor.

At 1:44 you can see the pf is 0.822 and the power is 2.48 KW.

At 2:11 you can see the pf is now 0.957 and the power is now 2.50 KW.

At 2:32 you can see the pf is now 0.998 and the power is now 2.51 KW.

Rob and Rich ARE right. The meters DON'T LIE.. the power doesn't change!

Also efficiency by definition is the ratio of power out divided by power in. Since power use doesn't change, neither does efficiency!

[Pyro4117]

gapind1, YOU need the study, as 5occerboy correctly pointed out, you left PF out of the calculation, which is where the savings are supposed to occur.

They don't show where the capacitors are installed, but if they aren't at the motor itself, there will be no I^R savings.

For commercial customers with a kVAR meter, PF improvement is valid. For residential customers it's a scam.

35+ years as a utility engineer and conservation program evaluator.

[ENERGYCONTROLPLUS]

Power Factor only works on Commercial facility that has a significant old motor loads because Utility companies will surcharge you for poor factor loss. Utilities companies do not charge for Poor power factor on Residential and will only charge you for true power.

The meter that you have reads loss of power factor but it does not matter as far as the residential side.

If what you are saying is true why isn't reconigze by EnergyStar? Please don't lie to your Customers.

[Gigivr6]

Show us the Watt consuming difference, I know the meter you have there can show it. stop hiding stuff from inosent people!!!