Dr. Robert Morey on "Free" Will: Part 1

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[CruciblesVerdict]

This guy is full of rhetoric with subjective Biblical interpretation. All people have free will and God is sovereign too- easily proven. I have no problem refuting this guys 5 point Calvinistic point of view Biblically, especially his historical take that free will came from the Catholics. If he would do his research he would know that Wycliffe, Huss, Waldo, and their followers believed in free way before the Reformation Protestants believed in it, not to mention the Apostles and early Fathers.

[1tmoch]

@CruciblesVerdict Wait a second. Now i've read the Roman catechism, and i see free will in it, laid on thick. I see it in the philosophy of the Greek pagans. Where i don't see it, is with (as you said) the apostles. I could really care less where it came from or who taught it, unless it be from the bible. So, how about starting and finishing there, and leave YOUR rhetoric at the door (your first 3 sentences as example, building up to 1 rebuttal attempt in the 4th and last sentence).

[TranceViper]

It doesn't make sense for him to view free will as a tangible resource that has a limited supply. Who decided that concept?

Anyway, it's a dangerous thing to believe in lack of free will because you risk missing opportunities to personally help someone because you have the "God will take care of it" mentality. Many a time have I seen situations where people could have done great things for others, but instead they just gave a pat on the back and said "I'll be prayin for ya!"

Actions, people.

[1tmoch]

@TranceViper This attitude you describe is not the biblical or historical reformed position. Understanding that God has ordained all things and that free will is a false humanistic idea, does not deter me in the least to obey God's commands. I my finiteness i operate under God's means to His ends. The assumption you say would be for people espousing this view is erroneous and forced. If people have done that, that is there error, as it can be flipped on the "free willer" as well.

[GoldenBoy7996]

this guys a fraud. this guys been refuted many times. 

[1tmoch]

@GoldenBoy7996 All claims and no pudding. Where's the beef? God's word can not be refuted, and Dr. Morey has accurately represented it here. "Fraud" is intentional deception. So, are you now able to read peoples hearts to determine motive and intent? Hmmm, sounds like you need to repent of your sinful slander...

[TranceViper]

If free will does not exist, then any sin committed by man, no matter how heinous, should not be subject to punishment because the entity at the wheel the whole time was God. Therefore invalidating the purpose of any command in the bible and also the concept of temptation, because it's not personally up to us anyway whether to engage or refrain.

And the real kicker.....your belief says me loving & following God isn't my geniune choice and it's just an auto-pilot setting?

Yeah, no thanks.

[SicilianOedipus]

@1tmoch You often say that free will came from Roman/Greek philosophy... which specific Roman/Greek source are you talking about? Is it the Odyssessy, Illiad, Plato, Socrates, or is it something else??

[travismification]

I love Dr. Morey Attitude kind the same way I act to people who ask me these questions.

[travismification]

@1tmoch I guess William Lane Craig would surely Disagree with Robert Morey. Even Lee Strobel, Mike Licona, Ravi Zacharias and others.

[KevZen2000]

exploitation, I mean explanation.

[KevZen2000]

Science is the best exploitation the issue of free will and determinism, but anomalies will almost always likely exist. Religion does not have enough explanatory power to answer it, because it requires testable hypotheses, and supernaturalism is typically without any rational principles to enable a rational discourse.

It might even be that the issue of free will and determinism will be debated forever, as its a very difficult question.

[patriotsfan1379]

@TranceViper your problem its pride hiding behind accountability its an old trick but its plain to see!!the bible says we are ""sinfull"" GOD restraints our evil desires allowing those that will further HIS plans and purpouses in this world ! so when you sin you are held responsible because you did it and you did it willingly you should be thankfull that GOD only allows what HE decrees otherwise you would be even more accountable for many more sins

[patriotsfan1379]

@TranceViper yea but faith is a gift of GOD eph 2;8,9,10 and without it and the convictions of the HOLY SPIRIT we would do no such works!! we would be like the unbelievers who act according to their evil desires JESUS said apart from me you can do nothing !! but if you think you can than good luck to you if there is such a thing as luck!![not]