Estranged Labor I

Alienation, estrangement, disconnection. We feel alienated from many things in our lives. In certain ways our entire lives are struggles to overcome alienation, to make meaning and meaningful connection in our lives. Why are we so alienated? Alienation disconnects us from controlling the fruits of our labor, having control of our own lives. It turns men into animals and separates people from one another, turning friends into enemies.

In this episode, we take a close look at one of Marx's earliest writings: Estranged Labor.

Find more at: www.marxismtodaypodcast.wordpress.com

Category:

Education

Tags:

• Alienation;
• Disconnection;
• Estranged;
• Labor;
• Marxism;
• Today;
• Podcast

[kingofcrunk1010]

What's the music?

[MarxismToday]

@kingofcrunk1010 The band is Hussalonia, and they have this song and others available at the internet archive. This particular song (and the rest on the same album) have been devoted to the public domain.

[cris750]

"alienation" is a starting point --> Division of Labor --> Class structure. The more that new technology is introduced into society the more it becomes possible to remove "alienation" or "estrangement". I say possible because it could go negative or positive if technology is used or misused. The form of technology is the variable for change. The distribution of money through the various workers with varying salaries/wages create social class warfare. True by observation.

[MarxismToday]

@cris750 Your point about technology is very interesting. I agree that technology has the ability to enhance alienation - as some industrial machinery did, or remove it - say by reducing the time required to do a menial necessary task. The kind of technology we get is influenced by our mode of production, so we tend to get technology which reinforces capitalism. Luckily technology also influences our mode of production so revolutionary technology can literally change the world.

[cris750]

K. Marx historical tribal example would show that "alienation" have existed when tribes exchanged resources through barter. Members of a tribe would be given roles and duties similar to the modern examples of the Division of Labor. No doubt that modern capitalism is filled with problems but K. Marx presentation is not adequate to critique it. I agree with your example but this existed when barter was common. Just replace "boss" with tribal chief or..... Premier.

[MarxismToday]

@cris750 It's my understanding that tribal societies were not based on barter or commodity exchange. The vast majority of labor/production in these societies was done for immediate consumption by the community with no market exchange. The same is true for feudalism - there were markets, but most production was not for those markets. This results in a different kind of alienation. You're right, alienation alone cannot explain capitalism, it is just one piece, but it's an important piece.

[cris750]

@MarxismToday alienation is constant throughout history even when there is no division of labor. While division of labor is not constant. The class structure developed later when currency became more in use and therefore obviously it is not constant. Class structure is a recent phenomenon created to buffer antagonism against the leadership structure. By making some of the proletariat mass into managers making more money than the rest of the wage workers.

[MarxismToday]

@cris750 Division of labor is connected to alienation, but they are not one in the same thing. I'm confused; on what account are you claiming Marx was wrong? Doing the same 3 second task over and over for 40 hours because the boss said to is a lot different than one man choosing to fish while another chooses to plant crops. Alienation also includes relations of production, and how people relate to each other through the medium of production.

[cris750]

@MarxismToday K. Marx presented the problem of Division of Labor which creates the social Class structure problem. How could the division of Labor problem be eliminated according to K. Marx model and presentation. The "Alienation" problem is connected with the Division of Labor problem. K. Marx was definately wrong. The Division of Labor is a natural phenomenon it exist in nature including among the Gens 1.0 history of the human race. Gens 2.0 is impossible to be realized and achieved.

[MarxismToday]

@cris750 On voting: Perhaps. There should be some way for workers to collectively control the surplus they create. Voting would be one way to do this. This does not need to require the state, but it could. Worker's control of industries doesn't necessarily have to be a state owned industry. Also, state owned industries can run the same way as private ones and be just as problematic. The key is worker control rather than ruling elite control. And yes, people must be self aware for this.