A few facts about Shakespeare aka Edward de Vere

A few facts about Edward de Vere AKA Shakespeare

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News & Politics

[Azariaadele]

I agree that the knee-jerk opposition to a legitimate research question is silly. However, "circumstantial evidence" does not meet academic standards - no matter what question you apply it to. More, the authorship position is based upon the false assumption that a particular "author" will provide a skeleton key to Shakespeare's plays. This fundamentally misunderstands the plays (whoever the candidate). The plays are multi-vocal.They yield innumerable, often contradictory interpretations.

[Azariaadele]

When I say the plays give rise to "contradictory interpretations", let me just offer one example. Is 'Henry V' war propaganda or is it a satirical anti-war play? The play contains seven or eight specific damning objections to the war - including a hints of Henry's illegitimacy - and an attack on the rationale for the war against France that has been pointed out since Hazlitt. If I "knew" the author was noble, it would not alter the fact that HV can be read as an anti-war play.

[edboswell]

@Azariaadele Isn't the "anti-war" aspect of Henry V primarily the bellicose goading and deception of the Catholic Church? If it was anti-war, why would the British govt. subsidize its production during WWII?

[edboswell]

@Azariaadele I disagree on standards of circumstantial evidence. I have found few leaps of faith in the Oxfordian position, while the Stratfordian case is entirely built on suppostion. His education? No proof Letters to or from this famous person? None Books owned by him? None His links to the 3rd Earl of Southampton. NONE, Yet he is listed as Shakespeare's patron? How can that be? If WS know Italy so well, why assume he didn't travel there? That's common sense, really. Oxford solves it

[Azariaadele]

Thanks, again, for the challenging and stimulating discussion. I will, hopefully, get some time to read some additional material. I appreciate your questions - and responses.

[edboswell]

@Azariaadele I would be keenly interested in your thoughts as you read Anderson's book. He had a master's in physics, and his thesis was on the overturning of theories. He noticed the same pattern took place over and over again, and that men of high caliber and intelligence would fight unfairly, and like badgers, to protect their life's work. When he came across the "authorship question", he noticed an exact repeat of that behavior pattern. He spent 10 years on the book.

[Azariaadele]

@edboswell Oxfordians, though, also pick and choose which circumstantial evidence they accept / discount. For example, they discount the references to the Gunpowder Plot in the Porter's speech in 'Macbeth' ("who committed treason enough for God's sake" [Mac II. iii. 9]) because their candidate was already dead in 1605; and the references to the shipwreck of the Sea-Venture from 1609 in 'The Tempest' ("the still-vexed Bermoothes" [Tem I.ii.229], etc.). We all do this.

[Azariaadele]

@edboswell The answer is that the Laurence Olivier production cut out most of the scenes that focus on Harry's cruelty (the massacre of all the French prisoners [H5 IV. vi. 37] BEFORE the French murder the English boys and the famous "Your naked infants spitted upon pikes" [H5 III. iii. 3] speech); the question about Harry's legitimacy that arises with Cambridge's betrayal and rival claim to the throne - [H5 II. ii. 155-60] through the mother (!); the epilogue, etc..

[Azariaadele]

Sorry . . . Mere's list from 'Palladis Tamia, Wits Treasury' (1598) is: "Sidney, Spencer, Daniel, Drayton [I missed this name in my first quote], Warner" . . . then "Shakespeare, Marlow, and Chapman".

[Azariaadele]

@edboswell Oxfordian research can be important - because it is based upon a set of assumptions that will necessarily yield an unusual angle of light upon the plays. There are two well funded university graduate programs now, one in the UK and one in America. If the archival material is there, it will be found . . . However, Oxfordians need to beware of special pleading. The resources are there. If you want to make your case, it will require meeting academic standards.

[Azariaadele]

@edboswell Shakespeare's "life" is deeply unsatisfying in many respects . . . Nothing that I have read, though, suggests that he was regarded, during his lifetime, as an "Elvis" figure. When Shakespeare is mentioned by Francies Meres in 1598, for example, he is not given pride of place, but listed sixth out of eight, in a series that includes Sidney, Spencer, Daniel, and Warner, first. Marlowe and Chapman come after him. This suggests success, but not celebrity.

[Azariaadele]

@edboswell I'm sure that this book is intriguing. It is an example of a book I would read - because it has wider relevance for Shakespeare / Renaissance studies.