Rochberg- Black Sounds (1/2)

George Rochberg's "Black Sounds" (1965), for winds and percussion, originally, although this performance includes brass.

Category:

Music

Tags:

• George
• Rochberg
• Winds
• Woodwinds
• Percussion
• Brass

[AyumuVanguard]

@John11inch Maybe, maybe not. I can't tell since I didn't ever actually not know. And also, I have no idea anymore. I need to check my YouTube inbox more often.

[OriginellerUserName]

@cnmaster01 But there are no actual, literal quotes, I think

[cnmaster01]

@OriginellerUserName From Wikipedia "A few of his works were musical collages of quotations from other composers. "Contra Mortem et Tempus", for example, contains passages from Pierre Boulez, Luciano Berio, Edgard Varèse and Charles Ives." So, it wouldn't be out of character for for him to squeeze a few quotes in here, nor would the arranger likely take issue with inserting them. Though I can't find any confirmation anywhere, nor do I have the scores to check for myself.

[John11inch]

@OriginellerUserName

I'm just letting you know what we would call it in English. We don't really have a single word to describe what you're talking about, at least not one that I'm familiar with, and I'd like to think that I'd be familiar.

[OriginellerUserName]

@John11inch True, but it's an interdisciplinary field (Acoustics&Instrument-/Orchest­ration). Acoustics is the theoretical study of overtones, combination tones, formants and all that stuff. Varèse knew about all these things and incorporated them into his writing

[John11inch]

@OriginellerUserName

We would not say acoustics.  We would just say "orchestration," when referring to instrumental combinations.

[OriginellerUserName]

Part 2/2 is very different from Varese, though, that's true. Enough blabbing

[OriginellerUserName]

The term "plagiarism" is too harsh, I take it back. But certainly "in the vein of..."

[OriginellerUserName]

And it's not a matter of "picking tiny segments", there are mils of such examples (like 5:16 sounding like bars 25-27 of Octandre). I'm not deriding this piece, btw, I like it, because i like Varese. I have nothing against imitation, it's the most sincere form of flattery (commenting only on this one work), but I thought it was puzzling because I googled the piece and there was no mention of Edgard...

[OriginellerUserName]

@John11inch What I meant by "AP", I don't know the English term, it's called "Akustik", "acoustics" probably: Varese had a certain way of voicing chords (brass at the bottom, larger intervals (like two minor 9s, increasingly dense towards the top, woods, *somewhat* analogous to overtone spectra), "filling out" wide voicings with the Tam-tam. From 0:10 on, Hyperprism, anyone?? And If the chord at 0:46 and its fanfare-esque reiteration doesn't remind you of Varèse, you're crazy.