Re: Argument for the Irrelevance of God

Reply to
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjjZr5F52Q8

"D1: Perfection describes a state wherein the subject is free from flaws, defects or shortcomings
D2: Benevolence describes a state wherein the subject is concern with good and charitable acts
D3: God is defined as having both qualities described in D1 and D2

P1: Given D1, a perfect being requires nothing
P2: Acknowledgement from lesser beings is something
P3: Humans are beings lesser than God
P4: Forgiveness is a good and charitable act

C1: God does not require acknowledgement from Humans (from D1, D3, P1, P2 & P3)
C2: God would forgive the failure of humans to acknowledge Him (from D2, D3 & P4)
C3: Given C1 and C2, belief in God is irrelevant"

P4 fails. To forgive a criminal who has not repented of criminal ways is to set up future conditions of ill and evil.

C1 holds, but is a red herring in this case. The theologian argues that Man requires God for the full realization of his own good.

To refute C2 the theologian may use the exception of P4 mentioned above:

To forgive unbelief without repentance is to set up future conditions which are evil (a lack of the good belief brings to man)

As C2 fails, so then C3 must also fail.

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[askirojadu]

You make a wrong assumption in your counter of P4. The idea is the person would repent if they were aware that God existed. It is not about "going against God" its about epistemology.

"The theologian argues that Man requires God for the full realization of his own good. "

You are sorta going off on a tangent here, morality of man is not the issue. The issue is the rule that God MUST require man to believe without proof (ie before you die) for your salvation.