Stateless Dictatorships

How a Free Society Prevents the Re-emergence of a government

Category:

News & Politics

Tags:

• libertarian
• anarchist
• freedomain

[jackson32]

Isn't asking if an existing stateless society could turn back in a state putting the cart before the horse. Could you guide me to information that shows how a stateless society could happen in the first place.

[stefbot]

Thanks, for that you'll have to dip into my podcasts, because it's a fairly large topic! :)

[LeeGeeGee]

Near monopolies can arise in a free market. Standard Oil gained 88% share through peaceful means without using state coercion. In your utopian free market, one DRO would eventually gain an 88% share through peaceful honest means. Since there would no longer be strong enough competition to prevent it, that DRO would then use coercion to prevent competition. The result is that it would be a state.

[stefbot]

That's a common theory, but it's totally false. If you're interested in why, I have an article on my blog at freedomain blogspot com

[LaughingMan0X]

One thing you could address in the "collection of arms bit" is the possibility of smuggling.

[stefbot]

Why would you smuggle without a government imposing tariffs and taxes?

[haheyho]

You don't want to suffer the violence of monopolization.. so you want a monopoly built on violence straight off the bat...

..................

[sharperguy]

What people have to remember is that the only reason the state can do bad things to us if we don't pay taxes is because they have the ideological support of the vast majority of the populous. In other words there are plenty of people wiling to pay their taxes because they believe it is necessary to have a stable society (lol). Some of this money can then be used to coerce everyone else.

Just imagine what would happen if everyone in a given country decided to stop paying at once.

[Zillo91]

You did not bring up the possibility of one DRO seizing control of all neuclear weapons? Wouldn't that give them the power to coerce everyone else?

[schmoborama]

@zoogle1

Are you an NRA member? Because they're the only people I know that imagine an entire civilian population being armed and trained in warfare, each and every one of us a survivalist. Survivalists love this idea, but NOBODY ELSE DOES. What benefits are there in a stateless society that can possibly make up for being completely alone with nothing but an AK47?

Just look at Palestine. Zionists cruised in and made their lives hell for generations. Was that worth not having a central govt?

[zoogle1]

@schmoborama 2/2 Which also comes back to the fact that the reason a state can sustain this military action is taxation and defecit, both of which are supported ideologically by the populace or by the state's monopoly on force. I do think it would be difficult to build an agressive army without any level of nationalism to back you. A city of one million armed citizens would be a challenge to conquer, and require a large force. It seems economically unfeasible for anything but a developed state.

[zoogle1]

@schmoborama While I agree that I feel some ideas weren't fully adressed, you also have to think of what kind of ideology would spread in this society regarding statism. People would view this hostile takeover for what it is, and would probably be well armed in anarchy. I imagine there would be very little to be gained from this takeover due to constant resistance, it would be a costly occupation. In fact, to sustain it would probably require an unreasonably large military.

[schmoborama]

This is ridiculous, it assume that the only people who might try to become a dictator would be someone who starts out as an equal, who just decides to try it overnight. These things happen over *generations*, not years, and they don't start out planned that way.

Armies also attract and are supported by undefended citizens. Who wants to live next to an armed country with no defense of your own? An army large enough to take over it's own region is supported in most societies.

[MarmaladeINFP]

@Emil246 How do powerful people do anything? How do people gain power & why do people follow those with power? It has nothing directly to do with govts. People follow cult leaders. People join gangs. In the 19th century, the Pinkertons employed more people than the US military. How did they do this? How do cult leaders get people to follow them without the force of the state? How do small groups of people gain power & create massive organizations? They just do it because that is human nature.

[Emil246]

@MarmaladeINFP

How would they go about doing this.

[MarmaladeINFP]

@Emil246 I have no doubt that, in Stef's fantasy world, the DRO corporations would be more than happy to unschool you and your children. In such a world, people would be so unschooled that they might entirely forget what schooling ever meant. Yes, there would be no schools. In fact, there would be no anything besides what brought profit and power to the DRO.

[Emil246]

@MarmaladeINFP Stef's part of the unschooling movement. No schools :)