TAG: Matt Slick VS Matt Dillahunty PART 4/5 - A.E. #593

Matt Slicks Website - http://www.mattslick.com/

The Atheist Experience is a weekly cable access television show in Austin, Texas geared at a non-atheist audience. Every week we field live calls from atheists and believers alike, and you never know what you're going to get! Sometimes it can get quite feisty indeed! You don't want to miss it.

Episode: #593
22 February, 2009
Topic: Live Calls. Matt & Tracie take on live calls.

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[rockys201]

I've gone cross-eyed listening to this!

[GMunny5]

(cont)

"We have grown out of the world and can not have an objective picture of it"

i would ask how you can necessarily assert this, but it's somewhat off-topic.

"It is practical that we perceive the world in that way in order to do science however"

Even if your going to assert that every single one of our perceptions is wrong (i don't know that they are) the LA has nothing to do with that. Things are what they are, and can not be something else simotaneuosly. That's all the LA imply. Objection?

[xOnimpulsex]

@GMunny5 It is impossible to imagine a universe without minds (without having a mind). We do not look at the world as if it were a room and we are standing outside of it looking through a glass window. We are Being-in-the-World. We have grown out of the world and can not have an objective picture of it. It is practical that we perceive the world in that way in order to do science however. (Check out David Hume's argument on properties and causality).

[GMunny5]

(cont.)

Even if we aren't there to make that judgement, it doesn't matter. A rock there is still whatever it is based on its physical properties. It can not be whatever it is, and something else simoultanesly. This is simply true. It does not matter if a mind is there to discern it.

This is all the LA are implying. Slick was upset because Dillahunty couldn't tell him what they were, if not conceptual, but i'd say they are simply natural or universal laws.

[GMunny5]

@xOnimpulsex "apple is an apple whether you know its there or not' - I would say no, our minds have structured the world in a way in which we can distinguish 'objects' from others and also from ourselves"

How we perceive things has nothing to do with the LA, nor does it affect the fact that the LA are not contingent upon minds.

To put it in the simplest analogy, imagine a universe exactly like ours but with no minds. A rock in that universe is still whatever it is, and not something else...

[JDillaDudas]

I think i need to drop some acid then go back and rewatch this...

[xOnimpulsex]

@deadmouse217 go amazon a copy of "the critique of pure reason". Thanks.

[deadmouse217]

@xOnimpulsex As you say this is where we part ways. I am going to have to hold that reality exists as reality regardless of any thoughts or perceptions. How we think and perceive reality of course affects our "reality", but the "external" world doesn't change if we accept it or reject it. It remains regardless of our cry's that it be otherwise to fit our desires. Thank you for your time and input, it was a enjoyable exchange.