CALVINISM- 'Why I Am Not A 5 Point Calvinist' - By Dr. Norman Geisler (1 OF 9)

(1 OF 9) WOW A MUST SEE!!! At 'A Moment of Truth' (AMomentOfTruth.org), we are in total agreement with Dr. Geisler. We believe Calvinism is an attack on Gods Character for "God Is Love" (1 John 4:8, 16). God is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance (2 Peter 3:9). We discern from the Word of God that most people wont be saved despite the fact that God desires for all to be saved! However, God does't send people to Hell. They choose to go there. 'MY CALVINIST BROTHER AND SISTER, MAYBE YOU NEED MORE OF GOD'S LOVE AND MERCY IN YOU, MAYBE!!!' (Sammy Sabbagh, 'A Moment of Truth').

Category:

Nonprofits & Activism

Tags:

• Calvinism
• arminianism
• elect
• election
• predestined
• chose
• God
• Jesus
• Bible
• Salvation
• Sovereign
• Hell
• Heaven
• Truth
• Saved
• Born
• Again

[Judgement220]

@shteve77 You said: "It also says in the later plagues that God hardened Pharaoh's heart."

Then according to your doctrine: How can God find fault with the Pharaoh, when He Himself caused the Pharaoh to disobey Him?

Relate it to the "Justness" of God if you can.

[Judgement220]

@shteve77 Concering the Jer 18 analogy you said:

"make the pot he wants to because the clay is marred he will make it into something else. This is exactly what God did with Pharaoh."

Okay, clear this up with me, According to Jer 18:3, Did God ever make Israel a vessel that he was pleased with because Jer 18:3 says:

"potter formed it into another pot, shaping it as seemed best to him."

Did God do this with Israel, Then relate to Rom 9:20-23.

[shteve77]

@Judgement220 God can use His power an sovereignty to do what ever He wants, but the story of what happened with Hezekiah proves your view wrong. God doesn't have to, He is all powerful and He does not have to listen to men or change His will for us, but scripture declares that He does. He did with Hezekiah. God has not predestined the outcome of everything.

[shteve77]

@Judgement220 You still won't give a straight answer. Again I didn't ask can God do it if He wants to, I am asking is it just?

If a judge holds a gun at your head and makes you rob a bank and then you find yourself before the judge in court and he sends you to jail for robbing the bank is that just?

[shteve77]

@Judgement220...so just answer this simple question. If everything that happens is predestined to happen by God and a good nation turns bad and God punishes them and in His own words, He doesn't bring the "good He intended", How can God say He intended good for them when you say He always planned to destroy that nation?

[shteve77]

@Judgement220...."and if that nation I warned repents of its evil, then I will relent and not inflict on it the disaster I had planned. And if....I announce that a nation...is to be built up....and if it does evil in my sight....then I will reconsider the good I had intended to do for it."

God says if a nation that is bad repents He will not bring the disaster He planned, and if a nation that is good turns away He will not bring about the good He intended...cont..

[shteve77]

@Judgement220 No you are wrong. The analogy is that if the potter can't make the pot he wants to because the clay is marred he will make it into something else. This is exactly what God did with Pharaoh.

As for Israel, God told them they were His treasuered possesion and that He would bless them provided they were faithful to Him. They were not and He removed them from the land. Ch19 shows that God told Israel He was going to destroy them....cont...

[shteve77]

@Judgement220 Pharaoh hardened his own heart several times. It says so. It also says in the later plagues that God hardened Pharaoh's heart. It differentiates between the two. God predicted the future and told Moses what would end up happening.

[Judgement220]

@shteve77 Concerning Rom 9:20-23:

"Is it just for God to create a person, cause them to sin and then punish them for commiting the evil that God caused them to commit?"

You are continuing to ask the question posed by Paul in Rom 9:19. I will explain why Paul answered the way he answered on the CREATOR'S RIGHT found in Rom 9:21.

"Just" means equals must maintain equals as equals. Is a car equal to a man? Is a vessel equal to the potter?

Your problem is that you equate God to man.

[Judgement220]

@shteve77 Concerning Jer 18 you said:

"Listen very carefully. God clearly says that if a nation turns away from Him..."

Therefore, NOW ISRAEL is BAD.

You are saying that God did not remake Israel, But the analogy in Jer 18:3-5 says that God made this bad vessel into a good vessel.

“Like CLAY in the hand of THE POTTER, so are you in my hand, O house of Israel." Jer 18:6

THE POTTER, remade the vessel into a good vessel.

Now in your own words, Relate Jer 18 to Rom 9.