Position and Hold vs. Line up and Wait

This video has a clip from Liveatc.net where the atc controller instructs the pilot to postion and hold, and the pilot responds by saying roger, line up and wait! The atc controller keeps telling him to position and hold until the pilot says position and hold. Tell me your comments. Should the pilot be able to say Line up and wait. subscribe and rate!

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• control
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• radio
• communications
• aviation

[tylerbm1997]

Thanks for everyone's comments and views! Just so everyone knows, this conversation was recorded before "line up and wait" became the new terminology. All pilots and Air Traffic Controllers are instructed to say "line up and wait". Thanks again for your responses!

[helobelow]

Wait where? On the RWY, ILS hold short line at taxi way intersection Charli/Bravo, behind United 1132? The hold tells you exactly to stay behind the RWY hold short line and not to get on the RWY yet until instructed to do so, wait does not.

[tylerbm1997]

@helobelow I do not understand your question. This video just shows how an aircraft is instructed to line up and wait but the aircraft responds as position and hold. An aircraft is usually instructed to line up and wait or position and hold, when at the hold short line. When the aircraft is holding short, ATC can instruct an aircraft to position and hold; crossover the hold line, line up with the runway's center line, and hold; wait for take-off clearance.

[CAY999Tyler]

JFK Tower wins...

[leyva1998]

@tylerbm1997 Well, the FAA official instruction used to be "Position and Hold", the ICAO (the rest of the world, almost) uses "Line up and wait". Now the FAA has changed the instruction to match ICAO. so now all over the world the instruction is "Line up and Wait"

[MaroonCamaro]

Yeah, it was changed cause the foreign pilots that dont speak english as a first language had trouble understanding the phrase position and hold.

[tylerbm1997]

@FF35Pilot They did change it to Line Up and Wait. This conversation took place before it was changed officially. The pilot was probably use to saying "position and hold" and the controller was probably saying "line up and wait" to get pilots used to hearing it. It was just a conflict of preferences. But now it is mandatory that ALL pilots and Air Traffic Controllers use the term, "line up and wait".

[FF35Pilot]

@tylerbm1997 ?? I swear they changed it to line up and wait... position and hold has more than one meaning... it could mean stay where you are... line up (i.e. line up with centreline) and wait. Very clear instruction there. Line up with the centreline and wait. very simple.... how's that confusing?

[wcelton]

Just to clarify, position and hold means to proceed on to the runway, line up and and wait for further clearance. The FAA changed the phraseology of this term to line up and wait, so you should no longer use the term position and hold.

[maggus999]

@tylerbm1997 Listening, it's obvious the pilot isn't from the US. I think I hear "starway", which is XL Airways France, a French company operating outa Paris De Gaulle. Since they're under JAA regulations and the FAA was still using the "position and hold" at that time, that's the reason for the confusion. I think it's weird though, that the US controller hadn't heard "line up and wait" before, surely some other european guy must've said that before?

[Stupendoussteve]

@wesker0900 they mean the same thing, in both cases the aircraft is already on the runway. You are thinking of hold short.

[cushynumbers]

Line up & hold Sounds very much like Line up & Roll over the radio,  At least by saying Line up & wait there is no confusion!

[wesker0900]

controller just wanted the pilot to say what he did so he wouldnt get in trouble because if he allowed th epilot to read with line up and wait and the pilot caused an incursion he would be in hot water even though the pilot knew he meant position and hold...the controller was just watching his ass