God, Religion, Fishes and Falsehoods - A Freedomain Radio Listener Question

Some objections to my disproofs of gods from a listener to the Freedomain Radio Sunday Call In Show.

Category:

Education

Tags:

• god
• religion
• jesus
• atheist
• atheism

[ifreemantoo]

I'm still waiting to hear from Stefbot for an answer to, 'where does 'morality' come from other than the thinking of men to their most common conclusion of 'just because'?

Regardless of belief in a Creator of or in atheism isn't the real problem people? I come to many of the conclusions that Stef does without having blame atheists specifically for the problems of people.

I'm surprised that a man so gifted with communication that he can't speak in a way that lessens the 'Us agin' Them'  crap.

[stefbot]

An excellent question, I have a free book on my website called Universally Preferable Behavior: a Rational Proof of Secular Ethics, which is I think a very compelling argument for where morality comes from, without gods or governments...

[Hashishin13]

@TheSteveMedia My point was that your really not willing to take that tiny step and say, No, Zues didn't exist, and he most definately did not ejaculate into the ocean to create yet another god.

Its kind of strange to say that there is no evidence for this ridiculously absurd claim, but I'm just going to say I dunno. There is such a thing as a reasonable presumption, like against a god, or that insane story.

[TheSteveMedia]

@Hashishin13 I'm an agnostic atheist. it means I don't claim knowledge of nor do I worship. In regards to Zeus ejaculating into the ocean, there is no scientific evidence that Zeus, or aphrodite, or poseidon, or [insert any god from antiquity here] ever existed. Whatever point you were trying to make wasn't exactly clear to me. What point are you trying to make with your ocean ejaculate metaphor?

[Hashishin13]

@TheSteveMedia Okay so your agnostic to the long list of Greek gods? Thor, Odin? Jehova and Jesus' miracles too then? So when Zeus ejaculated into the ocean and created the god Aphrodite, you weren't there so you aren't going to make a judgement because you think it could have happend, but science hasn't proved it yet? When Moses heard a burning bush talk to him and when the Bible says that God made man from dirt, despite all the evidence for evolution, your agnostic to that too?

[TheSteveMedia]

it's really time consuming to combating ignorance, especially stubborn ignorance so consider this my last response...

[TheSteveMedia]

@Hashishin13 "If there is no example of something, odds are it doesn't exist."

and that is why i'm agnostic because it is possible but until it is proven, I'm not going to believe in it (or not). Gravity is a theory but the word means different things in different contexts. In science, the word theory is a collective culmination of evidence from different scientific fields that support a single hypothesis. We are still studying and understanding anti-gravity...

[Hashishin13]

So you mean fact and belief not knowledge.

Fact:

There is no conciousness outside of matter that has ever been demonstrated to exist

Fact:

If there is no example of something, odds are it doesn't exist. Even if it does it's existence needs to be proven before it can be asserted.

"I will agree that consciousness only exists in matter but it doesn't mean that that is an empirical law of the universe."

So gravity goes one way, and has always done so but that isn't enough to make it a law?

[TheSteveMedia]

@Hashishin13 Let's make something clear in both of our minds. From my perspective there are two kinds of assertions in reality. 1) Knowledge 2) Belief knowledge is something that comes from science in that it can be shared and regardless of individual biases it is universal. Beliefs are assertions made by individuals based off of their own experiences. The difference between you and I is that my beliefs come from science, and can be substantiated by evidence. Yours cannot.

[Hashishin13]

@TheSteveMedia I didn't make any "ignorant assertions", I have been studying this as my hobby my whole life, as a matter of fact, accusing me of not knowing how science works was the real "ignorant assertion" here.

I know science can only prove what it can test, and since there is NOTHING to test here, science can't help. HOWEVER, since science can't help in this arguement then we know we aren't dealing with anything in the real world, as science can test everything in reality.

[TheSteveMedia]

@Hashishin13 From our narrow understanding of reality I will agree that consciousness only exists in matter but it doesn't mean that that is an empirical law of the universe. This is why religion is ridiculous from my perspective...It makes ignorant assertions about reality.

[Hashishin13]

@TheSteveMedia Name one instance of conciousness without matter. There is only conciousness in minds.