James White questioned by Robert Sungenis on the intent of the Atonement

In a previous debate with Robert Sungenis, James White is questioned, from 1 John 2:2, about the intent of the atonement in the Q & A segment. Based on sound exegesis of the text, who does the apostle John have in mind when he says that Jesus "is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world?"

Category:

People & Blogs

Tags:

• James White
• Robert Sungenis
• Propitiation
• Sacrifice
• Atonement
• Calvinism
• Arminianism
• John Piper
• Free Will
• God
• Bible
• Christianity
• Reformed
• Arminian
• Wesley
• John MacArthur
• RC Sproul

[CBALLEN]

Acts 13:48 is the most unambiguous verse on salvation,it says,When the Gentiles heard this, they were very glad and thanked the Lord for his message; and all who were chosen for eternal life became believers.

The particularity is ALL who were chosen for eternal life,some translations say..and as many as were appointed.Not even all the gentiles that heard God's word that day were chosen to believe.Unsaved men hate the fact that God has free will to choose His own sheep,it crushes their pride.

[CBALLEN]

All men Gentile and Jew,Fat and skinny,all colors,all economic brackets,all nations,slave and free,man and women,old and young contain God's elect people and every person who Jesus died to save will be in Heaven,not one that He died for will be in Hell.Jesus died to actually save specific individuals and took the wrath for their specific sins.Think for a minute,if Jesus died for ALL MEN &THEIR SINS God would have no wrath to pour out on the wicked and He still has plenty,Jesus SAVED people.

[theearstohear]

@casadapazaosdeabraao - I'm not quoting angels or the flesh - I'm quoting the bible. The things you say make you sound like you are completely unhinged. Why don't you breathe into a paper bag for about 10 minutes and then open up your bible and read the Gospel of John. Every time you see that God is in control of man's salvation and that man is powerless in fixing his sin problem, put a check there. Call me when God proves to you that he's sovereign in salvation, better yet, thank God.

[theearstohear]

@casadapazaosdeabraao - I am not a Calvinist and did not get my doctrine from John Calvin but from the Lord Jesus Christ who taught "No man can come except the father which hath sent me draw him and I will raise him up at the last day." (John 6:44) All I've quoted to you is the bible - maybe it's the bible that you hate? The vitriol and passion you have for defending your ersatz theology is no substitute for knowing what the Lord actually taught.

[casadapazaosdeabraao]

@theearstohear Reasoning like bereans is a good thing. They used The Word of The Creator to enlight the words they heard. Just like the apostle Paul.

But reasoning inspired by the "god of the desert" is exactly what those leaders that I've mentioned used to be. They heard "angels", they heard the flesh, they tried to own kingdoms and all kind of dead-human honors, they invented false doctrines, they forced people to follow an obbey them...

[casadapazaosdeabraao]

@theearstohear Paul was ful ofThe Holy Spirit, not full of all doctrine he got from other then Yeshua (Jesus). He got the Law of Grace straight from every other regenerated human gets too: from ABOVE (James 3:15).

No one that call himself calvinist is a genuine christian just like a half-man is not a man anymore, or never was it.

The seed must be THE SAME that made christians filled with The Holy Spirit that we can see in The Bible - any other "fruit" is bad.

[theearstohear]

@casadapazaosdeabraao - "And Paul, AS HIS MANNER WAS, went in unto them, and three sabbath days REASONED with them out of the scriptures" (Acts17:2) Reasoning from the scriptures is precisely the method used by the apostle Paul. The Lord Jesus Christ said that "the scripture cannot be broken" (John 10:35) and built logical arguments based on the precepts of scripture. "But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which [you] call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers" (Acts 24:14)

[theearstohear]

@physicist21 - Once you understand what "propitiation" is, the "world" that John has in view HAS TO BE the elect, else you've got universalism. I've done a short video on this - look for "Office Theology 108 - I John 2:2" - I think you'll find it amusing.

[theearstohear]

@physicist21 - Amen, brother.

[physicist21]

@theearstohear Ihave also noticed that the video said that to belive this way (referin to particular redemption) , one must first begin with cretain presuppositions brought into the text, but they don't realize that they are actually the ones bringing the presupposition that  the word "world" in 1 John 2:2 means every single human being that ever lived...