Syndicalism is antithetical to Anarchism (Bookchin)

Here is the Bookchin video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fK6kANh_VAg

Sorry if this offends the Pacific Street Film people, I don't intend any ill-will by it. I respect, admire, and appreciate all of your work and everything you have done to spread knowledge. I mean no disrespect, I'm just expressing my views.

Category:

News & Politics

Tags:

• Murray
• Bookchin
• Anarchism
• Syndicalism
• union
• revolution

[pacfilm]

Hey, re: V-log... Why would we be offended?

[Darganot]

I didn't want to take the piece out of context or try to make it seems like Brookchin was saying something he really wasn't. This is a fairly contentious issue in the community, as everyone tries to claim their shade of anarchism is the "right" one.

I'm using the video to make a point that I wasn't sure was intended, but was my subjective interpretation. I didn't want to use your work in a way you didn't intend.

It's your labor, after all. :-D

[utubenotgoodasgvideo]

Sure unions can suck, but they don't have to be. The IWW lets you stay in no matter where you work or if you are unemployed. As long as you are not a boss, you can be a member. You vote for all major legislation directly and all officers and delegates can be recalled by referendum. It has a pretty good balance of the efficiency of representation and the democracy of consensus. This is the closest thing we have to a syndicalist union in North America.

[freethinker17]

anarcho-synidcalists and other left wing anarchists are not "obsessed" with democracy, we merely see it as required for a more participatory and equitable social order.Its very untrue to say that democracy is always a form of government. For reasons that are far to complex to explain in the comments section on you tube, the traditional narrative about democracy is inacurate.

[RadioFreeWisconsin]

Perhaps not the unions we have now. These beuracratic and authoritarian unions need to be replaced with more revolutionary and representative ones. One idea: there should be no fixed leaders in the union and all delegates should be routinely rotated. The state destroyed all the true revolutionary unions like the IWW.

[musicalidea]

@utubenotgoodasgvideo I wonder if any of them are part of the Amer. Fed. of Worker Coops. However, they should have set up a charity/investment organ to fund the est of more worker coops & ESOP plans. No one is going to give us equity w/in the Corporatist version of the Global Bureaucratic Informatic Industrial Capitalist system just because we beg them to with protests, strikes & rallies: they massacre millions of innocents 4 profit. We must slowly build equity 4 ourselves via concerted means.

[utubenotgoodasgvideo]

@musicalidea Actually, at this point the IWW has more job shops that are workers coops than job shops that are conventional boss owned companies under contract. The IWW has been a huge sponsor of workers' self manged businesses. Red Emma's in Baltimore. Just Coffee in Madison. Mystery Street Recording in Chicago. Red and Black Cafe in Portland. ETC...

[musicalidea]

What do you call this form of politics:

1. All workplaces should be some form of a worker cooperative, with varying forms of charters, but with the common principle of post-pay profit distributed to workers as dividend bearing stocks, whether equally or unequally apportioned. Bonds would be allowed but non-worker owned stock would be limited.

2. There should be conventional representative government - but with some notable changes, among them: A) proportional voting. B) unicameral legislature.

[musicalidea]

@utubenotgoodasgvideo Yeah, but these idiots still haven't caught on to the fact that they should have - from the start - been building an economy of worker coops via some kind of investment organ, versus JUST begging the masters to treat them fairly via walkouts, slowdowns, pickets & strikes. If Labor Unions - grassroots (like IWW) or hierarchical (like SEIU & AFL-CIO) - would have funded ESOPs & co-ops, such as those in The American Fed of Worker Coops, we'd be a lot further along than we are.

[alhabbo]

dude, we aint gonna ur tools! wtf! u can have ur tools, i guarantee you that

[razchaoten]

you use the failings of buerocratised, reformist unions as an argument against anarchosyndicalism. Thats like saying you hate apples, so people shouldnt eat oranges Have you looked into the history of the IWW, or the CNT, have you ever actively engaged with any of the member federations of the IWA? You will not find greater hatred for mainstream unions than amongst genuine anarcho syndicalists.

Can you not use collectively owned tools? can you not organise redistribution through consensus?

[Grindermetalhead]

You're equating hierarchical, bureaucratic unions with anarchist unions that are non-hierarchical and egalitarian.

Unions form purely out of necessity to oppose exploitation.

When workers in a factory are being exploited and oppressed it is only natural for them to organize and stand up to the oppression. It is nothing more than a bunch of individuals who all share common misfortune uniting against a common oppressor. It's not an exclusive club but a grassroots movement.

[frostynorth]

From my viewing of the video, I think you're confusing syndicalists' views of unionism, and business/regulatory unionism. Or at least, you're inflating business unionism to say that it represents all unions. Syndicalism doesn't just say everyone should join a union then bring down the current order with a general strike. It has a specific vision of what a union's internal organization should be, and what you describe (especially regarding subservience to labour laws) is not it.