Ravi Zacharias - On Languages (Humorous)

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[veritas785]

dear bro suvish, where was this message given.. was this in hyd in Jan? It seems to me more like a Indian setting in the background is it? thanks God bless you!

[suvisheshakan]

This was in Atlanta, GA

[mehico33]

@DavidOchabski Cosmology has no dogma, that is the source of my aversion to religion. Their laying of asinine blanket rulings. I see no reason to invoke something such as a deity (or spirit realm), the physical is more than adequate to account for the most profound spiritual experiences one might have. The idea that an eternal, transcendent, omnipotent being could also be jealous and petty is also somewhat repulsive and mind boggling. That said I only have experience with christianity.

[DavidOchabski]

@mehico33 You're generalizing all religions as if they're all one idea. The term "religion" has gained all sorts of cultural pretension and baggage.

I personally see the same guise in you as I did in myself when I turned to transcendentalism and nihilism - escaping suffering and responsibility by evoking comfort in awe.

Cosmology has the closest definition to the secular idea of religion you know. The only difference is that one doesn't turn a blind eye to the ramifications of a Deity.

[mehico33]

@DavidOchabski No problem dude, I do think there are merits in religion I just think they are outweighed by the negatives.

Its an unfortunate reality that most people do not like to think any deeper than where the next paycheck is coming from, its good that you can find humility in your beliefs, that is healthy. Personally i find it in study of the cosmos and to top it off, the cosmos won't torture you forever for not believing in it.

[DavidOchabski]

@mehico33 On that quote by CH: It depends on your idea of origins. I see that Adam was still faced with the choice that we have, just on the other side of the coin. The only difference is that we get to see the repercussions and he didn't 'til after the fact.

I've seen commandments that show us how spiritually sick we are, but none that tell us to be well; it's an offer.

If God is Life, then what does it mean to be apart from God?

Sorry this is so late btw.

[mehico33]

@droptozro You'd make a great muslim and an even better nazi. Claim to "know" and don't realize theres no basis for this, I'm not against you having hope but don't appreciate your tone. Tell people they deserve death, they may feel the same way about you. To quote Hitch: We are created sick and commanded to be well. I personally wouldn't give so much credit to the doctrine. As a matter of fact, my ways cause no suffering to others and when they do I reconcile it, I own my faults.

[droptozro]

@mehico33

You deserve death for using that sexual urge unlawfully--thinking willfully lustful thoughts about another. Your uncontrolled thoughts reveal your heart, and your thoughts only reveal that you would ACT on if you knew no consequence--but there is consequence.

You have freedom from those slave lusts, I used to be a slave to pornography and sexual sins, no more though. You suffer for you using your body unlawfully, and it's justice to be punished. But you're offered forgiveness.

[droptozro]

@mehico33

"He created us, he created mold..forged. ...powerful sexual urge"

Your body is just the mold, exactly--how YOU use it and employ it is what determines whether or not you sin or do not sin. Sexual urges have lawful ways of being fulfilled, within marriage. Alcohol(wine) can be drunk lawfully but not drunkenness. Some are just outright unlawful(such as lying). All have used this mold to sin at some point, and most are slaves to it's lusts--it can be controlled in Christ.

[mehico33]

@droptozro Layed out a little more eloquently but the same tired masochism. "we deserve hellfire and not life", maybe you do but you clearly have a warped sense of justice. He created us, he created the mold in which we were forged. He got all creative with his curse "Ill put spikes on flowers, ill make your vagina hurt when you reproduce etc", he created us with the powerful sexual urge and says we deserve death for thinking about it. Freedom to worship or to suffer, freedom indeed lol.

[droptozro]

@mehico33

"Why demand human sacrifices for the sins of...(adam)?"

We all have the freedom of will and we're not being punished eternally for what Adam did, but for our own sins. We have temporal punishments due to the curse on this earth, but Ezek 18 lays out God's type of justice and men die for their own sins.

"all powerful... not just forgive us?"

Justice requires a punishment for crimes committed--God provided Christ as substitution for all even tho we deserve hellfire and not life.

[mehico33]

@dukevarte That would be a good answer if he himself was not responsible for the "prophecies", why do it in such a messed up way? In fact why demand human sacrifice for the sins of a being who aparently had free will(adam)? If god is all powerful why not just forgive us? What kind of example did he set us? Its ok to let someone else pay for your mistakes? I dont know, this ideology is a little hard to swallow