Hell Is Immoral - Punishment's Purpose

Hell Is Immoral Punishments Purpose

Introduction

What is the purpose of punishment? Thats the question we need to ask ourselves when considering the idea of Hell. Eternal punishment, and the possibility that there is anything one could do that would be deserving of never-ending torture.

For the sake of argument, Im going to ignore the fact that it is questionable, at best, as to whether the Bible actually speaks of a real place of eternal torment. What Im going to be talking about is the modern-day, evangelical Christian version of Hell. The place where people go to suffer in a lake of fire for all of eternity.

See the rest of the transcript on my blog:

http://j.mp/8u6QTl

Category:

People & Blogs

Tags:

• hell
• punishment
• reason
• bible
• god
• morals
• morality
• moral

[pjumpy]

No, you grant me nothing. The fact that you choose to deny the existence of God does not alter the reality of His existence.

If you wish to learn about God, the Bible describes His characteristics quite eloquently.

Of course it would take time, effort & the desire to learn the truth.

Something I fear is a long way from your grasp.

Pride is blinding.

It is a shame that you spend so much of your time & energy trying (unsuccessfully) to disprove God, whom you do not believe in.

Ironic?

Sad...

[TheSkepticalAtheist]

@pjumpy

Regardless of whether or not I deny his existence, I am not logically bound to accept his existence without evidence. You are claiming he exists, and it is up to you to demonstrate that.

But, the Bible is not evidence of God. The Bible is the claim that God exists. You can't use the claim as the evidence. You must use sources external to the Bible. "Trying to prove God with the Bible is like trying to prove Superman with a comic book."

We seem to have different standards for truth.

[pjumpy]

@TheSkepticalAtheist It's not up to me to prove that God exists, you've been given all you need to find out for yourself. You have been given the choice, it's up to you to find the truth.

The Bible isn't needed to prove God's existence, the world's full of evidence if you know what to look for.

You think to use logic to disprove God who gave us the laws of logic. Good luck.

Truth isn't bound by our standards, it stands on it's own, no matter what you choose to believe.

Seek & you shall find.

[TheSkepticalAtheist]

@pjumpy

On the contrary. It is up to you to prove God exists, since you insist that he does. Logically speaking, the one making the claim has to prove that the claim is true. Until proof is provided, I am under no obligation whatsoever to accept it as true.

If you can say God exists without providing evidence, and that I must believe it, then I say you must believe in Unicorns and I'm not going to provide any evidence that they exist. There is no difference between the two scenarios.

[pjumpy]

So... Your opinion is that your opinion was not an opinion but a logical argument? What exactly was logical about it?

You assume that all crimes are finite yet you do not consider the possibility of infinite repercussions from certain crimes. Like turning your back on the one who has granted you salvation from your sin.

Do you really think it is unimportant to know all perspectives to make an informed decision? Not very wise.

Do I even have to claim you aren't as smart as God?

That's a gimme...

[TheSkepticalAtheist]

@pjumpy

Okay, this whole argument is hypothetical in nature, because I'm granting you the idea that God even exists. So it's useless to try to say that some being that you can't even describe is "smarter" than me. You couldn't even know how "smart" this God is if you can't describe him.

Let's take one "crime" that your God believes is worthy of punishment FOREVER: eating shellfish. Oh yeah? That's worthy of being on fire for eternity? What perspective is this that you have?

[TheSkepticalAtheist]

@pjumpy

It's not an opinion. It's a logical argument. Until you can demonstrate that it is Just to punish someone for eternity for a finite "crime," I'm left to assume that it is unjust and immoral. I don't need to know "all perspectives." I just need to you show me THE perspective that deems infinite punishment for ANYTHING is moral and, in fact, NECESSARY. I submit that you cannot demonstrate such a thing.

In fact, you will only appeal to "mystery," or claim I'm not "as smart as God."

[pjumpy]

@TheSkepticalAtheist 'No perspective can justify infinite punishment for finite crimes.' And how can you make that assertion when you do not know all perspectives? Your opinion once again holds no weight.

You then state with 100% confidence your ignorance of crimes that have eternal consequences.

False analogy? No, false perception. It is a metaphorical statement to try help you understand your position. You the creation accusing the creator he does not understand.

You do NOT understand.

[TheSkepticalAtheist]

@pjumpy

No perspective can justify infinite punishment for finite crimes. I can say with 100% confidence that I am morally superior to any being who could even contemplate punishing another for eternity for crimes committed within an 80-year time span.

And that Bible verse is a false analogy. Humans are not clay. They are not objects. They are moral agents, as is the god you believe exists. To use your analogy, god can treat us any way he wants and it's moral because we are just objects.

[pjumpy]

@TheSkepticalAtheist So you, being less child like than your creator think you are in a good position to call his final judgement childish?

Hmmm... I think you comment suddenly carries little weight.

You are lacking the correct perspective.

"Shall the potter be esteemed as clay; that the thing made should say of him that made it, He made me not; or the thing formed say of him that formed it, He hath no understanding?" Isa 29:16

And what understanding do you have that God does not?