Christian Martyrs - Voice of the Martyrs

@ davidgcdeuce:  Point taken. Well said.

The word "martyr" means "witness." The first martyrs witnessed the resurrected Jesus, and gave their lives for this testimony. No one who "witnessed" the beginnings of Islam died as a martyr, including Mohammed himself. Yet all of Jesus' disciples suffered unspeakable torture for their faith.

martyrdom doesn't validate a religion as dead soldiers don't validate a war

Martyrdom does validate the integrity of the witness. If a man is so adamant about having seen the risen Christ that he is willing to suffer for it, you can only conclude that he was completely honest in his testimony. That leaves two options: Either the martyr in question was a lunatic, or he was telling the truth. And there were enough witnesses to Jesus' resurrection to negate the former possibility. They couldn't all be hallucinating. Certainly not doubting Thomas or the cowardly Peter.

People martyr themselves DAILY.

I agree the particular martyrs themselves thought they were doing the right thing and following truth, but by the number of martyrs worldwide through history of all the various religions, we must agree MOST died on a false premise.

So, how do the Christian martyrs differ?

They were eye witnesses. Did I not just say that? Other martyrs give their lives for those who lived in comfort while they spread their teaching. Christians have a heritage of suffering. And Christ Himself suffered and promised we would as well. Yet He taught us to love and forgive our enemy, which Mohammed and Joseph Smith did not do.

Since you agree that the martyrs have integrity, why do you not agree that they also have eyes and ears?

I want you to prove that there were eye witnesses, something you cannot do.

when youhear that there were eyewitnesses, you believe because you are credulous. When the converts of paul also heard that there were eyewitnesses, they also believed because they were credulous. There is not one scrap of evidence for the resurrection outside the Bible.

Just because it says 5000 saw him, it doesn't mean that it happened. It is embellishment. This should be obvious to those who think thoughtfully.

And no, I did not agree that the martyrs have integrity based on their death. I said they most certainly THOUGHT they were right, yet were wrong. In fact, if someone is willing to die for such little evidence, and such poor preachments, then I feel the opposite. They are the suicide bombers of today, except without even the reasons that a bomber has of sending a message. It is "turn the other cheek" to the worst degree, taking death without a fight.

NON RESISTANCE TO EVIL IS EVIL PERSONIFIED!

I ask, if the government started a campaign to kill all christians, would you disagree, or take your death like a good martyr?

I, a Christian apostate, would be on the front lines not allowing this evil to happen.

In your Christian view, we should not fight, and should allow these Christians to die. We should turn the side of our head when one side is shot

Do you see how this Christian pacifism and Martyr worship is evil yet?

Christianity often stagnates when it becomes cultural. The Chinese Christian movement seems to contradict you. Why does this type of debate consistently end in oversimplification and emotion? Are we examining our cases? do we rest on our laurels? Both? Neither? Okay, I'm now I'm getting a little heated. I'll leave it at that and hope this conversation goes well