Turtles all the Way Down

Featuring Clifford Goldstein
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Category:

Education

Tags:

• human
• knowledge
• philosophy
• Clifford
• Goldstein
• meaning
• of
• life
• faith
• science
• atheism
• atheist
• christianity
• christian
• postmodern
• postmodernism

[luccaskunk]

@mpcohenYou Thing is, the guy spent like 3 minutes telling us that science doesn't involve faith, that Christianity is superior because it has faith, and then he turns around and says they're both faith based. It's typical double speak.

[MaestroAlvis]

Here is the problem. Once you accept something on faith, inquiry ends. For Christians, research stops there.

Yes once you accept something on faith in science, you fail but that's not a complete loss. Just look at the atomic model. Your admittance of failure means you know you still have a ways to go, and you may find that with a little more work, you wont need to work on faith anymore.

[mpcohenYou]

Wittgenstein's name is pronounced Vit-gen-stine, dummy! And what does God stand on?

Science is not based on faith. It is based on scientific method, which is really just a codification of common sense. State a hypothesis. Do an experiment to test it. Publish your work and let others reproduce the result. Does anyone have a better way of establishing truth?

[MrJmartin05]

@bradkey98765 thank you, will be sure to check it out. Here's an interesting creationist one on the question. It's the best I've read detecting design dot com . Click on the essay with the same name.

[bradkey98765]

@MrJmartin05 And even if you do so it is far less unreasonable than you claim, fruit fly studies do not indicate problems with life of much greater life spans, I will continue to study this and if it showed otherwise I would have rethought everything I "know" about evolution, Since I’ve typed too much already for your point on haemoglobin may I redirect you to dhbailey dot com / papers / dhb-probability . pdf Which says almost everything I would have on the matter.

[bradkey98765]

@MrJmartin05 However all of this does have to be applied extremely cautiously as too many assumptions are made, I for one believe that the rate of positive mutations overtime for a species in a non changing environment will decrease as when a positive mutation is added there are less positive mutations that can be added. As such "positive" mutation rate today cannot be applied over billions or even millions of years.

[bradkey98765]

@MrJmartin05 The fruit fly takes 2 days to fully develop and then breed; they reproduce approximately 3650 times faster than humans, however have around 18 times less DNA, As such the data collection rate for fruit flies is 200 times faster than human, the 1 visual mutation found in 9 years , of a population of fruit flies conveniently close to that of humans, Implies 1 visual mutation in humans every 1800 years, or 1000 visual mutations to go from homo habilis to homosapiens.

[bradkey98765]

@MrJmartin05 After doing some much needed research, Drosophila melanogaster (common fruit fly) was first experimentally bred in 1901, the first mutated fruit fly was discovered in 1910 by Thomas Hunt Morgan. However it should be noted that any mutation found in this time was going to be a clearly visible one; hence why the mutation found was eye colour.

[Mekelsior]

@bradkey98765 I do not agree with you that the theory of evolution is beautiful, it is an extremely cruel system that pay no mind to anything worthy. It is a very crude concept that have little to no evidence to support it other than sophistry. Even mathmatics are against the theory, I can give you an example. The odds of Hemaglobin to form is 1 to 547! (if my mind serves me correct).

[MrJmartin05]

@bradkey98765 What we have consistently found is that in all creatures, there are genetic limitations to change.