Sam Harris and Reza Aslan debate the "ground zero mosque" - Part 1

Would Park51, the "ground zero mosque" be a symbol of religious tolerance, and should that be an American goal? Sam Harris and Reza Aslan debate on 89.3KKVC California southern radio http://www.scpr.org/programs/patt-morrison/2010/08/18/ground-zero-mosque/

Category:

Education

Tags:

• Sam Harris
• Reza Aslan
• Islam
• Ground Zero
• Mosque
• Ground Zero Mosque
• Atheism
• Islamic fundamentalism
• 911

[philateliceun]

Sam Harris says that noticing a unique problem in Islam is a sign of bigotry in this day and age but that is just a bullshit argument if you ask me. I don't think anyone is defending the stoning of women or Islamic bronze age tribes like nobody is defending North Korea. Sure the censoring of the cartoons was fucking ridiculous and some people are too frightened of Islam. But stuff like Geert Wilders and such is just bigoted. If you speak out against Islam speak out but don't just offend people.

[pp0u50f3]

@philateliceun I think that point is that any criticism of Islam will be seen as "offensive" by most of the muslim world thats why there seemed to be barely a moderate muslim on the face of the earth when Salmon Rushdie was given a Fatwa. Plus there are many liberal, well educated people that Sam regularly talks to that do actually defend the stoning of women

[philateliceun]

@pp0u50f3 Seriously there is not even 1% of left or liberals that actually think the stoning of women is ok . You can't just sat "every opposition to Islam is considered bigotry" that is such bullshit. Seriously we are talking about this mosque and now suddeny the left thinks every bad word about islam is bigotry, I think Sam needs to look at some forums to see what the 'right' actually says about islam in contrast to other religions. fuck me, we are not talking about nice discussions.

[pp0u50f3]

@philateliceun I'm not sure i would say "ok" but that they think we shouldn't critisice the stoning of women, that its thier cultural practice and its not our place to interfere and that it has nothing to do with the Quoran.

Agreed, all critics of Islam are called bigoted, those that generlize or are racially motivated justifiably so, those (like sam) that are simply worried about the logical consequences of certain beleifs unjustifiably so.

[polymath7]

Something tells me, amazingly, that I'm actually going to side with that unmitigated pinhead Aslan.

Come on Sam, don't force me to cross you of my short list of rational people.

[pp0u50f3]

@polymath7 hi there, I think this debate was a bit to short and ultimately dead before it started. Be wary of Reza he used at least one straw man that i noticed, also i felt Reza pirouetted around some questions, e.g. Whats the punishment for appostacy in the Muslim world? Sam doesn't think there should be a ban on buidling the ground zero mosque just that its in bad taste

[Gwisss]

Reza Aslan uses strawman arguments: "Sam said...", or arguments from authority "I have a Ph.D in Islam". Reza's dishonesty is contemptible and is a good representation of the stance the majority of moderate Muslims take on these issues.

Even Reza's attempts to be an authority enough to state with certainty that "Sam's views on Islam demonstrate his vast ignorance on the matter" is nothing short of shady and contemptible.

"Ph.D in Islam"... wtf

[neocons1345]

@Gwisss Right on " Ph.D in Islam" wtf...well said :)

[FrodoDojo]

I am torn between not wanting to appear a bigot and wanting people to grow out of the need for all religions. Unfortunately, ground zero is a testament to all that is wrong with religion...any religion.

[TAz69x]

sometimes I wake up and my penis is hard

[angelstarbum]

@Zanthios So I shouldn't criticize Islam becuase it might cuase a Muslim to blow himself up in a disco? 

[Zanthios]

@pp0u50f3 criticize my religion with a clear understanding (or not) or a question..... why offend people? you know Muslims are completely offended when we hear insults been throwing at us. just like the majority of people in this world...

just stop you will cause more tyranny and racist bigotry if you do, and more blood will be spilt

[Kulumuli]

In Cologne, Germany, they have the tallest cathedral int the world, the Cologne dome. It is a landmark. Of course, the muslims want to have a big mosque there. But even the poltical correct clerics of the Cologne dome asks; WHY must the mosque be higher than the dome? They could build the world's tallest mosque in many places. Why HERE? As in the ground zero mosque; is it an imperialistic building for islam?

[SmogHouseTradingCo]

@dethica The Christians have a habit of building churches in conquered lands as well, ever think that's just what happens when you conquer someone? Man you're fucking stupid.

[dethica]

let me tell you guys something:

the anti mosque crowd is saying that this is islam's way of asserting its superiority over conquered land. they are right!

you can not deny that islam has a history of building mosques in conquered territory to signify it's superiority. For example Babri Mosque in India. The muslims build a mosque there in the 1500's over a hindu temple. it is a controversial topic in india to this day. NO MOSQUE!

[fandanstan]

@Gwisss Neuroscience is the physiological study of the brain, no?

Sam Harris supports ethnic profiling, which, in my opinion is a detriment to his credibility.