Penn jillette on bill maher

Great description of how I feel. To me it is all about loving each other, obviously those who deserve it.

Category:

Comedy

Tags:

• Love
• Morality
• Penn
• jillette
• on
• bill
• maher

[edsilvester]

@oldgordo61 Its not logic telling you that, my friend. Why the definitive "we are not living robots"? - its not logical to talk in those definitive terms. You might LIKE there to be a purpose. You may PREFER there to be a reason to it all but this is not the same as it being so. You are confusing logic with wishful thinking.

As for moral compass, logically speaking, I can see purpose/benefit in socialised behavior. I do good things, I do not require any payment in an after life to do so.

[oldgordo61]

@rollsthepaul Then where does conscience comes from if not from God who has written it upon our very essences?

Evolution cannot explain the origin of conscience...a chimpanzee for example doesn't think twice about food from another chimp or mate with a female chimp who belongs to the Alpha male..nor does it feels remorse after committing either action.

Hyenas feel no remorse from stealing food from a cheetah or another hyena.

[oldgordo61]

@edsilvester Why do we even exist? Logic tells me there must be a purpose.To say that there's really no real overall purpose to our existence that we only exist to pass down our genes/values for the purpose to keep the species going if ultimately we become extinct defeats the purpose of having a moral compass in the first place all our efforts to try to do good becomes pointless in the final end.

We are not living robots who simply dance to our DNA. to be born and then die.

[edsilvester]

@oldgordo61 You are assuming too much. What 'grand scheme' ?

Why does there NEED to be a purpose in human terms? This assumption is where your argument seems to languish. It may be pleasing to think in such terms but thats flawed reasoning.

[oldgordo61]

@edsilvester Yes society does benifet almost immediately from positive behavior but it is only for the here and now what about your distant descendants?

What ultimate benifet/purpose come from positive acts in the grand scheme of things ? Eventually the human race shall pass away..even this world we live on will come to an end.

So if there is no God or an inteligent designer. then what is the ultimate benifet from human kindness if the human species eventually becomes extinct?

[edsilvester]

@oldgordo61 Yes, that's correct.

I do not accept this as illogical. It may require a bit more effort though.

There is a sociological advantage in positive behavior. You do not need an after-life to qualify ones actions; it has real merit in this world to have lived a good life. As society benefits from success, genes become successful - (we see attractiveness in success and these effect reproductive chances)

Your children live after you and continue to benefit after your death.

[oldgordo61]

@edsilvester Is that all there is then?

So your argument tells me I can go out and kill a lot of people but what if the laws of the land never catch me then I die of old age in a comfortable bed..and then I cease to exist never having to be accountable for my wrongful actions in life.

That is illogical..for our conscience is seared into our being it tells us it is morally wrong to kill and whether we accept it or not we cannot escape accountablity... in this life or beyond.

[edsilvester]

@oldgordo61 Your point a) what is the purpose of life - has no relevance to point b) atheism denies personal accountability.

a) the purpose of our life is the same as all life. To reproduce.

b) Accountability for an atheist is the same as that as a theist. There is no god to be accountable to, regardless of your faith when alive. We are not accountable in death, only life.

[oldgordo61]

What is the point of even living this life at all if nothing save the nothingness state oblivion is our ultimate fate? Even living for the here and now as atheists love to point out has absolutely no meaning. Whatever good we do regardless of eternal reward or punishment becomes pointless. They even that that there is real purpose to our existence.

The truth is atheism denies is personal accountabilty.

[rollsthepaul]

I will never be able to accept a God, that requires obedience and worship. It just goes against the grain and shits all over me constantly. Morality has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with conscience. If you listen to your conscience, it means you have a reflective mentality and your conscience won't die from lack of use.