I was deceived! When IS the rapture?!

The rapture passage gives many clues to the timing of the rapture. Let's read it together.

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[BlazyJon]

Also in 2 thessalonians it says "but concerning our gathering unto the Lord, let no one deceive you, for that day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed' 2 thessalonians being the context of 1 thessalonians.

[boltingpuppies]

@BlazyJon Amen. Paul's meaning is clear in both letters when we read them in their context. In 2 Thessalonians 1, Paul says that our suffering (for Him) is even plain indication that we are considered worthy to be in God's Kingdom He goes on to say that God will pay back those who are afflicting us & give us relief *WHEN* the Lord Jesus is revealed in flaming fire with His angels! He actually says we are given relief WHEN the Lord Jesus is *revealed*!

[Skywitness]

I don't use the word rapture, but Jesus comes and takes his church to be with him after the 6th seal is opened in Revelation 6:12-17. This time period coincides with the time period of Revelation 14:14-20 which is after the 7th angel has blown his trumpet.

The trumpets of Revelation are sounded as the Lamb is opening the seals. The great tribulation happens before Jesus comes back for his church. Christians will not be on the earth when the 7 vials of the wrath of God are poured out on earth.

[boltingpuppies]

@Skywitness Thank you for your comments. I agree that the sixth seal, seventh trumpet line up, however I also see the seventh bowl also lining up with the sixth seal and seventh trumpet. Events from Revelation 16:20's seventh bowl lines up with events in Revelation 6:14 sixth seal (islands and mountains). I can see you study His word and look for His coming. Very encouraging. God bless!

[Skywitness]

@boltingpuppies The verse in Revelation 16:15, I think is talking to those people who repented and accepted Jesus after the church was taken.

[Skywitness]

@boltingpuppies Have you noticed within the opening of the seals and the the sounding of the trumpets there are references which show the church is still on earth and Jesus hasn't taken the church yet. But when it comes to the pouring out of the vials of the wrath of God, you don't see references to the church. The only verse that comes close is:

Revelation 16:15, "Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame."

[Skywitness]

@boltingpuppies Revelation 6:17, "For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"

Revelation 6:17 was said by certain people after Jesus was visibly seen. What do you think is meant by the phrase, "For the great day of his wrath is come"?

I think the phrase has to do with the upcoming pouring out of the 7 vials of the wrath of God which leads up to the great supper of God where the birds of the air feast on the flesh of the antichrist's armies after Jesus defeats them.

[Skywitness]

@boltingpuppies I can see how you could think all 3 sequences take place at the same time, but when you look closer at the last sequence, the pouring out of God's wrath, it doesn't happen as the other 2 are unfolding.

Compare the events of the sounding of the trumpets with the pouring out of God's wrath. In the sounding of the trumpets evil is allowed to judge the earth for a time period. In the pouring out of God's wrath, evil, starting with the kingdom of the beast is being judged by God.

[boltingpuppies]

@Skywitness The church does not necessarily need to be removed in order for God to *begin* pouring out the bowls of wrath on the wicked (2Peter2:9)(Psalm 91:6-8). I think we see things very, very similarly with some slight variation at the very end. We are very near in our understanding.

[boltingpuppies]

@Skywitness I'm not sure why you think I do not make a distinction between the great tribulation and the wrath of God?

I do make a distinction between the great tribulation and the wrath of God. They are not interchangeable. We are in agreement on that point. We are not appointed to God's wrath but we are promised tribulation in this world.

Having said that, I still see the wrath being poured out prior to the church's removal due to the sixth seal lining up with the seventh bowl of wrath.

[Skywitness]

@boltingpuppies The problem that I see you're having is that you are not making a distinction between the great tribulation and the wrath of God.

After the great tribulation, Jesus comes back for his church. This is a visible event. Revelation 6:12-17. Jesus also comes back later on during a time after the last vial of the wrath of God has been poured out. He comes back this time to defeat the antichrist and his armies. This also is a visible event. Revelation 19:19-21.