Obliterating Statist Myths Episode One: Anarchic vs. Statist Law and Justice (Part 2 of 5)

SOURCES:

4. Medieval Ireland

http://mises.org/journals/lf/1971/1971_04.pdf
http://mises.org/journals/jls/1_2/1_2_1.pdf
http://mason.gmu.edu/~ihs/w91essay.html
http://books.google.com/books?id=nft4e62nicsC&printsec=frontcover#PPA32,M1



5. Other Stateless Societies

http://osf1.gmu.edu/~ihs/w91issues.html
http://mises.org/story/2542#1
http://mises.org/journals/scholar/stringham3.pdf

Category:

Nonprofits & Activism

Tags:

• ireland
• iceland
• anarchic
• anarchy
• government
• law
• justice
• chieftan
• tuath
• medieval
• brehon
• state
• statist
• emergent
• cooperation
• nomadic
• human
• ancestor
• neolithic
• custom
• tradition
• private
• property
• individual
• rights

[ShwangShwing]

How did it happen that all this stateless societies disappeared? It would suggest that they are not stable on the long term.

[junior00bacon00chee]

@ShwangShwing

their political system was basically infiltrated and warped by the english over the course of 500 years. so, a vastly larger state was able to corrupt them over the course of five centuries, as far as i understand anyway.

i don't think the modern state will be able to survive for much more than a decade in a world with the internet however.

[ShwangShwing]

@junior00bacon00chee When I see all those examples of stateless societies, and how they all came to an end I can't help but feel that this system is unstable. And how did it came that everywhere in the planet earth states formed? And still all the Earth is covered with states... And by the way the modern states are taking a lot more in taxes (as prercentage) than the ancient states. And sure, the states fall all over the history, but they rise again and again. How do you explain all that?

[junior00bacon00chee]

@ShwangShwing

states began as outgrowths of religion. the power of the state is vested in people's perception of it, as long as people believe in the necessity and legitimacy of states, states will continue to rise and fall.

it is statism that leads to the disastrous collapse of civilizations. for example, medieval iceland only descended into civil war after taxes were instituted and the number of chieftans was set by law.

[philateliceun]

I agree that Anarchism would gives us all alot more freedom. But I still can't see how it doesn't induce conflict. I mean when there is no governing body to define rules people would have their own morals and norms but we all know how these things collide with other morals. There must be set morals that everyone follows by. In an anarchy society it would still be wrong to kill, I think. There would still be a national governing body that sets rules based on cultural morality.

[junior00bacon00chee]

@philateliceun

there is a natural desire to cooperate peacefully even amongst people who might be violent brutes because of the division of labor. the benefit of engaging in the division of labor is enormous, ie, you'd have to make everything yourself w/o it. so, there would be a huge incentive to not be ostracized. those who still are unruly can be dealt with through ostracism or force if necessary.

the problem with top down legislated morality is that it always leads to corruption.

[mmeziere]

@ShwangShwing States consisting of nearly every type of gov have failed in the past as well. The current form of government in the western world is only a few hundred yrs old, there is no telling how sustainable it is. The world is an unstable place and unless human nature changes into some Utopian society, there will always be external forces attempting to change what political system is in place. Just because we do not have a stateless society right now does not mean it is not a viable option.

[meadowsirl]

conservatives always look to the past for answers rather than the science and the future

[JacobSpinney]

@JacobSpinney erm, breh-hen

[JacobSpinney]

I think they're called bre-hens. ;-)