Does class size matter? Ask Utah teachers

Utah teachers are struggling every day with the largest classes in the nation. Despite the changes made under Gov. Mike Leavitt, a tough economy has teachers pleading for more support, more funding and fewer students per class.

Category:

Education

Tags:

• schools
• education
• budget
• class size
• utah

[mavila3025]

@James92802 look up the web page for the utah teacher's association and read their mission statement. then tell me exactly what it is that you object to.

[mavila3025]

@James92802 You are the government. you and me. our families, our friends, our neighbors.it is our duty to make ourselves better at governing ourselves. we are in charge of the expectations. if we citizens as a nation, state, or community fail to set adequate expectations for our educators, you and i are to blame, not some faceless "government" or unions.

if we are to have high expectations, we must pay to achieve those expectations.

i will gladly pay to teach the children i love. will you?

[mavila3025]

@James92802 your'e a businessman? if you hire employees at $7.25 per hour what kind of people can you have working for you? remember they're employees, not business owners trying to make it. at $9.50 per hour, wouldn't you expect a bit more? at least able to pass a drug test? at $14.00 per hour you would want experience, reliability, good background, educated? see where i'm going with this?

what if starting salary for teachers was $60k per year? you could expect the very best.

[James92802]

@mavila3025 For years I was the lowest paid person at my company. Because I went into business for myself, I have had to pay 2x the taxes as a person who gained the same amount wealth while working for the government or a company. So to me -- 26 kids weekends off summers off - Christmas Vacation, paid health care - retirement fund. Hell that sounds fun.

[James92802]

@mavila3025 Good question as to what I would accept, depends on at what age you are asking me.

I'm early 50's now and have just sold my second company. So it would take a lot. On the other hand when I was younger I worked 6-7 days a week 12-14 hours a day for much less than even a first year teacher gets. Note I had to do this with no health care, no retirement account and most of all no assurance that I would have any success at all. Cont....

[James92802]

@mavila3025 Just what evidence do you have that more money would inspire anyone to do better? Expectations followed by consequences (both reward and punishment) are what work.

So long as government is in charge of expectations the results will be mediocre and when (as in California) politicians campaigns funded by teachers unions the expectations will be nonexistent.

[mavila3025]

@James92802 utah politicians are too obsessed with "lower taxes". that works for the really, really rich who can afford private school, private security, private fire protection, private snow removal, etc. taxes are the only way to pay for the services that provide the middle class, lower middle class, working poor and impoverished with a lifestyle that is the envy of most of the world.

Kearns Elementary School second grade class has 26 students. What salary would YOU accept?

[mavila3025]

@James92802 my hometown is saratoga, ca, but i've lived in utah since 1994. i'm flattered that you took the interest to check me out. your point is well taken, that utah teachers and schools have done very well, compared to the "national average" with what little they have had to work with. with better resources. they just might produce an educational system that competes with china, finland, or south korea. the US is currently ranked 25 in math, reading and science, right behind latvia.

[James92802]

@mavila3025 BTW your profile says you live in California... Want to compare anything California teachers achieve with Utah teaches? Anything? Teachers can always quit if they don't like it. I bet you want a teachers Union to help stop all the abuse teachers go through.?

Try this, tell Utah teachers that the bottom 10% will be replaced. For every 1 year as a teacher, you get 1 months grace if you preform below 10%. If one is incapable of doing the work that other teachers do, they get fired.

[James92802]

@mavila3025 Seems we are getting very good return on our tax dollar. Utah is 20 out of 51 in SAT scores. Utah schools graduate 88 % of students, while the national average is 69%.

More money for education does not equate to better results! Look at the Kansas City experiment where they tried a "cost-is-no-object educational plan". Kansas City quit this approach when student-teacher ratio was 13 to 1 and cost was $11,700 per pupil and the test scores went down!

Teachers need to work harder.