Re: Anti-Anti-Religion

Questioning terms a-theism, anti-theism, apo-theism. The God of creationists is not theos but the demiourgos. "Not this, not that" (Upanishads). Avoiding useless God-talk (Tolkien).

Category:

Education

Tags:

• Atheism
• god
• religion
• knowledge
• doubt
• Tolkien
• Upanishads

[lamlyn]

i don't have any 'legato' in my life as you put it, and i'm just fine thanks.

[thomasmatus]

OK, lamlyn, you have no 'legato' in your life. How about melody? Is there a tune you can tap to? Is it up-beat or down-beat? 'It don't mean a thing, if you ain't got that swing,' or, in other words, a life with no rhythmic continuity is hardly worth living Of course, life is always worth living, whatever one may feel, because there is a drummer, whose beat we may lose at times, but whom we can never ignore completely.

[amounderness]

I like Sofia Gubaidulina's use of the term 'legato' to characterise religion in life.

Another musical metaphor is used by Dietrich Bonhoeffer to suggest how God, the love of God, is present in the lives of persons of faith. He sees life as a sort of polyphony best built on a 'cantus firmus' a fixed song. He says, '...then the counterpoint has a firm support and can't come adrift or get out of tune. while remaining a distinct whole in its own right.'

So, legato and cantus firmus.

[thomasmatus]

Thanks so much for the reference in Bonhoeffer, with which I am unfamiliar. Beautiful metaphor. Note also that Gubaidulina's counterpoint is at times quite dissonant, but in the end the dissonance is resolved either harmonically or rhythmically. So it should be among persons of religious or non-religious persuasions.

[Dimitrij90]

Iam atheist and iam anti-religion.

iam glad i am. I hope there will be a country or state on this planet that is only(or mostly) inhabitet by atheists.(like sweden) so i dont have to put up with this stupid godtalk.

[thomasmatus]

The only historical example of an entirely atheist country was Communist Albania, under the dictator Enver Hoxha. When communism peacefully ended, most Albanians peacefully returned to former religious expressions (Islam, Orthodox Christianity, Roman Catholicism etc.). When a nation is free, there is room for atheists alongside those who have an inner faith. The former and the latter, if they wish, can live peacefully together; no need for 'ethnic cleansing' to drive out religious persons.

[TheAngelofliberty]

looking for the truth go to rekkitten on youtube peace

[LooksAeterna]

Apophatic theology is not likely to contribute to a choice of any particular religion or denomination. What's more, it will likely be in contradiction to most particular religions. Hence it would not be a suitable approach for denominationalist of ideological apologetics in any religion.

Perhpas the choice of religion (that includes materialism IMO) is more a poetic or an aesthetic matter.

[grandampersand]

"a belief in a creator doesn't stop bullets or grow food or support the destitute"...One of the things that draws me to Christ is the crucifixion. In that image is revealed the God of Christianity. It is an image which reveals, not only that "bullets" are not an unavoidable tragedy and that WE are the fingers that pull the triggers, but also that we must "grow food" and "support the destitute" even if it means that we may not be able to "stop bullets"

[lamlyn]

life is never as complete or as simple as bonhoeffer puts it. So many people suffer needlessly, but also believe in god. a belief in a creator doesn't stop bullets or grow food or support the destitute. we need a whole new outlook, NOT god, to solve the world's problems.

[lamlyn]

'Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?'. What do you think...and how do you KNOW that there is a God? why do you need a drummer? Why is life not worth living if you don't believe that a creator created an entire universe in 6 days? I'll repeat: I am fine and really enjoying life at the moment and i don't see evidence for god, nor do i feel an urge to believe in one. Why do i need god? i can't find a reason.

[lamlyn]

With all due respect, If you're trying to persuade me to consider religion, you're not doing a good job. Firstly, your grammar is a bit all over the place so i don't understand what you mean in some of it. Secondly, Life is worth living for me because there is no drummer, I have to pinch myself at the beauty that surrounds us every day, but in the words of douglas adams,

[amounderness]

I'm pleased you like that idea from Bonhoeffer. (I forgot to give the ref. It's from one of the letters sent from prison to his friend, and later biographer, Eberhard Bethge and dated 20 May 1944 - page 303 in my old copy of the Letters.) Bonhoeffer was an accomplished pianist and great lover of music - his letters contain many references to it.

That's interesting about dissonant counterpoint resolving in the end...I'll hold on to that idea.