@Me102288 Octane rating has nothing to do with energy per volume of the fuel. Diesel fuel burns slower than gasoline, and has far more energy than gas. High octane might be good for some high performance engines, but for most uses it rather useless, including a normal car. I'm not knocking hydrogen as a fuel about octane rating. It's just inefficient as an energy source, except for some exotic applications. It just takes more energy to make by electrolysis than you can get out in a vehicle.
@MetGuy9966 really the octane rating of fuel is a measure of combustabilty... you'd note drag racing cars use the highest octane fuel they can to get the most power out of a combustion engine they can for that 1/4 mile.
I dont think you get what I meant, 130 octane fuel replacing 89 octane fuel = you need 1/3 of 130 octane fuel to run the same engine at the same horsepower rating.. do you understand? low octane = ITS FLAMMABLE and inefficient at burning, =gasoline.. hydrogen burns 9x faster.
@Me102288 You're mixing your efficiencies A gasoline engine makes use of about 40% of the energy in the fuel. Most of the energy is unused as heat. Hydrogen returns, at best, 70% of the energy it takes to make it by electrolysis. So, if you spend a dollar to make hydrogen you can get 70 cents back to run your car. This might be a good trade off if you're NASA and you can't get to a filling station. But for a vehicle, it's a LOSER.
@Me102288 Octane rating has NOTHING to do with efficiency of a fuel. It's simply a measure of the capacity of a fuel to self ignite. High octane does NOT mean a fuel is stronger or cleaner or better for all cars. Low octane is actually better for most engines. The fuel burns slower, and the engine can take better advantage of the expansion.
@Me102288 $120? My van fills up for half that. Of course gas is expensive. Get your mind around this fact: Making and using hydrogen by electrolysis is at best 70% efficient. That means you only get back 70% of the energy back that you had to put in to make it. The efficiency numbers you quote for gasoline are based on the total energy in the gasoline. The gasoline engine only makes use of 40% of the available energy in the gasoline. Please get your facts straight.
@MetGuy9966 hint, running cars on hydrogen = no gasoline, average gas tank costs $120 to fill.. if you drive a lot, Every WEEK, thats a lot of money.. you think?
In the end run, if you could make gasoline on demand you would save money
we can make hydrogen... hydrogen is 130 octane, gasoline is typically 90 ... dop you understand Internal COMBUSTION engines run on explosive fuels? and do you reallize 130 "octane is more explosive then 90 octane which isnt explosive, its only flammable :-\
@MetGuy9966 hydrogen alone is more explosive, and internal Combustion engine runs on flameable gasoline...
truth is combustion engines run on almost anything explosive enough.. well hydrogen is 9x faster burning then gasoline, which means.... BMW beat us to it with theyre BMW Hydrogen 7 :-\
its the same 7 series line, But the internal combustion engine in it is running on hydrogen with 0% gasoline :-\ its liqiud hydrogen tank.. the dif? making it on demand is only one step away
@Me102288 I never said HHO doesn't work. It's just not efficient enough to be practical. All those fuels can run an engine, but a real engineer will do a "beginning to end" analysis of the actual costs with the fuel, including long term maintenance.
@Me102288 LOL An engine like that would be impossible to use. "notta" is right. So many of these ideas fall flat when hit by cold, hard reality. HHO cars are just like that. Maybe some gullible people will buy into it. But serious folks see through the scam.
@Me102288 Octane rating has nothing to do with energy per volume of the fuel. Diesel fuel burns slower than gasoline, and has far more energy than gas. High octane might be good for some high performance engines, but for most uses it rather useless, including a normal car. I'm not knocking hydrogen as a fuel about octane rating. It's just inefficient as an energy source, except for some exotic applications. It just takes more energy to make by electrolysis than you can get out in a vehicle.
MetGuy9966 6 months ago
@MetGuy9966 really the octane rating of fuel is a measure of combustabilty... you'd note drag racing cars use the highest octane fuel they can to get the most power out of a combustion engine they can for that 1/4 mile.
I dont think you get what I meant, 130 octane fuel replacing 89 octane fuel = you need 1/3 of 130 octane fuel to run the same engine at the same horsepower rating.. do you understand? low octane = ITS FLAMMABLE and inefficient at burning, =gasoline.. hydrogen burns 9x faster.
Me102288 6 months ago
@Me102288 You're mixing your efficiencies A gasoline engine makes use of about 40% of the energy in the fuel. Most of the energy is unused as heat. Hydrogen returns, at best, 70% of the energy it takes to make it by electrolysis. So, if you spend a dollar to make hydrogen you can get 70 cents back to run your car. This might be a good trade off if you're NASA and you can't get to a filling station. But for a vehicle, it's a LOSER.
MetGuy9966 6 months ago
@Me102288 Octane rating has NOTHING to do with efficiency of a fuel. It's simply a measure of the capacity of a fuel to self ignite. High octane does NOT mean a fuel is stronger or cleaner or better for all cars. Low octane is actually better for most engines. The fuel burns slower, and the engine can take better advantage of the expansion.
MetGuy9966 6 months ago
@Me102288 $120? My van fills up for half that. Of course gas is expensive. Get your mind around this fact: Making and using hydrogen by electrolysis is at best 70% efficient. That means you only get back 70% of the energy back that you had to put in to make it. The efficiency numbers you quote for gasoline are based on the total energy in the gasoline. The gasoline engine only makes use of 40% of the available energy in the gasoline. Please get your facts straight.
MetGuy9966 6 months ago
@forfunmx BMW Hydrogen 7 same internal combiustion engine in all bmw's 7 series.. cept the hydrogen 7 runs on hydrogen without ANY gasoline.
You might want to check the effeciencys of fuels, might be suprised gasoline is only 35 to 45 % at best...sad
considering hydrgen is near 80%.. do you no why all the nasty chemicals come outta exaust from gasoline running engines is mostly unburnt fuel?
I know the fraudelent sites everywhere yet I learned from science and places like NASA.
Me102288 6 months ago
@MetGuy9966 hint, running cars on hydrogen = no gasoline, average gas tank costs $120 to fill.. if you drive a lot, Every WEEK, thats a lot of money.. you think?
In the end run, if you could make gasoline on demand you would save money
we can make hydrogen... hydrogen is 130 octane, gasoline is typically 90 ... dop you understand Internal COMBUSTION engines run on explosive fuels? and do you reallize 130 "octane is more explosive then 90 octane which isnt explosive, its only flammable :-\
Me102288 6 months ago
@MetGuy9966 hydrogen alone is more explosive, and internal Combustion engine runs on flameable gasoline...
truth is combustion engines run on almost anything explosive enough.. well hydrogen is 9x faster burning then gasoline, which means.... BMW beat us to it with theyre BMW Hydrogen 7 :-\
its the same 7 series line, But the internal combustion engine in it is running on hydrogen with 0% gasoline :-\ its liqiud hydrogen tank.. the dif? making it on demand is only one step away
Me102288 6 months ago
@Me102288 I never said HHO doesn't work. It's just not efficient enough to be practical. All those fuels can run an engine, but a real engineer will do a "beginning to end" analysis of the actual costs with the fuel, including long term maintenance.
MetGuy9966 6 months ago
@Me102288 LOL An engine like that would be impossible to use. "notta" is right. So many of these ideas fall flat when hit by cold, hard reality. HHO cars are just like that. Maybe some gullible people will buy into it. But serious folks see through the scam.
MetGuy9966 6 months ago