Shine (Movie) - David Helfgott Training for Rach 3

Shine (1996). Director: Scott Hicks. Oscar for Best Actor in a Leading Role (Geoffrey Rush).

Category:

Music

Tags:

• Sergei
• Rachmaninoff
• Noah
• Taylor
• David
• Helfgott
• Rach
• Three
• Oscar
• Winner
• Scott
• Hicks
• Piano
• Pianist

[monstrumwomen]

Considering this is an outstanding piece of music, I am amazed to see people saying it is not the most complicated piece to play (which is correct), but technically and texture wise it is a joy to listen to, and yes it may have been blown out of proportion, but I feel exhilarated when I listen to it. So STOP arguing over whats the hardest piece to play. The point of this movie is to take you on a journey throughout david helfgotts life, and for him it was a big achievement!!

[BenMcCormack91]

To any pianist, this scene is a little hilarious. No teacher ever talks like this, and Rachmaninov's third isn't exactly as horrifyingly-difficult as he makes it out to be. It's a tough piece, to be sure, but the way the teacher approaches it is really silly.

But you have to bend reality to service narratives I guess. As a musician, I hate when they bend musical practice. I know lawyers who get irritated about courtroom scenes, scientists who hate the pseudo-science in sci-fi. It's life.

[zhangensprachen]

People do make a big deal out of the difficulty of rach 3, and it's warranted to an extent and silly to another extent. Personally, I think many sections of Scriabin's sonatas are more challenging, and if you're specifically thinking of a difficult chord passage, I can't think of anything more diabolical than Debussy's chord etude. Rachmaninoff's genius is not a diabolical one. He is like Chopin in the sense that he manages to marry an intended sound with playing ease.

[BenMcCormack91]

@Vesivian Getting up to any given skill level - be it a skill level where you are comfortable with Bach inventions, or a skill level where you are comfortable with Rachmaninoff concerti, is always a matter of work. There's nothing magical about that. Give me enough time and I could teach any person in decent physical and mental health how to play the piano with control and accuracy. Getting someone to be creative about it is the hard part.

[BenMcCormack91]

@Vesivian I know the score. I know the orchestration, I know the structure, I have sat at the piano and read through the whole thing multiple times, and I am, in fact, a pianist. The "huge chords" in the first cadenza aren't ever larger than a tenth, and the fast jumps between registers are a matter of coordination and mapping, which is a skill, not some magical ability you either have or don't have from birth. It's hard, but of course there's a method to learning it.

[Vesivian]

@BenMcCormack91 Definitely not. There's a reason why it's considered as one of the hardest concerto's ever written of all time, just take a look at the ossia cadenza of the 1st movement, those huge chords... So what you are trying to say is that anyone who ''studies a piece methodically and so on'' will be able to play this work? How ridiculous.

[BenMcCormack91]

@Vesivian Your comment does nothing other than take one of my sentences and negate the linking verb. I can respond by explaining a little more of my perspective, but if you're going to disagree with me, give me information rather than verb conjugation.

My comment assumed a few things; chiefly, it assumed that if a player studies a piece methodically, identifies sections that are difficult and works on the techniques required to play them, learning any piece is just a matter of time.

[Vesivian]

@BenMcCormack91 Urm no. Rachmanioff's third is exactly as horrifyingly-difficult as he makes it out to be. Just take a look at the score.

[vladimirhorowitz]

@mikkeljs Well, nothing wrong with having a different opinion.  I'm not one to tell someone not to like a composer, but I definitely think there's a good reason that nobody plays Sorabji in public. I've only heard a few pieces by him, which sounded loud, dissonant, and harsh to me. I don't know, maybe you know of a few that may change my mind. Although I have to say, the fact that you prefer him over all the greats says to me that you probably have a very different taste than most people.

[mikkeljs]

@vladimirhorowitz and he doesnt care about how it is received. He wrote music kean with his heart in total isolation and was extremely productive. If you actually look into the stuff, you will also discover the vastness of his natural sound language, his mature sence of harmonic disposition which is familiar with Scriabin, his love for random sound yet it isnt theorized as Astronische Musik or serialism but it is from an honest human life, a life of an exceptionally awakened isolated being

[mikkeljs]

@vladimirhorowitz I dont give a shit about difficulty in music - but as a pianist its natural to be curious about it, when most of your life is devoted to become as good as possible, get the most challenge and healthy repertoir. When it comes to Sorabji, you are very wrong. Sorabji is interesting because of his musical genious, and he is in fact my favourite composer over Beethoven, Mozart, Rachmaninov etc. Sorabji is genious because he have the guts to screw all traditional forms and dogma,

[vladimirhorowitz]

@mikkeljs Just for the record, it's not exactly an "accomplishment" to write difficult stuff. I could write something more difficult than anything Sorabji wrote in about 5 minutes. It would involve a lot of 64th note chromatic runs...at ffff and in octaves. But so what? That doesn't make it good and Sorabji's stuff isn't good because it's difficult either. How many touring concert pianists put Sorabji on their program? Not many because nobody wants to hear that crap and I don't blame them.