Tiananmen 6-4-1989 Anniversary: A Perspective

full transcript at:
www.sinomania.com/CHINANEWS/tiananmen.html

Category:

News & Politics

Tags:

• tiananmen
• square
• massacre
• human
• rights
• china
• bonus
• army
• riots

[tyhsu82]

Greetings! Ben,

thank you for your voice of reason. I testify that you are very right on this incident. I bet 200 yrs from now, this voice will still be here, but I am not going to bet on others.

I can testify because I was there during the whole process. At that time, school thought i were at my work place in training, work place thought i went to school, I get to spend time in the square for the "Chinese Woodstock"

[sinomaniac]

Thank you tyhsu82 for your interesting and valuable experience and for sharing it with us.

Peace.

[lasojuju]

Interesting video. America is a country born out of revolution and certainly had her low point and violence past as well.

[lasojuju]

I asked an old American gentleman lately why their politicians are tossing the constitution out the window, robing tax payer wallets to bailout wallstreet now...etc but still cannot get the Americans out to the streets? He told me with a smile: Because they know they will be attacked by dogs. That is part of the legacy of American history. I think he's talking about this!

[Xwaxtaxper]

Wait so can a group like the Falun Gong protest in Tianamen Square much like the same way that a group like A.N.S.W.E.R can protest in front of Capital Hill?

[mccheese0]

@liebstandarteadolf Obviously there is "complication" including calls for transparency, accountability, etc. Don't let too many trees prevent you from seeing the forest. BTW Democracy was called for by some there, if the video we saw was true. "Democracy" is a label for particular way to respond to the problems you mentioned.. Call it by a different name - but the solution is popular government, accountable to the governed, and transparent so that the governed know what govt is doing.

[mccheese0]

@liebstandarteadolf That fear is standing in the way of real Chinese success that will benefit the entire world. Nobody is itching to see such a failure. The world wants a free China and a free China would be a boon to the rest of the world. I won't even go into the benefits the Chinese people would get - but all you have to do is look at Europe for an example. I'd say the US too, but we have a few issues due to that "market worship" you mentioned.

[mccheese0]

@mccheese0 China is in a different situation. You have authoritarian rule but a strong economy. China is economically where the US was at the beginning of the 20th century... a manufacturing powerhouse but with state power vested in the small elite that controls the "mode and mean" of production (to toss a little Marx out...;)

China has the financial means to advance into greater political freedom. What stands in the way: Like the USSR you have a "nationals" problem.

[mccheese0]

@liebstandarteadolf Your last four posts are an excellent analysis of the Russian economic failings, though the relation between organized crime and existing government institutions isn't addressed. Even now Russians want democracy, but the lack of the economic minimum prevents it. Instead they have local mafia government and corruption. But how does that relate to the Chinese situation? See next post...

[liebstandarteadolf]

@mccheese0 I'll reply more later, I'm quite busy atm.

[liebstandarteadolf]

@mccheese0 That's a misconception. Democracy is only successful when applied at the right time and the right place. It in itself can't be judged. It does spread , but doesn't necessarily help attain prosperity. History attests to this. The students at Tianmen square didn't demand democracy as you put it, but rather more accountability and transparency within the system. The details are complicated. Both parties were at fault, but a black/white story is easier to sell. And you buy.

[liebstandarteadolf]

@mccheese0 @mccheese0 It could be for reasons other than a cover up. Let's for 1 second assume that what the chinese government is saying is true that the riot was instigated externally. Factoring in sympathy for the weak, assumption of guilt of the government, veiled racism of retards who don't even know they're racist, media sensationalism and anti-China sentiment in the media. I can only imagine that the alternative outcome would be much smearing than it is.

[liebstandarteadolf]

@mccheese0 I don't know if China can, but I'm not about to find out. What if it fails? This is the questions that goes through the mind of most Chinese people. Why risk something we have for sure, for something we will not have for sure? Some Westerners don't care, because subliminally, they're itching to see China collapse.

[liebstandarteadolf]

@mccheese0 They have managed a nominal democracy with their problems gone unnoticed in the West. Everyone's busy sensationalising what China is doing. Sure, on paper, China is a democracy to, it's just that corruption and abuse are more common, and the People's Congress rarely defeats any bills put up by the CCP. Taiwan has a developed economy, but its government too was a dictatorship, same with most of the Asian economies before the Asian financial crisis.