Jaroslav Pelikan

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"Jesus Through the Centuries: His Place in the History of Culture" - http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0300079877/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=p...

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[PapalSoldier]

@Mikhael1C Pope St. Nicholas, epistle (8) [A.D.865]:

“… Neither by Augustus, nor by all the clergy, nor by religious, nor by the people will

the judge be judged… ‘The first seat will not be judged by anyone.’”

[PapalSoldier]

@Mikhael1C No need to apologize, your being polite, however when protestants or people who believe in God but are non denominational, see a Orthodox and a Catholic arguing, only one can be right. And with all due respect. "Orthodox Theology" is protestant theology, we did not wait until 1054 for the truth.

[Mikhael1C]

@PapalSoldier One would question why you continue to talk to this one then.

Your assertions here are incorrect. From what I can tell you do not understand Orthodox ecclesiology or theology, nor do you seem to understand our ecclesiastical structure and the nature of that structure.

I think this is a good place to end this discussion. I ask your forgiveness for all my offenses.

[PapalSoldier]

@Mikhael1C yes, i am aware the "orthodox" sect calls itself "One Holy Catholic and Apostolic, which is a lie from the pit of hell considering the "Greek orthodox" Russia orthodox" etc all say the same thing, the "orthodox" ain't even one "church" they are a multitude, each with their own separate governance, which is why when i talk to 20 different "orthodox christians" i get 20 different answers.

[Mikhael1C]

@PapalSoldier Also, let's get something straight here. You're here not to dialogue or inform. Your only goal seems to be to spout various assertions that can be reduced down to the tautology that "the Catholic Church thinks that it's right".

Unless you are somehow convinced that continually yelling 'everyone else is wrong' is a useful and proper way of preaching, you're not even here to proselytize. I'm not sure what that leaves as your motivation apart from just liking argument.

[Mikhael1C]

@PapalSoldier I'm not sure what "calling the Church "Catholic"" has to do with your point. I think you'll find that everyone that adheres to Nicaea does that. You specifically said "the first time a church was called orthodox was in 1054". I pointed out that 1) that's a stupid argument and 2) that's historically inaccurate (both in the way that I pointed out and afterward-- I'm sure you're aware that the Orthodox Church calls itself the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church).

[PapalSoldier]

@Mikhael1C What? Horrible analogy. St.John of Damascus was Catholic, yes I'm well aware he is a doctor of The Catholic Church, I'm also sure your aware of him calling the Church "Catholic" The Greeks had not left the Chair of Peter yet.

[Mikhael1C]

Really? Your argument is one of word usage? And a historically inaccurate one at that...

May I suggest to you the work of St. John of Damascus entitled "An Exact Exposition on the Orthodox Faith." One might recall that St. John is a doctor of the Roman Catholic Church.

Or perhaps the acts of the 6th or 7th Ecumenical Councils.

Regardless, your argument is silly. You might as well say that there was no "Pope of Rome" before Pope John I, as he was likely the first one to use that title.

[PapalSoldier]

@Mikhael1C The guy said the apostles were "orthodox" well i guess simon magus was protestant. Considering the first time a church was called "orthodox" was in 1054,(Greek orthodox started by Michael Cerularius) this is obviously quite false.

[Mikhael1C]

@nymphrenic Understood.

However, from the Orthodox perspective, he spoke correctly. I have detailed this in my private message to you.