Ed Sisson May 2006: part 1 of 6

Lawyer Edward Sisson, who represented Dr. Caroline Crocker (featured in Ben Stein's "Expelled"), discusses Dr. Crocker's case, academic freedom, the 2005 Kansas "evolution hearings," & the evolution and intelligent design controversy, placing it in the history of controversies beginning with Anne Hutchinson's being expelled by Massachusetts Bay Colony in 1638 for heresy. Recorded in May 2006, edited into 37-minute film in May 2008 and posted complete to http://gallery.mac.com/sissoed#100000. Uploaded to youtube in 6 parts.

Category:

Science & Technology

Tags:

• Edward
• Sisson
• Caroline
• Crocker
• Expelled
• evolution
• intelligent
• design

[kenthovindspimp]

ALTERNATE2GOP STATES THIS on part 2:

"We'll just let onlookers of this discourse decide for that." (on who won the debate)"

and

"Seem to be asking that a little soon, but now that you've asked, it's in what is called a brain. One which in homosapiens is larger then that of apes, chimps, etc."

HIS EVIDENCE against TOE IS DIFFERENT BRAIN SIZE?

WOW!!!

WOW, WOW, WOW, HE IS ONE DENSE MOTHER FUCKER!

Please check fundies say the darndest things for this delicious morsel to be added.

[kenthovindspimp]

ALTERNATE2GOP STATES THIS on part 2:

"We'll just let onlookers of this discourse decide for that." (on who won the debate)"

and

"Seem to be asking that a little soon, but now that you've asked, it's in what is called a brain. One which in homosapiens is larger then that of apes, chimps, etc."

HIS EVIDENCE against TOE IS DIFFERENT BRAIN SIZE?

WOW!!!

WOW, WOW, WOW, HI IS ONE DENSE MOTHER FUCKER!

Please check fundies say the darndest things for this delicious morsel to be added.

[iknovate]

Dave: Nutjob? That's pretty much what the Jewish Leadership said of Jesus because of the threat he posed to their capitalization of religious practice. That didn't make it factual.

Is your capitalization of scientific practice perhaps threatened?

This is a legal issue, not a course of opinion/popularity. Try to stick to the facts.

Have you seen Expelled? Can you differentiate between the tenets of Intelligent Design and Creationism?

Offer something concrete, not just random blatherings.

[Alternate2GOP]

"Since Kitzmiller v. Dover, they can't even promote an anonymous designer."

They seem to be doing a pretty good job with that lately.

"So, instead, they cry "academic freedom" to try to circumvent the legal obstacles."

No, they cry academic freedom to prevent people from being persecuted for presenting evidence that drifts from the status quo.

[Alternate2GOP]

I agreed with what you said until the following...

"Because of legal failures on their part, those who want to teach Intelligent Design cannot legally say it is their God who did the designing."

Big distinction needs to be made here. While many of the proponents publicly acknowledge that they believe the designing force is a god, this is irrelevant. What does matter is if students are being taught specifically that the designing force must be God, otherwise no legal problems persist.

[DaveGrossmanSoloBass]

Caroline Crocker and nearly every other intelligent design proponent out there believes that it is their God that intelligently designed life. In their own forums, they are not shy about saying so. Because of legal failures on their part, those who want to teach Intelligent Design cannot legally say it is their God who did the designing. Since Kitzmiller v. Dover, they can't even promote an anonymous designer. So, instead, they cry "academic freedom" to try to circumvent the legal obstacles.

[Alternate2GOP]

"I didn't say she was teaching religion so don't try to change my argument to something else and think you've won if I cannot provide proof of your straw man argument."

Remember this statement you made?

"She tried to interject her own personal religious beliefs where they didn't belong."

That was your argument (first comment on the vid), don't try and change that.

"She taught her religious belief that life was intelligently designed."

How might one construe this as a religious belief?

[DaveGrossmanSoloBass]

I didn't say she was teaching religion so don't try to change my argument to something else and think you've won if I cannot provide proof of your straw man argument.

She taught her religious belief that life was intelligently designed. She admits as much on her own web site. She got exactly what she deserved.

End of discussion.

[Alternate2GOP]

I guess that comment applies directly to you.

[Alternate2GOP]

Don't get me started with wikipedia.

I want real genuine PROOF that what she was teaching was religion in the classroom.