Work Sucks!
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@Casevil669 of individual humans. It's called the central planning calculation problem. Also, TVP advocates the centralization of production, which is detrimental to the biosphere. Don't listen to Zeitgeisters that claim to be individualists or libertarians, because no matter how much they espouse their supposed libertarianism, TVP is definitely not libertarian, or even left-lib, since it rejects free markets. Check out mutualism, geoanarchism, or social anarchism.
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@Casevil669 Ehh... The first time I watched the Zeitgeist films, I was totally behind it. I thought I had realized the solution to every one of the world's problems, but The Venus Project has some major flaws. First of all, it advocates an entirely centrally planned economy, and TheLeftLibertarianism, libertarians, and history, have shown that centralized control in the economy doesn't work. There's no way their 'all-knowing' computer can calculate the subjective, individual needs
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Office Space!! That movie is hilarious.
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Great job.
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Democracy in the workplace? No more capitalsim? Wouldn't that destroy the state? How wonderfully subversive. Why didn't anyone think of this before?
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@MsSexySocialist I'd say that it is still private ownership if two or more people own something, like a house or car.
I work for a consumer co-op, and they treat me well. I agreed to, and advocate for, their business practices so I see no problem in endorsing a voluntary organization like that.
You're right that private power can be destructive, no doubts about that, but I personally think that when the market is turned against said powers, they will die, but only in the absence of a state.
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@Dirge987 (continued)
And most seem to regard democratic enterprise as being somehow based on "mob-rule" (this is ignoring that anarchist democracy is based on consensus btw).
So it strikes me as . . . well, unusual to hear that.
I guess I can respect your desire to have an economy that's actually decided by people themselves and not an elite of owners.
Although personally I think it's misplaced to blame everything on the state alone, as I fell private power is just as culpable.
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"They still have private property owned by the community of workers"
But then, by economic definition, it becomes collectively-owned, not privately-owned.
"I personally like small business and co-ops"
O_O
Uh . . . forgive me but I have to admit that surprises me. A self-proclaimed anarcho-capitalist who says they like co-ops.
I've talked with several right-libertarians (minarchists and anarcho-capitalists) and most say things like " democracy is a form of communism".
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@MsSexySocialist It doesn't necessarily stop being capitalism if a majority of the firms are co-ops, worker owned, non-hierarchical, etc. They still have private property owned by the community of workers.
What stateless economy would I prefer? I don't know. I have no idea what works the best since the state has always been there mucking it up. I personally like small business and co-ops. If voluntary socialism, resource based economies, labor hour currency or whatever works, I'll accept it.
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But then doesn't it stop being "capitalism"?
Speaking of which exactly what kind of future stateless economy would you prefer. It's clear you want a money-based market society, but what kind of firms would you like to see populate it?
Mostly small businesses? Mostly corporations? A mix of private firms and co-ops?
Oh and in case anyone doesn't know and like this video, a thing called The Venus Project could be of interest. Google it.
Casevil669 1 month ago 14
Man I wish I didn't just watch this. I almost had myself believing I was free, now I have to start all over.
CrixMakin 1 month ago 9