Why (good) libertarians and socialists/progressives aren't really at odds with each other.

The things held in common by proponents of these two ideas are substantial. Liberty often leads to progressive/socialist outcomes, and good thing for it!

Category:

News & Politics

Tags:

• kevin carson
• corporatism
• statism
• mercantilism
• liberty
• socialism
• progressivism
• worker self organization
• war
• poverty
• peace
• labor
• entrepreneurs

[fringeelements]

Okay video. Too much emphasis on the behavior of free marketers though. It is, and always has been, the intransigence of the socialists that is the impediment to reconciliation. Which makes sense because they have the more irrational ideology. So lets not pretend this is a two-sided issue.

[SelfOwnershipFTW]

@fringeelements This was more of an overture to those on the left, so going in guns blazing (does that work for you... ever?) wasn't what I was looking to do. I just want people of the left to know that stateless libertarianism, especially emergent orders approaching an entirely free market to the point of mutualism, serve their goals without the need for violent coercive monopolies.Maybe sometime I'll go back and update the piece to add more criticism rather than just stressing what we share.

[fringeelements]

Actually yes, it has worked for me. I know of two marxists who became anti-statists because of me, and I'm sure there are many more. These little overtures have been going on forever and they don't work. They were doing this before even I showed up.

What always happens is some "socialist" decides to open his mind or try to debunk someone, and then they get convinced. Overtures are contrived and they see it.

[SelfOwnershipFTW]

@fringeelements trying to argue the libertarian position by hard sell isn't all that convincing. I have people who are more communitarian-leaning who take libertarianism seriously now when it isn't misleading Randian political economy and moralizing self ownership talk all day long. I appreciate it if you're willing to fight it out in the trenches like that, its just not what I do, or even want to do. I've had too many LONG threads go absolutely nowhere.  Where I am should please everyone.

[soapboxkid75]

"To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical." - Thomas Jefferson

[hugolp]

I am a libertarian, coming from a left-wing social-democrat education. I mainly agree. We libertarian can get a bit anal with socialist, when usually we have the same objectives. I really think there is a lot of common thins with non-authoritarian socialist, but there is little to be done with authoritarian socialist (or authoritarian right-wingers for that matter).

[therealwild1]

@hugolp well said.

[SgtPepper9537]

Revolution 2012!

[mdak06]

Libertarianism is about governance where an individual's consent is paramount - where non-consent determines what actions are criminal. There's no reason a socialist commune can't exist within a free-market system, as long as all participants are involved voluntarily.

For the socialists who truly want to flatten society and "make everyone equal," this approach won't work. For those who want workers to not be under the thumb of crony-capitalists, this is what should be done. Good video.

[mdak06]

One thing I wish libertarians would do more of is point out that "capitalism" is NOT synonymous with "the free market." Capitalism can take many forms, including crony capitalism, fascist capitalism, etc. "Free-market capitalism" is the only form that doesn't involve the government using coercion to dole out favors to some and punishments to others.

Capitalism is a system that makes use of capital. It doesn't have to be a free-market system. China is a capitalist country, but not free-market.

[N0g0dzN0masterz]

I been saying libertarians are socialist historically not all socialist are libertarian though. But that does not matter what matters is what you stand for today. Fuck titles.

[dimideluxe]

Its funny in Europe we call the far left wingers (anarchists/bakunin and stuff) libertarians!

[23lFrench]

It's possible to a be a libertarian socialist DRRRRRR.....

[dabigdog377]

Hi im a libertarian and i challange all socialists to a boxing mach.

[TheIronCrawdad]

I just spent a good share of the night debating with my socialist friend and we came to almost the same conclusions. I found your video insightful. I will rephrase my arguments from now on. (Honestly i grew up socialist i only recently switched over to libertarianism when i realized the "gun in the room" wielded by the government... so i see where your coming from.)

[jrzckr]

@soapboxkid75 The socialist motto: "From each according to their ability, to each according to their lack thereof."