Beautiful Curtiss P-40 Flight Demonstration- B-I-G Allison V-12 Engine Sound !

This is a nice video of a Curtiss P-40 flight demonstration at Chino Airport in Southern California. The Allison V-12 engine may not have been the war-winner like the Rolls-Royce Merlin, but you'll have to admit it sounds just as sweet, no? This aircraft is owned by Tony Banta and is based at Livermore, California.

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[nutster9000]

I always thought that the Allison V-12 was a licenced derivative of "a" Rolls Royce V-12 model, couldn't say which version though. It was pretty much a copy of our design. I also read somewhere that the engine in the BF109 was descended from a Rolls Royce design. I'd love to know if that was right.

[octane130]

Nutster9000: No, the Allison V-1710, the Rolls Royce Merlin and the Daimler Benz DB 601 (which powered the Bf-109) were separate, indiginous designs. All good designs but being truly objective, the American Allison was the lesser of this group. Though very complicated with literally thousands of parts more than the Allison, the Rolls-Royce Merlin was truly a high-performing war-winner. (See next comments).

[octane130]

Considering the power outputs of these three engines at their ultimate development stages, the DB 601 was a little bit on the short side. However, it was an excellent design and incorporated such innovations as fuel injection (a really MAJOR advantage) and a hydraulically powered supercharger (as opposed to mechanically driven for the other two engines). The hydraulic motor on that supercharger was smaller than a Campell's soup can! (See next comments, I am on a roll!)

[octane130]

Interestingly, during the war, the DB 601 was started by hand-cranking an inertia starter. However, those engines were also equipped with an option for attaching an American-made Bendix electric starter motor (American mounting-bolt pattern and everything). This was indicative of the pre-war cooperation between the American and German aviation industries. I cite the mounting of an American Bendix starter on Paul Allen's Flying Heritage Collection's Bf-109 during restoration and flight testing.

[StealthDonut1]

Say what you want about the P-40, what a gorgeous bird she was

[djcahill4]

To be fair about the Allison you would want to remember that it was on old design, originally intended as an upgrade over the Maybach engines used in the U.S. Navy zeppelins. By war's end the Allison did become a true high-performance engine, as installed in the P-82 escort fighter. Curiously, the first Bf-109 had a RR "Kestrel," while the original "Merlin" was test flown in a Heinkel He.70.

[sigurd1979]

@octane130 The V-1710 actually became a better engine once the US started to focus on fighter engines. It was smaller and lighter than the Merlin with equal power potential. (one post war version made 2900hp!) On the P-38, it used a combination turbo/supercharger which was way ahead of its time. It could have been a war winner if development had been a higher priority.

[pramboy09]

@chasyes1 yes i have seen it, i have pictures of it in one of my books, basically a cutdown fuselage with a bubble canopy. It's performance was still bellow a mustang though

[chasyes1]

@pramboy09 have you ever seen late war development models? They have a cut down deck and look like a Mustang(almost) and look really cool I think it was the Q model I'll have to look it up

[crpdst2003]

@nuts Packard produced USA made Merlins....the Allison has been long the dog in aerial stories... USAAC ordered single stage supercharger.. and only P-38 got turbo.....it was a reliable engine and test versions rated at 2,600 hp...huge amount of Allison spare parts used by Merlins US and UK made egines post war... The Curtis D-12 forerunner of Allison and Merline was also made in UK by Fairey, named the Felix..

[crpdst2003]

@nutster9000 no, all vee twelve are derived from Curtis Vee twelve post WWI....Napier designers went to work for Rolls Royce expecting to continue their 3 bank 12 cyl Lion engine but Rolls wanted them to drop it and work up something like the New Curtiss engine....drill out of a block and not individual cyls...Germans indirectly copied it too but used Kestrel(Merlins forerunner) the engine made by the Napier engineers......Me 109 prototype used the Kestrel in fact....

[Treetop64]

@nutster9000

The prototype Bf-109 was actually powered by a RR Kestrel Engine. Junkers developed the engines that powered the first production versions up to the "D" model. Then Daimler-Benz built the engines for the E series onwards.

[nutster9000]

Respond to this video... Regarding octane130's comments I have absolutely no argument and find them enlightening as to those engines in comparison. I was just led to believe that Messerschmitt originally used a Rolls Royce Kestrel engine in the first 109s, only I thought the subsequent engines were developed from that, but I now know that not to be the case, but maybe Junkers took ideas from RR to produce their Jumo 210. That is about all I know! Still living & learning!