AronRa & Mr Deity Vs Creationist @ GAC 2012 - Pt 1/3

AronRa & Mr Deity debating with creationist Caleb Corneloup after the first day of the 2012 Global Atheist Convention in Melbourne Australia.

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[LoneRookRS1]

Creationists are slimy cowards. They don't listen, they just arrogantly preach their stupid beliefs. All you can do is humiliate them until they fuck off.

[popatapataioo]

Religion is for stupid people

[LoneRookRS1]

We trust our senses and reasoning because it is prudent and useful to do so. The natural order is consistent, and we trust this consistency as a base premise in our scientific knowledge of the world. We don't need a God to do science, or understand the workings of the world. We have libraries of information obtained through scientific enquiry, and none of it has the need to mention God.

[Bak3dB3an]

well when you understand why you can trust your senses and reasoning then everything else falls into place.

There is only one reason why you can trust your reasoning and senses. You would have to have all knowledge. You don't, nobody does. Only ONE has all knowledge.

If you don't get this simple point then we can't move on to the next conclusions.

[LoneRookRS1]

Your view is to postulate that some all powerful intelligent force is behind the universe, likely in some theistic, Christian form.

You have repeatedly failed to explain why this has logically has to be so. My only conclusion is therefore you don't have an argument in defence of it.

You talk about logic and yet mention "judgment day"????

[Bak3dB3an]

You can only TRUST the EVIDENCE of what you OBSERVE using your LOGIC if you can trust your LOGIC in the FIRST PLACE. lol

Your logic tells you that your logic is trustworthy. To even start to make sense you have to fluctuate to a theistic world view. I say you do make sense, this is why you're a theist by nature but you just think you're an atheist.

Descartes won't be there for you on judgement day. You have to figure these things out int he modern era.

[LoneRookRS1]

It's like arguing with a brick wall. Let's see if you can absorb the information this time.

There is NO EVIDENCE that the existence of natural order requires a theistic God to create it. There is no deductive logical argument in support of it. There is no scientific argument in support of it.

Now we've cleaned that up,

Saying logic isn't trustworthy is ridiculous. Even Descartes supported the objective existence of deductive and mathematical truths. It is prudent to rely on science.

[Bak3dB3an]

If you're not into circularity then why do you accept that your logic tells you that your logic is trustworthy?

If you're now a theist and accept God and his nature and want to discuss why God didn't have to create himself; then we can discuss it but you can't fluctuate between 2 world views so easily. Sitting on the fence hurts.

We can know what CREATED the universe because of the impossibility of the contrary. It's so apparent it's without dispute, only by those who suppress the truth.

[LoneRookRS1]

There is no reason to suggest that the existence of natural order without an omnipotent creator / theist god is absurd.

Actually, it is absurd to say God created the universe, because you are forced into the circular argument that God also created himself.

Why can't you just have the balls to say you don't know what created the universe, rather than all this theistic and illogical nonsense?

[Bak3dB3an]

It's proven because anything else apart form this belief ends in absurdity such as denying the obvious uniformity of nature etc.

When all other beliefs end in absurdity apart from one, then you've found the truth.

[LoneRookRS1]

Again, this is an unproven and untestable assumption. This is just something you have made up to believe. It's nothing less than faith. Appealing to the authority of historical figures doesn't change that.

[Bak3dB3an]

Newton was a theist. Because he understood the unformity of nature could only be relied upon if someone was purposefully holding it together.