Jos van Immerseel - J.S. Bach/ Karl Czerny (1837) - Praeludium in d (Das Wohltemperierte Klavier)

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Category:

Music

Tags:

• VPRO
• Vrije Geluiden
• Jos van Immerseel
• J.S. Bach

[osip7315]

i liked that, opens up a new window into bach !

[Totma11]

@gr0mithtimon I agree with you that studying ancient music is quite interesting. I dispute that the study of performance practice 'will' lead to 'understanding'... because we do not know nor ever will know what they played like. Which leaves us with 1 option... to make what we best we can out of it according to our taste... which not being saddled with 'conservatory performance practice ideas' from another century is most likely what they did.

[gr0mithtimon]

@Totma11

I don't quite understand why you insist on disputing that which I don't claim. I don't know how to play Bach, nor claim to do so, nor do i hold the notion that Bach should be played as Bach did (this is impossible). I only claim that it is an interesting and important endeavorer -- not a dogma -- to  study and apply the performance practice and instrumentation of the era in which these works where conceived, so that we may understand them better. Why is that so problematic?

[Totma11]

@gr0mithtimon I dispute your notion that you know how to play Bach.

I dispute your notion that Bach should be played like Bach would have played it... and not like Telemann, Reincken,Handel,Fux,or Buxtehude might have played it. I dispute your notion that making an apple pie with part of the the recipe is better than making no apple pie at all.

But I do appreciate how you admire your own clothing while standing quite naked.

[gr0mithtimon]

@Totma11

Ah, another straw man. You don't care to respond to any argument I actually give, do you? To quote Gustav Leonhardt :

"(...) most of our playing is based on hypothesis. That is because we cannot do better. Perhaps we may be able to do a little better, but at the moment much of what we do is pure hypothesis. We really do know very, very little."

[Totma11]

@gr0mithtimon I dispute that you or anyone else knows how Bach performed... and therefore what the appropriate performance practice should be.

[gr0mithtimon]

@Totma11

I'm sorry, but do you dispute that the music was written for harpsichord, and that it is very idiomatic music for that instrument? Do you dispute that a harpsichord is very different instrument from a piano, demanding a fundamentally different technique? Do you dispute the stylistic difference's between romantic or classical music and baroque music? Fragmented knowledge is no reason to ignore what we do know! Also, to clarify, what do you mean by a 'metronomic approach'?

[Totma11]

@gr0mithtimon Unless you recall hearing how Bach played for you, you are not a witness. As to the term 'romantic'... this is a term that has a million meanings. It is impossible to know to what extent Bach was a 'romantic' or not... I accept every possibility about Bach except for the 20th century idea that he had a metronomic approach to performance... because this is not historically possible...

[gr0mithtimon]

@Totma11

I like this performance. However, the fact that this is charming and musical does not change that it is very far from the original, nor does it invalidate attempts to place the music in that original context. I you don't like Bach unless played romantically, thats fine with me, but it doesn't change the facts: Bach was not a romantic, and a harpsichord is not a fortepiano. Bach knew for what instrument he composed, and he used every trick in the baroque-harpsichord book.

[Totma11]

It is high time we explore that traditional legacy of Bach performance as it existed before the 20th century academic world decided that 'Baroque performance practice' could not be at all like 'romantic performance practice'. The fortepiano adds a wonderful quality to Bach's music which needs the reedishly jocose qualites of it. This performance sounds like Richter... only a little looser... which I enjoy very much. Great post!